Do you believe in fallen angels, devils or ghosts?

stormdancer0 · Mar 9, 2014

DennisTate said:
I read a fascinating book last Saturday and it got me wondering what my fellow Christians believe regarding fallen angels, devils, ghosts and such???

From the Lighthouse BlogSynopsis of Muddy Waters: an insiders view of North American Native Spirituality

Fallen angels are basically demons, and yes they exist. I've seen them.

Devils - there is one devil, he is Satan, and he rules demons

Ghosts - no. To be absent with the body is to be present with the Lord. Or to be in Hades, a part of hell. There are demons who mimic the spirits of our dead loved ones.

Kings servant · Mar 10, 2014

stormdancer0 said:
Ghosts - no. To be absent with the body is to be present with the Lord. .

2 Corinthians 5:8. We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

The whole verse does not imply that when you die, you immediately go to be with the Lord. The writer is saying He would rather be absent from the body and with the Lord, that's it. There are no ghosts, the dead remain in the grave until called to judgement or until they rise at the Rapture.

The only things that go bump in the night are you imagination or the devils lackeys who try and make you think that grandma has stopped in for a visit!

Bobinator · Mar 11, 2014

DennisTate said:
What do you think of the near death experience of Dr. George Ritchie. Is his account of what goes on in spiritual realms in line with scripture?

.near-death.com/ritchie.html

Well, my own relatively minor experiences are in line with what he observed. I believe his to be true.

I don't see where it goes AGAINST scripture. Only against how many Christians have interpreted the Bible with respect to the subject matter.

Bobinator · Mar 11, 2014

Kings servant said:
2 Corinthians 5:8. We are confident, I say, and willing rather to be absent from the body, and to be present with the Lord.

The whole verse does not imply that when you die, you immediately go to be with the Lord. The writer is saying He would rather be absent from the body and with the Lord, that's it. There are no ghosts, the dead remain in the grave until called to judgement or until they rise at the Rapture.

The only things that go bump in the night are you imagination or the devils lackeys who try and make you think that grandma has stopped in for a visit!

Interesting. Your 2nd sentence in your second paragraph follows logic, but the 3rd sentence has no scripture to back it up.

JGiddings · Mar 11, 2014

I don't believe a word of what you posted from that guy's book.

nick garai · Mar 14, 2014

There are many fallen angels masquerading as ghosts in an attempt to deceive even the elect in Christ. There is only one devil.

DennisTate · Mar 15, 2014

nick garai said:
There are many fallen angels masquerading as ghosts in an attempt to deceive even the elect in Christ. There is only one devil.

If the "soul sleep" theory on the state of the dead is basically accurate.... then this statement is probably substantially accurate.... but if the soul sleep theory is terribly flawed... then so is this statement?????!!!!

The soul sleep theory is not a foolish theory..... if it is explained in the right context........ "sufficient unto the day is the evil thereof!" (Solomon) If we define the human life in terms of a one day event....... then there is something to this......

DennisTate · Mar 15, 2014

JGiddings said:
I don't believe a word of what you posted from that guy's book.

OK.... he is a controversial figure.... I am of the opinion that his book... within two centuries may be read to many Christian children by their parents... before the kids get into the writings of Paul..... because Paul was somebody who was extremely worried about his own salvation....and the salvation of his followers...... to such a degree that he did not have such perfect love that all fear had been cast out... the writings of Paul.... are not as free of flies in the ointment...... in my opinion..... as the quotations in red letters from the four gospels!!!!????

DennisTate · Mar 15, 2014

Bobinator said:
Well, my own relatively minor experiences are in line with what he observed. I believe his to be true.

I don't see where it goes AGAINST scripture. Only against how many Christians have interpreted the Bible with respect to the subject matter.

This is EXACTLY what I was thinking myself!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

DennisTate · Mar 15, 2014

A related question is whether or not former fallen angels will ever be given an opportunity to repent and return to G-d?

It is intriguing that the final Elijah is predicted to "restore all things"... and in a red letter edition of scripture..... that statement is in RED LETTERS!!!!!!???

