I'm tired of the Christian Culture

Status
Not open for further replies.

Zoness

667, neighbor of the beast
Supporter
Jul 21, 2008
8,384
1,654
Illinois
✟468,399.00
Country
United States
Faith
Pagan
Marital Status
Married
Qyöt27;65104420 said:
As does traditional orthodox beliefs about eschatology.

Dispensationalism is one of only a few things in the contemporary era that I confidently feel qualifies* as a true heresy (not to mention the Early Church declared Chiliasm, a.k.a., millenarianism - the main component of dispensationalism's eschatology - to be heresy a millennium and a half ago or more; amillennialism has been the dominant view for the vast majority of Christendom practically since the time of Augustine).

*two others are Prosperity and Pseudo-Gnosticism; arguably you could also put Biblical Inerrancy and Literalism in there too, as those could be tagged as what causes all the others to sprout.

I'm in absolute agreement here. My family looks at me as if I am Satan himself when I explain to them that the Rapture was a recent invention and hasn't been widely accepted for most of Christian history.
 
Upvote 0

BrotherRickG

Newbie
Feb 21, 2014
89
5
Tucson, AZ
Visit site
✟7,744.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
I'm in absolute agreement here. My family looks at me as if I am Satan himself when I explain to them that the Rapture was a recent invention and hasn't been widely accepted for most of Christian history.

This is why everyone must read the Bible for themselves and quit dissecting it to find a truth that may not be real. The Creator of all will speak to His children whenever He wants, with the words that are available.

I do believe in a removing of Christians from the last day's cleansings and to me it is very obvious and really not refutable;

Harvest;
Rev 14:14-16
14 I looked, and there before me was a white cloud, and seated on the cloud was one "like a son of man" with a crown of gold on his head and a sharp sickle in his hand. 15 Then another angel came out of the temple and called in a loud voice to him who was sitting on the cloud, "Take your sickle and reap, because the time to reap has come, for the harvest of the earth is ripe." 16 So he who was seated on the cloud swung his sickle over the earth, and the earth was harvested.
NIV

Then the Wrath Begins;
Rev 14:17-19
17 Another angel came out of the temple in heaven, and he too had a sharp sickle. 18 Still another angel, who had charge of the fire, came from the altar and called in a loud voice to him who had the sharp sickle, "Take your sharp sickle and gather the clusters of grapes from the earth's vine, because its grapes are ripe." 19 The angel swung his sickle on the earth, gathered its grapes and threw them into the great winepress of God's wrath.
NIV
Many will disagree and it baffles me.
 
Upvote 0

Gnarwhal

☩ Broman Catholic ☩
Oct 31, 2008
20,373
12,069
36
N/A
✟423,673.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
This is why everyone must read the Bible for themselves and quit dissecting it to find a truth that may not be real. The Creator of all will speak to His children whenever He wants, with the words that are available.

I do believe in a removing of Christians from the last day's cleansings and to me it is very obvious and really not refutable;

If Christians read the bible for themselves they would see that the historic teaching of the church is right and that the rapture is a fiction concocted in the 19th century by John Nelson Darby and his friends within the Plymouth Brethren.

Sure, when Christ returns the dead will rise and we'll meet the Lord in the air. But the lie comes in when people try to teach that Christ is going to whisk everyone away to some other cosmic location. The reality is that we'll escort Christ right back here to Earth, to his kingdom. The language used by St. Paul in 1 Thessalonians 4:17 is intentionally symbolic and meant to paint a picture of a common event in the Roman Empire. When a Roman dignitary would arrive by sea to a province, the city nearest the port would empty and all of it's inhabitants would rally around the dignitary to welcome them. BUT, they wouldn't remain at the port nor would they go somewhere else, they would instead escort the dignitary into the city.
 
Upvote 0

SnowyMacie

Well-Known Member
Apr 12, 2011
17,007
6,087
North Texas
✟118,149.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
In Relationship
I'm tangeting, sorry.

I don't know if this has been brought up before, but the idea of everything being "Christian _____". I just saw an ad on CF advertising a "Christian Counseling MA program." We need Christian Counseling cause us psychologists are evil cause we think mental problems come from the brain. While I do think it can cause issues in therapy if you belief differently than your therapist, but a good therapist shouldn't let that get in the way. I don't really understand the distrust some people have of psychology.
 
