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The books that will be opened in Daniel 7:10b could be records of all the actions of people, by which people will be judged (2 Corinthians 5:10), just as the books that will be opened subsequently in Revelation 20:12a will contain all the actions of people, by which people will be judged (Revelation 20:12b).
Daniel 7 doesn't necessarily refer to the Ancient of days and the Son of man as being different beings. For the description of the Ancient of days in Daniel 7:9 matches the description of the Son of man in Revelation 1:13-14. And the judgment of people occurring in front of the throne of the Ancient of days in Daniel 7:9-10 matches the judgment of people occurring in front of the throne of the Son of man in 2 Corinthians 5:10 and Revelation 20:11-15 (cf. John 5:22).
Also, when Daniel 7:13 says that the Son of man came "to" the Ancient of days, the original Chaldean word (ad, H5705) translated as "to" corresponds to a Hebrew word (ad, H5704) which can be translated as "when" (Psalms 71:18, Jonah 4:2). So Daniel 7:13b can refer to "when" the Ancient of days will come, which will be when the Son of man comes with the clouds of heaven (Daniel 7:13), which will be at his second coming to the earth (Matthew 24:30), which will be when the Ancient of days will come to the earth immediately after the tribulation to set up the millennial aspect of his kingdom on the earth with the church (Daniel 7:21-22, Matthew 24:29-31, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). So when Daniel 7:13b says "they brought him near before him", that can refer to angels bringing the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) before the returned Son of man/Ancient of days to be judged and given to the burning flame (Daniel 7:11b, Revelation 19:20).
The Son of man can be the Ancient of days because the Son of man is "from everlasting" (Micah 5:2, John 8:58, John 17:5).
The beast which comes up out of the earth in Revelation 13:11-16 indeed represents the Antichrist's False Prophet (Revelation 19:20, Revelation 16:13). He could be a (secretly apostate) pope who at some point during his tenure will make a great push for peace and unity between Christianity and Islam. He could say something like: "Why do we fight each other? Are we not all the spiritual children of Abraham and of his God, the one God? Can't we lay aside our foolish, man-made differences of theology, which have done us no good at all, but only brought us hatred and violence, and unite into one religion of Abraham, one religion of peace, based on love for the one God and love for our fellow man? What's more important than this?"
He could be so skillful in elucidating what the moderate Muslims could call "the true, peaceful, loving nature of Islam", that he could be hailed by them worldwide as (in their words) "a Great Imam, come to rescue our beloved Islam from the bad reputation falsely given to it by the terrorists". In this way, a pope could come to hold high positions of power in two religions at the same time, which could be symbolized by the two horns of the False Prophet lamb (Revelation 13:11). This would be similar to how the seven horns of the true-Jesus lamb in Revelation 5:6 could represent the true Jesus holding seven positions of power at the same time (compare Jesus wearing many crowns at the same time in Revelation 19:12). The False Prophet could even say that he is Jesus. (But he won't say that he's Christ, for the False Prophet and the Antichrist will deny that Jesus is the Christ, and will deny that Christ is in the flesh: 1 John 2:22; 2 John 1:7.)
Once the False Prophet by his amazing miracles has brought the world under his spell (Revelation 13:13-18, Revelation 19:20), including many Muslims and Christians who may not care much for scriptural dogma, but could go wild over his signs and wonders, he could begin to (in his words) "restore to the world the real message which was spoken by me (Jesus) at my first coming, and by the great prophet Mohammed, but which message became corrupted by power-hungry men when they copied and changed the early manuscripts of the Bible and the Koran". He could then gradually initiate the world into the Antichrist's Gnostic Luciferianism (1 John 4:3, Revelation 13:4-6), a religion which could have existed since ancient times in some "mystery" cults, and which still exists today in the highest degree of initiation of a worldwide secret society. The False Prophet could present his miraculously calling fire down from heaven (Revelation 13:13) as purported proof that Lucifer (the dragon, Satan) and the Antichrist are the true God (Revelation 13:4-8, Revelation 12:9), in an inversion of how back in Old Testament times, Elijah miraculously called fire down from heaven to prove that YHWH is the true God (1 Kings 18:37-39).
