Deliverance Ministry

Hockey_Fan

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Mormons are like the masonic lodge or a community club, they have a great support system and they use the bible but they really don't believe it outside of the Book of Mormon. BoM is first, Bible, then Doctrine and Covenants…. I would not envy them, they have the highest suicide rate in the country. Due in part to trying to live up to an impossible human standard and much of what you see is just that… they are very consumed with what you see.
…although I have found the best way to witness to a mormon is to just talk about what you have in common and how it is not our denomination that saves us, our good works or our life style but the cross. When mormons are proven wrong in their beliefs about Jos.Smith they often become bitter angry atheists. They know they were duped and they see millions of others duped also and have a very difficult time reconciling any belief in God bc they think they were already there….

I understand what you wrote. I think disillusionment is high among people of all religions. We think we may have finally found the answer to life and then the nagging problems persist. After a while, we realize that the religious person and the atheist are in the same boat and that's disappointing.

It's sort of like a divorce, I guess. You believe getting married will fix everything in your life and then it doesn't.... it's a letdown.

I've read parts of the Book of Mormon (certainly not the entire thing) and it reads sort of like the King James Bible. I found myself wishing there was a more readable version available.
 
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Hockey_Fan

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Oh yes, a Ouija board is a dangerous thing. I did not believe that demons could inhabit inanimate objects until I saw what happened when one was cast out of a Ouija board. Wow, that thing flew.

How would one go about casting a demon out of a Ouija board in the first place??:confused:
 
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Alive_Again

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As I said, I'm not directly in deliverance ministry, but I believe the renewing of the mind to be essential - a person who is liberated needs to reprogram himself with the Word of God through daily confession of the truth that replaces the lies that they have believed, thereby tearing down the stronghold brick by proverbial brick.
Wow. Not often you hear this important element discussed. It's what the Lord told Gary Carpenter, it's "working on the part of you that doesn't believe until you do".

You obviously know a lot more than just the curious party.
I know if we could see outside as things really are, we'd live much differently. We'd understand that level of warfare going on around us, and how our actions affect things (for the good and the bad).

I was giving this a lot of thought and I heard a prophetic word that said, "Don't look for devils in every bush. See Me high and lifted up, above all that would oppose you." The enemy just gets in the way, but if we focus too much on him, it detracts from our walk.

But if you don't understand your enemy, you won't do warfare as accurately.

When Norvel Hayes went from his living room into Throne of God,
God chlded him by saying, "How long are you gonna put up with those growths on your daughter's body?" (I think I worded this right!)

This brought on the "What do you mean?" questions that God didn't like. Anyway, He said, "If you'll curse those growths at the root, they will die, if you will believe and not doubt."

When he came back in the living room, he was ready to do warfare! He said that he had heard a pleading voice that politely and sweetly said, "Don't do that now. Your daughter has a date in there and don't interrupt her by doing this now. Don't do it now. Please don't do it now.

He said the moment he came back, he was as energized as you can imagine, being in the presence of God, hearing Him speak so clearly. But every minute since he came back, he began to feel more "ordinary" and not quite as confident. He recognized the sweet pleading voice as a devil. He stormed into her room (and with her date there) said something like: "Zona! I just came from the Throne of God and I'm gonna curse those growths... etc.!"

It took about a month for them to happen. He said it over and over every day like a broken record (thousands of times!). He wasn't telling God through the much speaking. He was attacking the part in his soul, that might doubt. You know the enemy contested his believing on a consistent basis!

One day some of the growths were missing (I think their were over 40 to begin with.) He kept on standing and confessing. She'd speak her doubt all over the situation regularly (in her ignorance). Finally one day she reached up to get a dress and had baby skin all over her arms and hands. He never let up.

People will criticize the whole speaking the Word over and over like you're trying to convince God.
You're fighting the good fight of faith. It's not God you're convincing. It's helpful to know this because even though He was right there at the throne, when he got back, he felt like we do when we're wanting to believe God for something in our lives.

Another important thing is not to wait.
The enemy knew if he could get him to wait that he would have time to work on his resolve. He'd cook up some circumstance that would try to prevent him from stepping out.

I want to point out Howard Pittman too on Youtube.
He had a heart attack and God set him straight too. On the way back to a repentant life, he was given a "tour" so to speak of these spirits in operation (they couldn't see him). He observe a high level meeting with the princes and saw various types of spirits (mammon, perversion, etc.) and how they appear and operate. He also heard how they mobilize certain kinds of spirits en masse to in an area and certain places on the earth are dominated (just like certain areas are dominated by the Kingdom of God). You'll prosper to find these places. Some call them "portals". You can kind of "smell them out" just by "feel". Inversely, certain parts of town just seem moldy and bad.

Kenneth Hagin said that the Lord once told him that some places were so cursed, you had to leave town to minister to the people in them.
Jesus was the example of this. Some churches are that way too. They'll never have a move of God in them.

