2 Creation Accounts

Anto9us · Aug 11, 2013

Well, OK - but in Gen 1 we would be male and female spirits, and we would be eating plants like all the other animals - "vegetarian spirits"...

Gen 1:29¶And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which [is] the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

Norah63 · Aug 11, 2013

Yes, don't you just love veggies?
When Jesus was resurrected he ate fish with them, and the disciples were probably amazed.

Anto9us · Aug 11, 2013

I had squash earlier today, but I just had some hamburger patties. I think it was after the Flood that people were "told they could eat animals".

A ladyfriend says she has gone vegetarian - yet eats fish.

Why do fish have this "in-between" status?

I like tuna fish and salmon

I am getting off-topic again

I do think there was "man as a spirit" and then "man in the flesh" but I think Gen 1 and 2 are BOTH "man in the flesh" cuz Gen 1 has them male and female and I don't think spirits eat either veggies OR fish - I don't think spirits eat ANYTHING

which I think is why Jesus seeing the disciples after His reseurrection MADE IT A POINT TO EAT FISH in front of them

to prove He wasn't a Ghost/Spirit

He was in a resurrected body

4LivingCreations · Aug 11, 2013

For me it's easier if the second account is simply a reiteration of the first.
It's my understanding that it's supposed to be simple, cause He told us to become like little children.

timewerx · Aug 11, 2013

Anto9us said:
A ladyfriend says she has gone vegetarian - yet eats fish.

Why do fish have this "in-between" status?

I don't know. Maybe because Jesus foresaw that in the future, fish food will remain unadulterated by chemicals. Otherwise, it's a mystery.

I also maintain a diet of fish, veggies, and bread. I avoid any red meat, chicken meat, salty and sweet foods, soda, coffee, mollusks, crustaceans, junk food, vitamins and food supplements.

You won't believe the immense health benefits you'll get from such diet.

It's probably a conspiracy why mass media is brainwashing everyone to love unhealthy foods, making them a part of a "psychologically healthy" lifestyle through TV shows, movies, ads.

Unhealthy foods are enjoyable to consume. But its immediate and short-term pleasures are greatly overshadowed with weakened immune system, increased fatigue, increased chances of headache, increased dental problems, and worst of all, these health problems are passed on to our offspring.

Unhealthy foods encourage the use of artificial drugs to "cure" the side effects but unfortunately, cause more problems of its own.

It's a vicious cycle to slowly destroy our physical, mental, and spiritual abilities. Immense profits to the food and pharmaceutical industry at the expense of our long term health and overall condition of our young children.

Pluckiy Pilgrim · Aug 12, 2013

Gen 1:29 And God said, Behold, I have given you every herb bearing seed, which [is] upon the face of all the earth, and every tree, in the which [is] the fruit of a tree yielding seed; to you it shall be for meat.

If Science is correct and "the big one" (i.e. flood) occurred roughly 12,000 years ago, the above verse in the first creation account proves one thing. It proves that the creation that took place in the first Chapter of Genesis took place in or near the equatorial zones.

Vegetarianism would not have been an option in the northern zones (still too cold) and over much of the rest of the earth, there simply wasn't enough water for much to grow other than grass. In most places rivers still didn't flow because the flow was cut off by the glaciers still present in most mountain ranges.

Additionally the only ancient religion that demanded vegetarianism and pretty much "demonized" all people who ate meat were the Vedic Aryans of ancient India. The Aryan age officially ended with the Kurukshetra (Mahabharata) war which traditionally ended 3102 BC. Thereafter, the Vedic people called themselves Hindus.

Kurukshetra War - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Some people date that war as early as 6000 BC, but that doesn't seem to fit the evidence. Around 3100 BC there was a rather large influx of people into the Mesopotamian regions of Sumer, Akkad (Semitic) and Assyria. Today we can track the gods, symbols and religious views of those people directly back to India. Iran was always Aryan as far back as we can track that nation's history.

Phantasman · Aug 12, 2013

Anto9us said:
Well, OK - but in Gen 1 we would be male and female spirits, and we would be eating plants like all the other animals - "vegetarian spirits"...

I really don't believe spirits are gendered. Gender is a physical quality that gets in the way of much spiritual understanding.

ChetSinger · Aug 12, 2013

I think they can refer to the same account if they're understood as being told from two points of view.

I've become intrigued by Wiseman's tablet theory, where chapter 1:1 through 2:4a contains a God-told history and chapter 2:4b through 5:2 contains an Adam-told history.

