Messianic Bigamy?

ContraMundum said:

Seems that some people just want to bring not only Christianity but also Judaism into disrepute.

Saw an interview with this Messianic Rabbi recently as well. This is just awful.

Here.

And here.

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Yes, some Messianic Jews are mixed up. Just like those Christians on that same new page that were jailed for Exorcism and Kidd napping in France.

From the article:

A self-styled Messianic Jew, Sharp said God told him he was a king 12 years ago and that he should take seven wives.

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“When you come to the land which the Lord your God is giving you, and possess it and dwell in it, and say, ‘I will set a king over me like all the nations that are around me,’ you shall surely set a king over you whom the Lord your God chooses; one from among your brethren you shall set as king over you; you may not set a foreigner over you, who is not your brother. But he shall not multiply horses for himself, nor cause the people to return to Egypt to multiply horses, for the Lord has said to you, ‘You shall not return that way again.’

Neither shall he multiply wives for himself, lest his heart turn away;

nor shall he greatly multiply silver and gold for himself. “Also it shall be, when he sits on the throne of his kingdom, that he shall write for himself a copy of this law in a book, from the one before the priests, the Levites. And it shall be with him, and he shall read it all the days of his life, that he may learn to fear the Lord his God and be careful to observe all the words of this law and these statutes, that his heart may not be lifted above his brethren, that he may not turn aside from the commandment to the right hand or to the left, and that he may prolong his days in his kingdom, he and his children in the midst of Israel. (Deuteronomy 17:14-20 NKJV)

...No true messianic jew would be so foolish as to say he can be a king... And have multiple wives, while not sinning.

That man is an adulterer and a liar, and if he doesn't repent he will go to the lake of fire, along with the rest of the ungodly.

Matt. 7:15 "Beware of the false prophets! They come to you wearing sheep's clothing, but underneath they are hungry wolves! 16 You will recognize them by their fruit. Can people pick grapes from thorn bushes, or figs from thistles? 17 Likewise, every healthy tree produces good fruit, but a poor tree produces bad fruit. 18 A healthy tree cannot bear bad fruit, or a poor tree good fruit. 19 Any tree that does not produce good fruit is cut down and thrown in the fire! 20 So you will recognize them by their fruit. 21 "Not everyone who says to me, `Lord, Lord!' will enter the Kingdom of Heaven, only those who do what my Father in heaven wants."
I think this applies.

I would say that this Rabbi is very deceived. In all honesty the women did not look happy.

That amazes me, is that this guy find women to live that sort of life. This reminds me of the Thais living in slums along a channel close to my home. The difference is that these Thai women look quite happy.

ContraMundum said:

Seems that some people just want to bring not only Christianity but also Judaism into disrepute.

Saw an interview with this Messianic Rabbi recently as well. This is just awful.

Here.

And here.

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Saw something similar to that years ago - and had another friend experience the same unfortunately in his own Messianic fellowship in England ...and another place being here in previous discussion as seen in Sex and Torah (as well as #73 / #86 Biblical Polygyny: A Careful Discussion and Debate ). Although it's not new, it's always saddening to hear on.

IMHO, as messed up as the Rabbi may be, I think what he did in advocating for it is a reflection of what happens when others have bad assumptions on the text of scripture/OT - assuming everything of the Law that we're to do is to be found solely in the OT and that all that occurred within the OT was given for our examples to emulate when it comes to following God's Torah. For I've seen men justify a HOST of sins on the basis of "Well, it happened in the OT!" and yet they never considered the audience or the context and why God allowed for such systems to exist.

With the Rabbi, his self-styled claim to be a "king" is disconcerting - and yet that in/of itself is not what would seem to be the main issue with his leaning toward polygamy.

Objectively, within the OT Law there were systems that made room for things like polygamy/marrying multiple wives.... all designed with the idea of children/offspring involved. The Law stated that a man could take another wife as long as he still provided for his first wife (Exodus 21:10).
This was also echoed in Deuteronomy 21:14-16. And for others who had multiple wives - including the Patriarchs:

• Jacob married Leah and Rachel (Gen.29:23-30; 31:17; 32:22) and then he married Leah and Rachel's handmaids, Zilbah and Bilhahand (Genesis 30:1-24; 37:2)

• Judge Gideon had many wives and a concubine (Judges 8:30-31)

• Elkanah married Hannah and Peninnah (1 Sam.1:2)

• David married Abigail and Ahinoam (1 Sam.25:42-43; 30:18, 1 Samuel 27:2-4/ 1 Samuel 30:4-6 ), then later took more wives (2 Sam.5:13) at Jerusalem (1 Chron.14:3)

• In 2 Sam.12:7-8, God gave David these multiple wives as a blessing, just as anointing him as king over Israel, protecting him from Saul, and giving him the house of Israel and Judah were also blessings from Him

• Ashur married Helah and Naarah (1 Chron.4:5)

• We have it where one of Mered’s wives gave birth to Miriam, Shammai and Ishbah the father of Eshtemoa (.1 Chronicles 4:16-18 / 1 Chronicles 4)

• Shaharaim married Hushim and Baara (1 Chron.8:8) and sons were born to Shaharaim in Moab after he had divorced his wives Hushim and Baara ( 1 Chronicles 8:7-9 /1 Chronicles 8 )

• Abijah had 14 wives (2 Chron.13:21)

• Jehoiada the priest had 2 wives (2 Chron.24:3).

