Satanic deception?

Herman Hedning · Mar 17, 2014

EternalDragon said:
Those were indentured servants who had their debt paid in return for so many years of work. We are talking lots of money. So if the servant then refuses to work, even when told to do the work, what would you suggest? Their boss is going to be out a lot of money or would need to pay lots of more money for a new servant.

Lets hear your alternative.

I guess he would have to pay lots of money for a new servant, after having done this: "The lord of that servant will come in a day when he looketh not for him, and at an hour when he is not aware, and will cut him in sunder, and will appoint him his portion with the unbelievers."

Luckily, that kind of servant could easily be bought at the local market.

poikilotherm · Mar 17, 2014

dhh712 said:
We can't know if we're deceived because if we knew, we wouldn't be deceived. It is simply a matter of trust. No one should have blind faith (or trust). Faith results from a spiritual experience of God. One experiences the transformed life (at least in my personal experience) and their faith grows from there. I understand this can lead to all sorts of suppositions that Satan could actually be the source of this change and I understand that.

Nonetheless, one cannot exist in a total state of not believing in anything for then that itself would constitute a belief. For the years I was an atheist I felt (now) that I was deceived by the world, brainwashed by it. It was only when I experienced God that there was a difference in my life; His word became life-giving to me. I will die by that testimony than to throw all which He has brought into my life away for fear it is from Satan and not God [besides there is the Scriptural reference which indicates that Satan cannot destroy himselfelse he would be for God which is not possible, yet understand you won't hear Scriptural reference (though then I should say I won't listen to your worldly circular reasoning, but I'll humor a sincere question if it is asked respectfully and not in a deriding manner)].

I don't necessarily ignore it, I just recognize it for what it is: scientific information about the world. What the unbeliever may not understand is that believers take authority only from the Word of God. It doesn't matter what science says about the world. It may be neat stuff that can tell us lots of interesting things which should definitely make us praise the wonderful might and glory of God the Creator, yet the believer does not seek corroboration from the world to authenticate God's word. Rather, it is the other way around. If what comes from the world does not match up with what is said in the Bible, it ultimately is just not the truth, no matter what so-called "facts" from the world may tell us. The deception which resulted in the first instance of disobedience to God was not understanding His word.

"Nonetheless, one cannot exist in a total state of not believing in anything for then that itself would constitute a belief."

But that is your belief - that there exists a supernatural "great deceiver"; what you dont know is the scope of that deception - your belief results in your not knowing what is true and what is deceit - you cannot even know if there is a great deceiver!

"If what comes from the world does not match up with what is said in the Bible, it ultimately is just not the truth, no matter what so-called "facts" from the world may tell us."

But if you cannot be sure that the Bible or your interpretation of it is true then would your faith not be better served by looking for just this type of corroboration? Or is science part of the deception?

Riberra · Mar 17, 2014

Herman Hedning said:
"And that servant, which knew his lord’s will, and prepared not himself, neither did according to his will, shall be beaten with many stripes". Yup, sounds like a terrific job.

Luke 12:45-48 is a parable it as nothing to do with slavery...
This is a warning for God's Servants ...{Luke 12:40}.
"Be ye therefore ready also: for the Son of man cometh at an hour when ye think not." {Luke 12:40}.
(You also must be ready, because the Son of Man will come at an hour when you do not expect him.)

It have the similar meaning as another parable:

1Thes 5:1-4
1 But of the times and the seasons, brethren, ye have no need that I write unto you.
2 For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night.
3 For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape.
4 But ye, brethren, are not in darkness, that that day should overtake you as a thief. (KJV)

