Who is the restrainer in 2 Thessalonians?

LittleLambofJesus · Jun 13, 2014

2 Thess 2:5 Not ye are remembering that still being toward ye these-things I told ye?
6 And now the restraining/retaining/katecon <2722> (5723) ye have been aware into the to be un-covered/apo-kalufqhnai <601> (5683) him in the of *himself time.

Since this is a rather controversial verse among Christians today, I thought I would make a thread on it since this other one was closed for inactivity:

Who is the restrainer in 2 Thessalonians?

Originally Posted by DeirdreB

I have heard many theories as to who the restrainer is in 2 Thessalonians 2:6-7:
6 And now you know what is restraining/kat-econ <2722> (5723) him [from being revealed at this time]; it is so that he may be manifested (revealed) in his own [appointed] time.
7 For the mystery of lawlessness (that hidden principle of rebellion against constituted authority) is already at work in the world, [but it is] restrained only until he who restrains is taken out of the way.

I am curious as who my fellow eschatologists think the restrainer is.

God Bless!

.

dfw69 · Jun 13, 2014

The church is the restrainer

n2thelight · Jun 13, 2014

Michael

Ronald · Jun 14, 2014

The Restrainer is the Holy Spirit, Who restrains evil. He will be removed and then all hell will break loose, unrestrained evil, where men follow their core inclinations. When the guidance and force of God is absent, what's left?

This is supported and leads into this understanding: "It is a righteous thing for God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you" 2 Thes 1:6
"...to give us rest when Jesus is revealed from heaven with His angels..." vs.7
"In fire taking vengeance on the who do not know God or obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ." vs.8
Good and evil have been balanced throughout history by His will. We have to appreciate this reality. He allows evil for a purpose, usually lessons. We would not know or appreciate what good is without it's opposite.
And of course since we are the Temple of the Holy Spirit, this implies that the church is taken away/raptured. We do God's work! When we are gone, the secular, liberal, lust of the flesh and pride of life will explode, but of course the antichrist will get everyone's attention, and he will control them, he will be their god. It makes you wonder, what kind of law and order will he enforce? Everything he says is a lie and everything he lures people into doing is sin. He told Jesus, worship me and I'll give you everything. Eat, drink and sin all you want ... ??? I think people will be so preoccupied with survival and staying alive during these times that there couldn't possibly be order.

random person · Jun 14, 2014

Ronald said:
The Restrainer is the Holy Spirit, Who restrains evil. He will be removed and then all hell will break loose, unrestrained evil, where men follow their core inclinations. When the guidance and force of God is absent, what's left?

This is supported and leads into this understanding: "It is a righteous thing for God to repay with tribulation those who trouble you" 2 Thes 1:6
"...to give us rest when Jesus is revealed from heaven with His angels..." vs.7
"In fire taking vengeance on the who do not know God or obey the gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ." vs.8
Good and evil have been balanced throughout history by His will. We have to appreciate this reality. He allows evil for a purpose, usually lessons. We would not know or appreciate what good is without it's opposite.
And of course since we are the Temple of the Holy Spirit, this implies that the church is taken away/raptured. We do God's work! When we are gone, the secular, liberal, lust of the flesh and pride of life will explode, but of course the antichrist will get everyone's attention, and he will control them, he will be their god. It makes you wonder, what kind of law and order will he enforce? Everything he says is a lie and everything he lures people into doing is sin. He told Jesus, worship me and I'll give you everything. Eat, drink and sin all you want ... ??? I think people will be so preoccupied with survival and staying alive during these times that there couldn't possibly be order.

Have you ever read Ephesians 1:13, 4:30, & Romans 8:9?

You promote antibiblical synergism that man assists God in their salvation rather than monergism in which salvation is completely the work of God.

If there is no Holy Spirit on the earth for 7 years, not a single soul in your "tribulation" will be saved. Because if you are truly God's, you will have the Holy Spirit as a seal. If you do not have the Holy Spirit, YOU ARE NOT GOD'S!

random person · Jun 14, 2014

dfw69 said:
The church is the restrainer

No church or kingdom during the world's "darkest hour", eh?

