Deliverance Ministry

No I used hebrew which is the original translation. either way I was taught by one of the leading teachers who is fluent in both hebrew and Greek. A graduate from Cambridge university awarded as a king scholar. The point is Christians cannot be owned by Satan and that's all there is to it. By the way the definition of oppression has nothing to do with demons in any language. However a demon can oppress someone.

English -prolonged cruel or unjust treatment or control.
Hebrew- cruelly, extortion, oppression, thing deceitfully gotten
Greek- From kata and a derivative of ponos; to labor down, i.e. Wear with toil (figuratively, harass) -- oppress, vex.

Who is Derek Prince and why should we take his advice on demons?

1915–2003) was born in India of British parents. Educated as a scholar of Greek and Latin at Eton College and Cambridge University, England, he held a Fellowship in Ancient and Modern Philosophy at King’s College. He also studied Hebrew and Aramaic, at Cambridge University and the Hebrew University in Jerusalem.

He is the author of over 50 books, 600 audio and 100 video teachings, many of which have been translated and published in more than 100 languages. His daily radio broadcast is translated into Arabic, Bahasa (Indonesia), Chinese (Amoy, Cantonese, Mandarin, Shanghaiese, Swatow), Croatian, German, Malagasy, Mongolian, Russian, Samoan, Spanish and Tongan. The radio program continues to touch lives around the world.

talitha said:

I am coming to believe that demonic influence, oppression, possession - whatever you want to call it - is more pervasive than we tend to think. For a long time I have wanted to know more about deliverance, to learn how to minister in that way, but many times, when there is a need for that, it happens behind closed doors. Even if a person manifests in a worship service, he or she is quickly whisked away, and those in the know go along to do what needs to be done. Even when I took a ministry training class under the apostle of my church, I didn't learn much at all about deliverance. But in a facebook chat with an online friend in Ghana she quickly identified the type of spirit behind something that has been messing with me for several years. I am beginning to think that we have turned a blind eye to these things for so long in Western Christianity (even in Spirit-filled churches) that we think they don't exist - which gives them all kinds of leeway to mess with us.

Any thoughts on this?

Does anyone know of some deliverance ministries with real knowledge and spiritual authority and a history of success in dealing with these things? When I look up topics in this area, I almost always end up with resources from Africa. I'm glad they have resources there, but how about in the West?

blessings
tal

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such ministry is part of the gospel work..
ask the lord for the gift of discernment of spirits..and he will give it..
ask for wisdom in how to proceed when you discern ..and the lord will give you wisdom

God bless you for desiring his will -to set people free.
our lord Jesus is with you

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add- i was delivered from demonic influence at 16yrs old...had an evil spirit cast out by the power of the authority of the name of Jesus...and later after i was baptized in the Holy Ghost the lord directly delivered me from demonic recurring night terrors.the lord Jesus displayed to me just how almighty he is and all fear left me .when i meet my lady (now wife) she would have instant paralyzing terror in moments of falling asleep..when she told me i said hold my hand as you fall asleep...she was tired and dozed off a few minutes later suddenly her hand squeezed mine like a cold vice so strong...for an instant the hairs on my neck stood up haha..then i recalled My lord Jesus showing me how almighty he is..and i spoke and said you evil tormenting spirit,you stop troubling her and get out of her body and life in Jesus name...
my fiancee(now wife ) never had that happen ever again, praise to our lord and savior Jesus.amen.
i share this to encourage you that i don't only speak theory but truth in Jesus.. so ask him and you will receive what you require to do HIS will

ChangedByHim said:

I highly recommend Dr. Lester Sumrall on the subject of demonology and deliverance. I graduated from his Bible College and sat under his ministry for a few years. He has several books on the subject and was looked upon as one of the world's leading experts on the subject. I witnessed him being used in powerful deliverance ministry numerous times.

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I wholehearted agree with this suggestion.

If we were to find someone who actually "operated" in the power of GOD in this area of discipleship, Lester was definitely one of them. It's unfortunate that once he left no one has really filled his position since. Maybe one day.

Talitha, on subjects like these, where the written word is not very expansive, we have to approach The Holy Spirit and place our trust in Him that He will reveal and teach us what we need to know, and sometimes that requires us to correct our preconceived ideas on subjects

It matters not what I or anyone else thinks, only what The Father says, since He is the only absolute truth. Take these matters to Him to learn, and rely not on mankind.

Hi Talitha,

1 Corinthians 12:1-12 (NKJV):

Now concerning spiritual gifts, brethren, I do not want you to be ignorant: You know that you were Gentiles, carried away to these dumb idols, however you were led. Therefore I make known to you that no one speaking by the Spirit of God calls Jesus accursed, and no one can say that Jesus is Lord except by the Holy Spirit.

