Does anyone know if this hadith is authentic?

TG123 · Oct 21, 2013

Salaam Alaikum. This is a question for Muslims only.

I was reading a bit about what Islam teaches about Gog and Magog, and came across the following hadith.

"Allah Ta'ala divided mankind into ten parts. Nine tenths constitute Ya'jooj and Ma'jooj while the remaining tenths constitutues the rest of mankind."

This is allegedly something that Umar heard Muhammad say, if the sites below can be believed.

I could not find it either in Bukhari or Muslim or Abu Dawud, but the following sites list it. Do you know whether or not this is something that Muhammad actually said?

IslamVirtueIslamic Miracle Pictures I Stories l Quran Recitation: Signs of Qiyamah

qiyamah

The Signs of the Last Day

Interestingly, I found no mention of this hadith in IslamQA or Islamicity in addition to not being on searchtruth.com, which would lead me to question whether it is authentic.

Would anyone know?

Thanks so much and God bless.

TG123

sunrise0 · Oct 21, 2013

Alaykum assalam TG123

It is authentic

please read this for a detailed answer:

Islam Question and Answer - The ratio of people of Paradise to people of Hell

TG123 · Oct 21, 2013

sunrise0 said:
Alaykum assalam TG123

It is authentic

please read this for a detailed answer:

Islam Question and Answer - The ratio of people of Paradise to people of Hell

Salaam Alaikum, and thanks. Can I ask you how you know that hadith is authentic? The ones in the IslamQA article are from Bukhari, whereas the one about the Gog and Magog making up 9 out of every 10 of earth's inhabitants is from another source, Ibn Hajar's Fath al-Bar. Is there any way you can verify that this is actually what Muhammad said? Thanks.

sunrise0 · Oct 22, 2013

TG123 said:
Salaam Alaikum

Click to expand...

,
wa alaykum

and thanks.

Click to expand...

you are welcome

Can I ask you how you know that hadith is authentic? The ones in the IslamQA article are from Bukhari, whereas the one about the Gog and Magog making up 9 out of every 10 of earth's inhabitants is from another source, Ibn Hajar's Fath al-Bar. Is there any way you can verify that this is actually what Muhammad said? Thanks.

Click to expand...

when refering to Hadeeth, Sihah is an Arabic word which means books including authentic sayings of the Prophet .
Al-Bukhari is one of them. in fact its title is (Sahih Al-Bukhari) meaning the authentic sayings of Prophet Muhammad which were compilated by Al-Bukhari

here are the others in case you like to know. they carry the names of the people who collected them:
Muslim
Jame' Attermithee
Abee Dawood
Nisa'e
Ibn Majah

Bukhari's book is described the most authentic book on earth next to the Holy Qura because He spent 16 years travelling and collecting Hadeeths from people in the Muslim worl. it is said that he collected almost a million Hadeeths, he made a big effort searching for information about the people who narrated them. he excluded every hadeeth when he found some thing wrong with one of the narraters like having bad memory, or not so good manners or reputaion; like he lied to someone,
Al-bukhari ended up with what we have today.

sometimes, like in this case you find different narrations for one matter, it means that the prophet talked about it more than once in different gatherings

TG123 · Oct 22, 2013

sunrise0 said:
,
wa alaykum

you are welcome

when refering to Hadeeth, Sihah is an Arabic word which means books including authentic sayings of the Prophet .
Al-Bukhari is one of them. in fact its title is (Sahih Al-Bukhari) meaning the authentic sayings of Prophet Muhammad which were compilated by Al-Bukhari

here are the others in case you like to know. they carry the names of the people who collected them:
Muslim
Jame' Attermithee
Abee Dawood
Nisa'e
Ibn Majah

Bukhari's book is described the most authentic book on earth next to the Holy Qura because He spent 16 years travelling and collecting Hadeeths from people in the Muslim worl. it is said that he collected almost a million Hadeeths, he made a big effort searching for information about the people who narrated them. he excluded every hadeeth when he found some thing wrong with one of the narraters like having bad memory, or not so good manners or reputaion; like he lied to someone,
Al-bukhari ended up with what we have today.

sometimes, like in this case you find different narrations for one matter, it means that the prophet talked about it more than once in different gatherings

Salaam Alaikum, and thank you for the lesson on the collection of hadiths. If I am not mistaken, there are some hadiths that are considered authentic (sahih) and others that are considered weak (daeef).
Islam Question and Answer - Is it possible to trust all ahaadeeth?

How do you know whether the hadith I cited

"Allah Ta'ala divided mankind into ten parts. Nine tenths constitute Ya'jooj and Ma'jooj while the remaining tenths constitutues the rest of mankind."

is authentic and not weak?

Thanks.

TG123

BruceDLimber · Oct 23, 2013

>Does anyone know if this hadith is authentic?

Basically, NO ONE knows which hadiths are or aren't authentic, which is precisely why different groups of Muslims recognize different--possibly contradictory--subsets of hadiths.

Simple as that.

sunrise0 · Oct 26, 2013

TG123 said:
Salaam Alaikum, and thank you for the lesson on the collection of hadiths. If I am not mistaken, there are some hadiths that are considered authentic (sahih) and others that are considered weak (daeef).
Islam Question and Answer - Is it possible to trust all ahaadeeth?

How do you know whether the hadith I cited

"Allah Ta'ala divided mankind into ten parts. Nine tenths constitute Ya'jooj and Ma'jooj while the remaining tenths constitutues the rest of mankind."

is authentic and not weak?