Upvote 0

bcrouch

Newbie
Mar 4, 2014
10
0
Taylorville, IL
✟7,620.00
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Libertarian
I'd actually say that the problem that's even worse than labeling everything as "Christian" is taking it a step further and labeling everything that is not "Christian" as "Secular". What happens from there is the thought that anything that is "Secular" is anti-Christian, and therefore should be avoided.
 
Upvote 0

Sayre

Veteran
Sep 21, 2013
2,519
65
✟18,216.00
Faith
Atheist
Marital Status
Private
I'd actually say that the problem that's even worse than labeling everything as "Christian" is taking it a step further and labeling everything that is not "Christian" as "Secular". What happens from there is the thought that anything that is "Secular" is anti-Christian, and therefore should be avoided.

You are on the money!

Why do we need Christian gyms? Can treadmills be sanctified? ^_^
 
  • Like
Reactions: liars_paradox
Upvote 0

Qyöt27

AMV Editor At Large
Apr 2, 2004
7,879
573
38
St. Petersburg, Florida
✟81,859.00
Faith
Methodist
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Others
I'd actually say that the problem that's even worse than labeling everything as "Christian" is taking it a step further and labeling everything that is not "Christian" as "Secular". What happens from there is the thought that anything that is "Secular" is anti-Christian, and therefore should be avoided.
This is precisely what I was referring to when I mentioned 'Pseudo-Gnosticism' above. In reality it's the acceptance of a dualistic worldview, it's simply that Gnostics were notorious for that kind of thing (in their case, it was between spirit and literal flesh-and-blood physical matter).

I used to encounter this all the time back when I was young enough to post in the Teens section, which makes sense considering youth groups often act as the breeding ground for it (or rather, I'd lay the blame on those that administrate youth groups rather than the kids themselves). You also used to see it all the time in the Secular Music area, to the point that they had to actually institute a forum rule (way back in 2005) that such threads don't belong there and to take it to Philosophy & Morality instead.



On this same line of thought, I hold a huge amount of antipathy for the idea of a 'Christian financial advisor'. Mostly because it's a front for pushing their political ideology (or fundamentalism, of the market or religious sort) and even go to the length of trying to use Scripture to defend greed if they don't outright ignore it in order to peddle Prosperity Gospel nonsense.

There's nothing intrinsically moral about how you go about managing your finances, and you definitely don't need someone who uses the 'Christian' tag in order to get 'good' advice. Any good advice you'd get from them could equally be gotten through any other financial advisory service, so there's automatically some ulterior motive involved. The real reason they call themselves 'Christian' is that they parrot Religious Right talking points and are no better than a pundit that talks about personal finances between going on anti-tax and/or generally anti-government tirades with all of those kinds of talking points thrown in too.
 
Upvote 0

liars_paradox

Senior Member
Jun 8, 2009
788
38
North Carolina
✟9,505.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
what is Christian culture exactly.....on physical level how will your life change by not being a Christian how can it hold you back im baffled...what are you gonna do go out and crank some smack ...your over think life brother my dad once told me never trust a man who changes his football team if they lose a few games because hell buckle under pressure dont buckle brother keep the faith

Dude, use punctuation marks. I hate having to double-read people's posts.
 
Upvote 0

liars_paradox

Senior Member
Jun 8, 2009
788
38
North Carolina
✟9,505.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Sorry, I've had a bit of trouble understanding your post, but my issues have also become historical/theological. As I've gone through school some very poignant questions have come up and I haven't figured out what to make of it.



Essentially, yes I think so. I think much of it has to do with morals, and my questioning whether something is truly an issue or if it's demonization is merely a product of American Christianity's (or at least American Evangelicalism's) puritanical bent.

Yeah, most of American Christianity is conservative, evangelical Christianity. But, I think that evangelicism is probably the only form of Christianity that's growing.

Rev.
Jesus is Awesome


I like this British show about an Anglican vicar. In this particular episode, the protagonist quarrels with an evangelical priest. It's pretty funny.

But, in that episode, Adam (the protagonist) has a pitifully small congregation, and Darren the evangelical has a large congregation, and filled with a lot of young people.