The ten horns/kings of the beast in its Antichrist's-empire aspect (Revelation 13:1, Revelation 17:3,12) could be ten men whom the Antichrist will appoint as kings over ten major nations, which nations could be the ten horns in Daniel 7:24. For in Daniel 7, the first three beasts (Daniel 7:3-6) represent the ancient empires of Babylon (lion), Medo-Persia (bear), and Greece (leopard). And the fourth beast, or fourth "king"/"kingdom" (Daniel 7:17,23), represents the ancient Roman Empire. And the ten horns/kings which come out of it (Daniel 7:7,24) could represent ten major kingdoms/nations today which came out the former territory of the Roman Empire, which consisted not only of Western Europe, but also the Middle East and North Africa.
These ten nations could be Germany, the U.K., France, Italy, Spain, Turkey, Egypt, Iraq, Algeria, and Syria. The ten part-iron/part-clay toes of Daniel 2:42 could represent the same thing as the ten horns of Daniel 7:7. The Europeans could be the iron, and the Arabs and Turks could be the clay. In Daniel 2:43, the inability of the iron to mix with the clay could represent how, for example, there are many Turks living in Germany, but they remain separated in ghettoes within German cities. Similarly, there are many Algerians living in France, but they remain separated in ghettoes within French cities.
But despite this social separation, which could endure indefinitely, the people of Western Europe on the one hand, and the people of the Middle East and North Africa on the other, could still one day put aside their political separation and become united into one confederation. For Daniel 2:42 refers to the ten as a singular "kingdom". The person who brings this about could be the Antichrist. The arising of the "little" horn (Daniel 7:8, Daniel 8:9), which is "diverse" from the ten major nations (Daniel 7:24), could mean that the Antichrist will arise from a little country. And the little horn arising from "among" the ten major nations (Daniel 7:8) could mean that the Antichrist's country's territory used to be part of the Roman Empire. And before that, it was part of one of the four Diadochian Greek kingdoms which succeeded the Greek Empire of Alexander the Great (Daniel 8:8-9,21-25). The territory of these four kingdoms stretched from Greece over to Iran, and down into Egypt. So the Antichrist could come from the Middle East. He could be an Arab who will come from the little country of Lebanon, from the modern city of Tyre (Ezekiel 28:2; 2 Thessalonians 2:4).
The Antichrist could start out by claiming to be a Baathist. After becoming the leader of Lebanon, he could peacefully gain control of a Baathist confederation of three of the ten major nations (Daniel 7:24): Egypt, "toward the south" of Lebanon (Daniel 8:9), and Iraq and Syria, "toward the east" of Lebanon (Daniel 8:9). This confederation could also include the minor nation of a United Palestine, that is, a defeated Israel, "the pleasant land" (Daniel 8:9). This Baathist confederation could be put together in the future by an Iraqi Baathist General who could completely defeat and occupy Israel and Egypt (Daniel 11:15-17; in verse 17 the original Hebrew word translated as "daughter" is "bath"), but who could then mysteriously disappear (Daniel 11:19) shortly before the Antichrist arises on the world stage (Daniel 11:21-45). Years later, when the Antichrist gains control over all ten of the major nations, he could appoint kings over them (Revelation 17:12) who will defer to him (Revelation 17:13), like, for example, when Napoleon gained control over different nations, he appointed kings over them who would defer to him.
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Hi.
Why would the Ancient of days never have to die as a human?
Jesus is the high priest forever of the order of Melchisedec (Hebrews 6:20), because of Jesus' divine/human power of an endless life (Hebrews 7:16-17). Because Jesus is God (John 1:1,14), even as a human it wasn't possible for him to remain dead (Acts 2:24).
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Because Jesus' temporary death didn't erase his pre-existence from everlasting (Micah 5:2, John 8:58, John 17:5).
Jesus is God (John 1:1,14, John 10:30, John 20:28, Titus 2:13, Philippians 2:6, Matthew 1:23). And he's uncreated God, just as God the Father is uncreated God. For everything that has been created has been created by Jesus (John 1:3, Colossians 1:16-17). Because Jesus is uncreated, there was never a time when he was not. He has always existed. He is YHWH the Holy One, from everlasting (Habakkuk 1:12a, Acts 3:14, Micah 5:2c). Jesus is YHWH the only Savior (Isaiah 43:11, Titus 2:13), YHWH the good shepherd (Psalms 23:1, John 10:11, Mark 10:18), YHWH who will set his feet on the Mount of Olives at his return (Zechariah 14:3-4, Acts 1:11-12), YHWH who is the first and the last (Isaiah 44:6, Revelation 2:8), YHWH the great I AM (Exodus 3:14, John 8:58), the great God (Titus 2:13), the mighty God (Isaiah 9:6), one God with God the Father (John 10:30, John 20:28), equal in divinity with God the Father (Philippians 2:6).