There are diversities of gifts, but the same Spirit. There are differences of ministries, but the same Lord. And there are diversities of activities, but it is the same God who works all in all. But the manifestation of the Spirit is given to each one for the profit of all: for to one is given the word of wisdom through the Spirit, to another the word of knowledge through the same Spirit, to another faith by the same Spirit, to another gifts of healings by the same Spirit, to another the working of miracles, to another prophecy, to another discerning of spirits, to another different kinds of tongues, to another the interpretation of tongues. But one and the same Spirit works all these things, distributing to each one individually as He wills.

Did you notice that there is no spiritual gift of deliverance?

I’ve been around a long time, and was first introduced into the Deliverance Ministry in 1991 (23 years ago), and through some wonderful men of God, such as Derek Prince and Tom Jewett, I was able to understand many things of the “Good News”, those things that were the essence of the Healing Ministry through the gifts of healing, working of miracles, and discerning of spirits.

The Deliverance Ministry of the 21st Century is a farce. Over the past 20 years I have watched the true healing ministry of our Lord Jesus Christ be turned into a circus, mockery, and an embarrassment through the many false teachers who centre their ministry on their own glorification and adoration. If you challenge these show-ponies you will be drum-rolled out of what they call the Body of Christ, excommunicated, to be deprived of the right of church membership by ecclesiastical authority, and excluded from membership or participation in a group. Now is that part of the Word of God?

I have always approached this ministry as our Lord Jesus Christ’s healing ministry that conducted itself in the same reasons for His Coming; He came to heal the broken-hearted, to deliver them from evil, to set them free from captivity, to cast out their demons, and to heal their illnesses. It wasn’t a tall order to our Lord Jesus Christ then or to His disciples. They didn’t go around in the 1st Century, in the mode that we see today in the 21st Century church of a big display of showmanship or work behind closed doors. They ministered in love and forgiveness through confession of sin and repentance. It’s interesting to note that these four commandments from our Messiah were given to those who believe that He is our Yeshua HaMashiach.

We need to understand the reality of the spiritual (supernatural) realm and the physical (natural) realm that our Lord spoke often about, and tried His hardest to make people aware of the heavenly and earthly things that most are not aware of.

He also explained in much detail of the “six heart soil levels” in Matthew 13 and Luke 8, and sadly most churches are founded on the first three soil levels by pollution and contamination of His Word through the many false teachers, who are the devil’s advocates, the enemy of His Kingdom, and they are there only to “steal, destroy, and kill” any seed, incorruptible seed, the Word of God, that has been sown.

Luke 8:10-16 (NKJV):
And He said, “To you it has been given to know the mysteries of the kingdom of God, but to the rest it is given in parables, that ‘Seeing they may not see, and hearing they may not understand.’
“Now the parable is this: The seed is the word of God. Those by the wayside are the ones who hear; then the devil comes and takes away (steal) the word out of their hearts, lest they should believe and be saved.
But the ones on the rock are those who, when they hear, receive the word with joy; and these have no root, who believe for a while and in time of temptation fall away (destroy).
Now the ones that fell among thorns are those who, when they have heard, go out and are choked with cares, riches, and pleasures of life, and bring no fruit to maturity (killed)
But the ones that fell on the good ground are those who, having heard the word with a noble and good heart, keep it and bear fruit with patience (the 30-fold, 60-fold and 100-fold).

It’s commonly known that most churches run on a 20% capacity of “good ground”, and the other 80% is the wayside, rocky and thorny Christians and they are the people that the so-called deliverance ministry is ministering, when their church is failing to feed them “meat”, and continue to feed them “milk”. False teaching is a method of “quick fix”, “silver or gold bullet” solution to hell, and not salvation and freedom.

To attain our Freedom in Christ we need to “confess our sins”, “repent”, ‘forgive” and then “love”.

1 Peter 1:22-25 (NKJV):
Since you have purified your souls in obeying the truth through the Spirit in sincere love of the brethren, love one another fervently with a pure heart, having been born again, not of corruptible seed but incorruptible, through the word of God which lives and abides forever, because “All flesh is as grass, and all the glory of man as the flower of the grass. The grass withers, and its flower falls away, but the word of the LORD endures forever.”

Now this is the word which by the gospel was preached to you.

Does this sound familiar to you?

To digress now, the Gentile church of the 21st Century has completely forgotten the “Chosen People”, the Jews, who were the original Body of Christ, and the modern church of today tends to forget that Christianity was stolen from them in 300AD. Then anti-Semeticism came into vogue and the leaders turned the real teachings of our Yeshua, the Jewish doctrine of 300 years into a semi-paganistic belief, which has over the past fifty years been distorted, misrepresented, and watered down, and has now become in a form of pagan and occultic practices and idolatry.

The Body of Christ has missed the mark completely over the past fifty years, as nowhere in the Word of God is the ministry of deliverance mentioned, but any acts of freedom and healing was performed by belief, confession, repentance, love, and forgiveness, which are the essence of: healing a broken-heart, being delivered from evil, and being set free from captivity.