People object to the term "possession" like they own you (which they don't). Hagin points out that it's more correctly thought of as "demonization". Hagin said in one of his visions, that Jesus said that there were various degrees of possesion (demonization).

This is getting long. I believe it is vital (beyond just stopping stuff working against your life in a "general" deliverance, for the discernment of spirits to be operating. (when ministering for others). Usually in coordination with a word of knowledge or prophecy. You can address quickly discernible fruit problems and never touch the root.

That's where the Derek Prince stuff is good because he demonstrates how they identify themselves (asking them what the root is).

Hagin testified that the Lord told him that the spirit of python Paul bound up (the Diana thing) was an operation of discernment of spirits, and he would not have been able to deal with it without the operation of that gift. He had to wait for that to happen. It wasn't just there that it happened.

This gives you ability to hear the enemy speak when they do (or see or know them). The demoniac in the Word spoke, but Jesus said you would not have heard him (speak about the swine). He also said that sometimes you had to know the name or number. Jesus commanded the spirits to leave and they didn't go. So He asked the number and then they took flight when He acted on that.

Jesus was angry with His disciples for their "little faith" when they couldn't cast out the spirit (but by prayer and fasting). This was a necessary component to having "great faith" (Jesus commended this).

Jesus told Gary Carpenter, that if you regularly pray in the Spirit and declare the Word in your heart and over your life (not just a little), and integrate fasting into your life that this will build great faith into your walk. "Little faith" never got the job done, and people preach about "mustard seed faith" out of context. The Lord said, "You can begin to work on the part of you that does not believe." by regular confession of the Word.
 
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Alive_Again

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One more thing. This conversation reminds me of what God told Anna Rountree when she was on one of her trips to Heaven (every day for a year back in the 90's).

She said angels are being prepared in Heaven to work with believers in a great move of God that is coming to the earth.
Hard to imagine angels going to "school", but they have universities in Heaven, and they are trained to perform tasks.

She said that they wear an armband with a red cross with two words "Only Believe". She also said that believers were taking "correspondence courses" here on earth and they didn't know it. They are led to certain teachings and testimonies and they are being trained a piece and a precept at a time to minister in this great harvest that will have many healings and miracles. Ever wonder why people are learning this stuff, yet not really moving in it?

The angels told Anna that in the great healing revival in the 40's and 50's that those ministers were supposed to share that anointing, but they kept it in tents. It was ignorance.

Believers will go two by two and two angels will accompany them. Many others will go and prepare the way for these things to happen. It will be an exciting time and it is time to take learning of healing and deliverance very seriously. There are a couple of excellent books by Kevin Basconi that primes your spirit to walk with Heaven kind of alongside you (really in Heavenly places). This is what God has been telling Kat Kerr to tell believers, that Heaven is going to run your race alongside you.

One prophetic word I heard, the Lord said to memorize all of the scriptures dealing with the salvation message and be able to recite them on cue. Not a mental exercise, but a planting and a watering and repeated exposure to light. Things are going to change and it is not time to go home yet.
 
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Alive_Again

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I knew a couple of guys I used to hang out with. They both started making Ouija boards. They used good craftmanship. One of them developed colon cancer and died within a couple of months.

The other told me that he gave some boards to an owner of a shop specializing in kind of "dark" stuff (alongside a smoke shop). He said the owner called him and told him that he kept on having bad nightmares.

You'd think where he worked that he would have been used to that already, but the boards act as "gates". That's another vital component of this stuff is to learn how to clean your house. Many CDs, DVDs, tapes, books, etc. have stuff in them that gives the enemy a legal right to afflict you.

Sometimes the Lord won't let the enemy afflict you, but then makes you aware that you need to get rid of certain things. How many movies these days have someone fornicating in it? Just about all of them (so it seems). Heaven does not approve of that one bit. But people collect these things.

I had a pastor who talked about having a bonfire like in the Book of Acts and I think it's a great idea to preach on this and to announce a big housecleaning. People begin to be open, when they would have held on to that Twilight DVD unless they had a little grace working at the time.

Certain prayers of renouncement are very profitable too. The Net's got a lot of them online. You might think it's just a bit freaky to go to such lengths, but if you've ever felt better after doing some of these, you'll put your thoughts about it on the shelf and be open to being moved in this way.

We judge things by the fruits, so if you have good fruits getting rid of stuff and renouncing things, then hold fast to it and consider it wisdom you'll share (even at the expense of looking like a fool).
 
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Andrea411

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I understand what you wrote. I think disillusionment is high among people of all religions. We think we may have finally found the answer to life and then the nagging problems persist. After a while, we realize that the religious person and the atheist are in the same boat and that's disappointing.

It's sort of like a divorce, I guess. You believe getting married will fix everything in your life and then it doesn't.... it's a letdown.

