Jesus as Savior-a sacrifice?

Rafiel

Member
May 10, 2014
50
4
currently with the snow geese !
✟7,693.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Hi,

It's so weird. I have read the bible since I was a boy. Yet, it is only now that many of the verses you wonderful Christians are mentioning are making something go right/light bulb/click in my mind and heart. Making "sense"? maybe?

I was blind to it so to speak. Overlooked, didn't notice....I don't know.

I have been meditating/talking to God in my heart/mind and soul though out the day, night and when I lay down and when I wake up. God and Jesus are on my awareness.
Ever since I started this post. I've not done so much "praying" in ever!

While I know I am a sinner, and in need of healing, I have generally avoided situations that would get me deeper into sin. There are some things that are potential sins that I have avoided cuz they are way over my head to understand or cope with.

Yet, yesterday evening, those very complicated sin potential situations have presented themselves in my face. Big temptations. I was surprised. I go out of my way to avoid situations that would get me into sinning in ways a part of me is not comfortable with at all. And it isn't about some pleasure sin, it's a temptation because of my solitary lifestyle. A relationship kind of temptation.

what bothered me the most was I had this momentary thought that maybe I should stop thinking about getting saved because it would be an obstacle to this new temptation that surprised me out of the blue.

I am going to need accountability for this temptation. But I am ashamed to talk about it.

cuz I am feeling like what if I accept Jesus and then I fall. I don't want that to happen. I can't avoid seeing this temptation cuz it came to me in my place of employment.

Maybe its something like feeling this huge gap/void/emptiness that I just know that God, and only God, can take care of. But this temptation is like an offer to fill it too. I don't know, I am mixed up over it. I want to choose God. I don't want to be a failure. Can I trust God to help? I know I shouldn't ask that, but it's a trust thing again.

What exactly is Grace? I don't understand it. I have read about it. I know the definition. But what is it? Is it something one can feel inside? Is it like a an unasked for/not hoped for hug?

self worth vs self esteem? what a lot of thoughts that's got me going on. a very "aha" moment. very meaningful ...

Thanks for sharing God.


How does one chat here?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

paul1149

that your faith might rest in the power of God
Supporter
Mar 22, 2011
8,460
5,268
NY
✟674,364.00
Country
United States
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Private
Politics
US-Others
what bothered me the most was I had this momentary thought that maybe I should stop thinking about getting saved because it would be an obstacle to this new temptation that surprised me out of the blue.

I am feeling like what if I accept Jesus and then I fall.

Maybe its something like feeling this huge gap/void/emptiness that I just know that God, and only God, can take care of. But this temptation is like an offer to fill it too. I don't know, I am mixed up over it. I want to choose God. I don't want to be a failure. Can I trust God to help? I know I shouldn't ask that, but it's a trust thing again.

What exactly is Grace? I don't understand it. I have read about it. I know the definition. But what is it? Is it something one can feel inside? Is it like a an unasked for/not hoped for hug?

self worth vs self esteem? what a lot of thoughts that's got me going on. a very "aha" moment. very meaningful ...

It's pretty much the norm for all kinds of issues to kick up when you begin making spiritual progress. If nothing else, call it the inertia of the flesh. If you patiently persevere you will overcome.

About failing after we accept Christ: we come to the Lord because we need help, not because we're inherently good. But it may be that this is academic, for when you see your need for Christ what happens down the road is not important compared to dealing with that paramount need. Once you're in Christ He is faithful to guide you (cf 2Pe 1.1-8).

Grace, as you know, is favor. Consider Romans 4.16:
Because of this, [the promise] is by faith, in order that it may be according to grace, so that the promise may be secure to all the descendants, not only to those of the law, but also to those of the faith of Abraham, who is the father of us all

If we could save ourselves by our works, we wouldn't need faith, because we would see our labors up close and would expect their just payment. If you worked hard all week and produced for the boss, and then he refused to pay you, you would be pretty upset.

But grace is a free gift. We are justified not by our works, but by the imputed merits of Christ on our behalf. Grace is not something that we can produce at hand, we have to reach out to God and accept it. That's where faith comes in. Faith is the means by which we connect with God, the channel through which grace reaches us. (cf Eph 2.8-9)

You hit an important subject with self-esteem and self-worth. AISI, self esteem is our own attempt to value ourselves. The problem is that this can so easily be done humanistically, without God in the equation. Thus many with seared consciences believe in their innocence and hold an undeservedly high view of themselves. I'm not even sure of the validity of self-worth, per se, because as good as we might have been, we were fatally flawed in Adam (God's standard being perfection) and needed rescue. The only safe way I know of finding our significance is to look to the price Jesus paid on the cross for us and deriving it from there. That's the measure of His love for us and our worth in Him. The end result in us is a paradoxical combination of humility and glory, which we call godliness.
 
