W London presentation on amazing things happenen in Africa

This Sat. (10th) at 6pm at the West London Revival bookshop hall, 4-6 hanworth Rd, central Hounslow a pastor will be reporting on how churches are being established in many African countries lately.

I just thought someone might be interested.

Do you know who the pastor is?

Yes, his name is Ron Carslake. I spent a couple of weeks with him ansd a local pastor in NW Zambia, visiting small churches in the villages.

Noelle_Faith said:

Do you know who the pastor is?

Click to expand...

You probably won't have heard of him, he hasnt written any books or done any TV. His ministry is among people that don't have these things!

This gives a different outlook on life. We live in a Western bubble!

I hope you come along.

We heard & saw how former witch doctors have become "prophets" who prophesy for reward in churches that preach "the prosperity gospel" and attribute physical illnesses to demons. Our ministry is to free prople from these concepts through the original gospel.
+ help on a practical level by helping contruct buildings for schools and "cash crops".

More at the same location from 13:30 tomorrow and prior to that at 11am at the hall above Boots, Harrow & Wealdstone HP2 6EF

Well as long as they're not forcing people to convert before helping them i guess this is ok news.
Though i'd rather they dropped Jesus and religion from the equation and just helped them with out trying to convert them.

Genersis said:

Well as long as they're not forcing people to convert before helping them i guess this is ok news.

Click to expand...

I'm not convinced. These people are poorly educated and superstitious. This is a fertile ground for religion, as societies like this do tend to be very religious. Will they really be better off believing our myths over their own? Why should we export our tribalism over there when they have a bunch of it already?

Genersis said:

Though i'd rather they dropped Jesus and religion from the equation and just helped them with out trying to convert them.

Click to expand...

Doing good for the sake of doing good without ulterior motive? Perhaps we should suggest that to the preacher. It's possible he's never considered it.

uberd00b said:

I'm not convinced. These people are poorly educated and superstitious. This is a fertile ground for religion, as societies like this do tend to be very religious. Will they really be better off believing our myths over their own? Why should we export our tribalism over there when they have a bunch of it already?

Doing good for the sake of doing good without ulterior motive? Perhaps we should suggest that to the preacher. It's possible he's never considered it.

Click to expand...

Well that's true.
I strongly disagree with spreading religion through means that...well...low.

I just thought i'd at least say i'm glad they are doing something to help, as, if i didn't point that out i thought i'd probably get someone replying to me saying"But what about all the good that comes of it?"

I doubt the Preacher is so ignorant that he is unaware of helping just for the sake of helping, with it not being in the name of religion. But you never know.
He'll probably see including religion as the better option though, due to personal convictions.

[Genersis]
He'll probably see including religion as the better option though, due to personal convictions.

Click to expand...

Given the fact that most people, perhaps even you, will never embark on a journey across seas to a desolate and dangerous land to help fund school projects, set up food distribution links, help with medical supplies and implementation etc... why on earth does someone, because of their own petty little grievances, play this role (rather ironically in an almost pious way) as some form of anti-religious police officer? Claiming some moral high ground about not bringing a person's faith into the equation, when that person is doing more to help his fellow man than you or I combined.

It stinks of self-righteousness. When you have helped as many people as Christians have in some of the poorest parts of the world, then perhaps your ignorance will be somewhat justified. Until then continue to pontificate from your tower about how sad it is to see a man or woman of God wanting to both help and share the GOOD NEWS to those who desperately need it..... Perhaps I should use the "sigh" emoticon..

non-religious said:

Given the fact that most people, perhaps even you, will never embark on a journey across seas to a desolate and dangerous land to help fund school projects, set up food distribution links, help with medical supplies and implementation etc... why on earth does someone, because of their own petty little grievances, play this role (rather ironically in an almost pious way) as some form of anti-religious police officer? Claiming some moral high ground about not bringing a person's faith into the equation, when that person is doing more to help his fellow man than you or I combined.

It stinks of self-righteousness. When you have helped as many people as Christians have in some of the poorest parts of the world, then perhaps your ignorance will be somewhat justified. Until then continue to pontificate from your tower about how sad it is to see a man or woman of God wanting to both help and share the GOOD NEWS to those who desperately need it..... Perhaps I should use the "sigh" emoticon..

Click to expand...

As i said already, I am grateful for the good things that Christians do in poverty stricken areas.
But plenty of people also do such things without bringing their personal beliefs into it.

I'm sorry.
But surely the money is better spent helping these people by building schools, and teaching them how to grow crops and that, rather than a sizeable portion of it going towards the construction and stocking of a church for them to attend for a religion they have most likely never heard of?

All because they do such great deeds doesn't mean they are above being Criticized.

Genersis said:

As i said already, I am grateful for the good things that Christians do in poverty stricken areas.
But plenty of people also do such things without bringing their personal beliefs into it.

I'm sorry.
But surely the money is better spent helping these people by building schools, and teaching them how to grow crops and that, rather than a sizeable portion of it going towards the construction and stocking of a church for them to attend for a religion they have most likely never heard of?

All because they do such great deeds doesn't mean they are above being Criticized.

Click to expand...

I agree with you, and I say that as a Christian.

non-religious said:

Hence the reason I listed setting up food distribution links (that would include the growing of crops) bringing medical supplies, setting up clinics, schools etc....

Never once did I mention giving money to fund a church. I would also put it to you, that all of the above, if done by Christians (I also never stated that non-Christians do not work for charities) would someone how offend you. Perhaps you should try reading my post a little bit more thoroughly before making incorrect statements not attributed to me....

Click to expand...

I see.
I made this mistake because what i was criticizing was the spreading of religion through these endeavours when i felt the money could be better spent leaving such out. This includes the building of churches and the like.
When you replied to my post, i assumed you were defending such.
Apologies.

And i never said that you said the Non-religious don't work for charities. It's just seemed worthy of bringing up to show that you can be charitable without a religion.

And no. I don't take offence to people of faith performing charitable acts.
It's just when they do it with a secondary motive to convert them to their religion i find is more than a little distasteful, especially when it wastes money.
Sure they can mention their religion and beliefs if they wish on a personal basses. But to build a church and give out bibles and the like to people who can't exactly say no as they need the help is, in my opinion, taking advantage of the needy. Preaching to people who don't have a choice in listening to them.
Perhaps you see this differently though?

[Genersis]
Sure they can mention their religion and beliefs if they wish on a personal basses. But to build a church and give out bibles and the like to people who can't exactly say no as they need the help is, in my opinion, taking advantage of the needy. Preaching to people who don't have a choice in listening to them.
Perhaps you see this differently though?

Click to expand...

I agree with this