Stryder said:
...Mark 11:24 - Jesus says that whatever we ask in prayer, we will receive it. It is Jesus, and also we through Jesus, who mediate.
We are to indeed pray
for others,
while we live,
not in any manner in death, see response and texts below for reasons why this is so from the Bible; and while living now, we pray
"for" others, we
do not pray
"to" anyone other than God. See examples:
Brethren, my heart's desire and
prayer to God for Israel is, that they might be saved. Romans 10:1
And it came to pass in those days, that he went out into a mountain to pray, and continued all night in
prayer to God. Luke 6:12
And the king answered and said unto the man of God,
Intreat now the face of the LORD thy God, and
pray for me, that my hand may be restored me again. And
the man of God besought the LORD, and the king's hand was restored him again, and became as [it was] before. 1 Kings 13:6
For thou,
O LORD of hosts, God of Israel, hast revealed to thy servant, saying, I will build thee an house: therefore hath thy servant found in his heart to
pray this prayer
unto thee. 2 Samuel 1:27
Hear my
prayer,
O God; give ear to the words of my mouth. Psalms 54:2
All of those, and many more examples, are all prayer unto God, and some prayer
"for" another unto God. All of the examples are of the living, and none of the dead.
None may ask the dead anything, for they are dead. God warns very strongly in scripture that no
"living" should seek
"unto the dead" [Isaiah 8:19], for it is
"necromancy", and
"sorcery" [Deuteronomy 18:11]. For they which answer in return are devils masquerading as the dead
[1 Samuel 28]. If they [devils] are believed upon, rather than God, then that which is sown, is reaped.
&c.
John 2:3 - Jesus knew the wine was gone, but invites and responds to Mary's intercession. God desires our lesser mediation and responds to it because He is a living and loving God.
Where in John 2, does Jesus
"invite" Mary to do anything? This is again addition to the text. Roman theology does a lot of this.
Additionally, Jesus stance toward His mother, is quite clear:
Jesus saith unto her,
Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine hour is not yet come. John 2:4
Jesus, even from the age of 12, made this abundantly clear:
And he said unto them, How is it that ye sought me?
wist ye not that I must be about my Father's business? Luke 2:49
Jesus mission was more important that Mary.
But he answered and said unto him that told him,
Who is my mother? and who are my brethren? Matthew 12:48
Where were his family? Not in the room with Him, see therefore the context on why they were outside seeking Him, it did not have to do with faith, but unbelief.
Besides missing the whole context of the wine and wedding, representing His blood and covenant, for His own wedding to tHis own Bride, along with the Water pots, etc, Roman Catholic theology again distorts the events to exalt Mary into the position of a co-mediator with Jesus. Again, this is blasphemy.
Now, as to this, "they have no wine", will you then raise the disciples to co-mediator in the same function? For which is greater the "wine" or the "bread" in Roman Theology? It is verily "the bread"...
Send them away, that they may go into the country round about, and into the villages, and buy themselves
bread: for
they have nothing to eat. Mark 6:36
In those days the multitude being very great, and
having nothing to eat, Jesus called his disciples [unto him], and saith unto them, Mark 8:1
And, yet again, Mary, as are all the apostles, were then alive that she and they may ask, but now they are all dead, unable to do anything.
John 2:5 - Mary intercedes on behalf of those at the wedding feast and tells them to do whatever Jesus tells them. Because Mary is our perfect model of faith, we too intercede on behalf of our brothers and sisters.
John 2:11 - in fact, it was Mary's intercession that started Jesus' ministry. His hour had not yet come, yet Jesus responds to Mary's intercession. Even though He could do it all by Himself, God wants to work with His children.
We may indeed
"pray for" others while we are yet alive, but not while dead, for scripture is clear, see below and more to come, but
never pray
"to" anyone other than the True and Living God.
Notice,
no one went to Mary for anything, and
none asked anything of her,
nor implored her to ask Jesus,
nor prayed unto her to beg of Him. Roman Catholic theology
adds it to the text when it is
nowhere found therein. She, of her ownself, asked, with her own human motives, and as such that Jesus knew why she had asked, hoping that she might set Him upon the path, and yet Jesus clearly says "
Woman, what have I to do with thee? mine
hour is not yet come."
She was
not to interfere with what the Father had already given Jesus to do, nor with the timing of the events and clock upon which Jesus was, since it had already all been given in Prophecy
[see Daniel, etc]. Jesus made that clear.
Also, What hour? The hour of His betrayal into the hands of men and unto death. The very hour He spake of the whole time, for Jesus had already been Baptised
[John 1:29-34].
