Lesbian Awarded Money from Sept. 11 Victims Fund

Regarding Paul Cameron's credibility on this issue:

http://psychology.ucdavis.edu/rainbow/html/facts_cameron.html

Originally posted by Mechanical Bliss
Considering homosexual marriage is not legal, those so-called facts could not have been obtained by studying actual homosexual marriages.

Furthermore, the American Academy of Pediatrics has shown that homosexuals make perfectly fine parents and the children raised by homosexuals are no more likely to be gay. I'd say a SCIENTIFIC source rather than a biased site which lists a study done by a DISCREDITED scientist, Paul Cameron, would be far more credible.

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To me, this has nothing to do with whether a homosexual is a model citizen or a dirt bag. I don't question they could be good parents. This is about whether homosexuality, an immoral sexual act that some people do, should be an appropriate criteria for marraige.

This still revolves around a perverted sexual act. Not friendships or close friends.

Originally posted by quizzler
This still revolves around a perverted sexual act. Not friendships or close friends.

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So now you're saying that homosexuality is purely about sex and absolutely no emotional attachment is involved?

On that stance you are incorrect.

No, I've understand emotional attachments are involved. But two guys can have emotional attachments and not have sexual desires for each other. Its called 'your bestfriend'.

Once again.......

Originally posted by quizzler
No, I've understand emotional attachments are involved. But two guys can have emotional attachments and not have sexual desires for each other. Its called 'your bestfriend'.

Once again.......

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the same can then be said about a man and a woman who are best friends

so lets get rid of marriage entirely

Originally posted by quizzler
No, I've understand emotional attachments are involved. But two guys can have emotional attachments and not have sexual desires for each other. Its called 'your bestfriend'.

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No, a homosexual relationship is different from "best friends".

I am heterosexual. I have good friends who are female (I would say that one of my best friends is female), but I do not feel sexual or romantic attraction towards them. There is a difference between friendship and romantic love.

Same for homosexuals. A gay male can be friends (good friends, best friends) with someone who is male, and not feel any sexual or romantic attraction. But then he may have a boyfriend who he feels the same sort of romantic love as a heterosexual male who has a girlfriend.

As much as you try to make it about "vile sex", homosexuality is about attraction, not sex.

-Chris

In the Church, marraige is about family unit. A bond that God approves us. "What God joins together, let no man seperate". Two people work as One unit. It is a Covenant God created. The covenant of marraige is not to be taken lightly. People do. I didnt get married for Tax reasons. I didnt get married for government benefits for the married. I married because i love her and commited to her.

Unfortunately most people think marraige is something like a contract. Try the ride a few years then leave.

OK, and churches should *never* be forced to marry homosexuals.

However, homosexuals should have some legal method to establish a union that's akin to marriage (at least in legal status, benefits, and responsibilities). It does not have to be a marriage in a church.

-Chris

Jerry, how a lizard reproduces has nothing to with the human race. I doesn't matter.

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Just getting it out in the open that it is not "what is natural" that matters to you.

People who homosexual are not looking to have kids by natural means, because they can't.

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So, do you think that marriage should be illegal for women past the age of menopause? How about men who have lost their reproductive ability in a war?

Is whether you can have natural children the defining character legitimizing civil marriage? No? I didn't think so.

Its a preverted act of what was intended.

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I don't think what you think is "intended" has much bearing on the legitimacy of a marriage claim either really. I think it would have much more to do with what the people who are making the marriage claim think is "intended" - at least they have some involvement in the issue. Your opinion of their relationship is pretty much value-less since you are not even remotely involved with them.

Originally posted by kern
Those "facts" are merely smears and insults.

"Homosexuals make poor parents". What are the facts backing this up? Whose definition are we using?

Just another example of Conservative Christianity using deceit and slander to advance their personal agendas. Makes me sick, and at times almost ashamed to be a Christian.

-Chris

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Chris

Ok, the "Homosexuals make poor parents" is harsh... but are you saying that homosexual behavior is a Christian thing?

Originally posted by websitejack
Chris

Ok, the "Homosexuals make poor parents" is harsh... but are you saying that homosexual behavior is a Christian thing?

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"harsh"? Try non-factual. Try arrant non-sense. Or fabrication. Call it false witness if you like. Calling that "harsh" is like calling Hitler "misguided".

