Do you consider this racist?

WolfGate · Jul 12, 2013

keith99 said:
.

It is not sexist to say men swim faster than women. It is sexist to assume that every man is a faster swimmer than every woman. (I picked that one specifically because I was a decent age group and college swimmer. Age group some of the girls were faster than me. But they were national level swimmers.).

Even that is not sexist, because it doesn't state a superior worth to being faster. It is silly and wrong, but not sexist.

What would be sexist is believing that because men are measurably and overall faster swimmers than women, that men are therefore more valuable or worthy. Holding that belief is what results in exclusive or increased opportunities or scholarships for men, at the expense of women.

I actually like your choice of swimming, because it's one area where superiority hasn't resulted in perceived greater value. More women than men end up with college scholarships. (Yeah, there are some NCAA limits that help that, but that's another topic)

Strathos · Jul 13, 2013

The alleged purpose of these things is that whites naturally have the advantage due to the culture, and they are just trying to even the scales and give blacks closer to equal opportunities. Whereas doing these things for whites who already have the advantage would just seem exclusionary.

For example if poor person steals a loaf of bred to feed their starving family, you could have sympathy for them, but if a rich person steals a loaf of bread just because he didn't feel like paying, that reflects much worse on him.

Of course it can be argued that stealing is wrong regardless, but the analogy isn't perfect.

I'm honestly not sure I buy all of this black power stuff though.

Upisoft · Jul 13, 2013

xfreakazoidx said:
When it comes to african-americans we all know about the slave thing and racial prejudice against them since the founding of the country. So obviously like most people we love to see them be equals as time had gone on. Granted some people still have racist views about them.

But I noticed over the years that alot of the things they called racist, they are now doing themselves. There are all black schools. Black scholarships. Black miss USA. And recently on tv there's a dating site called BlackPeopleMeet for blacks only.

Does that stuff qualify as racism against whites? If I had a white only dating site or white only scholarship the NAACP (is that whats it called?) would be all over it as racism. I'm curious to peoples views on this because while I don't mind if they want to do this stuff, but I really feel likes its a double standard.

Also please lets not turn this into a fight or anything. Its just a simple question on what is racist and what is not really.

It depends what you define as "racist". For me, it was always connected with prohibition of some people to do something while others were able to do it. In this case (by my idea of what racism is) it will be racism only if white/latino/asians/etc. can't do the same things. I.e. if there is blacks only school, then whites/etc. only schools and mixed race schools should not be prohibited. Black miss USA? OK, then Asian and mixed race miss USA should be possible too. BlackPeopleMeet site, Then LatinoPeopleMeet and AllPeopleMeet should be possible too.

In other words, if I'm a white guy and I have a black guy for a friend and we CAN'T be in one university/school together, then there is something wrong...

grasping the after wind · Jul 14, 2013

keith99 said:
Am I a racist if I think the Japanese are superior to the Chinese?

If you are Japanese yes you would be jingoistic to think such a thing. Since both are of the same race but different ethnicity I do not see it as racist but jingoistic. The sentiment is the same, the term alone is different because only a technicality of the definition rules it out from being racism.

To me the 'ism' consists of painting with a broad brush between groups, attributing traits that are either not supported or attributing statistically supported traits to all (or nearly all) members of the other group.

To me the whole idea of racism is that of one's attitude of superiority. If one does not possess that attitude one may be honestly called a lot of unpleasant names but racist is not one of them.

It is not sexist to say men swim faster than women. It is sexist to assume that every man is a faster swimmer than every woman. (I picked that one specifically because I was a decent age group and college swimmer. Age group some of the girls were faster than me. But they were national level swimmers.).

What would be sexist is to believe that one sex is superior to the other. If one merely has the idea that all men are faster swimmers, one is simply misinformed. If he thinks that because men are superior to women then all men must naturally be faster swimmers, then he is sexist.

Ana the Ist · Jul 14, 2013

xfreakazoidx said:
When it comes to african-americans we all know about the slave thing and racial prejudice against them since the founding of the country. So obviously like most people we love to see them be equals as time had gone on. Granted some people still have racist views about them.

But I noticed over the years that alot of the things they called racist, they are now doing themselves. There are all black schools. Black scholarships. Black miss USA. And recently on tv there's a dating site called BlackPeopleMeet for blacks only.

Does that stuff qualify as racism against whites? If I had a white only dating site or white only scholarship the NAACP (is that whats it called?) would be all over it as racism. I'm curious to peoples views on this because while I don't mind if they want to do this stuff, but I really feel likes its a double standard.

Also please lets not turn this into a fight or anything. Its just a simple question on what is racist and what is not really.

Yea it seems a bit racist. The general rule of thumb is to imagine how it would look if white people did it...if it would look racist, then its just as racist as if non-whites do it.

Example: a black man with "BLACK PRIDE" tattooed across his chest, a Mexican man with "BROWN PRIDE" tattooed across his chest....a white man with "WHITE PRIDE" tattooed across his chest. Are any of those racist? All of them? None of them?

Skaloop · Jul 14, 2013

Ana the Ist said:
Yea it seems a bit racist. The general rule of thumb is to imagine how it would look if white people did it...if it would look racist, then its just as racist as if non-whites do it.

Example: a black man with "BLACK PRIDE" tattooed across his chest, a Mexican man with "BROWN PRIDE" tattooed across his chest....a white man with "WHITE PRIDE" tattooed across his chest. Are any of those racist? All of them? None of them?

One of them. White Pride. Because that one has direct connotations of racism due to history of usage. The others do not.

