Rapture Before Wrath
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Big difference between a "parable" and a "simile," ie, Matt.13:10, "parable"
Old Jack's opinion
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ron4shua
" ... each in our own order " , Hallelu-YAH .
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For those folks that don't know .
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=YLT&quicksearch=simile&begin=47&end=47
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=YLT&quicksearch=simile&begin=47&end=47
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ron4shua
" ... each in our own order " , Hallelu-YAH .
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So then , are you suggesting Jesus The Christ our Elohim's first born was capable of half truths ?
Mat 13:9 “He who has ears to hear, let him hear!”
Mat 13:10 And the taught ones came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?”
Mat 13:11 And He answering, said to them, “Because it has been given to you to know the secrets of the reign of the heavens, but to them it has not been given.
Mat 13:12 “For whoever possesses, to him more shall be given, and he shall have overflowingly; but whoever does not possess, even what he possesses shall be taken away from him.
Mat 13:13 “Because of this I speak to them in parables, because seeing they do not see, and hearing they do not hear, nor do they understand.
Mat 13:14 “And in them the prophecy of Yeshayahu is completely filled, which says, ‘Hearing you shall hear and by no means understand, and seeing you shall see and by no means perceive,
Mat 13:15 for the heart of this people has become thickened, and their ears are hard of hearing, and their eyes they have closed, lest they should see with their eyes and hear with their ears, lest they should understand with their heart, and turn back, and I heal them.’
Mat 13:16 “And blessed are your eyes because they see, and your ears because they hear,
Mat 13:17 for truly I say to you, that many prophets and righteous ones longed to see what you see, and did not see it, and to hear what you hear, and did not hear it.
This is in black & white from the mouth of YAHshua . No indication of " added later " as some Scripture appears . Why would anyone make a statement , intimating the author of life was capable of speaking half truths .
Seams nothing changes .
43 `Because of this I say to you, that the reign of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth its fruit;
44 and he who is falling on this stone shall be broken, and on whomsoever it may fall it will crush him to pieces.'
45 And the chief priests and the Pharisees having heard his similes, knew that of them he speaketh,
46 and seeking to lay hold on him, they feared the multitudes, seeing they were holding him as a prophet.
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I am not trying to form any doctrine just reading what is written in The Bible.
-Judgment must come first.
Hebrews 9:27 - And as it is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment:
Daniel 12:2 - And many of them that sleep in the dust of the earth shall awake, some to everlasting life, and some to shame [and] everlasting contempt.
-What happen to the soul of unrepentant sinners :
Ezekiel 18:4 - Behold, all souls are mine; as the soul of the father, so also the soul of the son is mine: the soul that sinneth, it shall die.
Romans 6:23
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Revelation 21:8 - But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone: which is the second death.
Revelation 20:14
14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death.
NOTE
-A special treatment will be reserved to those accepting the mark of the Beast (Antichrist) and who worship the Antichrist or his image during the Great Tribulation
Revelation 14
9 And the third angel followed them, saying with a loud voice, If any man worship the beast and his image, and receive his mark in his forehead, or in his hand,
10 The same shall drink of the wine of the wrath of God, which is poured out without mixture into the cup of his indignation; and he shall be tormented with fire and brimstone in the presence of the holy angels, and in the presence of the Lamb:
11 And the smoke of their torment ascendeth up for ever and ever: and they have no rest day nor night, who worship the beast and his image, and whosoever receiveth the mark of his name.
Revelation 19:20 - And the beast was taken, and with him the false prophet that wrought miracles before him, with which he deceived them that had received the mark of the beast, and them that worshipped his image. These both were cast alive into a lake of fire burning with brimstone.
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ron4shua
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Greetings Brother , I as you am not trying to teach any new thing , just reading Scripture in the context in which it was intended .
I am not trying to form any doctrine just reading what is written in The Bible
Heb 9:24 For Messiah has not entered into a Set-apart Place made by hand – figures of the true – but into the heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of Elohim on our behalf,
Heb 9:25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters into the Set-apart Place year by year with blood not his own.
Heb 9:26 For if so, He would have had to suffer often, since the foundation of the world. But now He has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the offering of Himself.
Heb 9:27 And as it awaits men to die once, and after this the judgment,
Heb 9:28 so also the Messiah, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, shall appear a second time, apart from sin, to those waiting for Him, unto deliverance.
Our propitiation is in " heaven itself " NOW , acting as our High Priest in the NOW presence of Elohim YAHweh .
Dan 12:2 and many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth wake up, some to everlasting life, and some to reproaches, everlasting abhorrence.
I read Chapter two before twelve , do you ?
Dan 2:32 “This image’s head was of fine gold, its chest and arms of silver, its belly and thighs of bronze,
Dan 2:33 its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of clay.
Dan 2:34 “You were looking on, until a stone was cut out without hands, and it smote the image on its feet of iron and clay, and broke them in pieces.
Dan 2:35 “Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver, and the gold were crushed together, and became like chaff from the summer threshing-floors. And the wind took them away so that no trace of them was found. And the stone that smote the image became a great mountain and filled all the earth.
