Why makes/keeps you Lutheran?

Soma Seer said:

1) Why are you Lutheran (vs. Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox)?

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Lutherans view ourselves as Catholic, while not Papist.

I feel our Book of Concord retains the fullness of the Catholic/Orthodox Church, without the unnecessary extras that distract from being Christ centric. Lutherans accept what God says, rather than trying to over explain every little minute detail. God reveals what's necessary for salvation.

Lutherans practice universal (catholic) atonement, which means we aren't an inclusive denomination; Christ Jesus' death and resurrection is sufficient for all sinners. Lutherans practice vicarious atonement, meaning faith and belief are co-equals, which are gifts received from God, completely apart from our human nature; this view prevents ourselves from being our own gods, because our fallen flesh brings nothing to the table. Our belief in universal atonement and vicarious atonement support our practice of pedeobaptism.

As opposed to the individual interpretation approach of Protestantism, or the individual interpretation of the Papist, or the individual interpretation of a Magisterium; Lutherans allow Scripture to interpret Scripture, relying completely on the infallibly revealed Word of God and sole inspiration of the Holy Spirit. Lutheranism isn't a new teaching, it retains the writings and teaching of ancient Church fathers; and it retains the Apostolic teachings passed down through Christian generations; and the Apostolic teachings are held above Apostolic genealogy.

Lutheranism centers around the concepts of: Word and Sacrament as the means by which God has chosen to reveal himself, properly distinguishing between Law and Gospel, and the Two Kingdoms (Two Realms) based off St. Augustine's City of God.

2) What branch of Lutheranism do you follow?[/QUOTE]

The LCMS baptized me as an infant, I was a catechumenate through middle-school, and promptly left the Church in my college years. The public educational system and the lack of genuine Christian friends and fellowship in the school setting thoroughly de-Christianized me. After living a broadly agnostic or seldom semi-Lutheran at best; I went through a bad relationship and empty friends of convenience; I realized my life was far more stable and I had far more friends when I was actually living out a Christian lifestyle and repenting of my sins.

I've slowly crept my way back into the Lutheran Church, since 2005. By 2008, I was fully engaged into marital counseling, with my soon-to-be spouse. My fiancee and her daughter were baptized together, and I was wed in late 2008. By 2010, I adopted by wife's daughter, and a few months later, my wife gave birth to our 1st child together. I'm now a regular in Church once again, only with a family of four now, and I'm the happiest that I've ever been in life.

The Confessional Lutheranism to the Book of Concord is most easily found in the: ELS, WELS, CLC, and LCMS. Various Lutheran congregations of Germanic, French, Scandinavian, and English descent were geographically divided by Roman-Catholic Inquisitions, governments changing the state sponsored religion, the Prussian Union, and the Catholic League's Social Justice political movements: the NAZI, the Communist, and the Fascists.

As Lutheran refugees of various European geographies entered the United States from: Scandinavia, Germanic provinces/countries, Prussia, and etc... they brought with them propriety congregational bylaws, native languages, and local dialects. The ELS/WELS were predominantly from Western Germanic countries. The LCMS escaped the Prussian Union Church of the Prussian Empire. The ALC/NALC were predominantly of Scandinavian decent and are heavily influenced by the teachings of Jacobus Arminius' Remonstrance Church.

What was once hundreds of local denominations across North America, consolidation and conformity gradually brought down to the ELS, WELS, and LCMS representing Confessional doctrines consistent since 1530. The LCMS is the largest of the three and is by far the most eucumenical; which means it works extensively with worldwide Lutheran humanitarian organizations that aren't always (usually aren't) Confessional at all, the LCMS also conducts eucumencial discussions with Vatican, and other denominations in efforts to keep dialogues open.

An Arminian invasion of Lutheran seminaries occurred in the 1950's, the WELS plead with the LCMS not to admit the Arminian leaning Lutherans. The LCMS was slow to listen and grew too fast, by the time the 1970's rolled around the Arminians were professors at the LCMS seminaries. The Confessional Lutherans publicly debated the Arminians and challenged them on issues of theology, threatened with excommunication, many of the Arminians were part of the Seminex Walkout. They split the LCMS in half, taking with them congregations and colleges, renaming themselves the ELCA. The ELCA have completely redefined what it means to be Lutheran in the US and have turned it into just another Prussian Union Church of merged theologies. There remains a high level of animosity between the LCMS and its former congregational members, the ELCA.

Christ College of Valparaiso University never took sides, and remains funded by both the LCMS and ELCA for the education of Lutherans: » Academic Programs - Academics

3) If you converted to Lutheranism, what faith(s) did you follow previously?[/QUOTE]

My father was raised Southern Baptist, while my mom was raised United Methodist, and both were invited to a LCMS congregation; they followed with adult confirmation, and then marriage. My parents liked the depth of knowledge in Church history, Koine, and Hebrew brought into Bible studies. My parents also preferred the structured liturgy that completes the New Testament Scriptures every 3-years. My parents also liked the sheet music of traditional Catholic/Lutheran hymns rewritten by the Lutheran composer Johann Sebastian Bach.