That is the difference between Mainline Protestantism and Evangelicalism. Especially, the ones which like to play modern Christian music.

I'm the same way, I completely stopped listening to any and all Christian music because I find it to be a mockery of music in general (except for chanting and things like that). I'd much rather listen to Chopin or The Ramones than some of those jokes that get played on Christian radio.
Same here. Christian music sucks.

Personally, I'm not a big fan of modern music in church. But, the church that I regularly attend plays it.


I'm sure this isn't the case in all church communities, but it seems like in every church community in my town (even the more moderate-liberal ones), there are expectations to live a certain way. Some churches take it to more extremes than others.

Well, isn't that society in general? Yeah, I'd like to live in a world where people were not evil. And, I, like you, do hate the evangelical church that I have been going to.

I live in a metropolitan area of 5 million people, so I can find liberal churches more easily, but I haven't attended any regularly. Yet, my beliefs are more liberal than conservative.



As an example, one of my closest friends recently told me he couldn't hang out with me anymore because "I wasn't living according to God's plan" or something along those lines. I'm not attending church, I'm not "under the authority of a pastor" and I'm dating someone even though my divorce won't be finalized until next month - even though my ex-wife and I agreed that we were okay with each other doing that if we met someone, and she started dating someone three months before me. According to him though, I'm essentially "living in sin" and being the "good bible-believing Christian" that he is, if he's going to obey what Paul says in 1 Corinthians 5:11 then he "can't even eat with me"... or at least that's the conclusion his overly-controlling mentor spits out.

It's those kinds of rules, expectations, structures that don't make sense to me anymore. I feel like it's all phony, because I look around at the people at my old church who pretend to live righteously and I know they're all full of crap. They lie, cheat, steal, deceive and worse and yet they frown on me for not going to church and falling in love with someone a couple months shy of my divorce finalizing?

Get real.

Sorry, I don't know if any of this makes sense, maybe I'm just venting?

Out of curiosity, did you ever have a problem with their theology before people at this church began ostracizing you?

What kind of town do you live in? Where in the US do you live in? You're whining about evangelicals in a LIBERAL forum. Why aren't you going to the conservative or evangelical forum?

I am attending this stupid Bible Church. Bible Churches in Texas appear to be churches that broke from the Southern Baptist Church for God knows why, and they hate Immanuel Kant.

This megachurch has a large young adults group (which is why I go in the first place) and I see stupid facebook quotes from church members who read C.S. Lewis (author of The Chronicles of Narnia) as his writings are required literature for people becoming members of the church.

And, one idiot quotes C.S. Lewis' attack on Immanuel Kant and Stoicism, and the guy doesn't even know who Immanuel Kant or what Stoics are. I made a comment under his post, and he said that he didn't think that that's what "Lew Lew", meant and I told him that that was exactly what C.S. Lewis meant.

I like Immanuel Kant. I don't mind using logic and reason, and I don't find evolution or gay marriage a threat to my faith.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

liars_paradox

Senior Member
Jun 8, 2009
788
38
North Carolina
✟9,505.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
I'm tangeting, sorry.

I don't know if this has been brought up before, but the idea of everything being "Christian _____". I just saw an ad on CF advertising a "Christian Counseling MA program." We need Christian Counseling cause us psychologists are evil cause we think mental problems come from the brain. While I do think it can cause issues in therapy if you belief differently than your therapist, but a good therapist shouldn't let that get in the way. I don't really understand the distrust some people have of psychology.

Well, personally, psychologists are of the Devil. ^_^. JK - kind of...

But, the whole reason why they have "Christian Counselors" is so that you can be counseled by someone with similar faith values. I really don't find that absurd.

But, I have tried both kinds of therapists in the past, and found that both suck. The Christian one was forced onto me by the intern at this megachurch, but he continues to claim that it wasn't a requirement for me. And, the pastor in charge of the Young Adults group refused to listen to me.

Yet, both waste my time. I thought that the Christian counselor was a total dumb ass. He and I argued over what "thoughts" were.

I tried CBT with him, but I don't know if he was implementing it correctly. I told him what my emotions to certain stimuli in my environment, but then he asked me what my "thoughts" were. And, I was like, "my emotions were my thoughts."

