Judge in Utah strikes down same-sex marriage ban

Marius27 said:

Who says they're non-religious?

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Well anyone who is not following the bible in their eyes, are not religious to those that uphold "Christian"/ biblical views .
They were never christians to begin with.

Those that do not read literally or maybe look at the historical Jewish/Christian texts are not of God, regardless that they go to church and are accepted in some "Godless" communities.

Marius27 said:

Who says they're non-religious?

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This is also so true. Why is it the assumption that gay people are non religious/don't believe in God ?

Who else is non religious because they have civil rights ?

Supreme said:

How do Mormons view homosexuality? I know Utah is heavily Mormon, so I'm just wondering how this will go down with them?

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The official position of the Mormon church is that they have no issue with gay rights, or even civil unions, but they believe marriage is sacred and should not be extended to gays.

As for Utah, and their roughly 58% Mormon population, I'd say it is a lot like Christian forums -- in fact, I seem to recall that MachZero lives in Utah. You have a sizeable group of conservatives (Mormon and other religious) who are strongly against any rights for gays, you have those in the middle who are tired of hearing about it, and you have a group that fully supports gay rights.

A board that I frequent, that has a large number of very conservative Mormon posters, seem mostly resigned to it -- they see the writing on the wall that gay marriage will be legal nationwide in the next few years. Their largest concern is that it not erode their right to practice their religion (e.g. being forced to marry gays in their churches and/or temples).

Sitswithamouse said:

"Non religious" people are getting their rights to live with those they love.

May this continue.

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There are plenty religious homosexuals who are going to get married.

TerranceL said:

There are plenty religious homosexuals who are going to get married.

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Yes I know that.
Maybe I am being too cryptic in my posts.

Especially that I am a heretic for being attracted to women.
Whudda thunk?



ETA.... I am an ex Mormon

The official position of the Mormon church is that they have no issue with gay rights, or even civil unions, but they believe marriage is sacred and should not be extended to gays.

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I always wondered this . Marriage is a legally binding contract . If it were only a sacred union then why bother to make it legal ? Why can a man and a woman that are atheist get married(legally) ? Is it a sacred union for them too because they are heterosexuals?

It just doesn't make any sense to me.

Sitswithamouse said:

ETA.... I am an ex Mormon

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I've heard that that can be quite hard on ones social life. I hope it hasn't been that hard for you.

QueSeraSera said:

I always wondered this . Marriage is a legally binding contract . If it were only a sacred union then why bother to make it legal ? Why can a man and a woman that are atheist get married(legally) ? Is it a sacred union for them too because they are heterosexuals?

It just doesn't make any sense to me.

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Why, if marriage is sacred can the Kardashians, heterosexual couples get married and divorced within months of making sacred vows.
Is this a stable union??. Does this not make a mockery of marriage.

How many heterosexuals have affairs? , including religious leaders who do the same.

Why will Homosexual marriage wreck the institution of marriage, when heterosexual marriages are doing the same.

I don't get it either.

TerranceL said:

I've heard that that can be quite hard on ones social life. I hope it hasn't been that hard for you.

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I lost some very good friends in the church, but I couldn't live the way they wanted me to live.
There is more understanding now then there was 20 years ago. I am lucky I live in a secular, and in some cases a tolerant society.
I got married and had children. Unfortunately, my marriage is over, but I never regret having my children.
They inspire me and I am very proud of them. I have never let religion come before them and they have grown up to be kind and moralistic adults.

My life has been hard but I'm happy, just to see my children grow up as they wish and not tied to dogma and they are good kids.

'Well I would say that" wouldn't I.?

[QUOTEWhy, if marriage is sacred can the Kardashians, heterosexual couples get married and divorced within months of making sacred vows.][/QUOTE]

Because they have the legal right to .

How many heterosexuals have affairs? , including religious leaders who do the same.

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I think about 35 % of married men and 28% of married women . But we have to remember that is not illegal /banned so its different.

Why will Homosexual marriage wreck the institution of marriage, when heterosexual marriages are doing the same.

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Because they have homosexual sex ?

QueSeraSera said:

[QUOTEWhy, if marriage is sacred can the Kardashians, heterosexual couples get married and divorced within months of making sacred vows.]

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Because they have the legal right to .



I think about 35 % of married men and 28% of married women . But we have to remember that is not illegal /banned so its different.



Because they have homosexual sex ?[/QUOTE]

Exactly.
I'm eating shellfish tonight. Within biblical legality, I'm toast.

Sitswithamouse said:

I'm eating shellfish tonight. Within biblical legality, I'm toast.

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BTW, comparing OT dietary laws to sexual laws is a PRATT.

The biggest problem with having a civil, honest debate, is that it's impossible when one party is completely fine with being dishonest. The dietary laws are very different, and people continue pushing the falsehood.

Some people seem to have no problem lying, even after being busted on it. There is the born-that-way lie, the can't change lie, the change is harmful lie, the Matthew Shepard lie, the Harvey Milk lie, the Dayna Morales lie, and this one: the shellfish lie.

The obstinance it takes to keep pushing those PRATTs is the very definition of bigotry

Sitswithamouse said:

Well anyone who is not following the bible in their eyes, are not religious to those that uphold "Christian"/ biblical views .
They were never christians to begin with.

Those that do not read literally or maybe look at the historical Jewish/Christian texts are not of God, regardless that they go to church and are accepted in some "Godless" communities.

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No True Scotsman fallacy. There are 38,000 denominations of Christianity. Rejecting the literalistic nonsense Fundamentalist version doesn't make one a non-believer.

70% of all Jews are pro gay marriage. Millions of Christians are as well.

No Christians uphold the Biblical view by that standard.

There is the born-that-way lie,

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How do we know that's a lie, Since being on the Christian forums, I read on this forum, that where bible originated, they didn't even use that word. homosexual

KarateCowboy said:

the Matthew Shepard lie,

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What lie, I'm pretty sure the news said he was beaten and killed for being gay.

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

What lie, I'm pretty sure the news said he was beaten and killed for being gay.

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Most of the news outlets were lying or mistaken. His main killer was a bisexual. They had bedded each other.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Forum Runner. Pardon my brevity and spelling.

KarateCowboy said:

Most of the news outlets were lying or mistaken. His main killer was a bisexual. They had bedded each other.

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Forum Runner. Pardon my brevity and spelling.

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I've never heard that before, where's your proof? Please don't bother with just a Fox source, since they seem to be bias.

Dusky Mouse said:

How unfortunate for Utah.

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Not really. People who would like to be in a same-sex marriage now can. People who wouldn't like to be in a same-sex marriage aren't effected by the ban being struck down anyway.

CRAZY_CAT_WOMAN said:

I've never heard that before, where's your proof? Please don't bother with just a Fox source, since they seem to be bias.

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Ok

http://www.foxnews.com/us/2013/09/2...rdered-for-reasons-far-more-complicated-than/

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Forum Runner. Pardon my brevity and spelling.

KarateCowboy said:

Ok

Matthew Shepard not murdered for being gay, new book claims | Fox News

Sent from my Nexus 4 using Forum Runner. Pardon my brevity and spelling.

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How do you know if that book isn't a work of fiction? A lot of writers make thing up, that simply not true.