Just as the Trinity of Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (Matthew 28:19) is the three distinct, coexisting Persons (Mark 1:9-11) of God the Father (Galatians 1:3), God the Son (Hebrews 1:8), and God the Holy Spirit (cf. Mark 13:11 and Matthew 10:19-20; Acts 5:3-4), so the Trinity is YHWH the Father, YHWH the Son, and YHWH the Holy Spirit. For YHWH is the only God (Isaiah 45:5-6). He has always been and forever will be the only God (Isaiah 43:10b).
There are so many different ways to illustrate the Trinity that it shouldn't be difficult for every Christian to get at least some realization of it. While there's no sufficient analogy to completely explain God (Isaiah 40:18), how he can be one God and yet three Persons at the same time, the Bible does refer to God speaking things into existence (Genesis 1:24; Hebrews 11:3). What God spoke was his Word, who is that Person of the Trinity who has become flesh in Jesus Christ (John 1:1,14; 1 Timothy 3:16, Luke 24:39). But God the Word existed even before God the Father spoke anything into existence, for all things created were created by God the Word (John 1:1-3, Colossians 1:16-17). And the original Greek word in John 1:1,14 for "Word" is "Logos", which refers not only to spoken words, but also to any ordered thoughts. Clearly, God has always had ordered thoughts, so God the Word has always existed.
So a human analogy for God would have God the Father as the mind, and God the Word as the ordered thoughts, speech, and writings (incarnate words) of that mind. God the Holy Spirit would then be analogous to the breath (spirit) which is inextricable from human speech, and is also inextricable from ordered thought, in that a non-breathing person is dead and his brain has no thoughts. God the Holy Spirit (Acts 5:3-4) is one God with God the Father and God the Word because the Holy Spirit is the Spirit of the Father (Matthew 10:19-20 and Mark 13:11) and the Spirit of the Word (John 14:16-18, Romans 8:9). While an individual human isn't three persons, the truth about God can still be grasped by looking at man's design, for man was made in God's image (Genesis 1:26). Just as an individual man has his word (Revelation 12:11) and his spirit (1 Thessalonians 5:23), so the one God has his Word (John 1:1) and his Spirit (Romans 8:9). But the one God is so infinitely greater than man (Isaiah 40:17) that the Word of God and the Spirit of God are distinct Persons within his being.
Besides the analogy of a single human's mind, thoughts/speech/writings, and breath, the Trinity can also be compared to the single sun's sphere, light, and heat. The Father would be analogous to the sun's sphere, which is invisible to humans except for its visible light, which is analogous to the incarnate, visible Word (Colossians 1:15, John 14:9). And the sun is felt by humans via its invisible, infrared rays, which would be analogous to the Spirit. The Trinity can also be compared to water, which even though it's only one substance, it can exist in three distinct states of solid, liquid, and gas at the same time (such as in a water pitcher two-thirds full with water and ice cubes, and with water vapor filling the top third of the pitcher). The Trinity can also be compared to space, which even though it's only one area, it consists of three distinct dimensions at the same time. The Trinity can also be compared to 1x1x1=1, or to 1a x 1b x 1c = 1abc.
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When Daniel 7:9 refers to the throne of God as having wheels, it's referring to the same thing as Ezekiel 1, which refers the "merkabah" (H4818), the "chariot" of God, which has four "wheels" (Ezekiel 10:9) which are so large they're frightening (Ezekiel 1:18). Each wheel consists of a wheel at a right angle within another wheel (Ezekiel 1:16-17, Ezekiel 10:10). The wheels turn with the sound of a great rushing (Ezekiel 3:13). Each wheel has eyes all around its rims (Ezekiel 1:18). And each wheel has an accompanying footman, as it were (Ezekiel 10:9,16,17): a four-winged, four-faced (Ezekiel 1:6) angelic being called a cherub (Ezekiel 10:9), whose beating wings make a great sound like rushing waters (Ezekiel 1:24), and whose bodies are covered with eyes (Ezekiel 10:12). Their four faces are of a man, a lion, an ox, and an eagle (Ezekiel 1:10).