It says that that day won't overtake us as a thief in the night (unexpectedly), it does NOT say that that day will not overtake us at all! Why would God warn us, whom "are not in darkness" and whom "For yourselves know perfectly that the day of the Lord so cometh as a thief in the night" to be careful of Christ's return if we "brethren" are to already have been Raptured out before it happened? And if we are gone prior to the Second Advent then how could it be possible "that that day should overtake you as a thief"??? This Scripture is not written to un-saved sinners or to satan worshippers, or to Muslims, or to Hindus..., it is written to God's servants, brethren of Apostle Paul in Christianity. Why would God warn us if we weren't going to be here for the event?!? He would not! The answer is because nobody is being Raptured out of anywhere! But many will be deceived into worshipping the false christ (antichrist - satan) because they haven't been taught that satan comes first claiming to the true Jesus Christ prior to the Second Advent. When satan comes here as the false messiah the Rapturist will have been conditioned to run up to him with open arms, for now, they will think, safety and salvation are here, it is their day for rewards and peace - or is it? The Scripture says: "For when they shall say, Peace and safety; then sudden destruction cometh upon them, as travail upon a woman with child; and they shall not escape" (verse 3 above). That is why God warned us.
They (those deceived) will even unknowingly deliver up their unbeliever relatives and people that will deny this false christ antichrist to satan for conversion, albeit they do so in ignorance; for they will think that they are interceding for them to the true Jesus: "And ye shall be betrayed both by parents, and brethren, and kinsfolks, and friends; and some of you shall they cause to be put to death" {Luke 21:16}. This is the Great Tribulation spoken of, and that is where their false Rapture doctrines shall lead them. But the Rapturists aren't the only ones that the antichrist will deceive, it is written that he (satan - antichrist) "deceiveth the whole world" {Rev 12:9}.

There is a certain pitiful irony in the fact that they call their Rapture doctrine the "Rapture of the 'Saints'." I could point out that it is more than a little presumptuous to go around calling oneself a Saint.... Especially when the Rapture Saints will be worshipping satan (antichrist) when our True Messiah Jesus Christ returns to the earth at His prophesied Second Advent, although they will be doing so unawares.
These Rapturists are not evil satan worshipping people, they are good Christians who truly do love the Lord Jesus Christ and our Heavenly Father, but they will do it in ignorance because they have allowed satan and his false ministers to deceive them with false non-Biblical teachings and the lies of men instead of the truth of God's Word. Even many ministers that teach Rapture doctrines simply teach what they have been taught and ignorantly pass on the lie like the plague - satan's plague.
We shall not even mention all the false religions of the planet, but will specifically concern ourselves with Christians in this study. The first Christians deceived by satan are the clergy, which has already been long since accomplished, the Seminaries have been compromised and teach much false doctrine. Then those ill taught clergy are used to deceive the rest of the world. It is their shame that the Scripture speaks of, as they realize that they have led their entire flock into the bed of satan: "And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb" {Rev 6:16}. They really didn't mean to, sad isn't it? Have you ever wondered just who it is that runs and finances the Seminary Colleges that produce our Clergy.
But think about it, most Christians could not care less about studying God's Word, they find it easier to go to services once a week and swallow every word from the mystery man at the pulpit without checking it out for themselves in God's Word, the Bible. Satan can reach the whole world by deceiving and/or corrupting a small number of souls who are the teachers/preachers within all the world's religions including Christianity. Can you think of a more effective plan? And as it is written, satan DOES have a plan. God warns us of that plan in the Bible that we don't read, but rather we instead listen to satan's deceived false teachers/preachers -

More:
The Rapture Theory; What Does God's Word Say About It?

poikilotherm · Mar 17, 2014

juvenissun said:
Sorry, I forgot the argument. And it does not worth my effort to dig back to it.

Hmm... something like this:

Premise: Christians are all deceived.
Question: Are they deceived by satan?

Can you see the mess?

He is not special. Most young people today reasoned like this. No wonder the world is a mess and is going to get worse.

I have not said that Christians are all deceived. I asked how do they know that they are not being deceived by the "Great deceiver"? You do believe that Satan can deceive people don`t you? There are many tens of thousands of denominations and many more individual beliefs within them, I would presume you think Satanic deception plays a part in this - how can you know that you are immune? It is a simple question.

Riberra · Mar 17, 2014

poikilotherm said:
I have not said that Christians are all deceived. I asked how do they know that they are not being deceived by the "Great deceiver"? You do believe that Satan can deceive people don`t you? There are many tens of thousands of denominations and many more individual beliefs within them, I would presume you think Satanic deception plays a part in this - how can you know that you are immune? It is a simple question.

Possible Satanic deception.

The Rapture Theory; What Does God's Word Say About It?

juvenissun · Mar 17, 2014

poikilotherm said:
I have not said that Christians are all deceived. I asked how do they know that they are not being deceived by the "Great deceiver"? You do believe that Satan can deceive people don`t you? There are many tens of thousands of denominations and many more individual beliefs within them, I would presume you think Satanic deception plays a part in this - how can you know that you are immune? It is a simple question.