The kingdom and the church are one and the same, so, what you believe is God is going to scuttle His kingdom away before the mighty face of the antichrist kingdom... Satan's kingdom of darkness?

What about Ephesians 3:21?

Pfft!

What ever god you worship, is a coward and weak, and the gates of hell will prevail against his kingdom.

The God I worship, is awesome and omnipotent, whose eternal purpose in Christ is revealed by the church throughout all ages, WORLD WITHOUT END, AMEN.

LittleLambofJesus · Jun 14, 2014

n2thelight said:
Michael

Michael is mentioned in the Jewish Hebrew book of Revelation:

YLT Search Results for "michael"

Dan 10:21
but I declare to thee that which is noted down in the Writing of Truth, and there is not one strengthening himself with me, concerning these, except Michael your head.
Dan 12:1
'And at that time stand up doth Michael, the great head, who is standing up for the sons of thy people, and there hath been a time of distress, such as hath not been since there hath been a nation till that time, and at that time do thy people escape, every one who is found written in the book.

Rev 12:7
And there came war in the heaven; Michael and his messengers did war against the dragon, and the dragon did war, and his messengers,

Dragonslayer (1981) - Modern Trailer - YouTube

,

random person · Jun 14, 2014

LittleLambofJesus said:
Michael is mentioned in the Jewish Hebrew book of Revelation:

YLT Search Results for "michael"

Dan 10:21
but I declare to thee that which is noted down in the Writing of Truth, and there is not one strengthening himself with me, concerning these, except Michael your head.
Dan 12:1
'And at that time stand up doth Michael, the great head, who is standing up for the sons of thy people, and there hath been a time of distress, such as hath not been since there hath been a nation till that time, and at that time do thy people escape, every one who is found written in the book.

Rev 12:7
And there came war in the heaven; Michael and his messengers did war against the dragon, and the dragon did war, and his messengers,

Dragonslayer (1981) - Modern Trailer - YouTube

,

I am of the school of thought that Michael is a type of Christ.

Dave Watchman · Jun 14, 2014

I am curious as who my fellow eschatologists think the restrainer is.

In another thread I said:

Can it be as simple as this? The Woman's Liberation Movement of 1848? The Woman's Liberation Movement of 1848 is holding back the man of lawlessness. Once we can get these women out of the way, the man of sin, the son of perdition will be revealed. I think you guys are on to something big. It can't be a coincidence that 1848 was only 4 years after 1844 when the temple was cleansed. It sounds logical that these women would be the restrainers. It might be a lucky thing that the WLM was not at the DofJ or the AofD that came before the DofJ would have been much worse. Keep up the good work and you guys might become doctors of peterisms or amilleniumisors.

I'm sorry about that, I was just kidding around.

The real restrainer is Jesus.

He is doing "the daily" in heavens temple, but He is restraining much more than just the man of sin.

"Now the point in what we are saying is this: we have such a high priest, one who is seated at the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in heaven, 2 a minister in the holy places, in the true tent that the Lord set up, not man. 3 For every high priest is appointed to offer gifts and sacrifices; thus it is necessary for this priest also to have something to offer".

Jesus has been doing this daily sacrifice since the garden of Eden, standing in between humanity and the wrath of God. This is why Adam didn't die on the very day that he disobeyed, Jesus stood in the way. Who can take Him out of the way? Antiochus Epiphanes? A human Antichrist? The Pope? Nope. No human being can take the daily away from Jesus. Even the Devil himself can't take the daily away from Jesus by direct confrontation. Satan will do this indirectly like a hostage situation. By causing the world to fill up it's cup of iniquity, the moment will come when Jesus says enough is enough; there will be no more delay. He steps out of the way in heavens temple and the wrath of God begins. This happens in Revelation 8 when the censer is cast down:

3 And another angel came and stood at the altar with a golden censer, and he was given much incense to offer with the prayers of all the saints on the golden altar before the throne, 4 and the smoke of the incense, with the prayers of the saints, rose before God from the hand of the angel. 5 Then the angel took the censer and filled it with fire from the altar and threw it on the earth, and there were peals of thunder, rumblings,[a] flashes of lightning, and an earthquake.