BelievingIsObeying · Jul 14, 2013

Ana the Ist said:
Yea it seems a bit racist. The general rule of thumb is to imagine how it would look if white people did it...if it would look racist, then its just as racist as if non-whites do it.

Example: a black man with "BLACK PRIDE" tattooed across his chest, a Mexican man with "BROWN PRIDE" tattooed across his chest....a white man with "WHITE PRIDE" tattooed across his chest. Are any of those racist? All of them? None of them?

None of those, as none indicate a superiority of their race, just pride in that race. Racism includes believing one race is superior to the rest.

elephunky · Jul 14, 2013

Ana the Ist said:
Yea it seems a bit racist. The general rule of thumb is to imagine how it would look if white people did it...if it would look racist, then its just as racist as if non-whites do it.

Example: a black man with "BLACK PRIDE" tattooed across his chest, a Mexican man with "BROWN PRIDE" tattooed across his chest....a white man with "WHITE PRIDE" tattooed across his chest. Are any of those racist? All of them? None of them?

I think the issue that people have with white pride is from what has happened in past in history. Where as those with gay pride, black pride, etc is more about standing up and refusing to be ashamed of your colour/minority etc.

GoodSpeed · Jul 15, 2013

keith99 said:
Bolding mine.

Who says they were created with the goal of eliminating racism? Historically black colleges were mainly created to give blacks some chance. Separate and honestly less than what whites had. More than a few supporters did so to try to keep blacks out of their all white colleges.

Keith,

I wasn't saying that black universities were created with the goal of eliminating racism. I said it was understandle why they were created -- because the blacks couldn't attend the white universities (and I acknowledge that this exclusion of blacks to attend the white universities was racist).

poolerboy0077 · Jul 15, 2013

xfreakazoidx said:
When it comes to african-americans we all know about the slave thing and racial prejudice against them since the founding of the country. So obviously like most people we love to see them be equals as time had gone on. Granted some people still have racist views about them.

But I noticed over the years that alot of the things they called racist, they are now doing themselves. There are all black schools. Black scholarships. Black miss USA. And recently on tv there's a dating site called BlackPeopleMeet for blacks only.

Does that stuff qualify as racism against whites? If I had a white only dating site or white only scholarship the NAACP (is that whats it called?) would be all over it as racism. I'm curious to peoples views on this because while I don't mind if they want to do this stuff, but I really feel likes its a double standard.

Also please lets not turn this into a fight or anything. Its just a simple question on what is racist and what is not really.

Are you one of those people who considers a women's resource center sexist? Context and history matter when addressing your question.

Ana the Ist · Jul 15, 2013

Skaloop said:
One of them. White Pride. Because that one has direct connotations of racism due to history of usage. The others do not.

You sure of that? I'm pretty certain I can find mention of brown pride by La Raza or black pride by the Nation of Islam...

jpcedotal · Jul 15, 2013

"Separate but equal" is now being pushed by black leaders and the NAACP.

RDKirk · Jul 15, 2013

GoodSpeed said:
Keith,

I wasn't saying that black universities were created with the goal of eliminating racism. I said it was understandle why they were created -- because the blacks couldn't attend the white universities (and I acknowledge that this exclusion of blacks to attend the white universities was racist).

And that's why all those things were created--because either legally or socially, blacks were excluded or strongly disadvantaged because of being black.

RDKirk · Jul 15, 2013

jpcedotal said:
"Separate but equal" is now being pushed by black leaders and the NAACP.

"Separate but equal" probably could have survived if white people would have actually allowed either.

Don't forget that the reason Rosa Parks refused to stand up for that white man was because he demanded her seat in the black area of the bus. Separate was fine as long as it was distinctly inferior, but when it became desirable...suddenly separate wasn't possible anymore.

Indians discovered that, too.

GoodSpeed · Jul 15, 2013

Does anyone ever wonder sometimes if humans, as a race, just aren't intelligent enough to ever really NOT be racist/sexist/discriminatory (based on religion or place of origin)??
It seems like this has been an issue for thousands of years ...

Maybe separating races and keeping them separate is the only way? or we'd focus on hair color then?

RDKirk · Jul 15, 2013

GoodSpeed said:
Does anyone ever wonder sometimes if humans, as a race, just aren't intelligent enough to ever really NOT be racist/sexist/discriminatory (based on religion or place of origin)??
It seems like this has been an issue for thousands of years ...

Maybe separating races and keeping them separate is the only way? or we'd focus on hair color then?

From a Christian point of view, bigotry is a sin of the flesh, and is thus as inherent as any other sin of the flesh. As such, it must be taught against from the pulpit like any other sin of the flesh and battled in every generation.

You can see it rife even in the early church if you read through Acts with an eye toward the Hebraic Jew/Hellenist Jew/Gentile issues.

GoodSpeed · Jul 15, 2013

RDKirk said:
From a Christian point of view, bigotry is a sin of the flesh, and is thus as inherent as any other sin of the flesh. As such, it must be taught against from the pulpit like any other sin of the flesh and battled in every generation.

You can see it rife even in the early church if you read through Acts with an eye toward the Hebraic Jew/Hellenist Jew/Gentile issues.

This makes sense

Skaloop · Jul 15, 2013

Ana the Ist said:
You sure of that? I'm pretty certain I can find mention of brown pride by La Raza or black pride by the Nation of Islam...

Find mention, sure. But it's still not a direct connotation of the term.

quatona · Jul 15, 2013

xfreakazoidx said:
But I noticed over the years that alot of the things they called racist, they are now doing themselves.

They?

GoodSpeed · Jul 15, 2013

quatona said:
They?

Uh-oh we got a lawyer ... every single word is gonna need to be explained now or provide a reference.

Do you consider this racist?

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