Should the poor pay more taxes to fund tax breaks for the rich? (Romney tax plan)

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Publius

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:amen: Preach it, bro. Hard work and profit go hand in hand. "All hard work brings a profit but mere talk leads to poverty."-Proverbs 14:23

"The sluggard craves and gets nothing, but the desires of the diligent are fully satisfied."-Proverbs 13:4 NIV

So the "mere talkers" whine about what other have and think their lives will improve if Big Brother socks it to 'em.:sorry:

Wealth is never punished in the Bible.

Poverty, on the other hand, is divided in two categories: those who are poor due to circumstances beyond their control and those who are poor as the result of sin, laziness, or irresponsibility.

Any time in scripture we see a command to help the poor, it's always in reference to that first category, while the second category is always rebuked. In fact, the Bible even says in 2 Thess 3:10 that we are not to help them.
 
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conamer

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Wealth is never punished in the Bible.

Poverty, on the other hand, is divided in two categories: those who are poor due to circumstances beyond their control and those who are poor as the result of sin, laziness, or irresponsibility.

Any time in scripture we see a command to help the poor, it's always in reference to that first category, while the second category is always rebuked. In fact, the Bible even says in 2 Thess 3:10 that we are not to help them.
And in verse 9 Paul says that they worked their tails off and had a right to such help but wanted to set an example.
"If a man will not work, he shall not eat."
Yes, it's a form of correction. "He who ignores disciple comes to shame, but he who heeds correction is honored."Proverbs 13:18:thumbsup:
 
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275px-U.S._Distribution_of_Wealth%2C_2007.jpg

from wikipedia

Percentiles Ranked by AGI
Percentage of Federal Personal Income Tax Paid

Top 1%
36.73

Top 5%
58.66

Top 10%
70.47

Top 25%
87.30

Top 50%
97.75

Bottom 50%
2.25

from National Taxpayers Union - Who Pays Income Taxes?
 
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jpcedotal

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just how much exactly do the poor pay in taxes? Everyone I know get it all back at the end of the year...even lower middle class folks get almost all of their tax money back.

A little fact checking could do wonders for some of ya'll.
 
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Assuredcw

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Should the poor pay more taxes to fund tax breaks for the rich? (Romney tax plan)

No, they shouldn't, and they need to drag themselves out to the polls if they have to mortgage their homes to do it (to get the bus or cab fare, to get the birth certificate, to get the drivers license or state ID, etc, etc).
 
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Assuredcw

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You are entitled to your opinion, but progressive taxation (taxing the wealthy a higher rate than the middle class and poor) has been the norm up until the ridiculous 15% Capital Gains rate came into being. It's not fair -- it undermines the entire progressive taxation system, which expects more from those who have more resources.

That didn't USED to be "Going after the rich just because they are rich and punishing them." For some reason people are trying to make progressive taxation to be some form of punishment, and are doubling down on the idea of charging lower-income people a HIGHER rate. That's even worse than a flat tax, because poor and middle class people have considerably less disposable income (than wealthy people), and a flat tax would cut into what they had left to live on. You can see from this that charging them a HIGHER rate would therefore be unconscionable.
 
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Assuredcw

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Of course not, the poor people should just lie around and drink beer, smoke dope and suck up all the government resources. Put all the taxes on those of us that have worked most of our lives to get ahead.

:confused:

With all due respect, it's still not a reason to charge the poor a HIGHER tax rate. It's apples and oranges.
 
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conamer

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You are entitled to your opinion, but progressive taxation (taxing the wealthy a higher rate than the middle class and poor) has been the norm up until the ridiculous 15% Capital Gains rate came into being. It's not fair -- it undermines the entire progressive taxation system, which expects more from those who have more resources.

That didn't USED to be "Going after the rich just because they are rich and punishing them." For some reason people are trying to make progressive taxation to be some form of punishment, and are doubling down on the idea of charging lower-income people a HIGHER rate. That's even worse than a flat tax, because poor and middle class people have considerably less disposable income (than wealthy people), and a flat tax would cut into what they had left to live on. You can see from this that charging them a HIGHER rate would therefore be unconscionable.