If we remove the words deliverance and replace it with the known word of “healing”, then it will not be conducted behind closed doors because the Word of God says:

James 1:21-26 (NKJV):
Therefore lay aside all filthiness and overflow of wickedness, and receive with meekness the implanted word, which is able to save your soul (house).
But be doers of the word and not hearers only, deceiving yourselves.
For if anyone is a hearer of the word and not a doer, he is like a man observing his natural face in a mirror; for he observes himself, goes away, and immediately forgets what kind of man he was.
But he who looks into the perfect law of liberty and continues in it, and is not a forgetful hearer but a doer of the work, this one will be blessed in what he does.
If anyone among you thinks he is religious, and does not bridle his tongue but deceives his own heart, this one’s religion is useless (false teachers).

James 4:6-8 (NKJV):
But He gives more grace. Therefore He says: “God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble.” Therefore submit to God. Resist the devil and he will flee from you. Draw near to God and He will draw near to you. Cleanse your hands (confess and repent), you sinners; and purify your hearts (forgive and love), you double-minded.

Therefore, after reading these verses above, then why would you need a deliverance ministry when those who are suffering have fulfilled these requirements? The modern Body of Christ have completely ignored His teaching in Matthew 13 and Luke 8, as it appears that there are more wayside, rocky and thorny Christians trying to get an easy ride to heaven.

Those who meet specific needs don’t need to go behind closed doors:

James 5:13-16 (NKJV):
Is anyone among you suffering? Let him pray. Is anyone cheerful? Let him sing psalms. Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church (not the deliverance ministry behind closed doors), and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord.
And the prayer of faith will save the sick, and the Lord will raise him up. And if he has committed sins, he will be forgiven. (But only if they) Confess your trespasses to one another, and pray for one another, that you may be healed. The effective, fervent prayer of a righteous man avails much.

There you are the verses of the healing ministry of Yeshua that will heal the broken-hearted, deliver them from evil, set the captives free, cast out their demons, and heal their illnesses. Now if these Scriptures are not abiding by us we will experience the following:

Luke 11:24-26 (NKJV):
“When an unclean spirit goes out of a man, he goes through dry places, seeking rest; and finding none, he says, ‘I will return to my house from which I came.’ And when he comes, he finds it swept and put in order. Then he goes and takes with him seven other spirits more wicked than himself, and they enter and dwell there; and the last state of that man is worse than the first.”

And this will happen because:

1 Peter 5:5-9 (NKJV):
Likewise you younger people, submit yourselves to your elders. Yes, all of you be submissive to one another, and be clothed with humility, for “God resists the proud, but gives grace to the humble.”
Therefore humble yourselves under the mighty hand of God, that He may exalt you in due time, casting all your care upon Him, for He cares for you.
Be sober; be vigilant; because your adversary the devil walks about like a roaring lion, seeking whom he may devour. Resist him, steadfast in the faith, knowing that the same sufferings are experienced by your brotherhood in the world.

Like I said earlier. It's just a natural part of allowing Jesus' healing to flow through us.

Matjohluk said:

To digress now, the Gentile church of the 21st Century has completely forgotten the “Chosen People”, the Jews, who were the original Body of Christ, and the modern church of today tends to forget that Christianity was stolen from them in 300AD.

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"Christianity" was not something stolen!!

Christ is someone who is accepted or not!!

Jesus came to the Jews first, and was rejected. Then He came to the gentile (every one else).

He is still available to the Jews. All they have to do is accept the Christ. Jesus said "Behold I stand at the door and knock; if anyone hears My voice and opens the door, I will come in to him" (Rev 19:20)

The Jews never had "Christianity". Christianity is a religion. We don't need "Christianity" we need Jesus Christ. Most of the Jews did not accept Jesus Christ, but a few did. His disciples were Jewish people. And Jewish people can still recieve Him. Christianity is a religion. Christian should be those that have accepted Jesus Christ, but that is not always the case.

Christianity has done terrible things through out history!! Christianity has made it very hard for some people to accept Jesus Christ. Many, if not most, Jewish people today have a very hard time considering accepting Jesus Christ because of what Christianity has done. So not only did the church today not steal Christianity from the Jews, they don't want it!!

It is a good thing that we are not trying, or at least should not be trying to give them Christianity!!

We are supposed to be introducing them to Jesus Christ, who appeared in the flesh as a Jewish Rabbi. And He still lives!! That is the good news. They can get to know Him!! And that alone is our message!!

He sits at the right hand of God in the kingdom of God. His name is called the Word of God, because He wants and will talk to us if only we are willing to listen to Him. And we will listen to Him if only we can repent of trying to do things our ways and start looking to hear from Him so we will know what God wants us to do.

He, Jesus Christ, is just standing there waiting for anyone to listen to Him, but sadly we make it about Christianity (a religion whose followers have done terrible things to peoples like the Jews).

We can say alsorts of wonderfully sounding religous statements, but if we are not trying to get people to listen to Him, the Lord their God, then it is all for not.

Hi 2K2,

The church of Jesus Christ were mainly Jews, and Constantine didn't like the Jews running the church and it was basically taken from them. I not going to split hairs about that anyway. Most of the writers were Jews and the Scriptures were written for the Jews, and not for the basically the Gentiles. As I said, it's just a figure of speech take it whichever way you like, but the church before Constaintine had taken it over were mostly Jews.