Alright. Let me tell you your mistake:

Satan is part of Christianity. Clear? You can not separate the two.
If you "think" that satan is cheating, then you have already acknowledged that Christianity is true. Otherwise, there is no satan.

TLK Valentine · Mar 17, 2014

juvenissun said:
Alright. Let me tell you your mistake:

Satan is part of Christianity. Clear? You can not separate the two.

If you say so -- wherever there is Christianity, there is Satan.

If you "think" that satan is cheating, then you have already acknowledged that Christianity is true. Otherwise, there is no satan.

Assuming, of course, that Christianity is what defines Satan, and not the other way around.

The possibility exists that you've been conned from day 1.

juvenissun · Mar 17, 2014

TLK Valentine said:
If you say so -- wherever there is Christianity, there is Satan.

Assuming, of course, that Christianity is what defines Satan, and not the other way around.

The possibility exists that you've been conned from day 1.

So are you.

biggles53 · Mar 17, 2014

Riberra said:
Provide the exact verses about God allowing for slavery.

Leviticus 25:

Both your male and female slaves, whom you shall have, shall be of the nations that are round about you; of them shall you buy male and female slaves.

Also of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall you buy, and of their families that are with you, whom they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession.

And you shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your slaves forever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, you shall not rule one over another with harshness.

So....you can buy people who are foreigners in your land and keep them as your property. You can further bequeath that property to your children, if you wish....

Now...would you like the verses that give you permission to treat those slaves harshly, provided they don't die until a day or two after punishment...?

AV1611VET · Mar 17, 2014

biggles53 said:
Now...would you like the verses that give you permission to treat those slaves harshly, provided they don't die until a day or two after punishment...?

General Lee would have been proud of you.

CabVet · Mar 17, 2014

AV1611VET said:
General Lee would have been proud of you.

Yes, he took the Bible "too literally".

Riberra · Mar 17, 2014

biggles53 said:
Leviticus 25:

Both your male and female slaves, whom you shall have, shall be of the nations that are round about you; of them shall you buy male and female slaves.

Also of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall you buy, and of their families that are with you, whom they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession.

And you shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your slaves forever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, you shall not rule one over another with harshness.

So....you can buy people who are foreigners in your land and keep them as your property. You can further bequeath that property to your children, if you wish....

Now...would you like the verses that give you permission to treat those slaves harshly, provided they don't die until a day or two after punishment...?

I am really interested to know from which Bible version you get that?
Here full text from Leviticus 25 from King James Version.Maybe verse 55 may help you understand that you should always read the whole chapter,rather than quoting isolate portion of the text out of context....
55 For unto me the children of Israel are servants; they are my servants whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

Online:

http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/book.php?book=Leviticus&chapter=25&verse=1
LEVITICUS CHAPTER 25
Leviticus 25:

1 And the LORD spake unto Moses in mount Sinai, saying,
2 Speak unto the children of Israel, and say unto them, When ye come into the land which I give you, then shall the land keep a sabbath unto the LORD.
3 Six years thou shalt sow thy field, and six years thou shalt prune thy vineyard, and gather in the fruit thereof;
4 But in the seventh year shall be a sabbath of rest unto the land, a sabbath for the LORD: thou shalt neither sow thy field, nor prune thy vineyard.
5 That which groweth of its own accord of thy harvest thou shalt not reap, neither gather the grapes of thy vine undressed: for it is a year of rest unto the land.
6 And the sabbath of the land shall be meat for you; for thee, and for thy servant, and for thy maid, and for thy hired servant, and for thy stranger that sojourneth with thee,
7 And for thy cattle, and for the beast that are in thy land, shall all the increase thereof be meat.
8 And thou shalt number seven sabbaths of years unto thee, seven times seven years; and the space of the seven sabbaths of years shall be unto thee forty and nine years.
9 Then shalt thou cause the trumpet of the jubile to sound on the tenth day of the seventh month, in the day of atonement shall ye make the trumpet sound throughout all your land.
10 And ye shall hallow the fiftieth year, and proclaim liberty throughout all the land unto all the inhabitants thereof: it shall be a jubile unto you; and ye shall return every man unto his possession, and ye shall return every man unto his family.
11 A jubile shall that fiftieth year be unto you: ye shall not sow, neither reap that which groweth of itself in it, nor gather the grapes in it of thy vine undressed.
12 For it is the jubile; it shall be holy unto you: ye shall eat the increase thereof out of the field.
13 In the year of this jubile ye shall return every man unto his possession.
14 And if thou sell ought unto thy neighbour, or buyest ought of thy neighbour's hand, ye shall not oppress one another:
15 According to the number of years after the jubile thou shalt buy of thy neighbour, and according unto the number of years of the fruits he shall sell unto thee:
16 According to the multitude of years thou shalt increase the price thereof, and according to the fewness of years thou shalt diminish the price of it: for according to the number of the years of the fruits doth he sell unto thee.
17 Ye shall not therefore oppress one another; but thou shalt fear thy God: for I am the LORD your God.
18 Wherefore ye shall do my statutes, and keep my judgments, and do them; and ye shall dwell in the land in safety.
19 And the land shall yield her fruit, and ye shall eat your fill, and dwell therein in safety.
20 And if ye shall say, What shall we eat the seventh year? behold, we shall not sow, nor gather in our increase:
21 Then I will command my blessing upon you in the sixth year, and it shall bring forth fruit for three years.
22 And ye shall sow the eighth year, and eat yet of old fruit until the ninth year; until her fruits come in ye shall eat of the old store.
23 The land shall not be sold for ever: for the land is mine; for ye are strangers and sojourners with me.
24 And in all the land of your possession ye shall grant a redemption for the land.
25 If thy brother be waxen poor, and hath sold away some of his possession, and if any of his kin come to redeem it, then shall he redeem that which his brother sold.
26 And if the man have none to redeem it, and himself be able to redeem it;
27 Then let him count the years of the sale thereof, and restore the overplus unto the man to whom he sold it; that he may return unto his possession.
28 But if he be not able to restore it to him, then that which is sold shall remain in the hand of him that hath bought it until the year of jubile: and in the jubile it shall go out, and he shall return unto his possession.
29 And if a man sell a dwelling house in a walled city, then he may redeem it within a whole year after it is sold; within a full year may he redeem it.
30 And if it be not redeemed within the space of a full year, then the house that is in the walled city shall be established for ever to him that bought it throughout his generations: it shall not go out in the jubile.
31 But the houses of the villages which have no wall round about them shall be counted as the fields of the country: they may be redeemed, and they shall go out in the jubile.
32 Notwithstanding the cities of the Levites, and the houses of the cities of their possession, may the Levites redeem at any time.
33 And if a man purchase of the Levites, then the house that was sold, and the city of his possession, shall go out in the year of jubile: for the houses of the cities of the Levites are their possession among the children of Israel.
34 But the field of the suburbs of their cities may not be sold; for it is their perpetual possession.
35 And if thy brother be waxen poor, and fallen in decay with thee; then thou shalt relieve him: yea, though he be a stranger, or a sojourner; that he may live with thee.
36 Take thou no usury of him, or increase: but fear thy God; that thy brother may live with thee.
37 Thou shalt not give him thy money upon usury, nor lend him thy victuals for increase.
38 I am the LORD your God, which brought you forth out of the land of Egypt, to give you the land of Canaan, and to be your God.
39 And if thy brother that dwelleth by thee be waxen poor, and be sold unto thee; thou shalt not compel him to serve as a bondservant:
40 But as an hired servant, and as a sojourner, he shall be with thee, and shall serve thee unto the year of jubile:
41 And then shall he depart from thee, both he and his children with him, and shall return unto his own family, and unto the possession of his fathers shall he return.
42 For they are my servants, which I brought forth out of the land of Egypt: they shall not be sold as bondmen.
43 Thou shalt not rule over him with rigour; but shalt fear thy God.
44 Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.
45 Moreover of the children of the strangers that do sojourn among you, of them shall ye buy, and of their families that are with you, which they begat in your land: and they shall be your possession.
46 And ye shall take them as an inheritance for your children after you, to inherit them for a possession; they shall be your bondmen for ever: but over your brethren the children of Israel, ye shall not rule one over another with rigour.
47 And if a sojourner or stranger wax rich by thee, and thy brother that dwelleth by him wax poor, and sell himself unto the stranger or sojourner by thee, or to the stock of the stranger's family:
48 After that he is sold he may be redeemed again; one of his brethren may redeem him:
49 Either his uncle, or his uncle's son, may redeem him, or any that is nigh of kin unto him of his family may redeem him; or if he be able, he may redeem himself.
50 And he shall reckon with him that bought him from the year that he was sold to him unto the year of jubile: and the price of his sale shall be according unto the number of years, according to the time of an hired servant shall it be with him.
51 If there be yet many years behind, according unto them he shall give again the price of his redemption out of the money that he was bought for.
52 And if there remain but few years unto the year of jubile, then he shall count with him, and according unto his years shall he give him again the price of his redemption.
53 And as a yearly hired servant shall he be with him: and the other shall not rule with rigour over him in thy sight.
54 And if he be not redeemed in these years, then he shall go out in the year of jubile, both he, and his children with him.
55 For unto me the children of Israel are servants; they are my servants whom I brought forth out of the land of Egypt: I am the LORD your God.

