Lucifer

smaneck · May 26, 2014

delete

CherubRam · May 26, 2014

CherubRam said:
There is a literal Babylon, and there is a parabolic Babylon.

Isaiah 14 is a parabolic Babylon.

Isaiah 14:4
you will take up this taunt against the king of Babylon: How the oppressor has come to an end! How his fury has ended!

Isaiah 14:22
I will rise up against them, declares the Lord Almighty. I will wipe out Babylons name and survivors, her offspring and descendants, declares the Lord.

1 Peter 5:13
She who is in Babylon, chosen together with you, sends you her greetings, and so does my son Mark.

Revelation 17:5
The name written on her forehead was a mystery: Babylon the great the mother of prostitutes and of the abominations of the earth.

Dragon Leviathan Serpent

Isaiah 27:1
In that day, the Lord will punish with his sword his fierce, great and powerful sword Leviathan the gliding serpent, Leviathan the coiling serpent; he will slay the monster of the sea.

Revelation 13:1
The dragon stood on the shore of the sea. And I saw a beast coming out of the sea. It had ten horns and seven heads, with ten crowns on its horns, and on each head a blasphemous name.

Jeremiah 9:12
Who is wise enough to understand this? Who has been instructed by the Lord and can explain it? Why has the earth been ruined and laid waste like a desert that no one can cross?

Isaiah 14
:12 How you have fallen from heaven,
Day Star, son of the dawn!(Rising {Son / Sun} is a term for Satan)
You have been cast down to the ground,
you have brought down the nations
13 and you said in your heart,
I will ascend to the heavens;
I will raise my throne
above the stars of God; ( The Stars of God are the people of God)
I will sit enthroned on the mount of assembly,
on the utmost heights of Mount Zaphon.
14 I will ascend above the tops of the clouds;
I will make myself like the Most High.
15 But you are brought down to the place of the dead,
to the depths of the pit.
16 Those who see you stare at you,
they ponder your fate:
Is this the man who shook the earth
and made kingdoms tremble,
17 the man who made the world a desert,
who overthrew its cities
and would not let his captives go home?
18 All the kings of the nations lie in state,
each in his own tomb.
19 But you are cast out of your tomb
like a rejected branch;
you are covered with the slain,
with those pierced by the sword,
those who descend to the stones of the pit.
Like a corpse trampled underfoot,
20 you will not join them in burial,
for you have destroyed your land
and killed your people.
Let the offspring of the wicked
never be mentioned again.
21 Prepare a place to slaughter his children
for the sins of their ancestors;
they are not to rise to inherit the earth
and cover the world with their cities.

Note: Isaiah 14:13. Mount Zaphon was a sacred place for the Canaanites. The Canaanites these days call themselves Palestinian.

smaneck · May 26, 2014

CherubRam said:
Note: Isaiah 14:13. Mount Zaphon was a sacred place for the Canaanites. The Canaanites these days call themselves Palestinian.

Actually the Palestinians are more likely the descendants of the Samaritans.

CherubRam · May 26, 2014

smaneck said:
Actually the Palestinians are more likely the descendants of the Samaritans.

I am aware that the Samaritans and Canaanites had relations together.

smaneck · May 26, 2014

CherubRam said:
I am aware that the Samaritans and Canaanites had relations together.

No more than the people of Judea did. The Samaritans intermarried with people the Assyrians settled in Samaria after the Samaritan elites were carried off into captivity, but these were not Canaanites. During this time, the Canaanites were known as Phoenicians and rather than fight against the Assyrians, they relocated to N. Africa where they founded in the Carthaginian Empire.

LoAmmi · May 26, 2014

I don't believe the New Testament is true. Why do you quote it to me, Cherub, to prove your theories? Why not quote the Quran and the Book of Mormon while you're at it?

smaneck · May 26, 2014

CherubRam said:
There is a literal Babylon, and there is a parabolic Babylon.

Right. The Babylon of the Tanakh is literal, the Babylon of the New Testament is parabolic.

CherubRam · May 26, 2014

LoAmmi said:
I don't believe the New Testament is true. Why do you quote it to me, Cherub, to prove your theories? Why not quote the Quran and the Book of Mormon while you're at it?

The New Testament is not a book of witchcraft LoAmmi. It was the Catholics who made changes to suit their doctrinal beliefs. If it was not for that, it would fit perfectly with the fulfillment of Orthodox Judaism. By the way, it was the Hellenistic Jews who made some changes to the Old Testament themselves.

ViaCrucis · May 27, 2014

CherubRam said:
The New Testament is not a book of witchcraft LoAmmi. It was the Catholics who made changes to suit their doctrinal beliefs. If it was not for that, it would fit perfectly with the fulfillment of Orthodox Judaism. By the way, it was the Hellenistic Jews who made some changes to the Old Testament themselves.

Of course they did.

Here's a cookie.

Don't worry, it's not real chocolate. I used carob chips, because I know how chocolate is a 3rd degree blackbelt in the international lizard people society for martial cookery, an incorporated franchise of the Stalinist Illuminati People's Party of Vatican Fishmen of Mars.

Can't be too careful with these things.

-CryptoLutheran

awitch · May 27, 2014

ViaCrucis said:
Of course they did.

Here's a cookie.

Don't worry, it's not real chocolate. I used carob chips, because I know how chocolate is a 3rd degree blackbelt in the international lizard people society for martial cookery, an incorporated franchise of the Stalinist Illuminati People's Party of Vatican Fishmen of Mars.