Between the four wheels and four cherubim are coals of fire (Ezekiel 10:2), and above is a crystal platform (Ezekiel 1:22) above which God sits on a sapphire throne (Ezekiel 1:26, Ezekiel 10:1), and appears as bright as fire (Ezekiel 1:27), with a rainbow of light circling him (Ezekiel 1:28). God moves about on this chariot, for he came on it to appear to Ezekiel by the river Chebar in Babylonia (Ezekiel 1:3-28). Then God moved on it to a plain in Babylonia (Ezekiel 3:22-23). Later, God moved on it to the right side of Solomon's temple (Ezekiel 10:3-6). Then God moved on it to the east gate of that temple (Ezekiel 10:19). Then God moved on it to the top of the Mount of Olives east of Jerusalem (Ezekiel 11:22-23; compare Zechariah 14:4). Later, God moved on it to sit inside a future temple in Jerusalem (Ezekiel 43:2-7).
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oops I wish to take my vote back - there are appear to be two options saying they are the same event - i took the second one thinking it was the "not the same" option. Turns out it was another "the same event'. I think Rev 20:11 is after the millennium and Rev 6 is at the 2nd coming which starts the millennium.
in Christ,
Bob
in Christ,
Bob
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Hang around, vinsight4u. You have some good insights that we all need.
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Rev.6:12-17 same event as Rev.20:7-15 same event as Rev.7:9-17 same event as Rev.19:11-21 same event as Rev.11:14-19 same event as Rev.16:17-21 same event as Rev.14:14-20.
Old Jack that agapes those "1" synchronous non-chronological events.
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Actually, those are all different events, because Revelation is chronological.
Regarding Revelation 6:12-17, it could be fulfilled in our future by a huge volcanic eruption (possibly of the Yellowstone Caldera) which will occur during only the first stage of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24. This eruption could begin with a large earthquake (Revelation 6:12), signaling the sudden rising of magma within the volcano. When it erupts, it could shoot so much ash and smoke into the sky that the sun will appear darkened and the moon blood-red (Revelation 6:12b), like happens during large forest fires. The volcano could also shoot blobs of red-hot magma into the sky, which as they fall back down could appear like falling stars (Revelation 6:13). And it could shoot so much super-heated ash and smoke so high and so quickly into the sky that they could form a gigantic mushroom cloud which will make the sky (the first heaven) look like a scroll being rolled up (Revelation 6:14). Earthquakes connected with the eruption could be so large that they set off a chain reaction of other earthquakes in nearby faults and volcanoes, which could set off even more earthquakes further away, and so on, so that earthquakes will end up affecting every mountain and island, moving each of their positions at least a little bit (Revelation 6:14b).
Regarding Revelation 20:7-15, it shows that the Gog/Magog attack on Israel (Ezekiel chapters 38-39) won't occur until after the future millennium (Revelation 20:7-10), when there will be no defensive walls or fear of attack in Israel whatsoever (Ezekiel 38:11). This is the exact opposite of today's situation, when Israel is filled with very high defensive walls and is in constant fear of attack. At the beginning of the millennium, all present-day weapons of war throughout the world will be destroyed and they won't be allowed to be remade during the millennium (Micah 4:3-4). That is why after the millennium, the Gog/Magog armies will employ only rudimentary, wooden weapons like bows and arrows, spears, shields, and clubs (Ezekiel 39:9), which, after the defeat of the Gog/Magog armies, will be able to be used as convenient firewood by the people living in Israel at that time, instead of them having to go out and collect or cut down firewood from the forest (Ezekiel 39:10).
The Gog in Revelation 20:8 is the same as in Ezekiel chapters 38-39: an individual human leader whose personal name is "Gog" (Ezekiel 38:3). He could be born near the end of the millennium, and he will be killed and buried at the end of the Gog/Magog attack (Ezekiel 39:11). Both accounts of the attack show that the Gog/Magog armies will be completely defeated by fire from heaven (Ezekiel 38:22, Revelation 20:9). While the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11-15) will occur subsequent to the defeat of the Gog/Magog attack (Revelation 20:7-15), nothing requires (as is sometimes claimed) that the great white throne judgment has to happen immediately after the defeat of the attack. For there will be at least 7 years (Ezekiel 39:9b) between the defeat of the Gog/Magog attack and the great white throne judgment.