Jesus has a helper angel with a censer in heavens temple. This censer is used at the alter of incense which is for corporate atonement. When this daily service stops, the time of the end begins. The angel throwing the censer down on the earth is similar to Moses throwing the 10 commandments down on old Israel at Mt Sinai, there is a sense of righteous indignation. Gabriel kind of let the cat out of the bag when he told Daniel:

I am going to tell you what will happen later in "the time of wrath", because the vision concerns "the appointed time of the end".

Sounds to me like "the appointed time of the end" is "the time of wrath" and that the only temple we gotta worry about is the One already up there.

The following errors occurred with your submission:

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You are not fooling around. 50 posts mean 50 literal posts.

dfw69 · Jun 14, 2014

random person said:
No church or kingdom during the world's "darkest hour", eh?

The kingdom and the church are one and the same, so, what you believe is God is going to scuttle His kingdom away before the mighty face of the antichrist kingdom... Satan's kingdom of darkness?

What about Ephesians 3:21?

Pfft!

What ever god you worship, is a coward and weak, and the gates of hell will prevail against his kingdom.

The God I worship, is awesome and omnipotent, whose eternal purpose in Christ is revealed by the church throughout all ages, WORLD WITHOUT END, AMEN.

My god is god ... How can the gates of hell prevail against his church if it is raptured and taken to heaven?

Ronald · Jun 14, 2014

random person said:
random person said:

Have you ever read Ephesians 1:13, 4:30, & Romans 8:9?

Click to expand...

Yes, I am in agreement with them and nothing I said is contrary to these truths.

You promote antibiblical synergism that man assists God in their salvation rather than monergism in which salvation is completely the work of God.

Click to expand...

On the contrary, I believe it is all God's grace that we are saved. Without God, we could not be saved. We are chosen, elected, I get it. This does not negate that God works through us to restrain evil. He sets up governments through us, courts and judges that put people in jail for evil deeds.

If there is no Holy Spirit on the earth for 7 years, not a single soul in your "tribulation" will be saved

Click to expand...

I don't adhere to a 7-year trib, it's 3 1/2 years. Besides I am a Mid-tribber who thinks we will have to go through some tribulation as you can see a Multitude in heaven THAT CAME OUT OF THE TRIBULATION. (SEE REV.7:14)
Why don't you stick to the topic. The Holy Spirit is the Restrainer > what say you?

Because if you are truly God's, you will have the Holy Spirit as a seal.

Click to expand...

No argument there! You twist what I say and draw irrelevant conclusions.

If you do not have the Holy Spirit, YOU ARE NOT GOD'S!

Click to expand...

Of course not. I think you communicate on a different frequency, I can't quite tune it in, too much static!
Oh, it's the Amillennial station. Sorry, I've decided recently not to turn that channel on. Bye.

LittleLambofJesus · Jun 14, 2014

Ronald said:
Originally Posted by random person
If you do not have the Holy Spirit, YOU ARE NOT GOD'S!

Click to expand...

Of course not. I think you communicate on a different frequency, I can't quite tune it in, too much static!
Oh, it's the Amillennial station. Sorry, I've decided recently not to turn that channel on. Bye.

Off topic, but what the heck...........

http://outpostsite.com/media.php?pageID=13

.

n2thelight · Jun 15, 2014

II Thessalonians 2:6 "And now ye know what withholdeth [that which restraineth to the end] that he might be revealed in his time [own season]."

The subject here is "the son of perdition", Satan, the Antichrist, or what ever name you desire to use for him. He is Satan, and Satan will commit the "abomination of desolation" of Daniel 9:27; and the church will be here to see it, because the "gathering", or Christ's return follows this.

II Thessalonians 2:7 "For the mystery of iniquity [lawlessness] doth already work: only he who now letteth will let, until he be taken out of the way."