Neḇuḵaḏnetstsar was the head of Gold .
Three Kingdoms followed , then a two part Kingdom ( Roman Republic & Kingship )
Almost everyone has five fingers ! Do you see hundreds or thousands of years in between said Kingdoms ?
Eze 18:3 “As I live,” declares the Master יהוה, “you shall no longer use this proverb in Yisra’ĕl.
Eze 18:4 “See, all beings are Mine, the being of the father as well as the being of the son is Mine. The being that is sinning shall die.
Eze 18:5 “But if a man is righteous and shall do right-ruling and righteousness,
Obedience to His own Commandment .
at 3:13 Then יהושע came from Galil to Yoḥanan at the Yardĕn to be immersed by him.
Mat 3:14 But Yoḥanan was hindering Him, saying, “I need to be immersed by You, and You come to me?”
Mat 3:15 But יהושע answering, said to him, “Permit it now, for thus it is fitting for us to fill all righteousness.” Then he permitted Him.
Mat 3:16 And having been immersed, יהושע went up immediately from the water, and see, the heavens were opened, and He saw the Spirit of Elohim descending like a dove and coming upon Him,
Mat 3:17 and see, a voice out of the heavens, saying, “This is My Son, the Beloved, in whom I did delight.” His Acts 2:38 !
Rev 19:20 And the beast was seized, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he led astray those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshipped his image. The two were thrown alive into the lake of fire burning with sulphur.
I have no retort for v. 19:20 ; For two reasons first & foremost , I read v. 22:18,19 for what they are , a promise of retaliation in retribution for not heeding the warning . Second I read , The REVELATION of Jesus The Christ as exactly that , A REVELATION of YAHweh our Creator . Theres a greeting ( Rev 1:9 I, Yoḥanan, both your brother and co-sharer in pressure ( <1,,2347,thlipsis> Tribulation ), and in the reign and endurance of יהושע Messiah, ) & then A prophetic warning to the Assembles in Asia & of course the two v. described above at the end . Check the names of the tribes of the 144,000 . Nothing is correct , Revelation is an abstract picture of YAH .
Rev 22:18 For I witness to everyone hearing the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to them, Elohim shall add to him the plagues that are written in this book,
Rev 22:19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, Elohim shall take away his part from the Book of Life, and out of the set-apart city, which are written in this Book.
Act 2:17 ‘And it shall be in the last days, says Elohim, that I shall pour out of My Spirit on all flesh. And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams,
Act 2:18 and also on My male servants and on My female servants I shall pour out My Spirit in those days, and they shall prophesy.
Act 2:19 ‘And I shall show wonders in the heaven above and signs in the earth beneath: blood and fire and vapour of smoke.
Act 2:20 ‘The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and splendid day of יהוה.
Did this happen or are WE ALL FOOLS ?
I am not trying to form any doctrine just reading what is written in The Bible
Heb 9:24 For Messiah has not entered into a Set-apart Place made by hand – figures of the true – but into the heaven itself, now to appear in the presence of Elohim on our behalf,
Heb 9:25 not that He should offer Himself often, as the high priest enters into the Set-apart Place year by year with blood not his own.
Heb 9:26 For if so, He would have had to suffer often, since the foundation of the world. But now He has appeared once for all at the end of the ages to put away sin by the offering of Himself.
Heb 9:27 And as it awaits men to die once, and after this the judgment,
Heb 9:28 so also the Messiah, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, shall appear a second time, apart from sin, to those waiting for Him, unto deliverance.
Our propitiation is in " heaven itself " NOW , acting as our High Priest in the NOW presence of Elohim YAHweh .
Dan 12:2 and many of those who sleep in the dust of the earth wake up, some to everlasting life, and some to reproaches, everlasting abhorrence.
I read Chapter two before twelve , do you ?
Dan 2:32 “This image’s head was of fine gold, its chest and arms of silver, its belly and thighs of bronze,
Dan 2:33 its legs of iron, its feet partly of iron and partly of clay.
Dan 2:34 “You were looking on, until a stone was cut out without hands, and it smote the image on its feet of iron and clay, and broke them in pieces.
Dan 2:35 “Then the iron, the clay, the bronze, the silver, and the gold were crushed together, and became like chaff from the summer threshing-floors. And the wind took them away so that no trace of them was found. And the stone that smote the image became a great mountain and filled all the earth.
Neḇuḵaḏnetstsar was the head of Gold .
Three Kingdoms followed , then a two part Kingdom ( Roman Republic & Kingship )
Almost everyone has five fingers ! Do you see hundreds or thousands of years in between said Kingdoms ?
Eze 18:3 “As I live,” declares the Master יהוה, “you shall no longer use this proverb in Yisra’ĕl.
Eze 18:4 “See, all beings are Mine, the being of the father as well as the being of the son is Mine. The being that is sinning shall die.
Eze 18:5 “But if a man is righteous and shall do right-ruling and righteousness,
Obedience to His own Commandment .
at 3:13 Then יהושע came from Galil to Yoḥanan at the Yardĕn to be immersed by him.