Also, the Gog/Magog attack won't have to (as is sometimes claimed) involve only the nations listed in Ezekiel chapters 38-39. Those nations could be just a sampling. For the "nations" (ethnos), or peoples, who will be involved in the Gog/Magog attack will come from all over the earth (Revelation 20:8). They will still be physically part of Jesus' worldwide kingdom, still legally under his rule, just as they had been during the preceding millennium (Psalms 72:8-11, Psalms 66:3, Psalms 2). But after the millennium, they will be deceived by Satan into committing the attack (Revelation 20:7-10).
Also, while the Gog/Magog attack on Israel won't occur until after the future millennium (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39), Israel could suffer a different attack at the start of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, which attack could result in Israel's total defeat and occupation (Daniel 11:15-17).
And Jerusalem could be attacked in the future at least 3 times before the millennium: once near the start of the future tribulation (Daniel 11:22), then again mid-tribulation (Daniel 11:31), and then at the tribulation's end (Daniel 11:45), right before Jesus' 2nd coming and the start of the millennium (Zechariah 14:2-21).
Regarding Revelation 7:9-17, the great multitude can be only that part of the church (Revelation 7:14b) which will enter the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, and then come out of it (Revelation 7:14) and enter heaven (Revelation 7:15) by dying (cf. Philippians 1:21,23; 2 Corinthians 5:8) during the 2nd through 6th seals in the chapter just prior (Revelation 6), the tribulation's first stage.
This would be similar to how the souls of "them that were slain for the word of God", who will be under the altar in heaven at the 5th seal (Revelation 6:9-11), will enter heaven by dying sometime before the 5th seal. And it would be similar to how those in the church who will be on the sea of glass in heaven (Revelation 15:2, cf. Revelation 12:11) at the tribulation's 7 last plagues (Revelation chapters 15-16), the tribulation's final stage, will enter heaven by dying during the just-preceding, literal 3.5-year worldwide reign of the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of the beast) (Revelation 13:5-10, Revelation 14:12-13, Revelation 20:4-6, Matthew 24:9-13).
Regarding Revelation 19:11-21, it and Revelation 20:7-15/Ezekiel chapters 38-39 are two different events, separated by over 1,000 years (Revelation 19:19 to 20:9). After the first event, Satan will be bound in the bottomless pit for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:1-3), whereas after the 2nd event, he will be cast into the lake of fire to suffer forever (Revelation 20:10).
Revelation 19:19-21 is the battle at Jesus' 2nd coming, which Zechariah 14:2-5 shows will occur at Jerusalem. After that battle will occur Jesus' physical reign on the earth (Zechariah 14:9-21) with the bodily resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). It won't be until after the 1,000 years are over that the Gog/Magog rebellion will occur (Revelation 20:7-9, Ezekiel chapters 38-39).
Regarding Revelation 11:14-19, note that it doesn't refer to any coming of Jesus. Instead, Revelation 11:15 refers to the future point in time (Revelation 4:1b) when Jesus will take ultimate, legal, physical authority over the earth, away from Satan (cf. Luke 4:5-7) and Satan's fallen angels (Ephesians 6:12), and away from the Antichrist (the individual-man aspect of Revelation's "beast") (Revelation 13:4-18, cf. Revelation 12:9) and the Antichrist's 10 kings (Revelation 17:12-13). It won't be until a little later that Jesus will take de facto, physical control of the earth at his 2nd coming and during the subsequent millennium (Revelation 19:11 to 20:6).
Jesus' 2nd coming won't occur immediately after the sounding of the tribulation's 7th trumpet and the declaration of the legal replacement of the Antichrist's future, literal 3.5 year worldwide reign (Revelation 13:5-18, Revelation 12:6,14) with Jesus' reign (Revelation 11:15). For a "time" (Revelation 11:18) can last awhile (cf. Revelation 12:14). (It's like if someone said "It's time to sell this house"; this doesn't mean that it will get sold immediately.) The only part of Revelation 11:18 that will happen immediately after the 7th trumpet sounds is "thy wrath is come", for the plagues of the vials (Revelation 16), the tribulation's final stage, will come out of the 7th trumpet's heavenly-temple opening (Revelation 11:19, Revelation 15:5 to 16:1).
