Edward Fudge and Conditionalism

DerSchweik

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Conditionalism being the notion that hell is not eternal (as the bible teaches), that one goes to hell for a period of time, then is ultimately destroyed, thus ending their conscious, eternal torment in hell. This teaching is not something the bible teaches. I've not heard anyone teaching that in the church.

I *have* however heard it espoused by some I know who have left the church, and generally left the faith, or who on their way to leaving the faith.
 
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DerSchweik

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:(

Everyone I've ever known who's gone off believing in conditionalism has eventually left the church or left Christianity altogether.

The practical implications of conditionalism are that it ultimately denies the existence of God - something Dostoyevsky addressed in several of his books, notably Of Crime and Punishment and The Brothers Karamazov.

The famous concept "If God does not exist, then everything is permissible" is derived from these two works, and more specifically from the paradox of a loving God and human pain and suffering.

The [obvious] existence of human pain and suffering is proof sufficient for some that God cannot exist - at least not with characteristics of love and compassion.

Working backwards then, some who believe God does exist and who believe God is loving and compassionate (all of which are true) have managed however to rationalize away God's willingness to punish sin - especially via eternal damnation in hell - and in the process have rationalized away altogether His holiness (which demands sin's punishment).

If then there be no real punishment for our sins, esp our denial of Him, save our permanent destruction, our ceasing to exist altogether, which is what conditionalism is actually teaching, then the only motivation for becoming a Christian and living a Christ-like life is the promise of the blessings they'll receive with an eternity in heaven.

Such a person cannot claim their motivation being anything else, and certainly not the desire to be with God eternally, for they've already proclaimed their disdain for His holiness and truthfulness in denying the existence of an eternal hell.

Consider then what motivation exists to halt the act of personal suicide - save the motivation that drives on to suicide in the first place - which is the desire to cease to exist. If all things are permissible, and they are if there be no [eternal] consequences for our sin, save eternal destruction / non-existence, why give any heed to God whatsoever, save maybe for what benefits He can give you to satisfy whatever desires you might otherwise have?

Jesus answered them and said, “Truly, truly, I say to you, you seek Me, not because you saw signs, but because you ate of the loaves and were filled. Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life, which the Son of Man will give to you, for on Him the Father, God, has set His seal.” (John 6:26ff)

In other words, some seek Him not for who and what He is (holy, righteous, sinless, loving, caring, compassionate, etc. etc. etc.), but for what He can give them - which is the message of conditionalism - "seek Him for your personal desires, which only He can provide. If you do not desire what He can provide, eat, drink, and be merry - for tomorrow you cease to be."
 
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Smoky

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The practical implications of conditionalism are that it ultimately denies the existence of God

How so? That seems completely irrational to me. Genesis 2:17 (NKJV)
17 "but of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil you shall not eat, for in the day that you eat of it you shall surely die."


If then there be no real punishment for our sins, esp our denial of Him, save our permanent destruction, our ceasing to exist altogether, which is what conditionalism is actually teaching, then the only motivation for becoming a Christian and living a Christ-like life is the promise of the blessings they'll receive with an eternity in heaven.


That's not exactly what conditionalism teaches. Some will receive greater punishment than others before permanent destruction. How do you justify eternal, unending torment for sins commited in just a lifetime? How do you punish your own children?

If all things are permissible, and they are if there be no [eternal] consequences for our sin, save eternal destruction / non-existence, why give any heed to God whatsoever, save maybe for what benefits He can give you to satisfy whatever desires you might otherwise have?


That's nonsense. Eternal destruction is a serious consequence for sin. Why give any heed to God whatsoever? What about the benefits that it has for all mankind instead of personal benefit. Do you think the only reason for being righteous is avoidance of endless torment? What about bringing about the kingdom of God, in the kind of world God created for us to live in in the first place.

Do not work for the food which perishes, but for the food which endures to eternal life

Isn't this a personal benefit that we all desire, far greater than any benefit that we can aquire in this life? Eternal Life is a quality of life where God's will is done on earth as it is in heaven.
 
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