From then on the Church of Rome took extraordinary steps to destroy all knowledge of Jewish books that contained the true name of our Lord Jesus Christ. It continued on for centuries when all copies of the book of Elxai were destroyed that were comprehensive original records reporting the life of our Lord Jesus Christ. Then Pope Alexander VI ordered all copies of the Talmud destroyed, and later on every Hebrew book in the city of Prague was confiscated. The mass destruction of Jewish books included hundreds of copies of the Old Testament and caused the irretrievable loss of many original handwritten documents. The oldest text of the Old Testament that survived, before the discovery of the Dead Sea Scrolls" was said to be the Bodleian Codex (Oxford), which was dated to circa 1100 AD. All of this was an attempt by the church to remove damaging Rabbinic information about Jesus Christ from the face of the earth, the Inquisition burnt 12,000 volumes of the Talmud. As I said the only point I was making there was that before 300AD the church was mainly Jews.

Anyway, thanks for commenting on my thoughts of the Deliverance Ministry.

talitha said:

Interestingly, though I too have been around a long time (not sure how that's germane), and though I am in the midst of a study on gifts in my personal time, I have never noticed the absence of deliverance in those listings. Maybe it's missing because we are ALL commissioned by Jesus to cast out devils. It's not a motivational gift, and it's not a manifestation of the spirit, because we just carry authority from Jesus to do it. Just an idea.. hmm..l

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It is correct to say there is no deliverance ministry, since the gift in operation is the gifts of healings.

If you look up passages where Jesus cast out demons, a good many of the events afterwards said "and he was healed." It is a spiritual healing from GOD.

Hi Talitha

Yes, that is so in regards to the word “gifts”, as Paul is responding to a question he had received from the Corinth church, and when he said “spiritual gifts” Paul may have been referring to spiritual things or persons. And there is no problems about you feeling you might be patronising me, because you are not. Actually, I was actively involved in this ministry and I began to see far too much dabbling of occulticism, and mysticism; including much power and control by the leaders. You can’t cast out an evil spirit if the person’s “house is empty, swept, and put in order” because it will come back very quickly and bring more back with them from “dry places”.

What I was trying to bring out the attention of our Lord’s ministry was healing, not actually deliverance, because we were all commissioned to:

Heal the broken-hearted, and I found the only was in doing that is to counsel the person in love and bring them to the point of forgiving those who had offended and abused them. I used the most common principles of “Freedom in Christ” for the person to search their soul of the anger, bitterness, hurts, offences, and even hatred to bring them to the surface and lay them down in front of them to see that our Lord’s ministry is forgiveness and that they are required to forgive and love those people. I also brought those people to asking those people they had abused and offended, knowingly or unknowingly, and asked them for forgiveness. It’s amazing when you get a person to ask our Lord to show them all these people and to write their names down on a sheet of paper.

After you lead them in prayer of admitting their sin of unforgiveness, anger, bitterness, hurt, offence and even hatred the release you see on that person’s face, as many say they felt this heavy burden lift off them when they forgave that person. They all said that they had thought they had forgiven them, even though the thought kept on coming back deep down inside of them: “How can you forgive them after what they did to you!” Yep, that powerful demon swelling in their “house” was trying to steal, destroy, and kill that freedom that the person offered to them and needed, and the knowledge of the truth that will set them free from the evil one and captivity.

Yes, as Paul said that we desire the spiritual gifts.

The ministry of healing has been taken over by showmen, who flaunt their wares on TV, slam-dunking people for entertainment and has no authority, but working with the evil one as his advocate. I could mention many names of false teachers and prophets, but our Lord knows who they are and I will avoid any discriminating statements of such people, and I have no faith in their teaching, because it’s unbiblical. You can go in an punch “false teachers and prophets” into Google Search Engine and we would have a ball in viewing all those who believe they are doing HIS Will when they know they are false and are conning the people.

Authority can only come from freedom of the person who you are trying to help, lead and guide. It’s no use of casting out demons from a person who still has far too many fish hooks in their body. The will soon return and they will end up being worse than before. I’ve seen it so many times, and these slam-dunk ceremonies are of the “angel of light” and the Kundalini spirit that has penetrated deep-down within the bowels of the Body of Christ by allowing far-eastern religion practices in those churches. And you can throw in people like Bob Larson, Benny Hinn, and many, many more.

My mum dabbled in the occult and I saw a lot as a child of the supernatural realm, and could share many things, and I know when I was growing up between 1937 to 1947, I was introduced to our Lord as he saved me many times from the evil that was going on in our home. But, it had taken me from 1957 to 1991 to realise that God really was our Lord Jesus Christ. Many churches today are more God-centred than CHRIST-centred.