Upvote 0

Abandoned Barns

Powered by Grace
May 12, 2014
127
24
56
South Carolina
✟15,367.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Hey Raphael. Just have time for a quick note now because I'm on the job today (Boo! for working on Saturdays, but Yay! for the overtime) I'll write some more later though. Wow! Check you out with your getting to know "God and Jesus through prayer" self. That's awesome!

I read once that if you're speeding on the highway and get pulled by the law three things can happen; if the policeman writes you $100 ticket for speeding - that's justice, if he closes his book and tells you not to do it again - that's forgiveness, if he takes out his wallet and hands you $100 - that's Grace. Of course that's a very simple example and Grace which God offers us is worth infinitely more than $100, but I think it helps folks to see the difference. In it's most simplest definition Grace means "unmerited favor", but to Christian it means so much more. To me, it's one of the most exciting and hopeful words in all of the Bible, because it means that no matter how much of a dirt bag I am, I can "trust" that God still loves me, so much so that he died so that we could be together. There's nothing that I can do to ever deserve that love, no amount of good works or remaining unsinfull could ever, on their own, warrant it, but still it's offered to me. That's amazing, because it has to be born of pure love.

Where you're at now, I think. is where a lot of folks find themselves shortly before coming to Jesus. That is that they feel like they have to somehow "get their act together" first in order to become presentable enough to come to Jesus. That's kind of like saying "I have to get this cavity under control, before I can go see the dentist". They feel like somehow you have to make yourself righteous enough to deserve that love. But you know what Bo, you're not. I'm not. Nobody here is. That's the point; we all stink like sin, but He wants us anyway. How cool is that? How amazing is it that we have a God who loves and accepts just for who we are? No games. No putting on fronts or pretending to be something we're not. No feeling self-conscious about what we look like or how cool we are or what kind of jobs we have or clothes we wear. Just as you are, God wants you.

Rafael, look at this:

Ephesians 2 (ESV) said:
[8]For by grace you have been saved through faith; and that not of yourselves, it is the gift of God; [9]not as a result of works, so that no one may boast. [10]For we are His workmanship, created in Christ Jesus for good works, which God prepared beforehand so that we would walk in them.

You're going to see this verse a lot when you come to Jesus. And there are a lot a very loving brothers and sisters in Christ who disagree as to exactly what this verse means. I'll let you figure out for yourself what it's saying, but to me it means that you can't just "good boy" your way into heaven. It just doesn't work. When you let Jesus into your life, something begins to happen to your heart. You want to stop sinning. You want to perform good works to bring him glory. In James we read:

James 2 (ESV) said:
17Even so faith, if it has no works, is dead, being by itself.

And some will take that to mean that even once you believe in Jesus, it's also necessary to perform good works:

Faith + Works --> Salvation

And others, like me, will take that to mean that good works become a function of your faith in Jesus Christ:

Faith --> Salvation + Works

and you'll see Christians fussin at each other about the difference. I don't know, maybe I don't get it, but it seems like a pretty minor difference to be fussing about to me, because what everyone agrees on, is that faith comes first. If you work on your faith, God will work on your heart. And the changes that he makes to our hearts, is what gives us the strength to fight sin.

When I said chat, I just meant if you want to talk some more here. I think the board has a way to send each other private messages, if you wanted to talk about something that you're not comfortable doing so openly in here. I'm not sure if you and I are still too new to use that or not. If there's something that you wanted to talk to just me about, then by all means try to send me a message and if were still too new then we can exchange emails or something, but if it's something that you're comfortable with others on the board being able to read, then you probably want to keep posting in here. I certainly don't have all the answers. I'm really, just a little ahead of you in my walk, so I'm not sure that you want to limit yourself to just my opinion. I know it can be like drinking from the firehose sometimes, but there's a lot of wonderfully loving, very experienced Christians in here here. You probably look back on this thread and be glad that all the information is here.