Originally posted by quizzler
And if someone can explain to me how two males or two females mating make a baby, then please tell.

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From Susie Bright's Lesbian Sex World:  "Susie, how did you get pregnant?  Did you use the turkeybaster or did you party?"

Susie just looked at her questioner, who said, "So, you partied!"

for further edification see the film If These Walls Could Talk 2 to see how Ellen DeGeneres and Sharon Stone did it.

In addition, as already discussed in other posts there are examples of spontaneous pregnancies in other species where no intercourse occurred.

For the gay male view, see Dan Savage's The Kid:  What Happened When My Boyfriend and I Decided to Get Pregnant.

Originally posted by quizzler
No, I've understand emotional attachments are involved. But two guys can have emotional attachments and not have sexual desires for each other. Its called 'your bestfriend'.

Once again.......

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So the friendship you develop with a "best friend" of the same gender is equal to the emotional attachment you develop for your significant other of the opposite sex? I wouldn't say those are equal, but that's just my observation.

Originally posted by quizzler
What is being gay about? Sex.

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Excuse me, but if you are not gay yourself you cannot know the answer to your question.  That which you have said is a smear. 

You might heed the proverb "it is better to remain silent and have people think you are ignorant, than to open your mouth and thus remove all doubt that you are."

Originally posted by websitejack
Fact #1: Homosexual marriages are short lived.

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Since only one state, Vermont, recognizes queer unions, and another, Hawaii, kind of does, he has no data.  As for historically---sure!  Due to oppression, not unlike slavery facilitating the pathology common in many impoverished African-American families.  

Fact #2: Studies show homosexual marriage is hazardous to one's health.

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Disease statistics and nothing else.  It's a smear not unlike Hitler's calling syphillis a "Jewish disease" in Mein Kampf

Fact #3: Homosexual marriage has the highest rate of domestic violence.

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He excluded heterosexuals living together which is higher than gays & lesbians or married hets. 

Fact #4: Homosexual domestic violence is a larger problem than gay bashing.

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Basically true as is heterosexual domestic violence.  should we then ban marriage for hets?  Stats are inconclusive as both DV and bashings are underreported.

Fact #5: Homosexuals make poor parents.

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No data, just conjecture.

This guy's only a hired gun for the Religious Reich.  He's kind of like the hired gun doctor who testified when I was on a jury on a worker's comp case.  The plaintiff insisted she was in constant back pain.  the defense called a doctor who testifies frequently, his fees paid by insurance companies.  He said the plaintiff "had nothing wrong with her back".

Originally posted by Jerry Smith
"harsh"? Try non-factual. Try arrant non-sense. Or fabrication. Call it false witness if you like. Calling that "harsh" is like calling Hitler "misguided".

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Jerry,

So if I believe that homosexual behavior is harmful, that make me bad?

Originally posted by quizzler
This is about whether homosexuality, an immoral sexual act that some people do, should be an appropriate criteria for marraige.

This still revolves around a perverted sexual act. 

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So, when heteros apply for a marriage license, do they get asked "what sexual positions do you emply?"  Ooops I probably shouldn't have said that, or some of the hatemongers will decide they need to do this and deny licenses to anyone who does not exclusively use the missionary position.  I am sure an Alabama legislator is ready to introduce a bill to this effect even as we speak.

Originally posted by websitejack
Chris

Ok, the "Homosexuals make poor parents" is harsh... but are you saying that homosexual behavior is a Christian thing?

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I can only speak for myself, not other queers.  I've been 'married' in a ceremony though not legal and it included three Christian clergy, Bible reading, and religious music.  We try to be loving and kind to one another and the children and to grow in faith.  I certainly see no conflict whatsoever in loving my wife, including going downtown, and being a good Christian.

Both heterosexual and homosexual families have problems with promiscuity, substance abuse, and DV.  Those are separate issues from what sexual orientation a person is.

Originally posted by Texas Lynn

Fact #2: Studies show homosexual marriage is hazardous to one's health.

Disease statistics and nothing else.  It's a smear not unlike Hitler's calling syphillis a "Jewish disease" in Mein Kampf

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Without going into graphic details...the act of sodomy is not a healthy practice.

Pointing that out does not a Hitler make.

Homosexual marriage != sodomy. So, #2 is still a lie. Right along with the rest of the lies.