As a Messianic Gentile I have been struggling with that question since I was a teenager in the '70's!!!!

http://www.christianforums.com/t7647325/

Yom Kippur/The Rapture connection?!
This is just a theory and I may be wrong but after being highly skeptical of the idea of a rapture for most of my life I am now open to the idea that the Rapture could fit in extremely well with the ultimate fulfillment of the Fast of Yom Kippur.

I could not get my head around this idea until reading the NDE account of Dr. Richard Eby:

He paused as though the joy of that thought had overwhelmed him for the moment.

"My Father assures me that the time is yet a little while, but very little. Soon he will call those already in paradise to surround me as we descend from this third heaven to the first heaven around the Earth. The souls of all my saints will be instantly clothed in their new resurrection bodies, as will the living saints on Earth who rise to us in the glory cloud! At the sounding trumpet they all receive new bodies and rise to meet us in the air. We return as my body to my throne room with the Father. Now do you understand why I called this place a temporary abiding place? Do you grasp what it will mean to be one with me and the Father in your incorruptible bodies? My book states that I assumed mankind's sin so you "might be made the righteousness of God' in me!"

I can clearly recall how Jesus' voice paused at this moment. He was savoring an anticipation too intense and private to be revealed. Was he pre-living that moment at which he would enjoy the victory which his Father would give him as the eternal reward for his own long-suffering? His own sting of death would be swallowed up, and he would be the omniscient Head of a completed and compliant body for whom he had shed his blood on a terrible cross. He would reign as KING of the Jews after these days of grace. Then his thoughts returned to me.

"My son, when that time has come, my Father will call to me. The applause of the heavenly hosts will be deafening; they too have been awaiting that day, ever since they announced my birth to the shepherds at Bethlehem so long ago. Scoffers will gaze with fear and wonder as my angelic hosts watch me fulfill my promise to my earthly body of believers at my soon return to Earth.

DennisTate · Mar 15, 2014

stormdancer0 said:
Fallen angels are basically demons, and yes they exist. I've seen them.

Devils - there is one devil, he is Satan, and he rules demons

Ghosts - no. To be absent with the body is to be present with the Lord. Or to be in Hades, a part of hell. There are demons who mimic the spirits of our dead loved ones.

This is an excellent answer Stormdancer.... and twenty five years ago I would have completely agreed with you.... but since reading many NDE accounts.... I am asking other question..... one of those questions even relates to the type of BODY Christians are given for the time period between their death to the time of the fulfillment of Yom Kippur....if in fact the rapture is somehow connected to the autumn Jewish festivals?????!!!!

http://www.christianforums.com/t7647325-27/

The final Elijah will restore all things right?

Does the restoration of all things... include a body... that might perhaps be even better than the body shown to Dr. Richard Eby.... that apparently he would have during the time that he would be waiting until the complete fulfillment of the rapture/resurrection event??????!!!!!!

...............
............

Dr. Richard Eby:

near-death.com/forum/nde/000/91.html

Reflexly I raised my arms in thanks and adoration for my Lord's love in showing me heaven's wonders which were mysteries to me. As I bowed my head, I noted a glowing pure-white gown which somehow I had not seen when I looked through it in search of organs! I was awed by its total weightlessness and silky softness. My raised arms had parted its overlapping folds for the moment, revealing me as a neuter (i.e. no sex organs)! This came as a shock, although I had not felt surprise at the absence of defects or scars. This alteration was so unexpected!
"Lord Jesus, why am I now a neuter? I was a man."
Jesus replied:
"Yes, Dick, you were always a man, a child of God who returned our love by telling others of the good news about me. Remember? You read in my book the very first order I gave to Adam and Eve? 'Be fruitful and multiply!' I told them to replenish the Earth, not heaven. Again I told the Sadducees (who did not believe in a resurrection) that they 'knew not the scriptures' when they speculated about wives in heaven. I explained that after the resurrection all would be like angels who do not marry nor raise families. Everything in heaven is created or re-created into perfection! It is all in my book. None other is truth!