I've read parts of the Book of Mormon (certainly not the entire thing) and it reads sort of like the King James Bible. I found myself wishing there was a more readable version available.
Jos.Smith said the angel Moroni was interpreting the real bible to him personally. He hid his face in a hat as he had his wife write what the angel was telling him. The parts of the scripture he said the angel quoted to him also held those bracketed notations that the printers of the bible added to explain scriptures. he obviously was reading from pages of the KJV bible when he got his revelation. He was a con man who impregnated his adopted daughter and that was how polygamy was introduced to the new religion….
As a personality of the nineteen

I don't really advise spending much time on anti-mormon sites, there are anti-everything sites. If you want to look into mormonism after looking at their theology, that is your prerogative. But there are many things that the LDS do not tell members and you should know that also. I won't go onto the masonic connection, the magic underwear it is far more damning that J.S. took the wives of faithful followers as his own … I could not imagine a more treacherous con man than Jos Smith.
 
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talitha

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Wow, Alive_Again - lots of revvies there.....

A few things stand out for right now.

First, the thing about the growths - I have read that before, but it's hitting me where I live right now. I have been struggling with the difference between "persistence in prayer" and "vain repetition", and this helps me with that. It's like chopping wood. We do not chop wood by taking one swipe with an axe, and then if the log is not split, say, well, that didn't work, I guess I'm not supposed to have smaller pieces of wood. We have to do exactly the same motion over and over (okay, they have to - I've never chopped wood).

I have read I think two books by Anna Rountree - and I do remember the part you're talking about. I have often wondered why people (myself included) are learning things and yet not moving out in them.
Aha! :idea:

I think I will be looking back at this thread for my next book ideas! Right now I'm starting one by Pat Holliday....

Certain prayers of renouncement are very profitable too. The Net's got a lot of them online. You might think it's just a bit freaky to go to such lengths, but if you've ever felt better after doing some of these, you'll put your thoughts about it on the shelf and be open to being moved in this way.
That's one thing that started this journey - I don't remember if I said it earlier, but..... because of a dream I had, a friend ended up sending me to a website to find out about "marine spirits" - and even though I didn't think I was buying into that totally, one night when I couldn't fall asleep, I went ahead and spoke out the fifty-some-odd statements of declaration and renouncement - and I went right to sleep after that - and had my first really clear divine dream that I'd had in maybe six or seven years!

It works if you work it, huh?

blessings
tal
 
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Matjohluk

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Hi Talitha,

It’s a hard one, trying to hear from our Lord. I feel something on my heart off and on, or faint thought comes to mind in a whisper, or during praise and worship while my arms are raised I feel this warm/tingling feeling over my forearms as His Spirit overwhelms in a blessing.


A number of years ago, I visited a church to hear a visiting evangelist and he gave a great sermon, with gusto and enthusiasm. I was glued to every word he spoke, and when I looked around at the rest of the congregation they all appeared to be not interested in what the visitor was saying. I actually thought they were rude, and appeared to be manifesting the spirit of self-righteousness and appeared drugged out of their minds and they were not responding to his teaching.

After he finished he stood there at the stage, expecting people to come to speak to him, and our Lord gave me a great shove out of my chair, and I walked out to speak to him and to say “g’day”. I just looked at him and said: “Our Lord has just said: ‘Well done faithful servant!’” Well, the next thing I didn’t expect, the speaker grabbed in the biggest bear hug, and said: “Thank you Brother, thank you. I was waiting for those words from our Lord!” He said that this was his best performance he has ever did, and he knew the Lord was near. And I guess he would have noticed the body language of the church that was something was out place. Maybe, the message was for me as well.


I use Luke 11:24-26, Matthew 13:43-45, and 1 Peter 5:8 as the Scriptures to make people aware that when a spirit leaves a house (soul), whether by being “cast out” of a person by prayer, or upon the death of a person. When a spirit (clean or unclean) leaves a body it will either go into another person, animal or to “dry places”.


We need to be aware that the people of those days knew more that we know, had full knowledge and understanding of the spiritual realm of heavenly and earthly things, and how a good working knowledge of what was heavenly, what was earthly, what was what good, what was evil, and what was good within the that realm.


Sadly, the word “Christian” is used flippantly, because wayside, stony, and thorny Christians can be possessed, because their “house is empty, swept, and put in order” as those demons that had left them would be still hovering around them in “dry places” waiting for the chance to return and re-enter their cosy “house”. And as Scripture says that it goes and gets seven other spirits worse than them, which are possibly those spirits that had vacated their last “house” due to the death of the person they were living in. Luke 11:24-26, Matthew 13:43-45, and 1 Peter 5:8 explain it all well.


1 Peter 5:8 explains that when a spirit leaves a house, cast out or upon death of their host, it roams around “dry places”, searching for another “house” (soul/body) to dwell or that is, to own. The wayside, stony, and thorny Christian can steal, destroy and kill a church, and if the church isn’t switched on, then they will become the churches listed in Revelation 2 and 3. I’ve noticed that in these types of churches there are no gifts and if there is they soon diminish. Members begin to leave, and pastors begin to berate and brow-beat their congregation about “tithing”, which confirms that the spirit of mammon is in control.