And, he told me that thoughts precede emotions, but then I asked him to clarify what thoughts were. He couldn't, and said that he found it hard to believe that I didn't know what thoughts were. But, that wasn't the issue. It seemed like he wanted me to put into words the thought processes that came before emotions were, and I didn't think that was even humanly possible. Yet, the counselor didn't agree with that and thought that every thought had a word for it.

But, I have a computer science background, so I brought up Turin Machines and how there are things that we are capable of doing, but are impossible for computers to do because we don't know how it is that we do them. Exempli gratis, mathematical proofs can't be solved by computers (ie. Turin Machines), but human beings can do them and we can't put into precise language how to do them.

In terms of Turin Machines, solving mathematical proofs is impossible.

So, that proves that there are thoughts that we have, that we can't understand how to describe them very well. Yet, he didn't want to listen to me, and kind of changed the subject by complimenting my intelligence. And, said that I understood computers well while he understood people well. I told him that humans were more complex than computers, and he said that for me it was but not for him.

But, the fact that the Christian counselor couldn't explain to me what his definition of "thoughts" were only proves that he didn't know what he was talking about.

Humans are pretty complex - even for the stupid counselor. IF he knew humans so well, then he could make them. But, he can't, so we're not so simple to figure out after all.


And, to clarify, I went to a counselor, because of how I interacted with my all-male small group, which is meant to be a sort of bible study group where you can also confide in others.

And, what happened was that I brought up my liberal Christian views and they accused me of not believing. Which set me off, because I seriously do believe.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0

liars_paradox

Senior Member
Jun 8, 2009
788
38
North Carolina
✟9,505.00
Country
United States
Faith
Protestant
Marital Status
Single
Politics
US-Republican
Umm wot? That was pretty rude. There is nothing wrong with expressing our disappointment with evangelicals in this thread.

Yeah, but I thought that he had the wrong forum at first. I don't like them either, but many people don't know the difference which aggravates me.

It's like the stupid predestination vs. Free Will argument. Many assume that all churches believe in Free Will, but are ignorant of the long debate between the two arguments.

So, to complain about "Christian culture" in this forum made me mad at first, because I thought that he didn't know what liberal Christians were. My apologies for not realizing that he wasn't as ignorant as I had initially thought.

Yeah I've been here and it kinda sucks. I hate most Christians attitudes to almost everything. I still believe we share one and the same God, but I feel little desire to hang around your average "white evangelical protestant male". Bleerrggh.

I don't have a Jesus sticker on my car, I don't listen to "Christian music", or go to a christian gym (I kid you not!).

Sorry to hear about your divorce - I hope you are well and truly on the path of healing.

I can see how a "Christian counselor" might be useful for some people, but a Christian gym sounds dumb. Maybe I should do my research before writing it off, but how can you make a gym "Christian'? :D

If Christians read the bible for themselves they would see that the historic teaching of the church is right and that the rapture is a fiction concocted in the 19th century by John Nelson Darby and his friends within the Plymouth Brethren.

Well, they wouldn't be able to read that just by reading the bible by themselves. They would neither get what most Christians call the "rapture" nor would they know anything about how the modern concept of the "rapture" is a new thing.

The problem is that while many people are learning the bible, their church will give only their explanation behind the really enigmatic parts of the bible.

I had an argument with a friend over the snake thing in the creation story in the book of Genesis.

He tried to argue with me that the snake was the Devil by telling me how snakes don't talk. But, that didn't seem to help his argument that we should take Genesis literally.

Because, if you're telling me that the word "SNAKE" really means "the Devil", then you're already taking something metaphorically and not literally.

The conservatives tell me that the prophesies can be taken symbolically but not the "history". Yet, is Genesis really history? And, aren't you already not taking the snake thing literally in order to make sense of that story?

In the past, the church implemented both Historical Critical and Historical Grammatical methods of interpreting the Bible. And, taking things as symbols for something else in the bible wasn't considered heresy.

Yet, with the Age of Enlightenment, many churches reacted to mainline Protestantism's move with evangelism. And, that is how you get John Nelson Darby, and his whole lot in the first place.