There is no mystery around when this will take place, for we will know his methods of operation [withholdeth], and the signs, the seasons, and the times of Satan's arrival to earth. If you are in the Word of God and not following these "one verse preachers", you will know when to expect the Antichrist. You will also know within hours of when to expect our Lord Jesus Christ's return. Satan's reign on earth is not seven years because God reduced that time to five months for the "elect's" sake, as Jesus told us in Matthew 24:22. Jesus also revealed that the time is shortened to five months, to John in Revelation 9:5, and 10.
\
The "mystery of lawlessness" is the mystery of iniquity. "He who now letteth will let"; in the Greek should be translated; "He who holds fast [ketcho] will stand." The ellipsis, or "omission from an expression of a word clearly implied"; "There is one who hold's fast", instead of by repeating the verb, "will let". However, "katecho" is a transitive verb, and an object must be supplied also. So if the subject in verse six is Satan, then the object must be his position in the heavenlies [see Ephesians 6:12], from which he will be ejected from heaven by Michael [Revelation 12:7-9].
"Out of the way", in the Greek is "out of ek", or "the midst". It is the same expression used in Acts 17:33, and I Corinthians 5:2.

Many "rapture theorists" claim this one who "letteth" is the Holy Spirit, and they claim that when He is "taken away", then the Antichrist will come. By reversing the role of the characters in the verses here, and attributing what is Satan's to the Holy Spirit, you have a whole new doctrine called the "Any moment doctrine". This false doctrine is better known as the "rapture theory". It is dangerous to play around with a foreign language; and when the flock relies upon their shepherd for the truth, and the shepherd is assumed to be correct; in ignorance it is accepted just because he said it.

It is Michael who "holds fast" on to Lucifer [the Antichrist], and Michael will continue to keep Lucifer held until the appointed time, spoken of above. That time is appointed by God. Then at the appointed time God will give Satan the keys [authority] to release his fallen angels and they will be cast to the earth [see Revelation 9:1-10]. Let's take a look at the one [Michael] who holds on to Satan now.

Revelation 12:7; "And there was war in heaven: Michael and his angels fought against the dragon; and the dragon fought and his angels," Michael [that is who the "he" is in II Thessalonians 2:7 and his [Michael's] angels fought against the dragon [another name for Satan] and his [Satan's] fallen angels.

Revelation 12:8; "And prevailed not; neither was their place found any more in heaven." This war took place in heaven, and that is where Satan and his angels are now; though Satan's spirit, and demonic spirits are all over the earth today. Now we will see what Michael does with Satan, in fulfilling II Thessalonians 2:7.

Revelation 12:9; "And the great dragon [Satan] was cast out [that is the transitive verb of verse seven], that old serpent [this is the role Satan played in the Garden of Eden], called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world [except for God's elect]: he was cast out onto the earth, and his angels were cast out with him."
This is when Satan will physically appear on earth as a man with his angels. This is the time of the Antichrist's coming, and we must know when this time is by when these events takes place, for Satan comes at the sixth trumpet.

Then the verse picks up where Satan is standing in the holy place. Satan's object is to deceive all the world, and have the world take his markings in their minds. God's Word thus says that Satan will come to earth and stand in that Holy place, before Christ will come and gather anyone back to Himself.

random person · Jun 16, 2014

dfw69 said:
My god is god ... How can the gates of hell prevail against his church if it is raptured and taken to heaven?

By the kingdom of the church surrendering the whole earth to Satan's kingdom of darkness and experience zero growth for 7 years. Because there are no Christians or church preaching the Gospel in this period.

COLOSSIANS 1:13!

random person · Jun 16, 2014

Ronald said:
Yes, I am in agreement with them and nothing I said is contrary to these truths.

On the contrary, I believe it is all God's grace that we are saved. Without God, we could not be saved. We are chosen, elected, I get it. This does not negate that God works through us to restrain evil. He sets up governments through us, courts and judges that put people in jail for evil deeds.

I don't adhere to a 7-year trib, it's 3 1/2 years. Besides I am a Mid-tribber who thinks we will have to go through some tribulation as you can see a Multitude in heaven THAT CAME OUT OF THE TRIBULATION. (SEE REV.7:14)
Why don't you stick to the topic. The Holy Spirit is the Restrainer > what say you?