I’ve always believed that all the stuff that the early believers knew were the normal run-of-the-mill; they knew the heavenly and earthly things of the supernatural and natural realms very well, but the beginning of Church in 300AD soon stifled that knowledge and understanding, as many great Books of the Bible were destroyed and thrown out and not cannonised.

The Lord’s Prayer is basically enough to understand the forgiveness, and that can only come about by what was written in the NT to confess our sins and REPENT. Nobody teaches about REPENTANCE either, which is a main feature of freedom and walking in obedience to HIS Commandments. The laying on of hands in churches is a concern, because I would let some people lay their hands on me. His Word says to lay hands, anoint with oil, confess our sins and by prayer we will be healed; and confession, repentance and forgiveness is the most integral part of Freedom in Christ that will heal our broken-hearts, deliver us from the evil one and false teaching, set us free from captivity as we will know the truth, heal our illnesses and cast out demons out. I’ve seen demons leave people immediately when they had confessed their sins and forgiven another person. Repentance is the hardest of them all, as we can say we are sorry, but we keep on doing the same thing over and over again.

Preach, I could preach on the principalities and powers, rulers of darkness and spiritual hosts until I was blue in the face and most churches would laugh at you in gullibility of believing they can’t touch them because they are a Christian; yep, wayside, stony and thorny Christians!

The Body of Christ has no idea what the heavenly and earthly things are, and our churches are now full of Christian yoga, Christian martial arts, Christian Wicca, Christian mysticism, Christian this and Christian that; and they believe if they put “Christian” on it then it’s all okay with our Lord and they haven’t invited the demonic idols into their body. I shake my head in despair to see how gullible and deceived the Body of Christ is today. You can call a lemon and orange, but it will always be a lemon.

When I read “The Parable of the Sower”, I could visualise our Lord Jesus Christ sitting in the boat, watching a farmer walking across a field casting “wheat seed” to and fro, from left to right, in all directions.

As He looked toward the group of people gathered in front of Him, He could see that they had different personalities. Our Lord Jesus Christ saw himself as the “Sower”, like the farmer, casting the seeds of His Message to and fro upon His audience who had six different kinds of “heart-soil” level, upon which the seed would fall. He could see that depending on the “heart-soil” level of the people concerned Him whether they could lose, or kill, or crush, or receive the “seed” that He was about to sow!

As we know that in a field in those days, there are many narrow well-packed down strips of pathway that the farmer, the “Sower”, would walk casting the seed in all directions, and in the process some of the “seed” would fall on the harden, well-beaten pathway, “the wayside”, and the ground was so hard that the seed could not penetrate the well-packed down earth.

But on either side of the path there is the “stony soil”, and “thorny soil”.

The “stony soil” was very stony, but had a small depth of soil of approximately two inches, where the seed would germinate, but not enough soil for the root to develop in, because of the shallowness of ground. And when the summer heat arrived the plant would wither and die.

The “thorny soil” is a weed-filled soil and is a very deceptive ground, because it may look good, but it is full of fibrous roots of the weeds growing in the soil. When the seed germinates and begins to grow, the deep-seated thorn roots of the weed also begin to grow and begin to choke all the life out of the germinating seed before it could become a “full plant”.

Wayside Christian could be a person who has a shut-mind and a hardened heart, and they do not understand, nor try to understand. They allow Satan and his forces to steal, destroy, and kill the “Message”. We could say that they suffer from pride and gross immorality, and they don't want to change their life and they most have a false idea of salvation.

Stony Christian could have a shallow mind, and they show enthusiasm of being a new Christian until they run into difficulties, opposition, persecution, or requirement of personal discipline. They seem to receive the “Message”, want leadership, etc, but they have not sat down to count the cost. The “seed” is not rooted in them.

Thorny Christian is a “hearer of the Message”, with a surcharged heart, who seems to receive the “seed”, but is far too busy to pray, has no time to read the Bible, and sits in the church, and there mind is wandering elsewhere, full of worldly thoughts. They love to be involved in committees, and doing good deeds, but they have no spare time, spare emotion, spare energy, nor spare thought for the person of our Lord Jesus Christ, the living word. They are not Christ-centred whatsoever.

True Christian are three kinds of “true” Christians: the 100-fold Christian, who is completely obedient, dedicated, and surrendered to our Lord Jesus Christ; the 60-fold Christian, who bears fruit, but without complete obedience and discipline; and the 30-fold Christian, who are saved, but are half-hearted and still trying to understand and find their way along that narrow path.

We can all believe we are Spirit-filled, and Christ-centred, but our carnal mind needs reprogramming, and our spiritual mind, you HEART needs to be changed by being FILLED with HIM and His Word, not be "empty"; CLEANSED by HIM and His Blood, not be "swept"; and WALKING WITH HIM in obedience, discipline and in an active Lordship, not be "put in order" (see Matthew 12:43-45 and Luke 11:24-26).


I use quotation marks to emphasise the importance of CONFESS our SINS, REPENT, FORGIVE, and to LOVE than to capitalise them as I have in this case. They are our Lord Jesus Christ’s commandments!