Here's an article about it: Who Wrote Genesis? Are the Toledoth Colophons?

drstevej · Aug 12, 2013

Typical Hebrew style.... Big picture... then focus on the crown of creation*

*not a Jefferson Airplane reference

Anto9us · Aug 12, 2013

I want MEAT!

I want JEFFERSON AIRPLANE references!

God created humans in the first place cuz he heard Grace Slick on the radio singin:

"Don't you want somebody to love?"

I disagree with everything today, except the the Kurukshetra (Mahabharata) war - have no idea when it was - the only part of Mahabharata I have read is Bhagavad-Gita - I like it where two armies just STAND THERE facing each other while Krishna and Arjuna have a dialogue that takes forever.

I disagree that gender is a physical thing.

There is such a thing as "a feminine personality" and a "masculine personality.

We are made in the image of God - therefore I submit that gender is a part of God's image too.

Think of the most masculine man you know - God is more masculine that that - his masculinity is the SOURCE of human masculinity.

Now think of the most feminine woman you know - God is more feminine than that also, because God's femininity is the source of human femininity.

I disagree that Gen 2:4a belongs with what went AHEAD of it - I say it introduces what comes after - it is in the same sentence as the rest of 2:4 - both verbs are infinitives, oddly.

I disagree that 2:4 on is a "retelling in greater detail" of 1:1-2:3.

It is a different creation account altogether.

Jefferson Airplane and Jefferson Starship are the same band - but Gen 1:1-2:3 and 2:4 on are DIFFURNT

Some people think Hare Krishnas are PEACEFUL - yet Krishna spends hundreds of lines of dialogue convincing Arjuna he should FIGHT!

Pluckiy Pilgrim · Aug 12, 2013

"Some people think Hare Krishnas are PEACEFUL - yet Krishna spends hundreds of lines of dialogue convincing Arjuna he should FIGHT!"

Amen to that, buddy! Nearly 4 MILLION men were killed in a mere 18 days, thanks to Krishna's dialogue with Arjuna. And the Hindu's still bill Krishna as a "peacemaker!" (????)

In my attempt to try to reach some conclusions, I have been known to "lurk" on Hindu forums. It was quite an education.

People have spent 2000 years and I don't know how many billions of dollars evangelizing to the people in India, yet still only 3% of the people there claim to be Christians.

Do you know why? It's because for the last 2000 years the Hindu priesthood has been teaching that "the real Jesus is Krishna." People on the Hindu forums evidently believe it.

Their theory is that Krishna was considered to be an avatar (incarnation) of Vishnu, and in the Hindu belief system, Vishnu absorbs all other gods.

Do you remember that old Sci fi flick, "The Blob?"

Vishnu is kinda like that…

The same "absorbing" of other gods clearly took place in both the Egyptian and Babylonian god systems as well.

drstevej · Aug 12, 2013

Anto9us said:
I want JEFFERSON AIRPLANE references!

God created humans in the first place cuz he heard Grace Slick on the radio singin:

"Don't you want somebody to love?"

"Go ask Alice when she's ten feet tall.
Go ask Alice I think she'll know"

A Survey of Old Testament Introduction: Gleason Archer: 9780802484345: Amazon.com: Books

$8.12 on Kindle, worth every penny.

Anto9us · Aug 12, 2013

I remember the BLOB - never associated it with Vishnu - interesting

GO ASK GRACE SLICK - when she's eight months pregnant - that's when I saw her, still up on stage BELTIN IT OUT!

(I have to stop ordering books - I have THREE on the way from Amazon, and half a dozen here already started - oh - I am past the point in 2 Nephi where some people are turned black)

Hindu forums - amazing!

Ya know, I would fight too if someone shaved my head and made me wear pink and orange together

n2thelight · Aug 13, 2013

timewerx said:
It's possible that "Earth without form and void" may be a description of Earth after a cataclysmic collision with another planet which probably killed all life on Earth, left it disfigured temporarily, and shrouded it in thick dust which kept it very dark by preventing sunlight from reaching the planet.

"Replenish" is not entirely impossible.

God destroyed the earth,ie made it void and without form,after satan rebelled......

Genesis 1:2 "And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep."

Who is that Spirit of God? He is the Holy Spirit, and it is God's Spirit that moved upon the face of the waters.

In the Hebrew translation of the word, "was", as used in this verse "...the earth was without form,..."; in the original text it reads "became without form...". This same mistranslation of the word "became", and turning it into the word "was" is also present in Genesis 2:7. It should read there; "..and man became a living soul."