Mat 3:14 But Yoḥanan was hindering Him, saying, “I need to be immersed by You, and You come to me?”
Mat 3:15 But יהושע answering, said to him, “Permit it now, for thus it is fitting for us to fill all righteousness.” Then he permitted Him.
Mat 3:16 And having been immersed, יהושע went up immediately from the water, and see, the heavens were opened, and He saw the Spirit of Elohim descending like a dove and coming upon Him,
Mat 3:17 and see, a voice out of the heavens, saying, “This is My Son, the Beloved, in whom I did delight.” His Acts 2:38 !
Rev 19:20 And the beast was seized, and with him the false prophet who worked signs in his presence, by which he led astray those who received the mark of the beast and those who worshipped his image. The two were thrown alive into the lake of fire burning with sulphur.
I have no retort for v. 19:20 ; For two reasons first & foremost , I read v. 22:18,19 for what they are , a promise of retaliation in retribution for not heeding the warning . Second I read , The REVELATION of Jesus The Christ as exactly that , A REVELATION of YAHweh our Creator . Theres a greeting ( Rev 1:9 I, Yoḥanan, both your brother and co-sharer in pressure ( <1,,2347,thlipsis> Tribulation ), and in the reign and endurance of יהושע Messiah, ) & then A prophetic warning to the Assembles in Asia & of course the two v. described above at the end . Check the names of the tribes of the 144,000 . Nothing is correct , Revelation is an abstract picture of YAH .
Rev 22:18 For I witness to everyone hearing the words of the prophecy of this book: If anyone adds to them, Elohim shall add to him the plagues that are written in this book,
Rev 22:19 and if anyone takes away from the words of the book of this prophecy, Elohim shall take away his part from the Book of Life, and out of the set-apart city, which are written in this Book.
Act 2:17 ‘And it shall be in the last days, says Elohim, that I shall pour out of My Spirit on all flesh. And your sons and your daughters shall prophesy, and your young men shall see visions, and your old men shall dream dreams,
Act 2:18 and also on My male servants and on My female servants I shall pour out My Spirit in those days, and they shall prophesy.
Act 2:19 ‘And I shall show wonders in the heaven above and signs in the earth beneath: blood and fire and vapour of smoke.
Act 2:20 ‘The sun shall be turned into darkness, and the moon into blood, before the coming of the great and splendid day of יהוה.
Did this happen or are WE ALL FOOLS ?
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Question???
Post #780 "Matthew 13:10 And the disciples having come near, said to him, 'wherefore in similes dost thou speak to them?'"
Post #784 ""Matt.13:10 And the taught ones came and said to Him, "why do you speak to them in parables?""
Which of the former is your reading of Scripture in the context in which it was intended? Or what am I not seeing?
Curious old Jack
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iamlamad
Lamad
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WAKE UP! Do these verses tell us that EVERYTHING Jesus spoke to the Pharasees would be in parables? No it does not.
Was this a parable?
[Matthew 12:34[
O generation of vipers, how can ye, being evil, speak good things? for out of the abundance of the heart the mouth speaketh.
https://www.biblegateway.com/verse/en/Matthew 12:34
Matthew 23:33
Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
How about this?
John 8:58
Jesus said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, Before Abraham was, I am.
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ron4shua
" ... each in our own order " , Hallelu-YAH .
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Greetings Brother ,
Index of 100+ Versions of the Scriptures
Matthew 13:10 [ The Purpose of Parables ] And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?” (NKJV)
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=NKJV&quicksearch=parable&begin=47&end=47
Matthew 13:10 And the disciples having come near, said to him, `Wherefore in similes dost thou speak to them?' (YLT)
Young's Literal Translation, Revised Edition
The translation of the New Testament is based upon the belief that every word of the original is "God-breathed." (See 2 Timothy 3:16 and 2 Peter 3:15, 16.) This inspiration extends only to the original text and not to any translation ever made by man.
A strictly literal rendering may not be as pleasant to the ear as one where the apparent sense is chiefly aimed at, yet truth is what ought to be sought. The translations available at the time that this one was published had frequent departures from the original. The meaning of what the writers did write was being replaced by what they ought to have written.
This translation was not meant to compete with the Common Version, but to be used as an auxiliary to it. The Greek text used is the Received Text. A literal text was considered to be indispensable. The King James translators were unacquainted with two peculiarities of the Hebrew use of tense of verbs. Although there are several pages dealing with Hebrew verbs, there is no reference concerning what text was used in translating the Old Testament.
Baker Book House (n.d.)
[Tyndale House, Cambridge, United Kingdom]
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=simile&qs_version=YLT
sim·i·le
ˈsiməlē/Submit
noun
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
the use of simile.
par·a·ble
ˈperəb(ə
l/
noun
a simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
synonyms: allegory, moral story/tale, fable, exemplum
"the parable of the prodigal son"
simile - search - JewishEncyclopedia.com
" Curious old Jack ", please forgive me for being so remiss in not tagging my Scripture by " version " . I'm getting a little long in the tooth , what I hold as commonly understood , sometimes needs explanation in greater detail , sorry again , fellow believer .