To get a good insight into the spiritual realm we also need to understand the ancient cultures of the Cherokee Indians, and other indigenous aborigines of America and other countries beliefs and practices in regards to this realm, which is referred to as “animism”. They say exactly the same that when a spirit leaves a body during a ceremony and death they go into other areas (dry places), such as geographical areas. The Bible says “dry places”, because a demon prefers a warm-moist body, human or animal, to live in.


When we have knowledge and understanding of His Word buried deep-down in our spiritual mind (our heart) then we can only hear from the Spirit of God. And the pastor should know themself if their teaching is true and correct and if they are feeding His Sheep MILK, well we can kiss that church goodbye, because it will probably be full of wayside, stony, and thorny Christians, and not many 30-fold or 60-fold, because I believe a 100-fold believer wouldn’t stay in the church.

No, I am not implying, because these medical issues are real and these things need to be considered when dealing with a person who may be experiencing mental and emotional issues, which I explained in another posting. Sadly, there are always those gung-ho deliverance ministries around who end up causing more suffering to their issues and add further spiritual problems to the person.

There is a definite separation between spiritual (supernatural) and physical (natural), and that includes the nomenclature of spirits: clean and unclean, good and evil, white and black entities, and sweet and bitter. There is so much going in the spiritual realm that most Christians are closing their eyes and pretend that it’s not there.

Normal life is the spiritual and physical realms of earthly things, and spiritual life is the spiritual and physical reams of heavenly things.

Yes, we have seen far too many divorces and remarriages in the Body of Chris, and both spouses are to blame, and also forget they oath they made with our Yeshua during their marriage vows. Many remarried Christians from a divorce still struggle with marriage problems, but they don’t consider the vows they made with our Messiah.

When we suffer from double-mindedness, our soul is split between the worldly kingdom and His Kingdom, and they normally decide through their carnal mind (the brain) and their spiritual mind (the heart) is shut down. The brain is our battleground.

We need to also relate to what happens to a good/clean spirit, such as, our spirit. Yes we go to heaven and we meet up with our Yeshua HaMashiach, but are we recycled? I am sure all the ancient cultures of the world are very aware of the spirit, soul, and body; but it’s the Christians who are out of step with these ancient knowledge and understanding of the supernatural.

We need to understand when we are born, and we come into the world we don’t pick our spirit, after all, the theatre room staff are the first people we have contact with and depending on who the person is, can be the deciding factor of our life and destiny. What if the doctor and nursing staff were Satanists, or occultists or whatever? I do believe that they say they are “born that way”, because if one of the nursing staff are a homosexual then that baby can be born and become a homosexual.

I do believe that this is another way that personalities are entered into our bodily computer (our soul), and as we experience life of the similar personalities, then our life begins to slip through our fingers like sand. You hear people say that they must be cursed, when they compare themself with another person, say a friend, born at the same time, same hospital, they walk the same paths, same jobs, but the other person gets all the opportunities and the second person appears to have a dark cloud hanging over them and they miss out completely. These personalities are a personality but a spirit is hanging onto that personality, and is another reason why we come across ALTERS.

ALTERS are a hard one, they can be deceiving spirits, or they can be a lost child’s clean spirit that is searching for release, such as to know our Lord Jesus Christ. This is a very hard one to discuss.

The ministry is deficient because it’s a business and most are not really doing it for the person, but for their own ego, notches on the handle of their gun, looking for kill ratios.

Many years ago I read a book “Christians Set Yourself Free” by Graham Powell, and it was basic information and it did set me on a course to me freedom. I began to see things differently and began to get some answers what I was seeing around me in the churches and my past life of childhood and adulthood. I do believe that this book is what made me keep an open mind and don’t get caught up with all the gung-ho, Sam-dunk ministries.
 
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Matjohluk

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Hi Talitha,

When counselling, I usually begin my first few minute with people by giving them a sheet of writing paper and a pen, and we pray a prayer asking our Messiah to bring to the person’s mind all those people who have hurt and offended them, and explain to the person that they are to write the names down immediately that comes to mind, and they are not to argue or debate the names, even if they are his siblings, parents and other relations.

Then after the list is made, we then go through each person one by one, sharing the hurt and offence and what they felt, their anger, and bitterness. It’s amazing even as you talk about this one incident, more begin to appear. And as the person confesses their sin of anger and bitterness toward that person, and forgive them through prayer, you see an immediate release off them. As you continue with more and more, and finally after an hour or so, the person looks exhausted, and sometimes you have to call it day, and return where you left off. We then repeat the same process, and this is when you find out the depth of their forgiveness, because when you ask our Lord again to show those people who have hurt and offended them, some of the names that you had covered the week or so earlier have reappeared back on the sheet.