I prefer not to wonder if these stories were literal, because I think that that has been the source of my doubt. I tried to listen to social pressures lately, and read the bible with an "open mind" but I think that I liked it better when I had my liberal views.
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

SnowyMacie

Well-Known Member
Apr 12, 2011
17,007
6,087
North Texas
✟118,149.00
Country
United States
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
In Relationship
Well, personally, psychologists are of the Devil. ^_^. JK - kind of...

But, the whole reason why they have "Christian Counselors" is so that you can be counseled by someone with similar faith values. I really don't find that absurd.

But, I have tried both kinds of therapists in the past, and found that both suck. The Christian one was forced onto me by the intern at this megachurch, but he continues to claim that it wasn't a requirement for me. And, the pastor in charge of the Young Adults group refused to listen to me.

Yet, both waste my time. I thought that the Christian counselor was a total dumb ass. He and I argued over what "thoughts" were.

I tried CBT with him, but I don't know if he was implementing it correctly. I told him what my emotions to certain stimuli in my environment, but then he asked me what my "thoughts" were. And, I was like, "my emotions were my thoughts."

And, he told me that thoughts precede emotions, but then I asked him to clarify what thoughts were. He couldn't, and said that he found it hard to believe that I didn't know what thoughts were. But, that wasn't the issue. It seemed like he wanted me to put into words the thought processes that came before emotions were, and I didn't think that was even humanly possible. Yet, the counselor didn't agree with that and thought that every thought had a word for it.

But, I have a computer science background, so I brought up Turin Machines and how there are things that we are capable of doing, but are impossible for computers to do because we don't know how it is that we do them. Exempli gratis, mathematical proofs can't be solved by computers (ie. Turin Machines), but human beings can do them and we can't put into precise language how to do them.

In terms of Turin Machines, solving mathematical proofs is impossible.

So, that proves that there are thoughts that we have, that we can't understand how to describe them very well. Yet, he didn't want to listen to me, and kind of changed the subject by complimenting my intelligence. And, said that I understood computers well while he understood people well. I told him that humans were more complex than computers, and he said that for me it was but not for him.

But, the fact that the Christian counselor couldn't explain to me what his definition of "thoughts" were only proves that he didn't know what he was talking about.

Humans are pretty complex - even for the stupid counselor. IF he knew humans so well, then he could make them. But, he can't, so we're not so simple to figure out after all.


And, to clarify, I went to a counselor, because of how I interacted with my all-male small group, which is meant to be a sort of bible study group where you can also confide in others.

And, what happened was that I brought up my liberal Christian views and they accused me of not believing. Which set me off, because I seriously do believe.

I think having similar faith values can be important, or at least an understanding of your own personal faith. I had Depression in HS and I had this one psychiatrist who was an atheist to a very skeptical agnostic, I remember talking to him about, guy issues, and he could not understand that I felt a conviction to not do certain things. He would take that as answer of why I wouldn't do that. I changed over that.

That sounds like CBT to me. What he was probably asking you is "What are your thoughts on that event." If a client came to me one day and said "my girlfriend broke up with me, and I'm angry" All that really tells me is that he/she is angry with their ex. By asking their thoughts, I can get a much deeper insight into the event. "Do you think the anger is justified?, Do you feel overreacting, underreacting? Are you mad at her, what happened, or both?" then precede from there.

You can. I was angry yesterday afternoon as I was leaving for Dallas. I was angry cause I was running late, had to run back inside to get things I forgot three times, didn't eat enough for lunch, and wasn't looking forward to the boring drive ahead of me. My thoughts were "I'm late, tired of forgetting things, hungry, and hate I-20", and as a result, I wasn't in a pleasant mood.

I think what he was asking you to do, identify the thoughts that contributed to the emotion. It's not something that you can usually do instantly.
 
Upvote 0

Gnarwhal

☩ Broman Catholic ☩
Oct 31, 2008
20,373
12,069
36
N/A
✟423,673.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
Out of curiosity, did you ever have a problem with their theology before people at this church began ostracizing you?

Honestly? I have no idea. I turned my back on that church years ago. It's the same one I grew up in, my aforementioned friend still attended there. So honestly I couldn't care less about what any of those people there think of me, which is why I walked away from him when he gave me his ultimatum.

That being said, yes I took issue with their theology for a long time. I was really attached to that church since it had been my family's church for decades, but all of the sudden the senior pastor took a wild left turn from a scholarly approach to a charismatic approach and tried to model our church after the crazy Bethel Church about an hour and a half north of us.