Thanks.

TG123

all that lesson and you're still asking !

sunrise0 · Oct 26, 2013

BruceDLimber said:
>Does anyone know if this hadith is authentic?

Basically, NO ONE knows which hadiths are or aren't authentic, which is precisely why different groups of Muslims recognize different--possibly contradictory--subsets of hadiths.

Simple as that.

good to know we have an expert on Islamice matters :idea:

TG123 · Oct 26, 2013

sunrise0 said:
all that lesson and you're still asking !

I only ask because I have a Muslim friend who told me this hadeeth is daeef, and the same was told to me by another Muslim on a separate forum.
Would anyone know if this hadith is authentic?

Maybe we should ask ILoveBeingAMuslimah what her input is.

BruceDLimber · Oct 29, 2013

sunrise0 said:
good to know we have an expert on Islamice [sic] matters.

I notice you in no way refuted what I said, so it stands.

Bruce

kenzo0 · Oct 29, 2013

[B][I]BruceDLimber[/I][/B] said:
Basically, NO ONE knows which hadiths are or aren't authentic, which is precisely why different groups of Muslims recognize different--possibly contradictory--subsets of hadiths.

Simple as that.

[B][I]sunrise0[/I][/B] said:
good to know we have an expert on Islamice [sic] matters.

maybe I'm no longer a muslim.
but, I wont make statement without any reason about Islam.

actually, what Bruce told in his post were right.
formally, the most authentic hadits after Quran are:
Bukhari
Muslim
etc(you have mentioned before)

but, as what Bruce said, not all considered authentic for the muslims.
usually some muslims determined that story authentic or not by match it with passage in the Quran.
they not take all as authentic(some muslims) if its story against Quran.
and what Bruce said(I've bold) were the fact, for verses in the Quran itself are ambiguous.

God bless

Sister of Faith · Oct 31, 2013

8506 - حدثنا علي بن حمشاد العدل ثنا معاذ بن المثنى العنبري ثنا عمرو بن مرزوق ثنا عمران القطان عن قتادة عن سالم بن أبي الجعد عن معدان بن طلحة عن عمرو البكالي عن عبد الله بن عمرو رضي الله عنهما قال : إن الله عز و جل جزأ الخلق عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء الملائكة و جزءا سائر الخلق و جزأ الملائكة عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء يسبحون الليل و النهار لا يفترون و جزءا لرسالته و جزأ الخلق عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء الجن و جزءا بني آدم و جزأ بني آدم عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء يأجوج و مأجوج و جزءا سائر الناس { و السماء ذات الحبك } الذاريات قال : السماء السابعة و الحرم بحيالة العرش
هذا حديث صحيح الإسناد و لم يخرجاه
تعليق الذهبي قي التلخيص : صحيح

My comment:
I could only find this Hadith narration in the Book named "Al-Mustadrak Ala AsSahihain" written by "Al-Hakim". He claimed all hadith in it were authentic according to the conditions of either Sahih al-Bukhari or Sahih Muslim or both.
The statement of authenticity was not accepted by a number of prominent later Sunni scholars.

The red line is the part which you have quoted. the Hadith is narrated by Abdullah ibn Umar as mentioned in the site which you have mentioned.
The green lines says: "This Hadith is authenticated by al-Hâkim and al-Dhahabî concurs."

I'm just giving you an opinion but I don't know what the Ibadhi scholars (my school) say about the authenticity of this hadith. And Allah knows best

TG123 · Oct 31, 2013

Sister of Faith said:
8506 - حدثنا علي بن حمشاد العدل ثنا معاذ بن المثنى العنبري ثنا عمرو بن مرزوق ثنا عمران القطان عن قتادة عن سالم بن أبي الجعد عن معدان بن طلحة عن عمرو البكالي عن عبد الله بن عمرو رضي الله عنهما قال : إن الله عز و جل جزأ الخلق عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء الملائكة و جزءا سائر الخلق و جزأ الملائكة عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء يسبحون الليل و النهار لا يفترون و جزءا لرسالته و جزأ الخلق عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء الجن و جزءا بني آدم و جزأ بني آدم عشرة أجزاء فجعل تسعة أجزاء يأجوج و مأجوج و جزءا سائر الناس { و السماء ذات الحبك } الذاريات قال : السماء السابعة و الحرم بحيالة العرش
هذا حديث صحيح الإسناد و لم يخرجاه
تعليق الذهبي قي التلخيص : صحيح

My comment:
I could only find this Hadith narration in the Book named "Al-Mustadrak Ala AsSahihain" written by "Al-Hakim". He claimed all hadith in it were authentic according to the conditions of either Sahih al-Bukhari or Sahih Muslim or both.
The statement of authenticity was not accepted by a number of prominent later Sunni scholars.

The red line is the part which you have quoted. the Hadith is narrated by Abdullah ibn Umar as mentioned in the site which you have mentioned.
The green lines says: "This Hadith is authenticated by al-Hâkim and al-Dhahabî concurs."

I'm just giving you an opinion but I don't know what the Ibadhi scholars (my school) say about the authenticity of this hadith. And Allah knows best

Salaam Alaikum, Sister of Faith, and thank you for the answer. Based on your answer and on the answers of some other Muslims I have spoken to, I will assume that it is not something Muhammad said.

InshAllah you are doing well. Take care and have a good day.

TG123

Does anyone know if this hadith is authentic?

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