"In fact, everything that my children need to know about how God thinks and works and judges and rewards, either before or after the cross, is already in my book. That is why I commanded mankind to 'engrave my words upon their hearts,' and to pass them along from generation to generation. I wanted everyone to hear and know just who I AM, the Messiah, their one hope of salvation, their most high God."
I checked my body again: truly celestial! Its senses were too keen to describe.

Weightless, painless, instantly responsive. Comfortable and totally peaceful. Unaware of any disharmony elsewhere. Thinking with the mind of Christ. Sensing that I was IN him somehow.

He had said so clearly:
"I and the Father are one."
He had prayed so fervently:
"... that they all may be one, as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee; that they may be also one in us!," the Father declared it done!"

PersephonesTear · Mar 15, 2014

DennisTate said:
I read a fascinating book last Saturday and it got me wondering what my fellow Christians believe regarding fallen angels, devils, ghosts and such???

From the Lighthouse BlogSynopsis of Muddy Waters: an insiders view of North American Native Spirituality

Hmm...

Well I certainly do believe there are fallen angels, devils, and ghosts in existence. What they are, precisely, is up for debate.

Fallen angels are pretty self-explanatory.

Devils is somewhat of an antiquated term that could be just another word for demons or The Devil (aka Satan and/or Lucifer, depending upon who you ask) or any generic spiritual being that is NASTY. So that begs for clarification before one can really offer an opinion on "devils."

Ghosts: Who really knows? I know there are Christians who insist that ALL ghosts can ONLY be demons and/or fallen angels (depending on if the person in question even believes that demons and fallen angels are the same thing - many think they are not). However, that opinion completely discounts any possibility for NATURAL and completely non-spiritual explanations. Example - electric fields messing with the wiring in our brains, which triggers a hallucination? Which, if such were happening, that would not be completely a reaction that is all in our heads. After all, it would be triggered by an external force acting upon us, yes?

So I absolutely believe in ghosts, yes. But I also believe that not every ghost is necessarily the same thing; and not every ghost is necessarily spiritual.

~~~

As for the snippet about the spirit guide in the OP: Well dang, I couldn't begin to presume upon what category that would precisely fit. It seems like humans are very keen to neatly package and label every single spiritual experience they have, or they don't feel "safe."

I can say that it is clear that any entity that comes along and tries to bully you into accepting it by threatening the life of your children is obviously BAD and NOT FROM GOD. More often than not, that's really the extent of what we need to know about it.

I have no spirit guides, and it is my intention to never have one. I have, however, met other peoples' spirit guides. I would not presume to label all spirit guides as "demons," because there is just too much out there about which we know so little - in some cases nothing - about. Acting like we have all the answers just because we have THE BIBLE is extremely arrogant, often to our own detriment.

I certainly can say, however, that there is no indication anywhere in Scripture that we need any guide apart from the Holy Spirit; and I will stick to that, thank you very much.

Knockout · Mar 16, 2014

There has been a lot of research done in the area of aliens and paranormal activity from the lowest to the highest level, highest meaning political.

Evidence has shown that most if not all of the paranormal activity is aliens masquerading as whatever people are expecting. I encourage people to see the Stan Romanek story on youtube, his dad worked at Area 51 and they decided to experiment on his son Stan who is harassed by the government and greys continually. They have produced genetic offspring of mixed breed without his consent or knowledge, at least in the beginning.

They do all the same things to him as those who say their houses are haunted, only he knows in reality its 100% alien activity. This story shows us it is at least possible for the greys to do all of what we hear about when a house is haunted. But there is more research to be done yet.

Do you believe in fallen angels, devils or ghosts?

Are fallen angels, devils or ghosts real?

Yes, and we need protection from Messiah Jesus - Yeshua.

No, but lots of Christians have psychological problems.

Yes, but they are powerless against us if we stay close to God!

No, we evolved from apes and have nothing invisible to worry about.

Do not be so open-minded that your brain falls out

GOD'S WARRIOR.

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