So the 7th trumpet (Revelation 11:15-19), even though it will be the last trumpet to sound during the tribulation, won't be the resurrection "last trump" of 1 Corinthians 15:52. The latter won't sound until after the entire tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24 is over, at Jesus' 2nd coming (Matthew 24:29-31; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16), which won't occur until Revelation 19, and which is when the church will be resurrected (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6; 1 Corinthians 15:21-23,51-54; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16).
Before the 2nd coming, the tribulation's final, Revelation 16 stage could last for 75 days. For the first vial in Revelation 16 could be poured out immediately after the 1,260 days of the Antichrist's worldwide reign, which 1,260 days could begin when the abomination of desolation (possibly an android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple in Jerusalem (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 11:31,36). And Jesus could return on the 1,335th day after the setting up of the abomination of desolation (Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15). An analogy for the possible 75-day vials-delay between Jesus taking legal possession of the earth (Revelation 11:15) and his return to take de facto, physical possession of it (Revelation chapters 19-20) would be someone in New York legally inheriting a house in California 75 days before he moves there to live in that house.
At Jesus' 2nd coming, he will resurrect and judge only the church (1 Corinthians 15:21-23; 1 Thessalonians 4:15-16, Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Psalms 50:3-6, cf. Mark 13:27), and then he will marry the obedient part of the church (Revelation 19:7-8, Matthew 25:1-12). Then Revelation 19:11-21 will occur. So both the resurrection and the rewarding of the church spoken of in Revelation 11:18, as well as the destroying of the destroyers of the earth spoken of in Revelation 11:18, could occur 75 days after the 7th trumpet's sounding. And because a "time" can last awhile (cf. Revelation 12:14), this would still be well within the "time" referred to in Revelation 11:18.
Everyone not resurrected and judged at Jesus' 2nd coming won't be resurrected and judged until Revelation 20:11-15, which won't occur until sometime after the returned Jesus and the bodily resurrected church have reigned on the earth for 1,000 years (Revelation 20:4-6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29). Both resurrections and judgments can still occur within Revelation 11:18's "time". For the original Greek word (kairos, G2540) translated there as "time" can refer to even quite a long period. For example, the same Greek word is used in 2 Corinthians 6:2 to refer to the "time" of people getting saved, which has been going on for thousands of years.
Regarding Revelation 16:17-21, only after the destruction of Revelation's symbolic (and worldwide) "Babylon" at the 7th vial, the final event of the tribulation, is completed (Revelation 16:17,19, Revelation 19:2), will Jesus return and rapture (gather together) and marry the church (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Matthew 24:29-31; 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8).
Mark 13:20 can mean that all flesh on the earth would die if the Lord hadn't already shortened, as in "he hath shortened" (Mark 13:20b), the number of days of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18, Matthew 24, and Mark 13. The Lord could have already determined, from the beginning of Creation (cf. Isaiah 46:10), that he will return on the 1,335th day after the abomination of desolation (possibly a standing, android image of the Antichrist) is set up in the holy place (the inner sanctum) of a 3rd Jewish temple (Matthew 24:15, Daniel 12:11-12, Revelation 16:15). And the Lord will return "immediately after the tribulation" (Matthew 24:29-31), immediately after its final event, the worldwide destruction during the 7th vial (Revelation 16:19, Revelation 19:2 to 20:6). So Mark 13:20 can mean that if the Lord hadn't shortened the number of days of the tribulation, then all flesh on the earth would die during the 7th vial's aftermath, which could be a nuclear-winter scenario (which the Lord will miraculously prevent at his return) brought on by the 10 kings of the Antichrist's empire nuking the cities of the earth at the 7th vial (Revelation 17:16-17a, Revelation 16:19).
Regarding Revelation 14:14-20, see posts 74 and 78.
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Rev.6:12-14, "sun became black as sackcloth of hari, etc." For those that scrtuinize Matt.24:29, etc. and IIPet.3:10, 12 little comment will be needed. Here we have one picture of the end of the world for sure without ushering in a Jewish Millennial. The figures used are simply figures. Quaking, sun, whole moon (ie, full moon), heaven, stars, mountains and islands are to be understood literally.