When Obama was told on ABC in an interview raising the capital gains tax doesn't increase revenue(which many would think that is the reason to do it) Obama said it was about fairness. So there you have it, taking what isn't yours for no good reason is "fair". I call it theft.

If a person is paying no income tax or gets more money back they are going to vote for other people to keep getting socked and they still stay poor.


Liberals love the poor so much they make more of them.
 
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mandelduke

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When Obama was told on ABC in an interview raising the capital gains tax doesn't increase revenue(which many would think that is the reason to do it) Obama said it was about fairness. So there you have it, taking what isn't yours for no good reason is "fair". I call it theft.

If a person is paying no income tax or gets more money back they are going to vote for other people to keep getting socked and they still stay poor.


Liberals love the poor so much they make more of them.

Tell me it’s not so, does this mean the liberals won’t be getting 40 Acres and a Mule?
 
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Assuredcw

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When Obama was told on ABC in an interview raising the capital gains tax doesn't increase revenue(which many would think that is the reason to do it) Obama said it was about fairness. So there you have it, taking what isn't yours for no good reason is "fair". I call it theft.

If a person is paying no income tax or gets more money back they are going to vote for other people to keep getting socked and they still stay poor.


Liberals love the poor so much they make more of them.

President Obama disagrees with you. He thought the original progressive system of taxation was "fair." You, on the other hand, seem to have developed amnesia, and seem to think that President Obama INVENTED the progressive system of taxation, and that no one ever heard of it before he started talking about it. It only makes sense, if you think that your fellow posters were born yesterday (I don't mean to be rude, but that's what it feels like), and believe you that it was his idea. But it wasn't, and his disagreement with the Capital Gains tax (which is lower than what the vast majority of us pay, and is a "new" tax) is a valid one. It certainly wouldn't be "Exhibit A" on why Obama isn't qualified to be President, as though this is proof of his incompetence, because plenty of people agree with him. Our original system of taxation was progressive, and that is how many people would like it to stay.
 
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just how much exactly do the poor pay in taxes? Everyone I know get it all back at the end of the year...even lower middle class folks get almost all of their tax money back.

A little fact checking could do wonders for some of ya'll.

I posted figures right before you posted this. The wealth break down doesn't match up perfectly, but close enough to get the picture. The bottom 40% of the population has 0.2% of the wealth and the bottom 50% pays 2.25% of income taxes (more if you factor in other taxes)

The top 1% own 34.6% of the wealth and pay 36.73% of income taxes.
 
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Thekla

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[serious];61145200 said:
I posted figures right before you posted this. The wealth break down doesn't match up perfectly, but close enough to get the picture. The bottom 40% of the population has 0.2% of the wealth and the bottom 50% pays 2.25% of income taxes (more if you factor in other taxes)

The top 1% own 34.6% of the wealth and pay 36.73% of income taxes.


Tax rates at the very top income groups begin to match the percentage paid of the lowest income groups.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/08/11/b...-tax-returns-common-sense.html?pagewanted=all

Incomes in the middle class have been stagnant for decades; if wages had kept pace with increases in productivity, the lower and middle classes would be making a more substantial contribution in dollars contributed through tax.

I think this latter point is a symptom of a change in large-business mindset; the present focus is on quarterly profits to the detriment of long-term growth models and investment. In fact because of this phenomenon, many US corporations failed to properly invest in re-tooling and infrastructure and lost their competitive advantage in the world markets.

There was the more recent refocus on "financialization" (GM's finance arm, iirc about 30% of pharmaceutical investment is in finance/speculation, etc.).
Small business tends to the more 'old fashioned' focus and are more typically locally/community based unlike the large players where a minimum of the corp. actually "lives in" and is committed to the local community.

A small and/or community based business is also more likely to be interested in the well-being of their employees - who are also their neighbors.
 
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As for rates, I am mindful of the "widow's mite", and imo there is a lesson here for the secular realm as well.

That's a great analogy. as my post here shows, the poorest among us are asked to give disproportionately to their wealth. No one should be complaining how the poor aren't pulling their weight.
 
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