Ok, back to work I go. I'll check back later. You're doing amazing.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Rafiel

Member
May 10, 2014
50
4
currently with the snow geese !
✟7,693.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
I remember as a young man of 14 I found myself climbing the tall diving board-the one you have to tilt your head back to look at. We had just moved into the neighborhood. It was a public swimming pool. My second time seeing a swimming pool and the first time seeing one with diving boards. I am not sure why I decided to jump from the high board. I am not a heights friendly person by any stretch of the imagination. I walked over to the edge and looked down. A part of me said no. Not gonna jump. So I solved my problem by stepping all the way back to the ladder and running-if figured that I couldn't stop if I ran full speed ahead, so I did indeed run full speed ahead....till I went off into space.

Now, I am looking down into the living waters. And there is the temptation part of me that says don't jump-be afraid. So, I am running full speed ahead.......
 
Upvote 0

Abandoned Barns

Powered by Grace
May 12, 2014
127
24
56
South Carolina
✟15,367.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I remember as a young man of 14 I found myself climbing the tall diving board-the one you have to tilt your head back to look at. We had just moved into the neighborhood. It was a public swimming pool. My second time seeing a swimming pool and the first time seeing one with diving boards. I am not sure why I decided to jump from the high board. I am not a heights friendly person by any stretch of the imagination. I walked over to the edge and looked down. A part of me said no. Not gonna jump. So I solved my problem by stepping all the way back to the ladder and running-if figured that I couldn't stop if I ran full speed ahead, so I did indeed run full speed ahead....till I went off into space.

Now, I am looking down into the living waters. And there is the temptation part of me that says don't jump-be afraid. So, I am running full speed ahead.......
very cool! Go on - GET IT! We'll see you in the pool.

Check this out, Bo:

Everything by Lifehouse - the Skit That Has Moved Millions to Tears - Worship Video

it meant a lot to me, when I was coming to Christ. I've seen it a thousand times and I still can't watch it without getting a frog in my throat.
 
Upvote 0

Emmy

Senior Veteran
Feb 15, 2004
10,199
939
✟50,995.00
Faith
Salvation Army
Dear Rafiel. God wanted a new Covenant established, no more Animal-sacrifices, and Jesus offered Himself to be the Sacrifice to start the New Covenant with. No more animal sacrifices, the Blood of Jesus was the start of the New Covenant between God and Man. From now on God wants our Love with hearts, souls, and minds. The Sacrifice of Jesus was the end of the Old Covenant. We all know that God raised Jesus, and Jesus is our Saviour.
I say this with love, Rafiel. Greetings from Emmy, your sister in Christ.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Abandoned Barns

Powered by Grace
May 12, 2014
127
24
56
South Carolina
✟15,367.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
In your heart, do you repent of that sin, wish to be forgiven of it because you know that it is what separates you from God and understand that without God, there is only death? Do you truly wish to be washed clean of it by the blood of Jesus?
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

Rafiel

Member
May 10, 2014
50
4
currently with the snow geese !
✟7,693.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
In your heart, do you repent of that sin, wish to be forgiven of it because you know that it is what separates you from God and understand that without God, there is only death? Do you truly wish to be washed clean of it by the blood of Jesus?

From the depths of my heart and mind, I am truly sorry for my sins, I am heartbroken by my sins, and want God's forgiveness. I know there is only death for my sins and that I am already dead. I comprehend that Jesus truly shed his blood for my soul. I truly wish to be cleansed by the blood of Jesus.
 
Upvote 0

Abandoned Barns

Powered by Grace
May 12, 2014
127
24
56
South Carolina
✟15,367.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the only begotten son of the father? That he came down to earth and became flesh? That he died on the cross to take away your sins and the sins of all the world? That on the third day he rose from the dead to give us all eternal life?
 
Upvote 0

Rafiel

Member
May 10, 2014
50
4
currently with the snow geese !
✟7,693.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Do you believe that Jesus Christ is the only begotten son of the father? That he came down to earth and became flesh? That he died on the cross to take away your sins and the sins of all the world? That on the third day he rose from the dead to give us all eternal life?

Yes, I believe Jesus Christ is the only begotten son of God the father; that he came down to earth and became flesh. I believe Jesus Christ, our only hope, died on the cross to take away my sins and the sins of the world. Gratefully believe that on the third day, Jesus rose from the dead to give us eternal life.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Rafiel

Member
May 10, 2014
50
4
currently with the snow geese !
✟7,693.00
Faith
Christian
Marital Status
Single
Do you invite our loving Lord Jesus Christ into your life and wish to live with him forever? Do you accept Jesus as your personal Lord and Savior?

My Lord Jesus Christ I pray/ask that you come into my life. I want to live with you forever. Jesus my chest is bursting for you, my whole being accepts you as my personal Lord and precious Savior.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums