Is marijuana a sin? PLEASE HELP

ActionJ · Jul 6, 2013

McMatt said:
Well who was the one equating pot use to shooting heroin?

One poster equated the external stimulus of reading a book to the external use of marijuana. He said that there really is no difference. I simply tossed in a third external stimulus to see if his argument held up and if he would continue to defend that argument. Clearly, you see heroin use as something less than healthy for the mind and body and yet heroin is derived from a natural herb. So why is pot "okay" while heroin is not?

morningstar2651 · Jul 6, 2013

ActionJ said:
One poster equated the external stimulus of reading a book to the external use of marijuana. He said that there really is no difference. I simply tossed in a third external stimulus to see if his argument held up and if he would continue to defend that argument. Clearly, you see heroin use as something less than healthy for the mind and body and yet heroin is derived from a natural herb. So why is pot "okay" while heroin is not?

No, I don't equate the two. Your response is a straw man.

You said:

if the body/brain creates all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy or pleasure then there is no reason to seek external drugs

To which I replied:

The same could be said about reading books, listening to music, and watching movies. Why turn to external stimuli at all?

Which is a simple question in response to your post. If the body/brain creates all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy or pleasure, then why seek any external stimuli at all? Can't you just be pleased with your own internal thoughts and your own imagination?

Do you disagree? Do you think there is good to be found from reading books or watching television?

morningstar2651 · Jul 6, 2013

McMatt said:
Well who was the one equating pot use to shooting heroin?

miss-a brought up heroin in the context of a gateway drug in post 11.

ActionJ was the second to mention heroin in post 49

He then accused me of equating the use of heroin to reading a book. He choose to address a straw man rather than the actual content of my post.

miss-a · Jul 6, 2013

morningstar2651 said:
miss-a brought up heroin in the context of a gateway drug in post 11.

ActionJ was the second to mention heroin in post 49

He then accused me of equating the use of heroin to reading a book. He choose to address a straw man rather than the actual content of my post.

Well, miss-a is quite a dastardly beast, don't you know, wanting people to be healthy and happy and all. Who does she think she is?!?

Lollerskates · Jul 6, 2013

Cannabis is one of the most beneficial "drugs" someone can take. The side-effects are marginal, and the health benefits are substantial. There are plenty of studies that show this. Everything from curbing smoking, to destroying cancer cells makes up the benefits of cannabis. It is certainly better than pharmaceutical drugs, whose very name translates to "witchcraft drugs" in the Greek - the same Greek that speaks on the subject in the bible (pharmakia.)

Now, the problems spiritually would come in with the intent. Are you an AIDS patient, and need to develop an appetite? Cannabis is fine, I would say. Do you have chronic pain? Cannabis is better than Vicodin and Oxycontin I would say. Are you a cancer patient? Cannabis certainly helps with that. Are you depressed? Check for cannabis. Are you doing it socially? That is the gray area. Just like alcohol has health benefits, but can also be used sinfully, same with cannabis.

There are reasons for using everything. Even opium in its natural form has medicinal benefits in the right doses, and the right frequency of use. Snake venom has medicinal benefits. Anything natural has a use. Things engineered, or derivatives tend to tip toward less beneficial.

ActionJ · Jul 6, 2013

Lollerskates said:
Cannabis is one of the most beneficial "drugs" someone can take. The side-effects are marginal, and the health benefits are substantial. There are plenty of studies that show this. Everything from curbing smoking, to destroying cancer cells makes up the benefits of cannabis. It is certainly better than pharmaceutical drugs, whose very name translates to "witchcraft drugs" in the Greek - the same Greek that speaks on the subject in the bible (pharmakia.)

Now, the problems spiritually would come in with the intent. Are you an AIDS patient, and need to develop an appetite? Cannabis is fine, I would say. Do you have chronic pain? Cannabis is better than Vicodin and Oxycontin I would say. Are you a cancer patient? Cannabis certainly helps with that. Are you depressed? Check for cannabis. Are you doing it socially? That is the gray area. Just like alcohol has health benefits, but can also be used sinfully, same with cannabis.

There are reasons for using everything. Even opium in its natural form has medicinal benefits in the right doses, and the right frequency of use. Snake venom has medicinal benefits. Anything natural has a use. Things engineered, or derivatives tend to tip toward less beneficial.

1) I smoked for years. The smoke coated my lungs and caused me to cough often. My vocal cords are permanently damaged such that I speak with a raspy voice even though I quit smoking years ago.
2) While high, my cognitive thought process was hindered such that I was slow to make decisions and the decisions I did make were usually bad ones. I (as well as every one of my friends who got high with me) could not carry on a truly intellectual conversation.
3) In Jr. High and High School I would often smoke before class. I was unable to fully comprehend what the teacher was saying for two reasons: a) the THC numbed brain function and b) I was easily distracted by fellow students and/or shiny objects.
4) Pot caused me to become lazy. Prior to my addiction to marijuana I was very athletic or generally active. When I got hooked I really didn't want to do much other than watch TV, sleep, eat, or waste time in some other non-productive way.

The above descriptions were not only experienced in a personal way but I witnessed very similar effects on my friends and acquaintances.

The following excerpt is quoted here: HowStuffWorks "Marijuana and the Brain"

THC is a very potent chemical compared to other psychoactive drugs. An intravenous (IV) dose of only 1 milligram can produce serious mental and psychological effects. Once in your bloodstream, THC typically reaches the brain within seconds after it is inhaled and begins to go to work.

When I used to smoke pot I was one of its greatest proponents. Then, one day, reality struck and I was forced to face the truth. That's when I decided it was time to quit the harmful substance.

Lollerskates · Jul 6, 2013

ActionJ said:
1) I smoked for years. The smoke coated my lungs and caused me to cough often. My vocal cords are permanently damaged such that I speak with a raspy voice even though I quit smoking years ago.
2) While high, my cognitive thought process was hindered such that I was slow to make decisions and the decisions I did make were usually bad ones. I (as well as every one of my friends who got high with me) could not carry on a truly intellectual conversation.
3) In Jr. High and High School I would often smoke before class. I was unable to fully comprehend what the teacher was saying for two reasons: a) the THC numbed brain function and b) I was easily distracted by fellow students and/or shiny objects.
4) Pot caused me to become lazy. Prior to my addiction to marijuana I was very athletic or generally active. When I got hooked I really didn't want to much other than watch TV, sleep, eat, or waste time in some other non-productive way.

The above descriptions were not only experienced in a personal way but I witnessed very similar effects on my friends and acquaintances.

The following excerpt is quoted here: HowStuffWorks "Marijuana and the Brain"

When I used to smoke pot I was one of its greatest proponents. Then, one day, reality struck and I was forced to face the truth. That's when I decided it was time to quit the harmful substance.

I can respect that, but if I had my choice between cannabis and pharmaceutical drugs with endless serious side-effects, I would choose cannabis any day and all day.

ActionJ · Jul 6, 2013

Lollerskates said:
I can respect that, but if I had my choice between cannabis and pharmaceutical drugs with endless serious side-effects, I would choose cannabis any day and all day.

I had my choice (and still do) of all the above plus PCP, Black Beauties, Methamphetamines, alcohol, and lots more but the choice I ended up making was to quit them all (including booze and cigarettes). My drug of choice these days is Breyers Mint Chip Ice-cream.

ActionJ · Jul 6, 2013

morningstar2651 said:
miss-a brought up heroin in the context of a gateway drug in post 11.

ActionJ was the second to mention heroin in post 49

He then accused me of equating the use of heroin to reading a book. He choose to address a straw man rather than the actual content of my post.

You brought up "external stimuli" and used "books" as one of your examples in the midst of a conversation about "marijuana." By doing so, you created an inference by which you tied the reading of books to the use of marijuana. So, in a general sense, you inferred that both were "external stimuli" thus leading me to believe that you considered one to be on par with the other. I simply took your thought process one step further and included a third external stimulus, i.e., heroin.

The bottom line fact of the matter is that comparing books to marijuana is like comparing apples to oranges.

McMatt · Jul 6, 2013

XB3LI3V3RX said:
They both alter your mind and your ability to do physical things, so they are similar. I'm not understanding how using words you don't even know the meaning of (or if people do they use them in the wrong way) is the same as saying two different illegal drugs are similar. They are definitely similar in what they do to you, but they aren't the exact same.

~<Learn to Follow the Wolves>~

How are they similar? Heroin ruins lives and is extremely addictive, where pot doesn't/isn't. Comparing the two as similar is a very uneducated and ignorant way of looking at things.

Lollerskates · Jul 6, 2013

ActionJ said:
I had my choice (and still do) of all the above plus PCP, Black Beauties, Methamphetamines, alcohol, and lots more but the choice I ended up making was to quit them all (including booze and cigarettes). My drug of choice these days is Breyers Mint Chip Ice-cream.

Wow you were an experienced pharmacist lol...

Yea I don't necessarily condone cannabis therapy, I was trying to speak more on the comparative dangers. But yes, I would eat Breyers ice cream all day if it cured me of my ailments. It may.

There was a case in which a man found out he had terminal cancer. He locked himself up in a room, watched cartoons everyday, laughed and ate all of his comfort foods. Every so often his wife would check on him and cater to him. After six months, he felt better. After a few months after, he wasn't dead. He went to the doctor and found out his cancer had gone so far into remission that it was almost gone. He ended up living a good amount of years later.

McMatt · Jul 6, 2013

ActionJ said:
You brought up "external stimuli" and used "books" as one of your examples in the midst of a conversation about "marijuana." By doing so, you created an inference by which you tied the reading of books to the use of marijuana. So, in a general sense, you inferred that both were "external stimuli" thus leading me to believe that you considered one to be on par with the other. I simply took your thought process one step further and included a third external stimulus, i.e., heroin.

The bottom line fact of the matter is that comparing books to marijuana is like comparing apples to oranges.

Marijuana has very little side effects, and books have no side effects (unless you get really fat from doing nothing but reading). Heroin has really bad side effects. Life destroying side effects and very addictive properties. Thats where the straw man comes in

ActionJ said:
1) I smoked for years. The smoke coated my lungs and caused me to cough often. My vocal cords are permanently damaged such that I speak with a raspy voice even though I quit smoking years ago.
2) While high, my cognitive thought process was hindered such that I was slow to make decisions and the decisions I did make were usually bad ones. I (as well as every one of my friends who got high with me) could not carry on a truly intellectual conversation.
3) In Jr. High and High School I would often smoke before class. I was unable to fully comprehend what the teacher was saying for two reasons: a) the THC numbed brain function and b) I was easily distracted by fellow students and/or shiny objects.
4) Pot caused me to become lazy. Prior to my addiction to marijuana I was very athletic or generally active. When I got hooked I really didn't want to do much other than watch TV, sleep, eat, or waste time in some other non-productive way.

The above descriptions were not only experienced in a personal way but I witnessed very similar effects on my friends and acquaintances.

The following excerpt is quoted here: HowStuffWorks "Marijuana and the Brain"

When I used to smoke pot I was one of its greatest proponents. Then, one day, reality struck and I was forced to face the truth. That's when I decided it was time to quit the harmful substance.

All of that sounds like irresponsible use. If a person uses it responsibly then they will be alright. I used to go to class high all the time and I wound up graduating a year later. However, I don't blame pot. I blame my irresponsible use of it. You can't turn the blame away from yourself and onto pot. If you don't know how to use it responsibly, then you shouldn't be using it.

For the record, pot is 5 times more carcinogenic than cigarettes, however you can use pot in a much smaller scale and get the effects. You must have been a chimney for it to damage you, or maybe you were smoking it in the harshest way possible like a pipe or something. Cigarettes don't help either

XB3LI3V3RX · Jul 6, 2013

McMatt said:
How are they similar? Heroin ruins lives and is extremely addictive, where pot doesn't/isn't. Comparing the two as similar is a very uneducated and ignorant way of looking at things.

Your going to sit here and tell me marijuana doesn't ruin people's lives? So these six kids at my school a few months ago that just got caught with marijuana in school and now have to go to an alternative school to even graduate, have thousands of dollars to pay in fines, probably getting into fights with their family, and will probably continue with these drugs that they are paying hundreds and thousands of dollars for aren't having their lives changed because they touched this stuff? Did you even read about the stuff that marijuana did to the guy at the top of this page? I don't see how I'm the ignorant one when you won't even look at the facts that marijuana does change people's lives and always will as long as people smoke this stuff.

~<Learn to Follow the Wolves>~

morningstar2651 · Jul 6, 2013

ActionJ said:
You brought up "external stimuli" and used "books" as one of your examples in the midst of a conversation about "marijuana." By doing so, you created an inference by which you tied the reading of books to the use of marijuana. So, in a general sense, you inferred that both were "external stimuli" thus leading me to believe that you considered one to be on par with the other. I simply took your thought process one step further and included a third external stimulus, i.e., heroin.

The bottom line fact of the matter is that comparing books to marijuana is like comparing apples to oranges.

You said:

if the body/brain creates all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy or pleasure then there is no reason to seek external drugs

To which I replied:

The same could be said about reading books, listening to music, and watching movies. Why turn to external stimuli at all?

Which is a simple question in response to your post. If the body/brain creates all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy or pleasure, then why seek any external stimuli at all? Can't you just be pleased with your own internal thoughts and your own imagination?

Do you disagree? Do you think there is good to be found from reading books or watching television?

After all, it was you who claimed that the body/brain produces all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy/pleasure - I just asked you a question about your view that you feel uncomfortable answering. And so you evade it. You dodge it. You attack your straw man and you accuse me of equating heroin with Moby Dick.

ActionJ said:
So you equate reading books to shooting heroin? Okee dokee then! I mean ... heroin is an "external stimulus" ... isn't it?

All because I asked for you to clarify your own views. Is it so hard to admit that your first post wasn't very well phrased? That perhaps there are better reasons to not do drugs?

morningstar2651 · Jul 6, 2013

XB3LI3V3RX said:
Your going to sit here and tell me marijuana doesn't ruin people's lives? So these six kids at my school a few months ago that just got caught with marijuana in school and now have to go to an alternative school to even graduate, have thousands of dollars to pay in fines, probably getting into fights with their family, and will probably continue with these drugs that they are paying hundreds and thousands of dollars for aren't having their lives changed because they touched this stuff? Did you even read about the stuff that marijuana did to the guy at the top of this page? I don't see how I'm the ignorant one when you won't even look at the facts that marijuana does change people's lives and always will as long as people smoke this stuff.

~<Learn to Follow the Wolves>~

Your opinion is irrelevant. You believe any story you hear without question.

miss-a · Jul 6, 2013

morningstar2651 said:
You said:

To which I replied:
Which is a simple question in response to your post. If the body/brain creates all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy or pleasure, then why seek any external stimuli at all? Can't you just be pleased with your own internal thoughts and your own imagination?

Do you disagree? Do you think there is good to be found from reading books or watching television?

After all, it was you who claimed that the body/brain produces all the drugs necessary to experience feelings of joy/pleasure - I just asked you a question about your view that you feel uncomfortable answering. And so you evade it. You dodge it. You attack your straw man and you accuse me of equating heroin with Moby Dick.

All because I asked for you to clarify your own views.

Friends, it really is time to agree to disagree. We can all debate well. We've proven that. But at the end of the day, it is between the individual and God. He knows the truth behind our needs, motives, joy, addictions, dependencies, preferences, opinions, and what the truth is. Any of us who have a sincere heart for the truth and seek it will find it. It starts with asking Him. And truth equals freedom.

Thanks for your input.

Wishing you all truth, health and freedom,
a

XB3LI3V3RX · Jul 6, 2013

morningstar2651 said:
Your opinion is irrelevant. You believe any story you hear without question.

Everyone's opinion is relevant. These "stories" are things I've witness by the way. Why don't you just leave me alone? All you do is mock me everywhere I am on here because you get all mad that I disagree with pretty much everything you say. Grow up and learn that people have different opinions on stuff instead of being immature and attacking people you don't like.

~<Learn to Follow the Wolves>~

morningstar2651 · Jul 6, 2013

XB3LI3V3RX said:
Everyone's opinion is relevant. These "stories" are things I've witness by the way. Why don't you just leave me alone? All you do is mock me everywhere I am on here because you get all mad that I disagree with pretty much everything you say. Grow up and learn that people have different opinions on stuff instead of being immature and attacking people you don't like.

~<Learn to Follow the Wolves>~

No. Some opinions aren't worth listening to. Like the people that think that Obama is a transdimensional shapeshifting reptile. They're not worth listening to.

morningstar2651 · Jul 6, 2013

miss-a said:
Friends, it really is time to agree to disagree. We can all debate well. We've proven that. But at the end of the day, it is between the individual and God. He knows the truth behind our needs, motives, joy, addictions, dependencies, preferences, opinions, and what the truth is. Any of us who have a sincere heart for the truth and seek it will find it. It starts with asking Him. And truth equals freedom.

Thanks for your input.

Wishing you all truth, health and freedom,
a

I don't think we really disagree at all. My position just keeps being misrepresented as being pro-heroin.

BelievingIsObeying · Jul 6, 2013

If using marijuana for its medicinal purposes is a sin, then using oranges, aloe Vera, chocolate and coffee beans must be sins too.

Is marijuana a sin? PLEASE HELP

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