Sorry if you thought that I was patronising you by saying this: “Does this sound familiar to you?” I was trying to establish your true feelings and understanding of what I have tried to express to you from my heart. I would never patronise another person. I only speak in love!

Well, I am an elderly person (77 years of age), have been around the narrow paths, wide gates, seen the insides of a number of churches of sin and have seen how the true Word of God has been distorted, misrepresented, and watered down, and one such book of idolatry is “The Message”. If I was to be specific, then I would end up with a twenty page comments on what has been removed, changed, and distorted.

If you go into Google Engine I am sure you will find all that you need to check out and to see the acts that are being taken place before our very eyes, and the happy little church full of “itchy ears” are happy to hear what these watered-down version have go to say that make their comfort zone so comfortable.

Yes, the false teachers of the Body of Christ have been misleading HIS Church for a long time. If we don’t understand the depth of the heavenly things and earthly things of the supernatural and natural realms and have an understanding knowledge of them, then we will perish. The Christians also need to understand the depth of the Parable of the Sower. They also need to understand the depth of sin, confession of sin, forgiveness, love and repentance. And they also need to realise that they have been conned since 9/11 and the Body of Christ is being destroyed from within and not without. The damage has been down, and there is nothing you or I can do about it, but pray and keep walking in faith.

Islam comes to steal, destroy and kill, and they have been doing that using non-lethal weapons, such as political correctness and anti-Christ.

Our country is being inundated with boat people, mostly Muslims, coming from Muslim countries and is laying our country in waste as they come to steal, destroy and kill our economy, so subtle and so deliberate.

Liberal Christians are the wayside, stony and thorny Christians.

They conduct it behind closed doors because they are not teaching the true Gospel of our Lord Jesus Christ. He didn’t conduct His Ministry behind closed doors. I’ve casted out demons from a person in casual conversation, I didn’t need to go and hide behind a door. Exorcism is being misused, and overrated, when true Biblical standards overcomes and conquers ALL THINGS!

When you teach, you teach His Word, and people’s hurts and offences are healed by counseling, prayer, anointing of oil, confession of sins, and forgiving one another, and by the leading of the Spirit of God.

Yes, our ministry is to preach, teach, and save; and if our preaching and teaching is concentrated on our Lord’s Commandments of confession of sin, repentance, forgiveness and love; then why would you need a deliverance ministry?

Matthew 13:43-45 and Luke 11_24-26 isn’t literal whatsoever. And this where the people of those days knew exactly what happens when a spirit (soul) leaves a body during eviction or death. If you understand the ancient cultures of the spirit realm then you will understand that a spirit (soul) goes to “dry places”; and in the case of a Biblical demon, it roams around in dry places roaring like a lion seeking whom they can devour, that is, corrupt and dwell in, as a spirit needs a warm body. They go going into animals.

Again you need to understand that the people of those days knew who the principalities and powers were, and the rulers of darkness, and the spiritual hosts. But, the Body of Christ today invites more evil spirits into their churches through cursed money and occultic practices.

If you look at these verses as being literal, then you will struggle understanding those heavenly and earthly things of the supernatural and natural realms. I suggest the Books of Enoch and Jubilee a good starting point.

Blessings in Yeshua’s Name.

It's so hard to know what is real and what is fictious.

On the one hand, I do wonder about the spirit world, what can be attributed to spirits? Maybe certain addictions or other behaviors. On the other hand, I also believe there are very real medical and psychological conditions that can and should be treated and not to go around attempting to cast spirits out of everyone and everything. Hard to know where the balance is.

ARBITER01 said:

It is correct to say there is no deliverance ministry, since the gift in operation is the gifts of healings.

If you look up passages where Jesus cast out demons, a good many of the events afterwards said "and he was healed." It is a spiritual healing from GOD.

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i think it is semantics .

after all if i am healed from that which causes my dis-ease .. then i am delivered
from that which caused the dis-ease in my life .and if the source of that dis-ease was an evil spirit,then casting out the spirit will result in healing .

I think its in one of the biographies of Smith Wigglesworth where he speaks of going into a house with a companion ,to pray for a bed ridden ill lady .. he recounts how his companion suddenly jumped on her bed and grabbed her (radical method methinks haha)and commanded the foul spirit to come out of her ..result : she was healed .

so deliverance and healing are really one and the same methinks .

but i do like the OP's recent reference to the commission.. to cast out devils .It makes sense to in my heart .for a kingdom is established by occupation of the area which the king rules .. if the kings subjects do not occupy the territory then the enemy will govern it . we are told to go and cast the enemy out of the territory (being the hearts of mankind ) that the Holy Spirit may come in and occupy that territory and thus the governmental rule of the kingdom of God is established in the hearts of mankind .
There are two spirits ..one of this world governing evil spirits which occupy the lives of the unrepentant and the HOLY SPIRIT governing the ministering spirits of God (angels) and he occupies the hearts and lives of those obedient to the Gospel of the LORD JESUS.


so if deliverance is not a gift, in reference to the gifts of the spirit, then the gift is the authority to cast out demons .
this authority is recognized by far too few western believers and that is due to a great deception.

for me i find that "fear of man" is the snare and deception that hinders this authority from being exercised. certainly that is the case on my part . the lord forgive me and help me be bold (courageous) as he so commands us many times .