You keep on going through the confession, repentance and forgiveness until no more names appear. But, two or three may still appear, and these are the hard ones, because there is much more that the person hasn’t shared. You can bind a spirit to silence, and then proceed with further prayer, anointing of oil, and laying on of hands.

I’ve always checked people on their cleansing of their hands, and that is the complete confession of sins, repentance and forgiveness. Once this is done, then purifying the heart can be achieved, but at times our tongue does get us into trouble, and whatever we say comes from our heart, and so we then have to learn how to control our tongue. Finally, when all of this is achieved, we can resist the enemy and become humble.

Sorry, I wasn’t advocating you were ranting and screaming, but I am speaking of about 70% of the ministries I have come across in our country, and I could mention many American names, but don’t go there anymore.
(1) The eyes of a person are the window into their soul. And if their eyes roll back into the eye sockets and all I see is “white”, then I know I have a real juicy spirit to confront. If their eyes are fluttering or looking up and down or to the left and right, then I just order the person to look me in the eye. And I then stare into their eyes, and I tell the demon to get. Yes, I can see a double image of a person, like a fine aurora.

(2) We have to be aware, beware and don’t be unaware, because we can fool ourselves. As we all say the Spirit of God will lead us.

(3) Enough to know that the incubus and sucbus sprits and the nightmare work in together; and they are normally sent by one of the local witches! I believe that a witch is a female “watcher”! I have been attacked a number of times, and when a certain female member in our retirement village ceased to exist, it all stopped.

(4) They use an astral plane, and when you hear continual strange noises in the ceiling of your home and thumping water pipes that are not due to building movement or steam in the hot water pipe, I call that “the bubble effect” as they arrive. I just say in Jesus’ Name get. Other times you find that so-called Christians who are the town criers of prophesy go onto endless description of heaven, and are no doubt a false believer.

(5) All other gods are Nephlim, sons of gods, watchers, Annaukai, and the list could go on. Read the Books of Enoch. I’ve seen a number of UFOs in my life, and in the military, and my views will tell you that the Nephlim were other beings, and they mated with women on earth, and all they could produce were “females”, and the word Nephlim really meant “DUDS”, they were a dud!

Yes, you will think that because the dictionary has been changed the real Christian meaning for the word “stronghold” in the 1984 Macquarie Dictionary is: “A stronghold is a place where anything, as an ideology, opinion, attitude, outlook, feelings, mindset, habit, etc., that is STRONG!” Therefore, what its saying is that if we allow our emotions, problems, beliefs, opinions, attitudes, outlook on life, feelings, mindset, habits, etc., to become strong in our life, that is, an obsession then that is a stronghold up within our Christian life. This meaning was deliberately removed from the dictionary, the same as many, many words in the Bible. The only reason why you see it as a “fortress” is because that is all that is in the dictionary now.

Yes, they deleted these meanings of STRONGMAN and POSSESSION from the dictionaries.

To take the deletions further from the dictionary, there is a play on words in the use of “architect” that means a “designer, deviser, maker or creator”. When we go to “designer” the second meaning is “schemer or intriguer”. (Now does that ring a bell?) We go to “scheme”, which means an underhand plot” and “intriguer” means “plot craftily or crafty dealing”. And when you go to the base of the word “design” we find that it’s a “hostile plan or crafty scheme, evil, or selfish intention”. Once again, the words that had real meaning to them have been deleted from the dictionary. “Architect” is a word that is used as the god of Masonry.

Well, I call myself a “believer” or “His disciple” I refer to “Christian” as a label of those people who go to church on Sunday, who are mainly wayside, stony, and thorny Christians, and believers are 30-fold, 60-fold, and 100-fold. I am a believer and I don’t go to church, because of my health, but at the same time, to avoid being contaminated by false teaching. But, the real substance of the word "Christian” is in the heart of the person that people are attempting to describe, and which the pagan user cannot see.
Our Lord Jesus Christ never called himself a Christian; He never called his followers Christians. The apostles never called each other Christians. Our Lord Jesus Christ never used an adjective to describe himself. So therefore, we seem to struggle with how we identify ourselves. The disciples called each other, "brethren", "disciples", "apostles", "servants", "believers", "followers", "the faithful", "the elect", "the called", and "saints." Therefore, we can also identify ourselves as "bondservants" of our Messiah, our Lord Jesus Christ. As far as I am concerned there are Christians and Believers, and I believe that there are more goats milling amongst the sheep.

Well you will hear more of this, as this radiation is destroying our planet, and is the replacement for asbestos and cigarette smoke. Many Christians have suicided, such as: priests, band members, and the general run of the mill. Many suffer CFS, ME and FMS and don’t really know what is causing their suffering. Electromagnetic radiation and fields are dangerous and a health risk. In fact microwave radiation has been classified “2B” carcinogenic along with electromagnetic fields.