No argument there! You twist what I say and draw irrelevant conclusions.

Of course not. I think you communicate on a different frequency, I can't quite tune it in, too much static!
Oh, it's the Amillennial station. Sorry, I've decided recently not to turn that channel on. Bye.

Click to expand...

Now, you are contradicting yourself. If there is no Holy Spirit on the earth for 3.5 years, mid-tribber, than there will be no one saved NOT A SINGLE SOUL during the tribulation because nobody will have the Holy Spirit who is the believer's seal of salvation and redemption.

dfw69 · Jun 16, 2014

random person said:
By the kingdom of the church surrendering the whole earth to Satan's kingdom of darkness and experience zero growth for 7 years. Because there are no Christians or church preaching the Gospel in this period.

COLOSSIANS 1:13!

There will be growth in the tribulation ... Gods spirit is still at work and it will be poured out in those days

Many will see visions and dream dreams and prophesy and witness the gospel though persecuted... They will not conform to the laws of the false messiah to come.. who will desire judgement upon his rebels against his kingdom

Many will awaken and repent and believe the gospel and continue to treat each other as Jesus laws commanded ... To love one another .. Judge not condemn not...have mercy forgive sins 70x7

Many tribulations saints will be saved after the tribulation by gods spirit

144000 will witness the gospel

Enoch and Elijah will witness the gospel

Angels will fly above and witness the gospel

It will not be a hopeless time ...

bibletruth469 · Jun 16, 2014

The restrainer in that passage, I believe to be the Holy Spirit . He resides inside of every true believer that is in Christ . Once the entire church is raptured , the living spirit of God will ' caught up' with every believer .

Just because the rapture takes place doesn't mean that the Holy Spirit just disappears . He is still present but He does not reside within the tribulation believers he will still be present but just in a different way. ( similar to the Old Testament ) . However , there are some exceptions , just like in the Old Testament . For example , the 2 witnesses and the 144,000 will be sealed with the Holy Spirit .

. This indwelling of the Holy Spirit is a promise to the Chuch . Eph 1:13, " in whom ye also trusted , after ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after you believed , ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise".

dfw69 · Jun 16, 2014

bibletruth469 said:
The restrainer in that passage, I believe to be the Holy Spirit . He resides inside of every true believer that is in Christ . Once the entire church is raptured , the living spirit of God will ' caught up' with every believer .

Just because the rapture takes place doesn't mean that the Holy Spirit just disappears . He is still present but He does not reside within the tribulation believers he will still be present but just in a different way. ( similar to the Old Testament ) . However , there are some exceptions , just like in the Old Testament . For example , the 2 witnesses and the 144,000 will be sealed with the Holy Spirit .

. This indwelling of the Holy Spirit is a promise to the Chuch . Eph 1:13, " in whom ye also trusted , after ye heard the word of truth, the gospel of your salvation: in whom also after you believed , ye were sealed with that Holy Spirit of promise".

Would not the Holy Spirit seal tribulation saints if they repented and believed the gospel?

bibletruth469 · Jun 16, 2014

dfw69 said:
Would not the Holy Spirit seal tribulation saints if they repented and believed the gospel?

I don't think so. The Old Testament believers were not sealed with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit . The tribulation saints, since they are not part of the church will have different requirements .

The tribulation saints will still be saved, but they will not have the spirit of God living inside of them. If you happen to find a scripture passage that you believe states otherwise, please let me know. Thanks!

dfw69 · Jun 16, 2014

bibletruth469 said:
I don't think so. The Old Testament believers were not sealed with the indwelling of the Holy Spirit . The tribulation saints, since they are not part of the church will have different requirements .

The tribulation saints will still be saved, but they will not have the spirit of God living inside of them. If you happen to find a scripture passage that you believe states otherwise, please let me know. Thanks!

To tell you the truth I never really questioned it till now... I was just wondering.. I really don't know ..

Thanks for your reply peace

Who is the restrainer in 2 Thessalonians?

Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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