If you get the idea I'm trying to make a distinction between the two words " simile / parable , I missed the target by miles . The opposite is me intention .
Beings this can of worms is open , question for you Jack .
How ludicrous is it to think as a chiseled in stone BONE of contention . Anyone in the mythical " hell " can SEE , carry on a dialog with anyone or anything in the place of reward for YAHweh's BODY ? " a great chasm is fixed " , INDEED !
Just so you get my question as intended , Brother Jack . lu·di·crous
ˈlo͞odəkrəs/Submit
adjective
so foolish, unreasonable, or out of place as to be amusing; ridiculous.
"it's ludicrous that I have been fined"
synonyms: absurd, ridiculous, farcical, laughable, risible, preposterous, foolish, mad, insane, idiotic, stupid, inane, silly, asinine, nonsensical; informalcrazy
"a ludicrous idea"
Blessing to you & yours .
Index of 100+ Versions of the Scriptures
Matthew 13:10 [ The Purpose of Parables ] And the disciples came and said to Him, “Why do You speak to them in parables?” (NKJV)
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=NKJV&quicksearch=parable&begin=47&end=47
Matthew 13:10 And the disciples having come near, said to him, `Wherefore in similes dost thou speak to them?' (YLT)
Young's Literal Translation, Revised Edition
The translation of the New Testament is based upon the belief that every word of the original is "God-breathed." (See 2 Timothy 3:16 and 2 Peter 3:15, 16.) This inspiration extends only to the original text and not to any translation ever made by man.
A strictly literal rendering may not be as pleasant to the ear as one where the apparent sense is chiefly aimed at, yet truth is what ought to be sought. The translations available at the time that this one was published had frequent departures from the original. The meaning of what the writers did write was being replaced by what they ought to have written.
This translation was not meant to compete with the Common Version, but to be used as an auxiliary to it. The Greek text used is the Received Text. A literal text was considered to be indispensable. The King James translators were unacquainted with two peculiarities of the Hebrew use of tense of verbs. Although there are several pages dealing with Hebrew verbs, there is no reference concerning what text was used in translating the Old Testament.
Baker Book House (n.d.)
[Tyndale House, Cambridge, United Kingdom]
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=simile&qs_version=YLT
sim·i·le
ˈsiməlē/Submit
noun
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
the use of simile.
par·a·ble
ˈperəb(ə
l/noun
a simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
synonyms: allegory, moral story/tale, fable, exemplum
"the parable of the prodigal son"
simile - search - JewishEncyclopedia.com
" Curious old Jack ", please forgive me for being so remiss in not tagging my Scripture by " version " . I'm getting a little long in the tooth , what I hold as commonly understood , sometimes needs explanation in greater detail , sorry again , fellow believer .
If you get the idea I'm trying to make a distinction between the two words " simile / parable , I missed the target by miles . The opposite is me intention .
Beings this can of worms is open , question for you Jack .
How ludicrous is it to think as a chiseled in stone BONE of contention . Anyone in the mythical " hell " can SEE , carry on a dialog with anyone or anything in the place of reward for YAHweh's BODY ? " a great chasm is fixed " , INDEED !
Just so you get my question as intended , Brother Jack . lu·di·crous
ˈlo͞odəkrəs/Submit
adjective
so foolish, unreasonable, or out of place as to be amusing; ridiculous.
"it's ludicrous that I have been fined"
synonyms: absurd, ridiculous, farcical, laughable, risible, preposterous, foolish, mad, insane, idiotic, stupid, inane, silly, asinine, nonsensical; informalcrazy
"a ludicrous idea"
Blessing to you & yours .
Last edited:
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ron4shua
" ... each in our own order " , Hallelu-YAH .
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Greetings Brother iamlamad , you asked
Was this a parable?
Mat 12:34 “Brood of adders! How are you able to speak what is good – being wicked? For the mouth speaks from the overflow of the heart. (ISR)
Do you think there's a hidden or masked teaching of truth ? I don't , this doesn't meet the
criteria for a simile/parable . If you do , it's okay with me .
(ISR)
Same as Matthew 12:34 .
As above but I ask you does the next verse intimate any intention to conceal anything was exercised by our Master ?
Joh 8:59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but יהושע was hidden and went out of the Set-apart Place, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. (ISR)
For your future references , criteria for Scripture similes/parables .
sim·i·le
ˈsiməlē/Submit
noun
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
the use of simile.
par·a·ble
ˈperəb(əl/
noun
a simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
synonyms: allegory, moral story/tale, fable, exemplum
"the parable of the prodigal son"
By the way , I fully concur with your statement ; " Do these verses tell us that EVERYTHING Jesus spoke to the Pharisees would be in parables? No it does not. "
Any expounding by anyone must muster criteria for Scripture similes/parables .
In the case in question , I view the simile as completely preposterous in many points , taking it for rock hard truth . This story is void of any witness to start , which should be plenty for anyone ! Unless there's an ulterior motive like the dogmatic agenda of turning the word <1,,1067,geenna> into metaphorical forever & forever torture . Just the thing a JUST & forgiving Elohim would do correct , NOT .