If you want to learn something about a debilitating disorder that is being covered up by wireless companies and governments, then go to “switch2safe (dot) info” and you will learn of the health risks and the misinformation that is being spread by wireless companies.

This is the real problem of the Body of Christ they bring so many things from other religions into their churches and they believe if they add Christian to it then it will be spiritually all okay. Yoga and martial arts in churches under the surmise that by calling it Christian yoga and Christian martial arts they are not aware of the supernatural entities behind these far eastern religions, which is the same as using your church for a Masonic lodge.

Yair, all these idiots on the road get me into a lot of trouble with my wife!

Blessings
 
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Alithis

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Wow, Alive_Again - lots of revvies there.....

A few things stand out for right now.

First, the thing about the growths - I have read that before, but it's hitting me where I live right now. I have been struggling with the difference between "persistence in prayer" and "vain repetition", and this helps me with that. It's like chopping wood. We do not chop wood by taking one swipe with an axe, and then if the log is not split, say, well, that didn't work, I guess I'm not supposed to have smaller pieces of wood. We have to do exactly the same motion over and over (okay, they have to - I've never chopped wood).

I have read I think two books by Anna Rountree - and I do remember the part you're talking about. I have often wondered why people (myself included) are learning things and yet not moving out in them.
Aha! :idea:

I think I will be looking back at this thread for my next book ideas! Right now I'm starting one by Pat Holliday....


That's one thing that started this journey - I don't remember if I said it earlier, but..... because of a dream I had, a friend ended up sending me to a website to find out about "marine spirits" - and even though I didn't think I was buying into that totally, one night when I couldn't fall asleep, I went ahead and spoke out the fifty-some-odd statements of declaration and renouncement - and I went right to sleep after that - and had my first really clear divine dream that I'd had in maybe six or seven years!

It works if you work it, huh?

blessings
tal
on persistant prayer vs vain repetition ...
I have not read a book on any christian principles in a lot of years .i did as a young adult 19 to 24 ...I read moody, finny ,wigglesworth ,etc .but none in many years .i found they impart knowledge .but wisdom? (the ability to put knowledge into action in the manner most eternally beneficial to the benevolence of all people creation and God )methinks comes from God alone .
any way ... i think you might enjoy" Reece Howells ,intercessor "
the words that i recall that never left me from the account of his life were.. ABIDE IN FAITH .
he taught that once ,having believed and thus prayed based on that belief one should from that moment on fasten ones eyes upon the lord and take a stance in faith ..never allowing even the remotest thought or imagination that was contrary to that which was asked for according to the will of God, to be even momentarily entertained .
.. it seems that it was not a matter of praying the same prayer over and over but thanking god -in faith-over and over for that which he had already accomplished simply because his child had asked it of him .

but heres a thought that must not be left out .. reece howlles did not choose what to pray about .. he listened to the holy Spirit and prayed what the holy Spirit instructed him to pray .:).. which brings deeper meaning to the instruction" what so ever you pray according to MY will ".... rather then according to our flights of fancy .

(That is where the whole name it and claim it thing gauls me to be honest ... if caution is not taken to seek Gods will .. and you teach that , the spiritually uneducated risk using god as a ATM naming and claiming according to their own wants . As James warns again .it leads to disillusionment )

hmm i must read that book again ..its been 26 odd years since i did .
 
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talitha

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Matjohluk, I have figured out that your posts are so hard to follow because you are responding piece by piece to what I'm saying without quoting what I said. But it's not in the order that I posted it. Although it's rather laborious, I'm going to go ahead and look at your post and my post and see if I can figure out what you're responding to and exactly what point you are trying to make in each paragraph of this two-part post of yours, and see if I can respond somewhat intelligently and yet briefly enough so that I'm not spending an hour and a half on responding here, as I did last time - okay that might be too tall an order, but here we go. Sorry, I'm not going to respond to every single thing. That is just too much, and I don't really see that you are inviting response.

There is a definite separation between spiritual (supernatural) and physical (natural), and that includes the nomenclature of spirits: clean and unclean, good and evil, white and black entities, and sweet and bitter.
Okay, I don't know if I'm understanding you - you seem to be making a parallel between the separation between spiritual and physical and all these others, which are basically good and evil. It appears that you are saying that spiritual is good and physical is bad. I don't think (from everything else that you have written on this thread) that you believe that. So what were you trying to say here? :confused:
There is so much going in the spiritual realm that most Christians are closing their eyes and pretend that it’s not there.
Accurate assessment.
Normal life is the spiritual and physical realms of earthly things, and spiritual life is the spiritual and physical reams of heavenly things.
I'm not sure I understand what you mean by that - how that applies to your experience of reality?