Can't be too careful with these things.

-CryptoLutheran

LoAmmi · May 27, 2014

CherubRam said:
The New Testament is not a book of witchcraft LoAmmi. It was the Catholics who made changes to suit their doctrinal beliefs. If it was not for that, it would fit perfectly with the fulfillment of Orthodox Judaism. By the way, it was the Hellenistic Jews who made some changes to the Old Testament themselves.

I never said it was a book of witchcraft. The Lord of the Rings isn't a book of witchcraft but that doesn't mean I believe it is something that is true.

CherubRam · May 27, 2014

LoAmmi said:
I never said it was a book of witchcraft. The Lord of the Rings isn't a book of witchcraft but that doesn't mean I believe it is something that is true.

Jews living in Christ day believed it. After killing Hebrew Christians, the Jews would take the New testament scripture written in Hebrew, and carefully cut the name of God out. Then they would place the divine name in a safe place to keep. Following that, they then would burn the remainder of the scrolls in a fire. Rabbi Jose ben Halafta who lived during the second century AD states that, "One cuts out the reference to the Divine Name which are in them [the New Testament writings] and stores them away, and the rest burns." One of his characteristic sayings is, "He who proclaimed the coming of the Messiah,[John] and he who hated scholars [Yahshua] and his disciples; and that false prophet and those slanderers, will have no part in the future world." According to Wilhelm Bacher this was directed against the Hebrew Christians. And so it is an established fact then, that the disciples of Christ did in fact write the Holy Name of God into the original New Testament.

Rabbi Yose: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jose_ben_Halafta

Wilhelm Bacher: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wilhelm_Bacher

LoAmmi · May 27, 2014

CherubRam said:
Jews living in Christ day believed it. After killing Hebrew Christians, the Jews would take the New testament scripture written in Hebrew, and carefully cut the name of God out. Then they would place the divine name in a safe place to keep. Following that, they then would burn the remainder of the scrolls in a fire. Rabbi Yose who lived during the second century AD states that, "One cuts out the reference to the Divine Name which are in them [the New Testament writings] and stores them away, and the rest burns." One of his characteristic sayings is, "He who proclaimed the coming of the Messiah,[John] and he who hated scholars [Yahshua] and his disciples; and that false prophet and those slanderers, will have no part in the future world." According to Wilhelm Bacher this was directed against the Hebrew Christians. And so it is an established fact then, that the disciples of Christ did in fact write the Holy Name of God into the original New Testament.

I've only been able to find your assertion with you. Do you have some other evidence where I can actually read what is written there instead of your interpretation of it?

What's the bloody difference anyway? A book of nonsense that contained the divine name would still be a book of nonsense. Adding the divine name doesn't make something true. So, your point is what exactly?

CherubRam · May 27, 2014

LoAmmi said:
I've only been able to find your assertion with you. Do you have some other evidence where I can actually read what is written there instead of your interpretation of it?

What's the bloody difference anyway? A book of nonsense that contained the divine name would still be a book of nonsense. Adding the divine name doesn't make something true. So, your point is what exactly?

Rabbi Yose: Jose ben Halafta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wilhelm Bacher: Wilhelm Bacher - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

LoAmmi · May 27, 2014

As I stated though, a book of nonsense is still a book of nonsense no matter what name it has written in it. Why should your assertion that the New Testament had it originally sway me at all? It is a non-factor. Might as well tell me that the New Testament was written on the highest quality scrolls man could make. Doesn't effect the truth of it.

CherubRam · May 27, 2014

LoAmmi said:
As I stated though, a book of nonsense is still a book of nonsense no matter what name it has written in it. Why should your assertion that the New Testament had it originally sway me at all? It is a non-factor. Might as well tell me that the New Testament was written on the highest quality scrolls man could make. Doesn't effect the truth of it.

The bottom line is this. No one is going to stop using New Testament scriptures to please you.

LoAmmi · May 27, 2014

CherubRam said:
The bottom line is this. No one is going to stop using New Testament scriptures to please you.

You keep trying to convince me. I don't believe the New Testament is true. You cannot convince people with items they don't believe are true.

If you simply want to state you believe something, fine, I have no objections. Don't try to convince me by using the New Testament though.

ViaCrucis · May 27, 2014

CherubRam said:
Rabbi Yose: Jose ben Halafta - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wilhelm Bacher: Wilhelm Bacher - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Neither article substantiates your claims, they only mention that according to Bacher Halafta's statement was directed against "Hebrew Christians". Nothing therein about cutting out the divine name from New Testament scrolls and then burning the rest.

You'll need to try again on that one.

-CryptoLutheran

light upon light · May 27, 2014

LoAmmi said:
CherubRam said:

The bottom line is this. No one is going to stop using New Testament scriptures to please you.

Click to expand...

You keep trying to convince me. I don't believe the New Testament is true. You cannot convince people with items they don't believe are true.

CherubRam,

There are so many points of agreement (for example, Abraham, Moses, the Hebrew prophets, the importance of marriage and family, that we worship One God etc.) why is it so important to you that LoAmmi agree with you regarding the New Testament?

CherubRam · May 27, 2014

light upon light said:
CherubRam,

There are so many points of agreement (for example, Abraham, Moses, the Hebrew prophets, the importance of marriage and family, that we worship One God etc.) why is it so important to you that LoAmmi agree with you regarding the New Testament?

I am not going to stop using the New Testament to please him.

He is a Jew, and I am a Judaic Christian. Judaic means: Pertaining to Judaism.

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