Muslim militias Burn and attack Churches in Egypt

Status
Not open for further replies.

JimR-OCDS

God Cannot Be Grasped, Except Through Love
Oct 28, 2008
18,341
3,284
The Kingdom of Heaven
Visit site
✟185,132.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
:doh:Oh good grief! Parsing words to fine an "out" while our brothers and sisters in Christ are brutally attacked and killed outright!

BTW, I've seen many cartoons about Obama's "red lines"--the last one has him relieved because it isn't really a "red line" (where he said he'd act)--it's blood! (Blood is not one of his "red lines" or so it seems.)


So you want Obama to side and provide aid to the rebels in Syria, who copt said are terrorists ? According to him, the Military and Dictators are the good guys, protecting Christians. :doh:


Jim
 
Upvote 0

AMDG

Tenderized for Christ
May 24, 2004
25,362
1,286
74
Pacific Northwest, United States
✟47,022.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
I think I can agree with this article:

As a Christian and an American citizen, I am calling on the President of the United States to immediately offer asylum to the Christians in Egypt who are under extreme and life threatening duress!
As Israel in the ’80′s and ’90′s accomplished in Operations Moses and Solomon with their airlifts of Ethiopian Jews from hostile areas; the Christians of the world are calling on you, Mr. President, to airlift this beleaguered minority before this becomes the first anti-Christian pogrom in Egypt in nearly 700 years.

Read more at Clash DailyThe Optics or the Coptics, Mr. President?

At least that sounds a tad more humane. At the very least, if we are concerned about our brothers and sisters in Chirst, we can sign the petition at the American Center for Law and Justice asking Obama to at least speak to what the Copts are going through.

You know there is a saying--You broke it, you fix it. Well, this mess can be traced back to Obama's Cairo speech and the Arab Spring that turned into a bitter Arab Winter and there is proof that the elections were questionable. Obama "broke" the precarious balance in Egypt--now IMO, he needs to fix it.
 
Upvote 0

Tallguy88

We shall see the King when he comes!
Supporter
Jan 13, 2009
32,459
7,737
Parts Unknown
✟240,396.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Single
AMDG said:
I think I can agree with this article:

At least that sounds a tad more humane. At the very least, if we are concerned about our brothers and sisters in Chirst, we can sign the petition at the American Center for Law and Justice asking Obama to at least speak to what the Copts are going through.

You know there is a saying--You broke it, you fix it. Well, this mess can be traced back to Obama's Cairo speech and the Arab Spring that turned into a bitter Arab Winter and there is proof that the elections were questionable. Obama "broke" the precarious balance in Egypt--now IMO, he needs to fix it.

It's a huge oversimplification to say Obama is personally responsible for the turmoil in Egypt.
 
Upvote 0

JimR-OCDS

God Cannot Be Grasped, Except Through Love
Oct 28, 2008
18,341
3,284
The Kingdom of Heaven
Visit site
✟185,132.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
It's a huge oversimplification to say Obama is personally responsible for the turmoil in Egypt.


Right, we should oppose democracy and uplift military dictatorships. :doh:

Well, it's pretty much in line with Tea Party thinking.


Jim
 
Upvote 0

mark46

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 29, 2010
20,042
4,720
✟830,515.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
You certainly could be right with regard to Morsi and what he might have done in the future.

The reality seems to be that he was trying to wrest power from the military and concentrate it in his office. The military, in the end, could not accept this.

As in Turkey, no one can rule without the full support of the military.

It seems that there used to be three secular states in the region: Turkey, Iraq and Egypt. Perhaps, now, we will be left with only Turkey.



The problem is, we don't know that. The Morsi government was only in office a short time. Would they have moved toward an Iranian type theocratic government ? Don't know, it didn't appear so, and Morsi himself condemned the radical Islamic attacks on Christians. The military didn't cooperate much with him, so how much could he do is unknown. Also, Muslims tried to defend Christian churches last Easter, but they themselves were attacked by the radicals.

With the military coup, it merely fans the flames of radical rhetoric that Islam is under attack by non-Muslims. Christian Churches burning, could even be done by the military itself, in order to get support from the rest of the world. It's a nasty part of the world and people are not above doing evil, if it serves their cause.

In all, I hope Obama does the right thing by going to the UN on the issue in Syria and not act alone.

He should call for a vote from the UN Security Council on whether to use military strikes against Al Assad for using chemical weapons. If Russia once again votes down the military option, fine, stay out of it. Blame Russia for the consequences.


Jim
 
Last edited:
Upvote 0
Oct 15, 2008
19,375
7,272
Central California
✟274,069.00
Country
United States
Faith
Eastern Orthodox
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
I think it's highly naïve to think that all countries are capable of, much less want democracy! Some countries have a culture and mentality that just doesn't desire voting and freedom....

Sometimes a dictatorship IS better. When I go to the Philippines, I haven't met on Filipino yet who wouldn't want Ferdinand Marcos back if they could resurrect him from the grave! The guy was a major dictator, curtailed certain civil rights, embezzled, and is suspected of being involved in Ninoy Aquino's death. But the fact is, under his reign the Philippines was clean, had improved infrastructure, stability, an American presence that brought in jobs and opened up military service to Filipinos, and the whole nation was in good shape.

Mubarrak wasn't a bad leader either in many ways. He was a crook, a dictator, and had too much power, but Coptic Christians weren't being slaughtered and churches burned and riots happening in the streets.

Instead of looking in terms of democracies and pulling for the power to the people side, maybe we should look at what these wonderful little movements have done to our brothers in sisters in Christ!
 