ALTERS are a hard one, they can be deceiving spirits, or they can be a lost child’s clean spirit that is searching for release, such as to know our Lord Jesus Christ. This is a very hard one to discuss.
Yup. :-/
 
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talitha

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Response to Matjohluk Part 2 of 2

When counselling, I usually begin my first few minute with people by giving them a sheet of writing paper and a pen....
Yeah, I have used a similar method sometimes, including sometimes in self-examination.

Thanks for answering my five questions and for numbering them so that I knew what you were talking about - this helped greatly.

(1) Soooo.. it's either a behavior you observe with your eyes or words you hear with your ears that lets you know there's a demon?

(3) Enough to know that the incubus and sucbus sprits and the nightmare work in together; and they are normally sent by one of the local witches! I believe that a witch is a female “watcher”! I have been attacked a number of times, and when a certain female member in our retirement village ceased to exist, it all stopped.
This reminds me distinctly of this scripture, which came up in an interpretation of one of my dreams recently:
And say, Thus says the Lord GOD; Woe to the women that sew charms upon all wrists, and make veils for the heads, of every length, to hunt souls! Will you hunt the souls of my people, and will you save the souls alive that belong to you? And will you profane me among my people for handfuls of barley and for pieces of bread, to slay the souls that should not die, and to save the souls alive that should not live, by your lying to my people that hear your lies? Therefore thus says the Lord GOD; Behold, I am against your charms, with which you hunt the souls there like birds, and I will tear them from your arms, and will let the souls go, even the souls that you hunt like birds. Your veils also will I tear, and deliver my people out of your hand, and they shall be no more in your hand to be hunted; and you shall know that I am the LORD. Because with lies you have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not turn from his wicked way, to save his life: Therefore you shall see no more false visions, nor practice divinations: for I will deliver my people out of your hand: and you shall know that I am the LORD. (from Ezekiel 13, KJ2000 version)

(4) They use an astral plane, and when you hear continual strange noises in the ceiling of your home and thumping water pipes that are not due to building movement or steam in the hot water pipe, I call that “the bubble effect” as they arrive. I just say in Jesus’ Name get.
Interesting..

Other times you find that so-called Christians who are the town criers of prophesy go onto endless description of heaven, and are no doubt a false believer.
You really think so?

(5) All other gods are Nephlim, sons of gods, watchers, Annaukai, and the list could go on. Read the Books of Enoch. I’ve seen a number of UFOs in my life, and in the military, and my views will tell you that the Nephlim were other beings, and they mated with women on earth, and all they could produce were “females”, and the word Nephlim really meant “DUDS”, they were a dud!
But do you agree they are all demonic?

On "stronghold" - this is why I disagree with you:
Etymology of the word (via etymonline): early 14c., from strong (adj.) + hold (n.) "fortified place, refuge."
Hebrew and Greek words, according to Thayer's point to a military connection.
(btw, I love etymology..)

Our Lord Jesus Christ never called himself a Christian; He never called his followers Christians.
Of course Jesus never called himself a Christian - he was the Christ. The Bible does use the word "Christian" to describe followers of the Way.. I don't think there is any problem in the name.

This is the real problem of the Body of Christ they bring so many things from other religions into their churches and they believe if they add Christian to it then it will be spiritually all okay.
Agreed..

done.. Getting close to 1 AM - I'm tired.....
 
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PersephonesTear

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How would one go about casting a demon out of a Ouija board in the first place??:confused:
Sorry for just popping in on this without any previous discussion, but...

I honestly do not see the need, the reason, or the point of trying to cast a demon out of an object that exists solely to communicate with spirits. Ouija boards have no other purpose, no other value, no reason to exist other than to speak with spirits. Why waste the time on them? Just toss the thing out, and be done with it.

You can sit there and cast spirits out of Ouija boards all day long, but in the end you still have exactly what you started with - a spirit board that can be used for nothing but talking to spirits. Messing with it at all (even to supposedly cast out a demon) is at best a waste of time, and at worst a good way to get yourself hurt.
 
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Alithis

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Sorry for just popping in on this without any previous discussion, but...

I honestly do not see the need, the reason, or the point of trying to cast a demon out of an object that exists solely to communicate with spirits. Ouija boards have no other purpose, no other value, no reason to exist other than to speak with spirits. Why waste the time on them? Just toss the thing out, and be done with it.

You can sit there and cast spirits out of Ouija boards all day long, but in the end you still have exactly what you started with - a spirit board that can be used for nothing but talking to spirits. Messing with it at all (even to supposedly cast out a demon) is at best a waste of time, and at worst a good way to get yourself hurt.
fair point .. bind the spirit and burn the board .

but not overly conducive to the discussion .
some part of this discussion are a little to much intellectualism for me ..too much lean on understanding ... risky business when one leans on their own understanding .
just saying :)
 
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PersephonesTear

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fair point .. bind the spirit and burn the board .

but not overly conducive to the discussion .
some part of this discussion are a little to much intellectualism for me ..too much lean on understanding ... risky business when one leans on their own understanding .
just saying :)


Eeeh... I don't know. I haven't found the thread overly intellectual, just very wordy. It can be difficult to wade through it all, but I'm trying.
 
