God loved and God died for whom, You?

Chuck70

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"The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee." (Jer 31:3, KJV)

We are familiar with "til death do us part" and how long that love often lasts. But, this is "everlasting love" from God who does not change his mind or change his love! Once loved always loved! Now, Baptists, what do we understand when we read "out of"? Check this verse:

"And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water..." (Matt 3:16a, KJV)

Jesus was down in the water and then came up "out of", so we believe he must have been down in the water, right? So, consider these "out of" statements in God's word.

"I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word." (John 17:6, KJV)

Jesus has a people who God the Father gave him OUT OF the world. No explanation, it is in plain English.

"If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." (John 15:19, KJV)

Interesting, those Jesus chose OUT OF the world, are strongly distinguished from the world! What did Jesus do for these he chose "out of" the world?

"And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation" (Rev 5:9, KJV)

We see Jesus Christ redeemed his own OUT OF the world, meaning men OUT OF every "kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation". So, we have a particular redemption, a definite atonement for his own people chosen OUT OF the world.

Remember, Jesus is God and he shed his blood for his church:

"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood." (Acts 20:28, KJV)

Are you concerned if you are one of God's own and have an anxious desire about it? If this is a sincere concern that is a very good sign. Take heart:

"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:37-40, KJV)

This wonderful salvation was prophesied in Ezekiel centuries before:

"Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them." (Ezek 36:25-27, KJV)

Whose "will" do you see there? It surely is NOT man's weak "free will", but the determinative will of God Almighty!

Chuck
 
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Chuck70

Newbie
Mar 10, 2013
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"The LORD hath appeared of old unto me, saying, Yea, I have loved thee with an everlasting love: therefore with lovingkindness have I drawn thee." (Jer 31:3, KJV)

We are familiar with "til death do us part" and how long that love often lasts. But, this is "everlasting love" from God who does not change his mind or change his love! Once loved always loved! Now, Baptists, what do we understand when we read "out of"? Check this verse:

"And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water..." (Matt 3:16a, KJV)

Jesus was down in the water and then came up "out of", so we believe he must have been down in the water, right? So, consider these "out of" statements in God's word.

"I have manifested thy name unto the men which thou gavest me out of the world: thine they were, and thou gavest them me; and they have kept thy word." (John 17:6, KJV)

Jesus has a people who God the Father gave him OUT OF the world. No explanation, it is in plain English.

"If ye were of the world, the world would love his own: but because ye are not of the world, but I have chosen you out of the world, therefore the world hateth you." (John 15:19, KJV)

Interesting, those Jesus chose OUT OF the world, are strongly distinguished from the world! What did Jesus do for these he chose "out of" the world?

"And they sung a new song, saying, Thou art worthy to take the book, and to open the seals thereof: for thou wast slain, and hast redeemed us to God by thy blood out of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation" (Rev 5:9, KJV)

We see Jesus Christ redeemed his own OUT OF the world, meaning men OUT OF every "kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation". So, we have a particular redemption, a definite atonement for his own people chosen OUT OF the world.

Remember, Jesus is God and he shed his blood for his church:

"Take heed therefore unto yourselves, and to all the flock, over the which the Holy Ghost hath made you overseers, to feed the church of God, which he hath purchased with his own blood." (Acts 20:28, KJV)

Are you concerned if you are one of God's own and have an anxious desire about it? If this is a sincere concern that is a very good sign. Take heart:

"All that the Father giveth me shall come to me; and him that cometh to me I will in no wise cast out. For I came down from heaven, not to do mine own will, but the will of him that sent me. And this is the Father's will which hath sent me, that of all which he hath given me I should lose nothing, but should raise it up again at the last day. And this is the will of him that sent me, that every one which seeth the Son, and believeth on him, may have everlasting life: and I will raise him up at the last day." (John 6:37-40, KJV)

This wonderful salvation was prophesied in Ezekiel centuries before:

"Then will I sprinkle clean water upon you, and ye shall be clean: from all your filthiness, and from all your idols, will I cleanse you. A new heart also will I give you, and a new spirit will I put within you: and I will take away the stony heart out of your flesh, and I will give you an heart of flesh. And I will put my spirit within you, and cause you to walk in my statutes, and ye shall keep my judgments, and do them." (Ezek 36:25-27, KJV)

Whose "will" do you see there? It surely is NOT man's weak "free will", but the determinative will of God Almighty!

