Re-Evaluating Rapture Theology

interpreter said:

I ripped the writings of Paul from my Bible. He was also wrong about us being saved entirely by grace and faith. We are told in the Revelation that in the final judgemnt we are judged according to our works.
Again, I challenge you to come up with one instance of Jesus mentioning a rapture.

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it's not Paul's imagination interpreter.
it is poeple's imagination about Paul's words.

people get it wrong....not Paul.

i'm not sure if you believe in a future coming of Christ...
but we mostly all do.

when Christ does come in the future,
He will bring the dead in Christ from heaven to earth,
and raise them here....
He will then gather together His election
who are alive and remain unto His coming.

Jesus taught that too.
as does John.
so i really don't get your theory that it was Paul's imagination?

true

zeke37 said:

it's not Paul's imagination interpreter.
it is poeple's imagination about Paul's words.

people get it wrong....not Paul.

i'm not sure if you believe in a future coming of Christ...
but we mostly all do.

when Christ does come in the future,
He will bring the dead in Christ from heaven to earth,
and raise them here....
He will then gather together His election
who are alive and remain unto His coming.

Jesus taught that too.
as does John.
so i really don't get your theory that it was Paul's imagination?

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The second coming was in 312AD when the sign of the Son of Man appeared in the clouds, and Jesus came into power through St. Constantine who rode a white horse and conquered with a bow. There was no rapture. Instead, Constantine sent his messengers with a trumpet and gathered all the Church together to Nicea.

interpreter said:

The second coming was in 312AD when the sign of the Son of Man appeared in the clouds, and Jesus came into power through St. Constantine who rode a white horse and conquered with a bow.

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balogna.

There was no rapture.

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not yet.

Instead, Constantine sent his messengers with a trumpet and gathered all the Church together to Nicea.

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and? how was the the worst time in history ever?

the "gathering to Christ" happens after the "dead are raised".
the dead are part of that gathering.

and the dead are not walking around today.

so your theory is bunk.
you sir, are simply incorrect.

you ripping out Paul's writings, makes it quite apparent
that you do not believe in the NT as being inspired by God.

It is amazing what church people believe when others do their thinking for them.

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vinsight4u said:

What exactly is Sharia law?

What would a country have to do in order to be following it?

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I don't know all the details but I'm pretty sure it forbids any public display of affection such as holding hands. Also a woman is not allowed to be seen walking with a man unless they are married. Of course women have to cover all their hair. Women are not allowed to have jobs or drive cars. Nobody is allowed to eat pork. Nobody is allowed to borrow money. Nobody is allowed to post photos in their home. Everybody has to pray five times a day. Nobody is allowed to have a dog as a pet. And punishments are brutal.

And um... why are you asking? Did you accidentally post to the wrong thread?

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Sharia law is never going to happen in western nations.

There are some very strange rules in Islam. Of course not all Muslims follow all the rules as strictly as others. Some Muslims have no problems with dogs or pictures, but others do. It's my understanding that Sharia law is typically very strict. So much so that even most Muslims would not want it.

Either way Dan, and Revelation is clear over and over again stating that the Antichrist will overpower the Christians in war, and "behead" them (except for the 144,000)

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Just as a side note; I noticed that the twelve tribes mentioned are nevr mentioned in that order before. That in fact, of the three or so times that the twelve tribes ARE mentioned they are never the same.
I counted all the tribes and there are 15 mentioned as there are 15 Apostles mentioned.
Interesting, huh?

it seems there are 14 tribes total...where do you see the 15th?
1Chr12 details more than any other scripture, and 14 are mentioned.
infact, never is more than 14 mentioned.

Judah
Simeon
Levi
Benj.
Ephraim
Man East
Issachar
Zebulon
Nephtali
Dan
Asher
Reuben
Gad
Man West

here is a great appendix on the tribes.
The Order and Grouping of the Twelve Tribes. - Appendix to the Companion Bible

HeavensWorship said:

Obviously you are not saved neither do you know how to get saved. Salvation comes by faith alone. Jesus also teaches this saying that the "work" that you need to do to be saved is to simply believe. You might as well rip Jesus teachings from the bible as well because it is in agreement with Paul, rather vice-verse.

There are many types of judgments. The one you refer to in Revelation is the judgment of the saved. NOT the judgment of all people.

regarding your position on the rapture. I think we are on the same page. if you read my previous posts you will notice that.

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No, I am refering to the judgment of all people in the final judgment, the great white throne judgment of the dead. We will all be judged according to our works, despite what Paul taught.
Are we agreed that the "rapture" is a figment of Paul's imagination?

zeke37 said:

balogna.


not yet.


and? how was the the worst time in history ever?

the "gathering to Christ" happens after the "dead are raised".
the dead are part of that gathering.

and the dead are not walking around today.

so your theory is bunk.
you sir, are simply incorrect.

you ripping out Paul's writings, makes it quite apparent
that you do not believe in the NT as being inspired by God.

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Jesus did not say that the dead will be gathered together at His second coming, only the Church that was alive at he time. The Nicene Council gave us the Nicene Creed which does not mention the rapture.