The dispute as to whether this cataclysm is to be dated before or after what the futurist call the Great Tribulation and what they call the Rapture is unimportant. Here we get only one glimpse of the end of the world.
Old Jack
Rev.6:12-14, "sun became black as sackcloth of hari, etc." For those that scrtuinize Matt.24:29, etc. and IIPet.3:10, 12 little comment will be needed.
Here we have one picture of the end of the world for sure without ushering in a Jewish Millennial. The figures used are simply figures. Quaking, sun, whole moon (ie, full moon), heaven, stars, mountains and islands are to be understood literally. The dispute as to whether this cataclysm is to be dated before or after what the futurist call the Great Tribulation and what they call the Rapture is unimportant. Here we get only one glimpse of the end of the world.
Old Jack
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Revelation 6:12-13 and Matthew 24:29-31 are two different sets of events. For Revelation 6:12-13 will occur during only the first stage of the future tribulation of Revelation chapters 6 to 18 and Matthew 24, whereas Matthew 24:29-31 (like Revelation 19:7-21, 2 Thessalonians 2:1-8, and 1 Thessalonians 4:15-17) will occur immediately after the tribulation (Matthew 24:29). Also, when Revelation 6:12-13 occurs, the moon's light will appear blood-red, whereas when Matthew 24:29 occurs, the moon's light won't be seen at all. There will also be one point between the time of Revelation 6:12-13 and the time of Matthew 24:29 when the moon's light temporarily won't be seen at all, during 1/3 of the night (Revelation 8:12).
Also, the sun temporarily appearing to be darkened in Revelation 6:12-13 will be only the first time during the tribulation that something like that will happen. For it will happen again during the 4th trumpet (part of the tribulation's 2nd stage), for 1/3 of the day (Revelation 8:12), and then again during the 5th trumpet (Revelation 9:2), and then again during the 5th vial (Revelation 16:10), part of the tribulation's 4th and final stage, the 3rd stage being the literal 3.5-year time period of the Antichrist's worldwide reign (which time period is shown from 4 different angles in Revelation chapters 11 to 14). Also, what will appear like "stars" falling from the sky in Revelation 6:12-13 will be only the first time during the tribulation that something like that will happen. For subsequently, during the 3rd trumpet, what will appear like a star will fall from the sky (Revelation 8:10-11), and then again during the 5th trumpet (Revelation 9:1). And then again, mid-tribulation, what will appear like stars will descend from the sky (Revelation 12:4).
Regarding 2 Peter 3:10-13, in the day of the Lord will occur the destruction of heaven (the first heaven: the sky, the atmosphere) and the earth (the surface of the earth) at the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11, Revelation 21:1). And this will be followed by the creation of a new atmosphere and surface for the earth (2 Peter 3:13, Revelation 21:1) onto which New Jerusalem, God the Father's house (John 14:2, Revelation 21:2-3), will descend from the 3rd heaven (Revelation 21:2-3). But the day of the Lord won't immediately bring the destruction of earth's atmosphere and surface. For the day of the Lord will begin at Jesus' 2nd coming (1 Corinthians 1:7-8) as a thief (2 Peter 3:10a, Revelation 16:15). And after his 2nd coming, he will establish his kingdom physically on the earth with the bodily resurrected church for 1,000 years (Revelation 19:7 to 20:6, Revelation 5:10, Revelation 2:26-29, Psalms 66:3-4, Psalms 72:8-11, Zechariah 14:3-21).
And after the 1,000 years, the Gog/Magog rebellion will occur (Revelation 20:7-10, Ezekiel chapters 38-39). And after its defeat, at least 7 more years will occur (Ezekiel 39:9b), before the earth's atmosphere and surface are destroyed at the great white throne judgment (Revelation 20:11). All these events, from Jesus' 2nd coming to the great white throne judgment, will be part of the day of the Lord. For it is not a 24-hour day, but to God is like a 1,000-year "day" (2 Peter 3:8).
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n2thelight
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Revelation 20 This is the "great day of God" when the full Godhead comes to dwell on earth with His saints forever. This is different from the "day of the Lord",,Revelation 6 which was 1,000 years earlier, that took place at the seventh trump when Jesus Christ came and set up His kingdom for the Millennium....
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