There's also 1 Chronicles 7:3-5 / 1 Chronicles 7 and 2 Chronicles 11:22-23

God knew that, after entering the promised land, the Israelites would want to imitate the nations around them and be governed by a king. So before the Israelites entered into the promised land, they were given specific instructions about the placing of a king over them (Deut.17:14-19). One of these instructions prohibited such a king from having many wives. Some believe that this instruction prohibited polygamy; however, this instruction was a preventative measure to keep the king from being adversely influenced by his many wives —"Neither shall he multiply wives to himself, that his heart turn not away" (Deut.17:17). King Solomon is an example of a man who allowed his wives to influence him into turning from God. See 1.Kgs.11:1-8


With polygamy, there are some Jewish camps that would not have an issue with it...such as the Indian Jews apart of Bene Israel. The Jews there are said to be descendants of the survivors of an ancient shipwreck. An excellent book on the issue is known as "Burnt Bread and Chutney"...and as the author explains in the preface, the Bene Israel “evolved quite uniquely, without many of the holidays, rituals, and rabbinic rulings introduced meanwhile in the general Jewish Diaspora. …They adopted the local language, Marathi, and manners of dress like the sari, along with some of the other Indian customs; they… mostly kept to themselves. They maintained the few ancient Jewish rituals which could be passed on.” At the same time, they absorbed Indian influences in prayer melodies and rituals, fasting, pilgrimages, and caste-like ways....who in some parts are known for still practicing polygamy still as did many of the patriarchs (Abraham, Jacob, etc) and David did---thus angering others there. One can go here for more - if aware of the book entitled "Burnt Bread and Chutney: Growing Up Between Cultures - A Memoir of an Indian Jewish Girl" Additionally, one can go here and here to Marriage and family - Bene Israel - Countries and Their Cultures or The Bene Israel Indian Jewish family in transnational context - Gale and Jewish Communities in Exotic Places for more on the subject...but that is another story. .....


But suffice to say, the reality of the matter is that many - if going off of what the OT alone says - would have plenty of basis for saying that they could chose to have multiple wives. And that would still be inconsistent with the calling of believers when it comes to seeing who our standard is: Yeshua. Many things in the Mosaic Law were never given to be done for all time, as many of them were done due to restraint for people who neither had his Spirit...or the same kind of relationship that we have today---and with the Lord Yeshua, who came and gave clarity on what was meant in the Law, as well as alluding on what was yet to come with differing Laws (updates) for new people, that is something that can never be forgotten.

We already see where the religious leaders tried to trap the Lord by discussing the laws of Moses in regards to divorce ( Deuteronomy 24:2-4 / Deuteronomy 24 )---as they were focused on what Moses gave in the law and the Lord brought them back to the focus of how things were MEANT to be....and why laws were given ( Matthew 19:7-9 / Matthew 19, Mark 10:4-6/ Mark 10 ) Where they had actually glorified one aspect of what Moses said, the Lord made clear that a specific law was never given because the Lord wanted others to walk in that for all time...but rather, it was given since the people were corrupt/wouldn't honor him and a system had to be given to restrain the damage that could be done to others when marriage wasn't upheld.


And with Yeshua, he noted in no uncertain terms that God's BEST was for ONE Man and ONE Woman together as was the case with Adam/Eve. No examples of multiple wives - although ALLOWED in OT times - ever seemed to be positive since a lot of damage came about from them - and Christ always wanted to point people back to what was best for them. God worked through things allowed in the OT - from polygamy to the mistakes of others (like Judah sleeping with a prostitute and prostitution being widespread in many places - or Samson being used of the Lord despite his sleeping around)

janwoG said:

That amazes me, is that this guy find women to live that sort of life. This reminds me of the Thais living in slums along a channel close to my home. The difference is that these Thai women look quite happy.

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Indeed.

Crying out loud. One wife is usually enough headache, but SEVEN!?

Gott im Himmel!!

HAHA, Steve, I must say you made me chuckle on that.

GXG,

I did not know that there was a verse or law that if a man takes another wife that he is to look after the first one first. I never knew that was there. Thank you.

Moriah Ruth

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Isaiah 4:1 is an Old Testament reference which has been used by those who believe in polygyny as justification for allowing a man of faith to have 7 wives. Significantly, Christians did practice polygyny until it was outlawed by the Romans in the 4th century. Sefardic Jews practiced it well into the 14th or 15th century while Yemeni Jews still practice it to a limited extent.

Moriah Ruth 777 said:

GXG,

I did not know that there was a verse or law that if a man takes another wife that he is to look after the first one first. I never knew that was there.

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It definitely intrigued me during my days in the Evangelical world and assuming that it was always a matter of God NEVER giving allowance in the OT Law for having multiple spouses (in limitation) and giving laws to ensure that other spouses were taken care of - but then when you see the culture Israel lived in and where they came from with socially accepted norms the Lord worked with, it was easier to handle.

Of course, it can be difficult to address when assuming that all things present within the OT were automatically beneficial rather than simply seeing them as rules to limit behavior that came with a price - similar to the issue of what occurred when it was more than likely that early man had relationships with their siblings and it was allowed for the sake of being true to the command of "fruitful/multiply"...and then later in time, new law was added forbidding that as it concerns incest ( more shared Here, here and here) - in the same way the rules for multiple wives may've been allowed to some degree but not something meant to continue when further development occurred.

With the man from the OP, that's definitely something in regards to a cult rather than someone growing up in another culture where it was acceptable - and thus, it's a pity where he seems to be trying to justify it.

Thank you.

Moriah Ruth

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Not a problem

Thank you GXG