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Matjohluk

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Sorry Talitha,

But, I don’t know how to use the functions that you used in highlighting my comments then your comments. So here goes and try to leave it as it is.

Originally Posted by Matjohluk
There is a definite separation between spiritual (supernatural) and physical (natural), and that includes the nomenclature of spirits: clean and unclean, good and evil, white and black entities, and sweet and bitter.

YOU SAID: Okay, I don't know if I'munderstanding you - you seem to be making a parallel between the separation between spiritual and physical and all these others, which are basically good and evil. It appears that you are saying that spiritual is good and physical is bad. I don't think (from everything else that you have written on this thread) that you believe that. So what were you trying to say here?

ME SAID: Yes I am making a parallel, because Biblical thoughts and teaching on the “theology of the spiritual realm” leaves much to be desired that all spirits are EVIL, which is wrong. You can have either a good or evil spirit, this I know from my own personal experiences, and knowledge and understanding of the laws of the spiritual realm as per all ancient cultures before the New Testament. I am sure that the converted Jews before the foundation of the Bible knew this as well, and we would know because the Church of Rome destroyed all Jewish books between 300-1500AD, and they are now are gone forever.

We often hear a person say that a person has a GOOD spirit; and that person doesn’t have to be a believer or a Christian to have a GOOD spirit. Planet earth is a world of dualism and that is what I was trying to describe in my example of clean and unclean, good and evil, light and dark, white and black angels/spirits.

This known fact throughout all cultures of the world and ancient cultures, as they knew that a spirit leaves the “soul” or “house” when cast out or upon death. Good spirits are not cast out, but they leave a “soul” upon death, and they may enter another person of the family through what is referred to as “soul tie” or an animal, or wander in “dry places”.

We have all heard about “Casper the friendly ghost”, well such GOOD spirits exist in this form. Sometime these spirits are used by fortune tellers who seem to pass on exact information of other people, but sadly Christians critics see such things as being demonic and evil, not all non-Christians are EVIL. In a Christian’s mind everything is demonic, which is a lie!

I can’t remember what comment you made when I explained this above, but I can share many such experiences that familiar and mischievous spirits are not EVIL. The Fruit of the Spirit is a spirit, such as we can have a good spirit, a kind spirit, a gentle spirit, a patient spirit, a self-controlled spirit, a faithful spirit, a joyful spirit, a peaceful spirit and a loving spirit; and you don’t have to be a believer to have those spirits.


There is so much going in the spiritual realm that most Christians are closing their eyes and pretend that it’s not there.
YOU SAID: Accurate assessment.

ME SAID: Thanks!

Normal life is the spiritual and physical realms of earthly things, and spiritual life is the spiritual and physical reams of heavenly things.

YOU SAID: I'm not sure I understand what you mean by that - how that applies to your experience of reality?

ME SAID: We live on planet earth, and we experience many things of planet earth, but most Christians see these experiences in one narrow minded belief system, and don’t see the differences between the earthly and heavenly things.

The spiritual realms of earthly things are the local and geographic spirits, such as good, or evil and the evil being the rulers of darkness and spiritual hosts. They can be annoying to us in either giving us a hard time or trying to pull us into line. Such as:
(1) If we are in a hurry in traffic, running late for an appointment, and every time you get to a set of lights they turn RED. Annoying, and we could consider that the enemy is doing that deliberately or is that a coincidence? What do you think?

(2) But on other occasions we are exceeding the speed limit, breaking the road rules, being impatient and losing self-control, the same happens time after time, and finally you get pinged and end up with an exceedingly large fine and a loss of driving points. Is that a coincidence? What do you think?

(3) We approach a door and the door opens for you before you get to it. What do you think?

(4) A door is open, and as you approach to walk through it, it slams in your face, and there is no wind and nobody on the other side. What do you think?

(5) You another person’s precious item in your hand, and it flies out of your hand and smashes, you know you didn’t drop it, but everyone else around believes you did. What do you think?

(6) You are sitting in your armchair and then you get a feeling that a person is coming and next minute they are standing at your door knocking. So what do you think?

Now when we go to the spiritual realm of heavenly things then we are walking in the supernatural with God’s angels and Satan’s angels of the “principalities and powers”. They are those angels who save our life, and I can vouch for that a number of times, or those dark angels who try to destroy our life.

I get very annoyed when Christians only see dark, black, and demonic, and then when you are sharing of God’s or dark angel experiences, they don’t want to hear and blurt out “Don’t give glory to Satan!”

So when things all come down to the nitty-gritty, there are no coincidences!


ALTERS are a hard one, they can be deceiving spirits, or they can be a lost child’s clean spirit that is searching for release, such as to know our Lord Jesus Christ. This is a very hard one to discuss.
Yup. :-/
 
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