Then they sought to take him: but no man laid hands on him, because
his hour was not yet come. John 7:30
These words spake Jesus in the treasury, as he taught in the temple: and no man laid hands on him; for
his hour was not yet come. John 8:20
Behold,
the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and
shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me. John 16:32
Then cometh he to his disciples, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take [your] rest: behold,
the hour is at hand, and the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners. Matthew 26:45
And he went forward a little, and fell on the ground, and prayed that, if it were possible,
the hour might pass from him. Mark 14:35
And he cometh the third time, and saith unto them, Sleep on now, and take [your] rest: it is enough,
the hour is come; behold, the Son of man is betrayed into the hands of sinners. Mark 14:41
When I was daily with you in the temple, ye stretched forth no hands against me: but
this is your hour, and the power of darkness. Luke 22:53
And Jesus answered them, saying,
The hour is come, that the Son of man should be glorified. John 12:23
Now is my soul troubled; and what shall I say?
Father, save me from this hour: but for this cause came I unto this hour. John 12:27
Now before the feast of the passover, when J
esus knew that his hour was come that he should depart out of this world unto the Father, having loved his own which were in the world, he loved them unto the end. John 13:1
Behold,
the hour cometh, yea, is now come, that ye shall be scattered, every man to his own, and shall leave me alone: and yet I am not alone, because the Father is with me. John 16:32
These words spake Jesus, and lifted up his eyes to heaven, and said, Father,
the hour is come; glorify thy Son, that thy Son also may glorify thee: John 17:1
Notice, even the Biblical Mary says to
"do whatever [Jesus] tells [us] to do", and not what Roman theology tells us to do. Jesus says,
"If ye love me, keep my commandments." [John 14:15; Exodus 20:6], and yet Roman theology says not the 7th Day Sabbath of the Lord thy God, but another common working day, one of their own choosing, etc.
Yet the Roman 'Mary', that 'apparition', a mockery of the true, speaks contrary even to those words which the real and Biblical Mary then spake while alive. The Roman 'apparitional' 'Mary', that
'angel of light' [2 Corinthians 11:14], says to listen to 'her voice'... to be documented later.
Rom. 15:30 - Paul commands the family of God to pray for him. If we are united together in the one body of Christ, we can help each other
Also, where is it ever said that we should not ask others to pray for us?...
The last example is perfectly fine, but none of those being asked to pray
"for" another are "dead", but rather alive. Also none are asking any to pray
"to" anyone other than God.
All of these texts cited to prove "prayer to" the "saints" which are supposed, by Roman Catholic immortal soul theology, to be in heaven [an impossibility], ignore, what Stryder actually stated which was in regards to "Prayer
to the saints...", not prayer
of the saints or prayer
for the saints. Therefore, all of the above examples
fail to demonstrate a single text from scripture, for "prayer
to the saints". Secondly
it ignores the entirety of the scriptures upon the matter of those which have died, from Genesis to Revelation, in that
"the dead know not anything" [Ecclesiastes 9:5], and
"the dead praise not the Lord" and
"go down into silence" [Psalms 115:17] and
"Also their love, and their hatred, and their envy, is now perished" [Ecclesiastes 9:10] and they
"dwell in darkness" [Psalms 143:3] they being in
"sleep" and not "
awake" [Job 14:12; and many many others.] for the dead's
"breath goeth forth, returneth to his earth; in that very day his thoughts perish" [Psalms 146:4], for when they die, they
"wasteth away" [Job 14:10], and sees
"corruption" [Acts 13:36], and even as it is wrtitten,
"His sons come to honour, and he knoweth [it] not; and they are brought low, but he perceiveth [it] not of them." [Job 14:21], for no man hath any power to retain that breath which is God's, once He calls that which is His, and not ours, back unto Himself [Ecclesiastes 8:8].
[FONT="]There
the wicked cease [from] troubling; and there
the weary be at rest. Job 3:17
[There]
the prisoners rest together;
they hear not the voice of the oppressor. Job 3:18
The
small and great are there; and the
servant [is] free from his master. Job 3:19
The
eye of him that hath seen me shall see me no [more]: thine eyes [are] upon me, and
I [am] not. Job 7:8
[As] the cloud is consumed and vanisheth away: so he that goeth down to the grave shall come up no [more]. Job 7:9
He shall return no more to his house,
neither shall his place know him any more. Job 7:10
So
man lieth down, and riseth not: till the heavens [be] no more, they
shall not awake, nor be raised out of their sleep. Job 14:12[/FONT]
&c.
PS.
Jesus is the perfect model of Faith,
not Mary [see examples throughout scripture where she doubted]. Roman theology is ever attempting to replace Jesus perfect example with their own "mary's", in faith, in obedience, in sinlessness, etc and in all things. In some things they even seek to supercede Christ Jesus, for upon the Roman 'Rosary' is 10 prayers to Mary for every 1 unto God, upon the most part. The reason is, that satan, that 'angel of light', seeks to usurp God in all things and it is he which appears, masquerading as an apparitional...