Chuck

I felt a need to give a defense before the onslaught comes. ;)

The OP is so clear in the direct statements of Scripture, yet proud man will object and wish to have a merit in his own salvation. But, noticing the meaning of the Bible words can solve many of these problems. Check these meanings.

World:
"For there is no man that doeth any thing in secret, and he himself seeketh to be known openly. If thou do these things, shew thyself to the world." (John 7:4, KJV)
[Even in this modern age, can anyone show himself to every individual who ever lived? Of course not!]
"First, I thank my God through Jesus Christ for you all, that your faith is spoken of throughout the whole world." (Rom 1:8, KJV)
[Here "world' means the entire Roman Empire, the whole world outside of Israel especially.]
"Now if the fall of them be the riches of the world, and the diminishing of them the riches of the Gentiles; how much more their fulness?" (Rom 11:12, KJV)
[Here the word "world" is specifically shown to mean the Gentiles in distinction from the Jews.]

"For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in him should not perish, but have everlasting life." (John 3:16, KJV)
[Noting what Rom.11:12 taught about world, notice that in 3:16, Jesus is speaking to "a man of the Pharisees"v1, "ruler of the Jews"v1, "a master of Israel"v10. So, Jesus is emphasizing God did not love just Jews, but people "of every kindred, and tongue, and people, and nation" Rev.5:9.]

All:
"But if we shall say, Of men; they feared the people: for all men counted John, that he was a prophet indeed." (Mark 11:32, KJV)
[Obviously not all men without exceptions for his head was cut off!]
"For I would that all men were even as I myself. But every man hath his proper gift of God, one after this manner, and another after that." (1Cor 7:7, KJV)
[The human race would soon end if all men were abstaining from sex!]

Every:
"The law and the prophets were until John: since that time the kingdom of God is preached, and every man presseth into it." (Luke 16:16, KJV)
[Does every man seek and struggle to get into God's kingdom? ... of course there are limits to be observed.]
"But I would have you know, that the head of every man is Christ; and the head of the woman is the man; and the head of Christ is God." (1Cor 11:3, KJV)
[Again, it has to mean "every man" in context, under consideration here.]

Then we come to the question of the "will of God", and we must recognize that God's will is referred to in two ways. His will of precept, or what he wills for us to do or obey; and then his will in his decree:

Will of precept:
"The secret things belong unto the LORD our God: but those things which are revealed belong unto us and to our children for ever, that we may do all the words of this law." (Deut 29:29, KJV)
"Behold, thou art called a Jew, and restest in the law, and makest thy boast of God, And knowest his will, and approvest the things that are more excellent, being instructed out of the law;" (Rom 2:17-18, KJV)

God's will of decree:
"In whom also we have obtained an inheritance, being predestinated according to the purpose of him who worketh all things after the counsel of his own will:" (Eph 1:11, KJV)
"And all the inhabitants of the earth are reputed as nothing: and he doeth according to his will in the army of heaven, and among the inhabitants of the earth: and none can stay his hand, or say unto him, What doest thou?" (Dan 4:35, KJV)

One last verse often quoted trying to refute particular redemption:

“But we see Jesus, who was made a little lower than the angels for the suffering of death, crowned with glory and honour; that he by the grace of God should taste death for every man.” (Heb 2:9 AV)

The word "man" is not in the Greek text. It must be supplied by the context and that comes in v10: "in bringing many sons unto glory"... So, Christ tasted death for "every son", not every man who ever lived.

Chuck
 
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