My father was denied baptism by a Southern Baptist pastor, when my dad answered an altar call, my father was laughed/snickered away by the minister who didn't believe my dad was old enough to make a "decision for God". Neither my mom or dad felt there was much to cling to from their former congregations that they grew-up in.

4) And what convinced you to convert?[/QUOTE]

Even though I was well outside the Church for at least a decade, casual conversations with those of faith rarely discussed Biblical topics or issues on a level that I found at all challenging. Whether I wanted to admit it or not, the Lutheran Church had far better equipped me than I was willing to give it credit. The Bible seemed foreign to Catholics in discussion, who only knew their catechesis. Catechesis seemed foreign to the Reformed. The Evangelicals say something different every time you talk to them. Then there's the Holy Spirit crowd that doesn't need a Bible or tradition, because they have a direct link to God.

At the end of my occasional Church hop or outing with friends; it was other denominations that caused me to flee and return home to the LCMS.

Wow. What a misrepresentation of the Seminex controversy and founding of the ELCA, which actually has roots almost as old at the country itself.

Arcangl86 said:

Wow. What a misrepresentation of the Seminex controversy and founding of the ELCA, which actually has roots almost as old at the country itself.

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KMOX: http://youtu.be/1OJ0vIG8IvY

In 1976 the Association of Evangelical Lutheran Churches (AELC) was formed from congregations that left the Lutheran Church—Missouri Synod (LCMS) in a schism precipitated by progressive-traditionalist disputes over higher criticism, academic freedom and ecumenism. Its establishment was precipitated by the controversy at the LCMS's Concordia Seminary in St. Louis, Missouri in 1974, which resulted in the formation of a separate institution "Concordia Seminary-in-Exile" known as "Seminex". The AELC brought approximately 100,000 members into the ELCA. Its immigrant heritage came mostly from Germany; the complexion of its theology generally resembled that of the LCA, as the dissenting former "moderate" faction of the LCMS.

The ELCA officially came into existence on January 1, 1988, by the merging of three churches.

Evangelical Lutheran Church in America - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Thank you for posting some more information. I had a problem with the way you characterized the whole thing. Yes, there were theological conflicts. Yes it was political, but you made it seem like the ELCA was a bunch of people who got kicked out for not being Lutheran and formed it's own church body. It was far more complex then that, and the predecessor bodies fell on all ends of the Lutheran theological spectrum.

Daniel Stinson said:

An Arminian invasion of Lutheran seminaries occurred in the 1950's, the WELS plead with the LCMS not to admit the Arminian leaning Lutherans. The LCMS was slow to listen and grew too fast, by the time the 1970's rolled around the Arminians were professors at the LCMS seminaries. The Confessional Lutherans publicly debated the Arminians and challenged them on issues of theology, threatened with excommunication, many of the Arminians were part of the Seminex Walkout. They split the LCMS in half, taking with them congregations and colleges, renaming themselves the ELCA. The ELCA have completely redefined what it means to be Lutheran in the US and have turned it into just another Prussian Union Church of merged theologies. There remains a high level of animosity between the LCMS and its former congregational members, the ELCA.

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Not anywhere close to being accurate. And splitting the LCMS in half? So, 100,000 left, and 2.5 million stayed in LCMS. Not quite half! And the group that left, the AELC (the 100,000) formed in 1976 and joined with LCA and ALC (both about 2.5 million) in 1988 to form ELCA.

And many of the original people who left (and who stayed) have since died. The “animosity” relates to the theology, not the fact that they were former members of LCMS.

1) Why are you Lutheran (vs. Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox)?

Because in my study of scriptures, and church history and doctrine, the Lutheran doctrines seem most Christ-centered and Scripture-based.

2) What branch of Lutheranism do you follow?

Confessional (LCMS)

3) If you converted to Lutheranism, what faith(s) did you follow previously?

I was raised Presbyterian, and attended many other denominations (charismatic, Methodist, Episcopalian, Roman Catholic, Baptist, non-denom (basically reformed Baptist)). I was ordained an elder in the Presbyterian Church USA. That's when I really started studying the catechisms and confessions. And it lead me away from the Reformed faith into the Lutheran stream. I've been Lutheran now for about ten years.

4) And what convinced you to convert?

Four reasons, in order of when I learned them, or they became important to me:

Soteriology. I just couldn't find three (and a half) petals of the TULIP in Scripture, no matter how I tried. It made "sense" but it wasn't Scriptural. I was becoming more and more disheartened with Reformed teaching on limited atonement, irresistible grace, and the perseverance of the saints. When I began studying Lutheran doctrine, I kept finding things I'd already learned in Scripture. They weren't afraid to say "Yeah, it may not make sense to our human senses. It's a Mystery. And we're okay with that."

Christ-centered. I'd grown up hearing EITHER the Law (you have to do this or that) OR the Gospel (God loves you and has died for you) in sermons. Lutherans taught me a different way to read Scripture, that identifies both the Law and the Gospel, and ties them together. You can't have one without the other. The Bible opened up in a new way to me, because now I can see Christ in almost every passage, and the Law as well. It's not Old Testament = Law and New Testament = Gospel. It's both, together, pointing to Christ, who is the center of the whole story.