Sorry for running on , Blessings to you & yours .
Was this a parable?
Mat 12:34 “Brood of adders! How are you able to speak what is good – being wicked? For the mouth speaks from the overflow of the heart. (ISR)
Do you think there's a hidden or masked teaching of truth ? I don't , this doesn't meet the
criteria for a simile/parable . If you do , it's okay with me .
Mat 23:33 “Serpents, brood of adders! How would you escape the judgment of Gehenna?
(ISR)
Same as Matthew 12:34 .
Joh 8:58 יהושע said to them, “Truly, truly, I say to you, before Aḇraham came to be, I am.”1 Footnote: 1See also 1:1, 6:62, 17:5. (ISR)
As above but I ask you does the next verse intimate any intention to conceal anything was exercised by our Master ?
Joh 8:59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but יהושע was hidden and went out of the Set-apart Place, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. (ISR)
For your future references , criteria for Scripture similes/parables .
sim·i·le
ˈsiməlē/Submit
noun
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
the use of simile.
par·a·ble
ˈperəb(ə
l/noun
a simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
synonyms: allegory, moral story/tale, fable, exemplum
"the parable of the prodigal son"
By the way , I fully concur with your statement ; " Do these verses tell us that EVERYTHING Jesus spoke to the Pharisees would be in parables? No it does not. "
Any expounding by anyone must muster criteria for Scripture similes/parables .
In the case in question , I view the simile as completely preposterous in many points , taking it for rock hard truth . This story is void of any witness to start , which should be plenty for anyone ! Unless there's an ulterior motive like the dogmatic agenda of turning the word <1,,1067,geenna> into metaphorical forever & forever torture . Just the thing a JUST & forgiving Elohim would do correct , NOT .
Sorry for running on , Blessings to you & yours .
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Greetings Brother ,
Index of 100+ Versions of the Scriptures
Matthew 13:10 [ The Purpose of Parables ] And the disciples came and said to Him, Why do You speak to them in parables? (NKJV)
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?qs_version=NKJV&quicksearch=parable&begin=47&end=47
Matthew 13:10 And the disciples having come near, said to him, `Wherefore in similes dost thou speak to them?' (YLT)
Young's Literal Translation, Revised Edition
The translation of the New Testament is based upon the belief that every word of the original is "God-breathed." (See 2 Timothy 3:16 and 2 Peter 3:15, 16.) This inspiration extends only to the original text and not to any translation ever made by man.
A strictly literal rendering may not be as pleasant to the ear as one where the apparent sense is chiefly aimed at, yet truth is what ought to be sought. The translations available at the time that this one was published had frequent departures from the original. The meaning of what the writers did write was being replaced by what they ought to have written.
This translation was not meant to compete with the Common Version, but to be used as an auxiliary to it. The Greek text used is the Received Text. A literal text was considered to be indispensable. The King James translators were unacquainted with two peculiarities of the Hebrew use of tense of verbs. Although there are several pages dealing with Hebrew verbs, there is no reference concerning what text was used in translating the Old Testament.
Baker Book House (n.d.)
[Tyndale House, Cambridge, United Kingdom]
https://www.biblegateway.com/quicksearch/?quicksearch=simile&qs_version=YLT
sim·i·le
ˈsiməlē/Submit
noun
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
the use of simile.
par·a·ble
ˈperəb(ə
noun
a simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
synonyms: allegory, moral story/tale, fable, exemplum
"the parable of the prodigal son"
simile - search - JewishEncyclopedia.com
" Curious old Jack ", please forgive me for being so remiss in not tagging my Scripture by " version " . I'm getting a little long in the tooth , what I hold as commonly understood , sometimes needs explanation in greater detail , sorry again , fellow believer .
If you get the idea I'm trying to make a distinction between the two words " simile / parable , I missed the target by miles . The opposite is me intention .
Beings this can of worms is open , question for you Jack .
How ludicrous is it to think as a chiseled in stone BONE of contention . Anyone in the mythical " hell " can SEE , carry on a dialog with anyone or anything in the place of reward for YAHweh's BODY ? " a great chasm is fixed " , INDEED !
Just so you get my question as intended , Brother Jack . lu·di·crous
ˈlo͞odəkrəs/Submit
adjective
so foolish, unreasonable, or out of place as to be amusing; ridiculous.
"it's ludicrous that I have been fined"
synonyms: absurd, ridiculous, farcical, laughable, risible, preposterous, foolish, mad, insane, idiotic, stupid, inane, silly, asinine, nonsensical; informalcrazy
"a ludicrous idea"
Blessing to you & yours .
Have to take off early this morning, however wanted to thank you again for the study. Would encourage you to see how extremely interpretive Bible translations are, eg, even with my treasured YLT, where even the original inerrant, infallible, and inspired Autographs needed and needs a valid interpretation.
We have extremely diverse understandings of what a Biblical "Parable" and "Simile" is, not that I'm correct as I'm of a lower paygrade.