I would have very edifying and impassioned discussions about it with the same friend who turned on me. It's possible he relayed some of our discussion so the pastoral staff (since he's close to some of them) and they slowly turned him against me. Who knows.

What kind of town do you live in? Where in the US do you live in? You're whining about evangelicals in a LIBERAL forum. Why aren't you going to the conservative or evangelical forum?


I live in a medium-sized college town with about 90,000 people and what seems like an overabundance of churches per capita. Sorry if this thread comes across as whining, I just needed a safe place to vent and since I consider myself a liberal Democrat, this is seemed to fit the bill.

I'm not looking to debate conservative evangelicals on the merits of my friends choice to dissolve our friendship, if anything I wanted to discuss with like-minded people the idea that such behavior is a cancer in Christianity.

I am attending this stupid Bible Church. Bible Churches in Texas appear to be churches that broke from the Southern Baptist Church for God knows why, and they hate Immanuel Kant.

This megachurch has a large young adults group (which is why I go in the first place) and I see stupid facebook quotes from church members who read C.S. Lewis (author of The Chronicles of Narnia) as his writings are required literature for people becoming members of the church.

And, one idiot quotes C.S. Lewis' attack on Immanuel Kant and Stoicism, and the guy doesn't even know who Immanuel Kant or what Stoics are. I made a comment under his post, and he said that he didn't think that that's what "Lew Lew", meant and I told him that that was exactly what C.S. Lewis meant.

I like Immanuel Kant. I don't mind using logic and reason, and I don't find evolution or gay marriage a threat to my faith.

I hear what you're saying. My college group explored a lot of Lewis' work (Mere Christianity, The Problem of Pain, A Grief Observed, etc) and there were quite a few people who I believe never fully grasped the nuances of what Lewis was saying, and it does stand at odds with some theologies.

That being said, from a theological standpoint, I'm fairly conservative. I like liturgical churches more than contemporary, I affirm the ancient Creeds and tend to reject heresies (with the concept of Universal Reconciliation probably being an exception, but not something I'm married to). However, when it comes to praxis, and the social agenda of most conservative churches, I'm absolutely not on board.
 
Upvote 0

AGTG

Well-Known Member
Mar 11, 2014
794
309
✟6,038.00
Faith
Non-Denom
Marital Status
Married
It sounds like you need the resurrection life of Jesus Holy Spirit residing in you. Dead religion is always a burnout because there's no life in it.

The best way to experience God is one on one. We do this through faith and humility, seeking His face and being open to receiving His truth straight from Him.

When you do this daily by getting into the Bible, spending time in prayer, and simply speaking of surrendering to Him, He will reveal Jesus to us and we can be led by His Spirit.

His Spirit, of course, does not go against His Word, which is why we need both to have a solid relationship based upon truth. We worship in spirit and in truth.
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Gnarwhal

☩ Broman Catholic ☩
Oct 31, 2008
20,373
12,069
36
N/A
✟423,673.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Libertarian
It sounds like you need the resurrection life of Jesus Holy Spirit residing in you. Dead religion is always a burnout because there's no life in it.

The best way to experience God is one on one. We do this through faith and humility, seeking His face and being open to receiving His truth straight from Him.

When you do this daily by getting into the Bible, spending time in prayer, and simply speaking of surrendering to Him, He will reveal Jesus to us and we can be led by His Spirit.

His Spirit, of course, does not go against His Word, which is why we need both to have a solid relationship based upon truth. We worship in spirit and in truth.

We're going to have to agree to disagree here. That whole "personal relationship with God" modus operandi is how I lived my faith for the first 22 years I was a Christian and I've come to disagree that it's all there is. My burnout has nothing to do with "dead religion" as you call it.

In fact, my burnout is more connected to the "personal relationship with God" approach because it has been birthed out of and resides within the type of culture that I've grown weary of. This highly individualized, kitschy and over-commercialized version of the ancient Christian faith.

I've had faith in and a relationship with God for a long time, and in recent years I've more readily found God within a liturgical setting than a contemporary one. Now I accept that not everyone shares my approach or my opinion, but I'm saying right now that the overly casual approach isn't for me.
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.