CabVet · Mar 17, 2014

Riberra said:
I am really interested to know from which Bible version you get that?
Here full text from Leviticus 25 from King James Version.
LEVITICUS CHAPTER 25
Leviticus 25:

44 Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.

Your version right there. In case you didn't know, "bonbmen" and "bondmaid" refer to male and female slaves.

Riberra · Mar 17, 2014

CabVet said:
Your version right there. In case you didn't know, "bonbmen" and "bondmaid" refer to male and female slaves.

They were surely not bad treated till they obey God's rules .....
43 Thou shalt not rule over him with rigour; but shalt fear thy God.
44 Both thy bondmen, and thy bondmaids, which thou shalt have, shall be of the heathen that are round about you; of them shall ye buy bondmen and bondmaids.

53 And as a yearly hired servant shall he be with him: and the other shall not rule with rigour over him in thy sight.

Finally these "slaves"---servants--were not bad treated till they respected the same God's rules that Moses peoples (Levites) have to respect by the way.

Subduction Zone · Mar 18, 2014

And yet you can freely beat your slave as long as he does not die. In fact if your slave dies after more than 3 days you are in the clear:

Exodus 21:20-21 KJV - And if a man smite his servant, or his - Bible Gateway

Exodus 21 20-21:

"20 And if a man smite his servant, or his maid, with a rod, and he die under his hand; he shall be surely punished.

21 Notwithstanding, if he continue a day or two, he shall not be punished: for he is his money."

Subduction Zone · Mar 18, 2014

The Bible is not just pro-slavery. It tells you also how to trick your fellow countryman into being your slave forever.

Riberra · Mar 18, 2014

Subduction Zone said:
The Bible is not just pro-slavery. It tells you also how to trick your fellow countryman into being your slave forever.

Forever...do you know some Levites which have slaves these days?In Moses times thousands of years ago surely.

Subduction Zone · Mar 18, 2014

Riberra said:
Forever...do you know some Levites which have slaves these days?In Moses times surely.

Forever obviously referred to the lifetime of the slave. Jewish slaves were supposedly limited to seven years, but there was a biblical loophole for that.

Riberra · Mar 18, 2014

Subduction Zone said:
Forever obviously referred to the lifetime of the slave. Jewish slaves were supposedly limited to seven years,

Seven years of services (servants) after that they were free then !This hardly refers to a lifetime of slavery? Maybe they were syndicated those "slaves"!

Subduction Zone said:
but there was a biblical loophole for that.

Interesting...

Subduction Zone · Mar 18, 2014

Riberra said:
Seven years of services (servants) after that they were free then !This hardly refers to a lifetime of slavery? Maybe they were syndicated those "slaves"!

Interesting...

See, you made a mistake. You broke up my post when you shouldn't have.

Now a thinking person would have asked what was the loophole if he did not know it.

But before I give that to you a couple of questions:

Is slavery moral?

Second, is tricking someone into a lifetime of slavery moral?

Satanic deception?

Hiking is fun

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

Junior Member

Well-Known Member

... and God saw that it was good.

I've already read the books you want burned.

... and God saw that it was good.

Junior Member

SCIENCE CAN TAKE A HIKE

Question everything

Well-Known Member

Question everything

Well-Known Member

Regular Member

Regular Member

Well-Known Member

Regular Member

Well-Known Member

Regular Member

Similar threads