Those in the Ark were Taken- taken up, as we are Taken- taken up-Rapture...Deuteronomy 4:20, Acts 1:2, Acts 1:9, Acts 1:11


Genesis 8:4 as Noahs Ark Rested on the Mountains after (the 7th month) and the Bride of Christ Rapture to the New Jerusalem (Heaven) above the Wrath that's in (the 7 year) Tribulation. As the Righteous in Noahs ark were Lifted up above, over all the Tribulation- Wrath on Earth was under their feet. Also in the Rapture- We are Lifted up above, over all the Tribulation- Wrath on Earth (under us) Psalm 47:3 (under our feet) Psalm 47:1-9

Read the Holy Bible king james version (KJV) The proper word is eagles be gathered together Luke 17:37

Luke 17

26And as it was in the days of Noe, so shall it be also in the days of the Son of man.
27They did eat, they drank, they married wives, they were given in marriage, [SIZE=+0]until[/SIZE] the day that Noah entered into the ark, and the flood came, and destroyed them all.
28Likewise also as it was in the days of Lot; they did eat, they drank, they bought, they sold, they planted, they builded;
29But the same day that Lot went out of Sodom it rained fire and brimstone from heaven, and destroyed them all.
30Even thus shall it be in the day when the Son of man is revealed.
31In that day, he which shall be upon the housetop, and his stuff in the house, let him not come down to take it away: and he that is in the field, let him likewise not return back.
32Remember Lot's wife.
33Whosoever shall seek to save his life shall lose it; and whosoever shall lose his life shall preserve it.
34I tell you, in that night there shall be two men in one bed; the one shall be taken, and the other shall be left.
35Two women shall be grinding together; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
36Two men shall be in the field; the one shall be taken, and the other left.
37And they answered and said unto him, Where, Lord? And he said unto them, Wheresoever the body is, thither will the eagles be gathered together.

Exodus 19:4
Ye have seen what I did unto the Egyptians, and how I bare you on eagles' wings, and brought you unto myself.


Isaiah 40:31
But they that wait upon the LORD shall renew their strength; they shall mount up with wings as eagles; they shall run, and not be weary; and they shall walk, and not faint.

Those Left Behind experienced the Wrath (Tribulation) Almighty God rescued the Righteous (Noah, and his family! Lot, and his family) prior to his Judgment (Wrath) on those Left Behind.

One shall be taken (Rapture) and the other Left Behind Luke 17:35-36

Luke 17:35-36
Two women shall be grinding together (Working) the one shall be taken (Rapture) and the other left. (Left Behind- Tribulation)

36Two men shall be in the field (World) the one shall be taken (Rapture) and the other left. (Left Behind- Tribulation)

Just as us Saved, and Sealed Born Again (New Creatures 2 Corinthians 5:17)Rapture (lifteth up) before the Tribulation (Wrath)

Llifteth up the meek: as Now, and when we Rapture…

He casteth the wicked down to the ground) as the Meek, are (lifteth up (Rapture)

Psalm 147:6
The LORD (lifteth up the meek) he casteth the wicked down to the ground.

One taken (Rapture) the other (Left Behind in Tribulation)

Don’t Be Left Behind…

Taken- taken up

Deuteronomy 4:20
But the LORD hath taken you, and brought you forth out of the iron furnace, even out of Egypt, to be unto him a people of inheritance, as ye are this day.

Acts 1:2
Until the day in which he was taken up, after that he through the Holy Ghost had given commandments unto the apostles whom he had chosen:

Acts 1:9
And when he had spoken these things, while they beheld, he was taken up; and a cloud received him out of their sight.


Acts 1:11
Which also said, Ye men of Galilee, why stand ye gazing up into heaven? this same Jesus, which is taken up from you into heaven, shall so come in like manner as ye have seen him go into heaven.

Acts 1:22
Beginning from the baptism of John, unto that same day that he was taken up from us, must one be ordained to be a witness with us of his resurrection.

King Jesus Christ of Nazareth is LORD...



Kind Regards,

Reference:
raptureprophecy.net

interpreter said:

Jesus did not say that the dead will be gathered together at His second coming, only the Church that was alive at he time. The Nicene Council gave us the Nicene Creed which does not mention the rapture.

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Jesus said that the dead would be raised on the last day.
Jesus said that he will gathger the elect from heaven and earth, after the tribulation of those days.
and you could never convince me that the worst time in history was during the first century.

Paul taught the same things as Jesus.

the word "raptrure" does not mean a PRE tribulation rapture.
that is a figment of peoples imagination,
much like your constant proposal that the gathering to Christ happened in the first century.

it means a "seizing" to Christ at His Coming.

Zec14 describes this too.

interpreter said:

Jesus did not say that the dead will be gathered together at His second coming, only the Church that was alive at he time. The Nicene Council gave us the Nicene Creed which does not mention the rapture.

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the Nicene Creed designers believed that Paul was inspired and included His works in the Holy Writ.

but since you don't believe paul, i guess by proxi you don't believe in the Nicene Creed.

Why are you on this sub forum then?