: testimony: one time i went to visit a friend in a nearby small town -i had recently been greatly refreshed in the Holy Spirit and was walking in a sense of excitement and joy of the lord . i wasn't trying to witness i was just excited and was sharing my excitement with folks about how joyful the lord JESUS made me .
this day a guy was at that house and my friend was out ..in my excitement i said what about you (name) ? do you know about the lord JESUS and how much he loves you.. ?

he says" i don't want to ^%$& know about &^%$$#
etc .." you get the picture lol..
i still pushed the topic ..he walked passed me and went out of the house cursing .. i followed him outside .. he pulled his hood over his head and his shoulders hunched his face went dark and he began to blaspheme speaking wickedness about my Lord Jesus like nothing i have ever heard .
at first i didn't know what to do i was stunned by this display of abandonment to all reason and by the most blasphemous language i had ever heard in my life... but i got angry when he continued and i saw this was directly an evil spirit talking this filth .. not knowing what to do ..but feeling indignant i suddenly said well "name" ,,Jesus loves you and satan in the name of Jesus you can SHUT UP "... yes i said that haha . i was really angry with the filth he was saying about my LORD .

well i testify to you all .. this young man went silent ..he sat down on the house steps ,,lifted his head pushed his hood off and looked so dazed and confused like he had no idea what he was just doing ..and i sat beside him and i shared with him how Jesus loves him and how he can be saved .. and he listened so meekly ..so opposite to only 2 minutes earlier .
I did not personally get to lead him to the lord in prayer that day ..and i am sorrowful of that and i am sorrowful i did not step up into the full range of the authority we have in Jesus and cast that spirit out ...but it is a massive lesson to me personally .

Hockey_Fan said:

It's so hard to know what is real and what is fictious.

On the one hand, I do wonder about the spirit world, what can be attributed to spirits? Maybe certain addictions or other behaviours. On the other hand, I also believe there are very real medical and psychological conditions that can and should be treated and not to go around attempting to cast spirits out of everyone and everything. Hard to know where the balance is.

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The reality of the supernatural realm is real, but it depends upon who is describing it. Much of the supposed encounters of the Spirit of God in many churches is all showmanship and false, and not fictious.

There is nothing that attributes to spirits, as they are there all the time, controlling them on the inside or suppressing and oppressing them from the outside. They are only a finger tip away.

I see them in people every day in their actions, attitudes, shortcomings and their manifestations when I am near them in a coffee shop or shopping centres. Keep your eyes open and you will see their manifestations as the person may begin to scratch themself intensely, or their feet start tapping with the jitters or cross leg begins to swing around and twitch and their foot nearly ends up over their shoulder. They know who you are in Christ and if you are threat to them you will see the manifestation that will give them away.

The day that any believer believes there is no such thing as the supernatural and demons and that all we have to do is to sit in a parked car with the motor running waiting for our Lord to return, have been misled, misinformed, and have received false teaching.

Any form of addiction is control by a spirit. Yes, there is a real medical condition, but you will discover in time that most medical conditions are due to the encounter of a spirit. Basically, double-mindedness is schizophrenia. Many multiple personality disorders you will discover a demon behind the different personalities. These personalities are formed from an abuse or trauma, and at the time a spirit will enter.

I’ve experienced these manifestations when praying for a person who has come up for prayer. Before praying I normally ask them if they have any sin to confess, and you find that some people will begin to rant, or fall over onto the floor before you can lay hands on them. A spirit will cause that to a person.

That is so true, as I see inexperience people who are still carrying their own baggage and believe they can go about casting out demons, and they end up making those people worse, by transferring their demons over the person, and try to cast out an “alter”, which is a personality, and not a “spirit”, these show jockeys make most people worse.

You hear all the stories of all the great healings, but if you check them out, you will find that there is no truth in their claims and a person may get a healing, but will lose it very quickly if there isn’t any follow up counselling and filling the house of the person with our Lord, and cleanse their hands and purify their heart.

The balance comes from the Spirit of God, and discernment. These TV show jockeys do more damage to the Kingdom of God than the evil one, and many are the devil’s advocates.

Hi Michael,

I agree with semantics and even with the word “disease”.
I always find it sad when I hear of Christians dying from diseases, and we all seem to cry, when we hear a story like this, and feel so powerless in prayer and in confidence.

All we can hear most say: “My dear brother/sister it’s that HIS WILL, will be done!”

I fret for many Christians who love our Lord so much, but yet they suffer and die. Why is this so we can ask? I do believe that much of our diseases are caused through our lack of knowledge and understanding of the REAL WORD of God, and because of this we will perish. There is so much to learn, but sadly many don't see or agree with the cutting edge understanding and knowledge of the spiritual mysteries of disease, and the real “heavenly and earthly things”.