Upvote 0

MKJ

Contributor
Jul 6, 2009
12,260
776
East
✟23,894.00
Faith
Anglican
Marital Status
Married
Politics
CA-Greens
I think it's highly naïve to think that all countries are capable of, much less want democracy! Some countries have a culture and mentality that just doesn't desire voting and freedom....

Sometimes a dictatorship IS better. When I go to the Philippines, I haven't met on Filipino yet who wouldn't want Ferdinand Marcos back if they could resurrect him from the grave! The guy was a major dictator, curtailed certain civil rights, embezzled, and is suspected of being involved in Ninoy Aquino's death. But the fact is, under his reign the Philippines was clean, had improved infrastructure, stability, an American presence that brought in jobs and opened up military service to Filipinos, and the whole nation was in good shape.

Mubarrak wasn't a bad leader either in many ways. He was a crook, a dictator, and had too much power, but Coptic Christians weren't being slaughtered and churches burned and riots happening in the streets.

Instead of looking in terms of democracies and pulling for the power to the people side, maybe we should look at what these wonderful little movements have done to our brothers in sisters in Christ!

A lot of Egyptians seemed quite unhappy with Mubarrak though. I don't think that is something that can be just set aside. And I don't think most were ever really keen on the MB as a governance option - but there were really not a lot of other organized groups that seemed to have the wherewithal to do much. This is a big problem with those sort of dictatorships I think - because they suppress any sort of opposition, it is very difficult to grow the kinds of public groups that can play the roles required in a democratic system. You get the old ruling class, the radical wahoos, and a bunch of disorganized people who don't look like they could manage a gas station.

I am kind of curious why it is that the OP is so much in support of the army which seems to be doing very little to protect the Christian churches. I think it is very hard to say what game it is the military is playing right now, what their ultimate goal is. They are holding things together, somewhat, but what sort of outcome are they looking for? It is certainly a dangerous situation if the wrong people end up in control within the military.
 
Upvote 0

mark46

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 29, 2010
20,042
4,720
✟830,515.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
It seems that missiles will fly in the next couple of days, certainly before Obama takes off to go to Russia. Kerry seemed quite clear.


So you want Obama to side and provide aid to the rebels in Syria, who copt said are terrorists ? According to him, the Military and Dictators are the good guys, protecting Christians. :doh:


Jim
 
Upvote 0

copticorthodoxy

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 5, 2005
2,582
127
42
✟25,993.00
Faith
Oriental Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
I decided not to debate about politics here , i will just share the attacks on Christians which happens daily in Egypt ...

Just for Fun

1234391_632751526765789_1205311838_n.jpg
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

copticorthodoxy

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Dec 5, 2005
2,582
127
42
✟25,993.00
Faith
Oriental Orthodox
Marital Status
Single
The below video for Jihadist in the way to Syria , Stop truck driver and ask them questions about praying to know if they are muslims Sunni or Shia and when they discover that they are shia they kill them . This video is made by radical islamicts to fear the pro-regime

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A_7GtJnJKGw
 
Upvote 0

Michie

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
165,505
55,199
Woods
✟4,584,588.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Upvote 0

Michie

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
165,505
55,199
Woods
✟4,584,588.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
USCCB, CRS send memo to bishops on Egypt


The chairman of the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops’ Committee on International Justice and Peace and the chairman of the board of Catholic Relief Services have sent a memorandum on Egypt to all the bishops of the United States.

“Our Conference will continue to reach out directly to the people and Church in Egypt,” wrote Bishops Richard Pates and Gerald Kicanas. “At the same time we will urge our government to find ways to support respect for human rights, religious freedom, and the building of an inclusive democracy in which all Egyptians have a stake and a voice.”
“We will serve those most in need,” they added, “and press for an end to the violence, a return to the rule of law, the protection of the Christian community, and the initiation of ‘dialogue and reconciliation’ that leads to an inclusive future for all Egyptians.”
Full text of memorandum (USCCB)
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

Michie

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Feb 5, 2002
165,505
55,199
Woods
✟4,584,588.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Others
Upvote 0

JimR-OCDS

God Cannot Be Grasped, Except Through Love
Oct 28, 2008
18,341
3,284
The Kingdom of Heaven
Visit site
✟185,132.00
Country
United States
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
I don't know if the Syrian regime did use chemical weapons or not . But, it seems that US do the same as they did in Iraq by accusing them of possessing nuclear weapons then they find nothing . So dirty game


DAMASCUS, Syria — U.N. experts collected samples and testimony from Syrian doctors and victims of an alleged chemical weapons attack Monday following a treacherous journey through government and rebel-held territory, where their convoy was hit by snipers.
As U.S. officials said there was very little doubt that Syria used chemical weapons and Western powers stepped up calls for swift military action, President Bashar Assad's government vowed to defend itself against any international attack, warning that such an intervention would ignite turmoil across the region.
It also would bring the U.S. closer to a conflict that has killed more than 100,000 people since Assad cracked down on Arab Spring-inspired protesters in March 2011.


Syria Chemical Weapons: UN Inspectors Probe Allegations Of Nerve Gas Attack
Yet you want the United States to support Al Asaad.



This is a UN matter and the Arab Nations should be responding, not the West, where we're only damned if we do and damned if we don't.


Jim
 
Upvote 0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums

mark46

Well-Known Member
Supporter
Jan 29, 2010
20,042
4,720
✟830,515.00
Faith
Catholic
Marital Status
Married
Politics
US-Democrat
Our Coptic brother has many times asked us to support the Butcher of Damascus.

Yet you want the United States to support Al Asaad.



This is a UN matter and the Arab Nations should be responding, not the West, where we're only damned if we do and damned if we don't.


Jim
 
Upvote 0
Status
Not open for further replies.