Sacraments. This wasn't as big a thing for me at first, but the teaching of the Real Presence in the Eucharist and the work of Christ in Baptism made a huge difference to me in how I worshiped. Again, it fit Scripture so nicely, but in a way I'd never been taught before.

Liturgy. My parents-in-law are Presbyterian, and I hadn't realized how Lutheran I had become until we attended their church service one Sunday. While they had a similar Order of Worship (Introit, Confession, Scripture, Sermon, Offering, Prayers, Communion, Benediction), I found that I sorely missed the... well, the active participation, I guess. In Lutheran services, you don't just sit and listen. You respond. You sing. Sometimes you chant. Every part of the liturgy is directly from Scripture (and the references are printed in our bulletin if you want to look them up) from the Te Deum to the Nunc Dimitus. I find that my private devotions have taken on liturgical structures as well, because I use the Morning or Evening prayer service from the hymnal to structure it. It's not something I was looking for when I first visited the Lutheran church, but I find now that it has strong impact on worship.

Important point ...

Lutherans also happen to be incredibly cute individuals.

Edial said:

Important point ...

Lutherans also happen to be incredibly cute individuals.

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As we seem to have left theological merits of Lutherans, and are now concerned with how cute some are considered to be, I will also ask an unrelated question, In Gen 1:1 a world is created. Q where is that world now?

Semiday said:

As we seem to have left theological merits of Lutherans, and are now concerned with how cute some are considered to be, I will also ask an unrelated question, In Gen 1:1 a world is created. Q where is that world now?

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The original intent of this thread remains. If you wish to ask a completely unrelated question, please, create your own thread for it.

Sorry for deviating from the thread.
Yes some of them really are very cute, Am I back on the straight and narrow now?

I thought as your name contained the term Mystic… you would be concerned with things other than how cute the Lutherans they are, (my mistake)

My personal convictions about what I find in Scripture.

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Athelstan said:

My personal convictions about what I find in Scripture.

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That seems like a solid reason for being a practicing Lutheran.

1) Why are you Lutheran (vs. Catholic/Protestant/Orthodox)?

I am both Lutheran and Anglican. Why? Because what I was very attracted to what I read by Luther, C.S. Lewis and N.T. Wright, and repelled by what I found in most other denominations. I like the Anglican via media thing, a middle way between Protestant and Catholic, and Lutherans have some of that going to too.

2) What branch of Lutheranism do you follow?

ELCA, and simultaneously TEC, because my church has both formal affliations.

3) If you converted to Lutheranism, what faith(s) did you follow previously?

I came to it from Assemblies of God, which in my congregation was very similar to conservative Methodist that was also sanely charismatic. It was a comfy way station for a while, but it wasn't where I really belonged.

4) And what convinced you to convert?

I like Lutheran grace-centered theology. The Lutheran version of monergism satisfies me, where Arminianism and Calvinism do not.

What I find interesting in this discussion is that there is a wide spread of Lutheran sensibilities but that we all believe the same theology. That is what is so fascinating about Lutherans; we are very precise in matters of doctrine.

Yes, some Synods/ Diocese welcome women and gays into the priesthood but the Gospel preached is identical across the globe. Lutherans in worship, a glorious sight.

I'm currently debating with myself about which church I should really belong in, but I still like the Lutheran church for two reasons: it's counted as temperate or diplomatic protestantism which is willing to do dialogue and interaction with the other churches, and it encourages us to read the scripture ourselves for trying to discover what Christianity is in it's purest form.

Edial said:

Important point ...

Lutherans also happen to be incredibly cute individuals.

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Not to toot mine or the misses horn, but yep, got to agree there!

Athelstan said:

Not to toot mine or the misses horn, but yep, got to agree there!

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Well... the Misses at any rate!

I was raised and confirmed LCMS many years ago, but attended a non-denominational church for a number of years after I came back to Christ after being a prodigal daughter.
the pastor was a good, God fearing man who loved the Lord as were many of the congregation but:

I didn't like the lack of the belief in the Real Presence in the Eucharist-after reading through the Bible a few times it was more than obvious to me that this is what scripture plainly says especially 1 Corinthians 11 especially vs. 29.
I also was being pressured to be re-baptized as I was being told I didn't understand what I was doing as an infant I instinctively felt this was wrong and found my support in Scripture - baptism is a sacrament for the forgiveness of sins!
I began to be troubled by a lack of connection to historic Christianity and the ancient liturgy, in the non denom church.
This was all brought home to me when I visited a Lutheran Church(ELCA) around the corner from my home.
So I left my non-denom and joined the Lutheran church the Church of my childhood.
Oh that and the fact the Lutheran bible studies were so much more in-depth in Scripture than the nondenom ones-really delving into Scripture! (Some other churches probably do this, too, but Christian education is first and foremost in Lutheran Churches.)
We actually studied the 10 commandments, the creeds, the Old and New Testament in entirety.
And the Law and Gospel distinction.