There is no science or formula or a quick fix to take the place of relationship with our Lord Jesus Christ, and obedience to His Word. Sadly, many don't see that a wrong in our body has probably been caused by our lack of understanding and knowledge of His Word, and the lack of confession, repentance, forgiveness, and love.

We don't even realise that the word "disease" originally meant "lack of ease" and "lack of peace", and I believe that when a Christian is not at peace, then this isn't a medical issue, but a spiritual issue, then at the same time the enemy has many tricks up his sleeve, and his offensive weapons are deadly.

Whether we see the ministry as deliverance or healing, but it all comes down to one thing that we need to get to the "root cause" of any chronic diseases so that they can be eliminated before they take hold due to a spiritual issue. Our Lord Jesus Christ said: "Peace I leave with you, my PEACE I give unto you...." (John 14:27).

We don't go beyond what medical care offers because it addresses the connection between the human spirit and human chemistry that a doctor understands, but they don't see the spiritual connection as a possible causation factor.

Many of our diseases are made by spiritual forces that have stolen our peace through our lack of understanding and knowledge. And sadly, many have dabbled in things that they shouldn't have and failed to confess their sins, repent and renounce these things.

We lack the real understanding and knowledge of those "earthly and heavenly things" that have the answers to "PEACE", "Healing", and "Deliverance".

I do care, and I do fret for so many Christians who die unnecessary at a young age. I can remember reading a book some time back: "A More Excellent Way" by Henry Wright and it speaks of much what I believe is the reason of many Christians are dying unnecessary. But, at the same time, false teaching, grandstand showmanship, and idolatry has taken over the Body of Christ.

Yes, I’ve experience similar things that you have shared about Smith Wigglesworth, as I had a demon manifest in front of me from one of the male children (11 year-old) in the church. The child had been a fair nuisance for months and he had sat at the feet of the pastor with another male child when our pastor was giving his message. He did everything to belittle the pastor while he was teaching. The people in the congregation would “tut-tut” and shake their heads. This went on for months, and then one Sunday after the service the child left the church and went into the fellowship room where all the goodies were set up for partaking. I followed him out and not intentionally, and there was only the boy and I in the room. This meeting was ordained by our Lord. The child picked up all these cakes in both hands, and his hands were like claws of an eagle.

I spoke to him: “What are you doing?” He turned with a snarling grimace on his face and swore at me and told me: “Not to talk to him!” I just said: “Get in Jesus’ Name!” The child gave a shocked look, became calm, turned around put all the cakes back on the plate and walked back into the church as if nothing had happened. I never spoke to anyone about it and left it at that.

Next Sunday the two boys were out front again, and this boy sat there and didn’t do anything. Everyone noticed that, and couldn’t believe what they were seeing. In fact the other boy misbehaved and the boy spoke to him and told him to stop. And from then on the child was good.
I could tell many more, but that will do. Deliverance isn’t needed behind closed doors.

If our house is empty, swept and put in order, then we have Buckley’s in maintaining our relationship with our Lord, because we are not submitting and drawing near to HIM, we are not resisting the evil one, we are not cleansing our hands or purifying our heart.

I agree that westerners don’t recognise the authority that is given to them, and at the same time they don’t recognise or understand the ministry performed by our Yeshua and HIS disciples. We are HIS disciples and therefore have been given His Authority.

They fear man so much, and that fear has been manifested by the power of mammon.

We make many mistakes, but they are lessons learnt, and I am much wiser than I was 15 years ago.

Imagine for a moment what goes on in cults, and in other religions where people are taught to listen to other spirits instead of God. What do you think happens? Do Mormon prophets learn how to listen to the angel Moroni? Or how to fake prophecies using tricks they've been taught by those who trained them?


This could be the same problem we are facing in Charismatic churches today. That for so long, people have been faking the gifts of the Spirit that we are no better than a cult. And because our leaders have taught us to trust in them rather than the leading of the Spirit, we really don't have the tools it takes to discern spirits so that we can even do a proper deliverance if we want to!


Learning how to accurately hear God is not that hard. It might take years of practice, which can really be helped by listening to those who have already spent the time and learned from their mistakes. The Gifts of the Spirit are helpful in this as well, teaching us to recognize when God is using one of us to do something godly. It's all simple, basic stuff if you ask me!

So why are so many churches so far behind on learning this? I think the problem is usually because the pastor wants all the glory. The gifts are used by the Body of Christ, which means a pastor's job is to commission the saints for ministry; not hog the spotlight all to himself.

Another issue is doctrine. We can't really afford to allow the prophets to speak, the teachers to teach, or the apostles in training to lay foundations that challenge our understanding of the Bible, right? So whenever God does anything out of the ordinary, pastors are tempted to claim that mystical ability of "discernment" and declare them as false. But in reality this "discernment" is simply their own understanding of doctrine (which is supposedly backed up by scripture but usually is not).

And thus, any hope we have of being trained in church to accurately discern spirits, is sacrificed at the altar of Man.