Old brother Jack
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iamlamad
Lamad
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Greetings Brother iamlamad , you asked
Was this a parable?
Mat 12:34 Brood of adders! How are you able to speak what is good being wicked? For the mouth speaks from the overflow of the heart. (ISR)
Do you think there's a hidden or masked teaching of truth ? I don't , this doesn't meet the
criteria for a simile/parable . If you do , it's okay with me .
Mat 23:33 Serpents, brood of adders! How would you escape the judgment of Gehenna?
(ISR)
Same as Matthew 12:34 .
Joh 8:58 יהושע said to them, Truly, truly, I say to you, before Aḇraham came to be, I am.1 Footnote: 1See also 1:1, 6:62, 17:5. (ISR)
As above but I ask you does the next verse intimate any intention to conceal anything was exercised by our Master ?
Joh 8:59 Therefore they picked up stones to throw at Him, but יהושע was hidden and went out of the Set-apart Place, going through the midst of them, and so passed by. (ISR)
For your future references , criteria for Scripture similes/parables .
sim·i·le
ˈsiməlē/Submit
noun
a figure of speech involving the comparison of one thing with another thing of a different kind, used to make a description more emphatic or vivid (e.g., as brave as a lion, crazy like a fox ).
the use of simile.
par·a·ble
ˈperəb(ə
noun
a simple story used to illustrate a moral or spiritual lesson, as told by Jesus in the Gospels.
synonyms: allegory, moral story/tale, fable, exemplum
"the parable of the prodigal son"
By the way , I fully concur with your statement ; " Do these verses tell us that EVERYTHING Jesus spoke to the Pharisees would be in parables? No it does not. "
Any expounding by anyone must muster criteria for Scripture similes/parables .
In the case in question , I view the simile as completely preposterous in many points , taking it for rock hard truth . This story is void of any witness to start , which should be plenty for anyone ! Unless there's an ulterior motive like the dogmatic agenda of turning the word <1,,1067,geenna> into metaphorical forever & forever torture . Just the thing a JUST & forgiving Elohim would do correct , NOT .
Sorry for running on , Blessings to you & yours .
So you agree then, Jesus did not always speak to the Pharisees in parables.
Good.
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ron4shua
" ... each in our own order " , Hallelu-YAH .
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Greetings Brother Jack , please allow me to thank you for your kind reply . Without being privy to the Hebrew Oral Torah , which will always be hidden from us "little Dogs". Truth of Scripture will be by the Spirit of Truth , possible that's the way it was always meant for us , a testing exercise in FAITH durability .
Brother , as a preteen I read 2 & 3/4 of a third Translation version . I was Government quarantined for over 18 months . I have been blessed with 23 different versions on the shelve , all read cover to cover . Some numerous times , a few near worn out .
The majority of 30 more , all 30 the Renewed Covernets , complete , & again some several times . I had 47 versions on an installed E-Sword 7 or 8 years ago .
To describe brother ron , the servant of Elohim in The NAME of YAH , would be simply.
Overread , knowing nothing but YAHweh's Messiah YAHshua & Him our Propitiation .
Dearest Brother Jack I must disagree with you on a point or two . The only "valid interpretation " is a myth of your own judgement . Scripture IS "original inerrant, infallible, and inspired " also will never be translated as intender . Because of language changes & the fires of Constantine the great . One quick example , our Masters Brothers name was lost forever when the translators , named the book attributed to him after King Iames . Kissing his backside attempting to get more translation FUNDS from him . Of course , about 185 years later the "J" & "J" sound was adopted to the English language & it was changed to James . 185 years , these United States of America is what just over 200 years old . Our founding fathers arrived in wind powered wooden vessels & years age WE walked on the moon .
By the way the translators held out for more filthy luker & the King broke the sit down by a counter offer of taking a head or two . That's the story reads .
The Infinite Spirit is LOVE , the whole works is a test of how an applicant measures up .
".. the making of many books has no end, and much study is a wearying of the flesh.
Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the entire matter: Fear Elohim and guard His commands, for this applies to all mankind!
Ecc 12:14 For Elohim shall bring every work into right-ruling, including all that is hidden, whether good or whether evil .
Your Brother in Messiah , the servant ron .
Brother , as a preteen I read 2 & 3/4 of a third Translation version . I was Government quarantined for over 18 months . I have been blessed with 23 different versions on the shelve , all read cover to cover . Some numerous times , a few near worn out .
The majority of 30 more , all 30 the Renewed Covernets , complete , & again some several times . I had 47 versions on an installed E-Sword 7 or 8 years ago .
To describe brother ron , the servant of Elohim in The NAME of YAH , would be simply.
Overread , knowing nothing but YAHweh's Messiah YAHshua & Him our Propitiation .
Dearest Brother Jack I must disagree with you on a point or two . The only "valid interpretation " is a myth of your own judgement . Scripture IS "original inerrant, infallible, and inspired " also will never be translated as intender . Because of language changes & the fires of Constantine the great . One quick example , our Masters Brothers name was lost forever when the translators , named the book attributed to him after King Iames . Kissing his backside attempting to get more translation FUNDS from him . Of course , about 185 years later the "J" & "J" sound was adopted to the English language & it was changed to James . 185 years , these United States of America is what just over 200 years old . Our founding fathers arrived in wind powered wooden vessels & years age WE walked on the moon .