The correct Hebrew translation from the Massoretic Hebrew text for the words, "without form" is "tohu-va bohu" in the Hebrew Strong's dictionary. So we see that the earth was not "created without form", but it "became [tohu] without form and void". Lets go to Strong's Hebrew dictionary, reference number 1961 to verify the word "was", that we read in this verse. "Yahah, haw-yaw; a prime root, to exit; to become, or come to pass." [#1961]

Now lets continue in the Strong's Hebrew dictionary to get the true meaning for the word "void". # 2258, on page 36 tells us that we have to go to # 2254 for the prime on the meaning of this word "void". # 2254; "Chabal, khaw-bal; to wind tightly as a rope, to bind, to pervert, destroy, to corrupt, spoil, travail," This corresponds with its other use in # 2255, which reads; "to ruin".

"Tohu" of the earth, then means that total destruction had come to pass upon the earth. The second "was" in the verse is in italics type because there is no verb "to be" in the Hebrew language. One of the problems in translating the Hebrew into English is that the verb, "to be" is not distinguished from the verb, "to become".

At the end of Genesis 1:1 the first earth age ceased to exist in its previous form. God created the earth to be inhabited, and then He destroyed it. There was an entire earth age that existed between verses one and two of Genesis. This first earth age is spoken of in II Peter, Jeremiah, Proverbs, and Jude.

We find more documentation concerning the first earth age in II Peter 3. In fact we can read of all three earth ages, as Peter becomes a witness to the fact.

II Peter 3:5; "For this they willingly are ignorant of, that by the word of God the heavens were of old, and the earth standing out of the water and in the water:"

The earth came about by "the word of God", God's speech. Some ministers preach that this was Noah's flood, well let's see.

II Peter 3:6; "Whereby the world that then was, being overflowed with water, perished:"

Perished means total destruction. "The world [age] that then was" ended in total ruin through another flood that was prior to Noah's day. There were no survivors of that flood; no animals, no man, no insects, nor vegetation survived in any form. Everything perished! We know in Noah's flood that two of all life forms were saved.

II Peter 3:7; "But the heavens and the earth which are now, by the same word are dept in store, reserved unto fire against the day of judgment and perdition of ungodly men."

This is the second heaven and earth age which we are living in now. This earth age will not be destroyed until God's time of judgment on the ungodly men of this earth age comes to a close. that time of perdition [destruction] is after the millennium, and after the judgment. Then will come the consuming fire. Hebrews 12:19 tells us that our God is that consuming fire.

II Peter 3:8; "But, beloved, be not ignorant of this one thing, that one day is with the Lord as a thousand years, and a thousand years as one day."

One week is 7000 years, and we are coming to the Sabbath of that week very shortly, which the common name for the next thousand years is "the Millennium age". The Millennium age is the thousand years after Jesus Christ returns to earth at the seventh trumpet to establish his kingdom here on earth. All souls at that time will not be in the flesh bodies, but in another dimension. They will exist in their incorruptible bodies, spoken of in I Corinthians 15:50-54.

Jeremiah 4:23; "I beheld the earth, and, lo it was without form, and void; and the heavens, and they had no light."

Here we get back to the same word that we saw earlier in Genesis 1:2; The Hebrew word "Tohu" for "void". In other words, God is saying, "I destroyed the first heaven and earth age." There simply was no life form existing on this earth at the close of the first earth age in any form.

Jeremiah 4:24; "I beheld the mountains, and lo, they trembled, and all the hills moved lightly."

This is why the magnetic north is 90 miles off true north? God shook the earth and everything moved from its foundations at the time the destruction "tohu" took place.

Jeremiah 4:25; "I beheld, and, lo, there was no man, and all the birds of the heavens were fled."

Did you get that? No man, no animals, and not even the birds were left alive. The earth was covered with water, and life could not exist. There was no boat floating around on the surface, for the span of time could have been for thousands of years, or a much greater time.

Jeremiah 4:26; "I beheld, and lo, the fruitful place was a wilderness, and all the cities thereof were broken down at the presence of the Lord, and by His fierce anger."

http://www.theseason.org/genesis/genesis1.htm

Phantasman · Aug 13, 2013

Anto9us said:
I disagree that gender is a physical thing.

There is such a thing as "a feminine personality" and a "masculine personality.

The better term for spirituality of female is "consort". Sophia who is wisdom resides in the female, yet all wisdom is of the Father. If you read Proverbs 8 you get the descriptive "she" for wisdom as being from the beginning. She was there at creation (as in the Apocryphon of John).

A ship is she. But it has no female parts. Only what man designates as females to "her".

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