By the way the translators held out for more filthy luker & the King broke the sit down by a counter offer of taking a head or two . That's the story reads .
The Infinite Spirit is LOVE , the whole works is a test of how an applicant measures up .
".. the making of many books has no end, and much study is a wearying of the flesh.
Ecc 12:13 Let us hear the conclusion of the entire matter: Fear Elohim and guard His commands, for this applies to all mankind!
Ecc 12:14 For Elohim shall bring every work into right-ruling, including all that is hidden, whether good or whether evil .
Your Brother in Messiah , the servant ron .
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That is confusing.
The Wrath comes after the Tribulation and according to Josephu, multitudes of Christians escaped from Jerusalem before I was leveled......
Some links I have recently run across concerning the fleeing of 1st century Jews fleeing prior to the 70AD destruction of Jerusalem.........
Matthew 24, Mark 13 and Luke's Temple/Jerusalem Discourses harmonized
Matt 24:29 Signs in sun, moon, stars, powers of heavens shaken
Matthew 24:29
Yet immediately after the tribulation of those days,
and the powers<1411> of the heavens shall be being shaken<4531>
Mark 13:
24 But in those the days, after that tribulation,
and the powers in the heavens shall be be being shaken
Luke 21:
25 And shall be signs in sun, and moon, and stars,
For the powers of the heavens shall be being shaken.
---------------------------------
The Destruction of Jerusalem - George Peter Holford, 1805AD
Proof that Matthew 24 was fully fulfilled in 70 AD!
Also see: Rapture refuted
Matthew 24:16
then those in the Judea let them be fleeing! into the mountains
Mark 13:14
Then those in the Judea, let them be fleeing into the mountains
Luke 21:21
then those in the Judea, let them be fleeing into the mountains;
and those in midst of Her, let them be coming out to country;
and those in the countries placed, let them not come be entering into Her
22 That days of vengeance these are, of the to be fulfilled<4130> all the having been written 23 “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great Distress in the land and Wrath upon this people.
Pella Flight Tradition Study Archive
Christian Flight to Pella
Capstone to the Fulfillment of Jesus Christ’s Olivet Prophecy
Luke 21:20-22: “But when you see Jerusalem surrounded by armies.. Then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains, and let those who are inside the city depart, and let not those who are out in the country enter it; for these are days of vengeance, to fulfill all that is written.” RSV
Eusebius: “The members of the Jerusalem church by means of an oracle, given by revelation to acceptable persons there, were ordered to leave the city before the war began and settle in a town in Peraea called Pella.” Book III, 5:4
- S.G.F. Brandon: The Fall of Jerusalem and the Christian Church
Revelation 7: A Preterist Commentary - Revelation Revolution
The Preservation of the 144,000 and the Escape of First Century Jewish Christians to Pella . . .
A similar mark on the foreheads of the saints is also mentioned in Ezekiel 9:4-6. The sealing of the 144,000 is one of the first of many allusions to the story of Exodus found throughout Revelation. The sealing of the 144,000 is reminiscent of the marking of the Jews during the tenth plague of Exodus. In this plague, the Jewish slaves sacrificed a lamb and spread its blood over the doorframes of their homes. This act marked the followers of God so that when the angel of death came through the land killing all the firstborn, he would pass over these homes. The 144,000 Christian saints of Revelation 7, like the Jews of Exodus, escaped the angel of death by being marked with the blood of Jesus, the sacrificial lamb of Revelation 5:6 and the true Passover lamb of Exodus 12. Thus it appears that the seal given to the 144,000 in v. 3 and 4 like the blood of the Lamb marked on the doorframes on Passover is the Holy Spirit. Ephesians 1:13 reads, “In Him, you also, after listening to the message of truth, the gospel of your salvation—having also believed, you were sealed in Him with the Holy Spirit [emphasis mine.]” The sealing of the Holy Spirit is also referenced in Ephesians 4:30 and 2 Corinthians 1:21-22.
Later symbolized by the woman of Revelation 12:14, the 144,000 are, I believe, the Christian saints who survived Israel’s first century war with Rome just as the Hebrew slaves of Exodus survived the plague of the firstborn. In Revelation 12:14, a woman flees to the desert to escape the serpent pursuing her. There she is taken care of for a time, times and half a time. While she is gone, Israel and Rome are afflicted with the ten plagues of Exodus as will be addressed in detail throughout the remainder of this commentary.8 Similarly first century Jewish Christians escaped the plagues of Revelation and the ravages of the Jewish War because they fled to Pella at the start of this war.9 Thus as predicted, these Christians in Jerusalem and perhaps their Gentile brethren already living outside of Israel like the 144,000 and the woman of Revelation 12 were kept safe from the coming plagues of Revelation.
A likely path from Jerusalem to Pella.
======================
Visual Timeline of the Roman-Jewish War ARTchive @ PreteristArchive.com, The Internet's Only Balanced Look at Preterist Eschatology and Preterism
CAST OF CHARACTERS: Roman: Emperor Nero | General Vespasian | General Titus | The Roman Army || Jewish: General / Historian Josephus | Factional Leaders in Jerusalem || Administrators of Roman Judea Targets: Jerusalem | Herod's Temple // Maps of the Roman Invasion // Theological Timeline
CHRONOLOGY IMMEDIATELY SURROUNDING THE WAR
Stage 1: Murder of James the Just, "Opposition High Priest" ; Irrevocable Split: 62
Stage 2: General Revolt in Jerusalem ; Zealot Occupation of Masada: August-September 66
Stage 3: The Campaign of Cestius Gallus and the Defeat of the Twelfth Legion: October-November 66
Stage 4: End of Collaborative Government, Priesthood ; General Flight: November 66 - March 67
Part 6: Vespasian Subdues Northern and Western Palestine: December 66 - December 68
Part 7: Three-way Power Struggle within Jerusalem After Roman Retreat: January 68 - May 70
Part 8: Romans Breach City Walls and Leave Jerusalem Desolate: May 10 - September 10, 70
===========================
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Hello Ted. That is a excellent point.
Luke's Gospel never uses the word "tribulation/s" which I thought was interesting.....
==============================================
During my Greek studies of the NT, I came across something unique
The word "tribulation" does not occur in Luke's Gospel.........
The word "TRIBULATION" does not occur in Luke's Gospel.
Matthew 24:9 “Then they will deliver you up to tribulation and kill you, and you will be hated by all nations for My name’s sake.
Matthew 24:21for then shall be great tribulation, such as not has become from beginning of world<2889> till of the now, neither not no may be becoming.
Mark 13:19 for shall be tribulation in those days such as not has become such from beginning of creation<2397> which God creates till of the now, and not no may be becoming
=========================
Luke uses vengeance, great Distress and Wrath:
Luke 21
22 That days of vengeance these are, of the to be fulfilled all the having been written
23 “But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days!
For there will be great distress in the land and Wrath upon this people.
36 “Yet be being vigilant/watching, in every season beseeching that ye should be being strong to be escaping all these, the being about to be becoming and to stand before the Son of the Man.
================================
Revelation 2:10 "tribulation 10 days"
Revelation 2:10 No yet thou be fearing! which-things thou are being about to be suffering
Behold! the Devil is being about to be casting ye into a prison, that ye may be being tried.
And ye shall be having tribulation ten days,
Be thou becoming faithful until death! and I shall be giving to thee the Crown of the life].
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Hi LLOJ,
Well, my point is that many people believe that believers won't go through the days of tribulation because they attribute those days to be the same as the day of God's wrath. They base this on the passage that says that we are not children destined for wrath. Then, based on all of that understanding they then draw the conclusion that believers will be raptured before the days of great tribulation.
However, they do not reference the same days. The days of great tribulation upon the earth are days in which Satan, the beast and the Antichrist will rule and reign upon the earth and inflict all sorts of terrors upon the believers. Then comes the rapture. Then comes God's wrath. We the believers are not promised to be removed from the days of great tribulation, but we are promised to be removed from the earth before the great and terrible day of God's wrath upon the earth and all its inhabitants.
So, as I understand the Scriptures, there will be believers alive and living upon the earth throughout the days of great tribulation. But then we get to the Revelation chap. 14 v. 14. The harvest of the earth. Then one looking as the son of man, Jesus, will come down from heaven standing on the clouds and shout, "Come up here!" Then the dead in Christ shall rise from their graves and those believers alive at that time will join them in the clouds to be removed from the earth before the second angel comes and throws those remaining on the earth into the winepress of God's wrath. Then we will see the angels pour out the bowls of God's wrath upon the inhabitants of the earth.
God bless,
In Christ, ted
Well, my point is that many people believe that believers won't go through the days of tribulation because they attribute those days to be the same as the day of God's wrath. They base this on the passage that says that we are not children destined for wrath. Then, based on all of that understanding they then draw the conclusion that believers will be raptured before the days of great tribulation.
However, they do not reference the same days. The days of great tribulation upon the earth are days in which Satan, the beast and the Antichrist will rule and reign upon the earth and inflict all sorts of terrors upon the believers. Then comes the rapture. Then comes God's wrath. We the believers are not promised to be removed from the days of great tribulation, but we are promised to be removed from the earth before the great and terrible day of God's wrath upon the earth and all its inhabitants.
So, as I understand the Scriptures, there will be believers alive and living upon the earth throughout the days of great tribulation. But then we get to the Revelation chap. 14 v. 14. The harvest of the earth. Then one looking as the son of man, Jesus, will come down from heaven standing on the clouds and shout, "Come up here!" Then the dead in Christ shall rise from their graves and those believers alive at that time will join them in the clouds to be removed from the earth before the second angel comes and throws those remaining on the earth into the winepress of God's wrath. Then we will see the angels pour out the bowls of God's wrath upon the inhabitants of the earth.
God bless,
In Christ, ted
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