The Temple HAS to be rebuilt

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

NJBeliever said:
To quote Jesus Christ our Lord:

Mark 13: 14But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

So (according to you) Jesus is saying to His disciples "when you see the abomination of desolation standing inside of YOU then run to the mountains."

So the antichrist will be indwelling inside Christians??? That doesn't remotely make sense.

Which was first, the gospels or Corinthians. There was a literal temple in Jerusalem but it was destroyed. There is nothing wrong with the scriptures given. Our bodies is the temple of God. That is a true statement.

If you are looking for the Antichrist in a literal Jewish temple then you won't find him. The very idea of this was invented to hide the identity of the Antichrist and that is why I keep telling folks to research for themselves people like Francisco Ribera who contributed very greatly to what Futurist believe today. His role was to conceal the Antichrist. In his day many knew exactly who it was.

Biblewriter · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
Jen, Futurism is dangerous. You should look up Francisco Ribera who contributed greatly to futurism and understand why and how he came up with many of his futuristic ideas.

Your understanding of the history of Church doctrine is seriously flawed. Both of the two earliest known Christian commentators on Bible prophecy were futurists. These were Papias and Irenaeus. By the fourth century, when these ideas had been replaced by replacement theology, Eusebius complained about the "many" early Christian writers who had followed the (as he considered) erroneous ideas of Papias and Irenaeus.

So futurism most certainly did not begin with Ribera.

No prophecy states that there will be a temple built before the return of the Messiah. But several prophecies explicitly refer to a destruction of the temple and a bringing an end to sacrifices that will be made by an individual who has not yet appeared on the scene. He could not destroy something that was not there, and he could not bring an end to a practice that was not taking place. So we know that a temple will be rebuilt, and that non-christian Jews will offer sacrifices in it. But this will be dine in unbelief in the gospel of Christ. This will be a thoroughly Jewish temple and thoroughly Jewish worship.

But to deny that there will be a future temple, recognized by God, and that there will be animal sacrifices offered in it, is to deny explicitly stated scripture. Ezekiel 40-43 describe in great detail a temple unlike anything that has ever been built. Then Ezekiel 43:7 says, "And He said to me, 'Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel forever. No more shall the house of Israel defile My holy name, they nor their kings, by their harlotry or with the carcasses of their kings on their high places.'"

This is followed by a detailed account of the altar in this temple,which goes from Ezekiel 43:13-17. Then begins a detailed instruction for the offerings to be offered to cleanse this altar in Ezekiel 43:18-27. Then Ezekiel 44:10-28 gives detailed instructions for the priesthood in this future temple. Finally, Ezekiel 45:13-46:13 gives a detailed instruction for the offerings to be offered on the altar in this new temple. These offerings are distinctly different from the offerings described in the law of Moses.

To deny that all this will happen, and that God will recognize it, is to deny explicitly stated scripture.

Now many say that this cannot happen, because the sacrifice of Jesus did away with all other sacrifice. But this is using human reasoning to do away with explicitly stated scripture.

This will not be a return to the law of Moses, for the sacrifices detailed here are distinctly different from those specified in the law.

Our breaking of bread, often called the communion service looks back to the offering Jesus made on the cross. In like manner, the Old Testament sacrifices looked forward to this same offering. The millennial sacrifices will also look back to the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross.

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

Biblewriter said:
Your understanding of the history of Church doctrine is seriously flawed. Both of the two earliest known Christian commentators on Bible prophecy were futurists. These were Papias and Irenaeus. By the fourth century, when these ideas had been replaced by replacement theology, Eusebius complained about the "many" early Christian writers who had followed the (as he considered) erroneous ideas of Papias and Irenaeus.

So futurism most certainly did not begin with Ribera.

No prophecy states that there will be a temple built before the return of the Messiah. But several prophecies explicitly refer to a destruction of the temple and a bringing an end to sacrifices that will be made by an individual who has not yet appeared on the scene. He could not destroy something that was not there, and he could not bring an end to a practice that was not taking place. So we know that a temple will be rebuilt, and that non-christian Jews will offer sacrifices in it. But this will be dine in unbelief in the gospel of Christ. This will be a thoroughly Jewish temple and thoroughly Jewish worship.

But to deny that there will be a future temple, recognized by God, and that there will be animal sacrifices offered in it, is to deny explicitly stated scripture. Ezekiel 40-43 describe in great detail a temple unlike anything that has ever been built. Then Ezekiel 43:7 says, "And He said to me, 'Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel forever. No more shall the house of Israel defile My holy name, they nor their kings, by their harlotry or with the carcasses of their kings on their high places.'"

This is followed by a detailed account of the altar in this temple,which goes from Ezekiel 43:13-17. Then begins a detailed instruction of the offerings to be offered to cleanse this altar in Ezekiel 43:18-27. Then Ezekiel 44:10-28 gives detailed instructions for the priesthood in this future temple. Finally, Ezekiel 45:13-46:13 gives a detailed instruction for the offerings to be offered on the altar in this new temple. These offerings are distinctly different from the offerings described in the law of Moses.

To deny that all this will happen, and that God will recognize it, is to deny explicitly stated scripture.

Now many say that this cannot happen, because the sacrifice of Jesus did away with all other sacrifice. But this is using human reasoning to do away with explicitly stated scripture.

This will not be a return to the law of Moses, for the sacrifices detailed here are distinctly different from those specified in the law.

Our breaking of bread, often called the communion service looks back to the offering Jesus made on the cross. In like manner, the Old Testament sacrifices looked forward to this same offering. The millennial sacrifices will also look back to the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross.

I never said Ribera started it because I know some of what he said did not come from him but he expanded, added and contributed greatly to what futurist believe today but for a particular reason. Because the truth was being easily seen. It is easy to be a futurist in the 4th century and earlier. At that time many prophecies would be in the future. There is a reason therefore why God told Daniel to seal the book until the time of the end. The knowledge that is being increased does not only apply to knowledge of science of technology but also knowledge of the book of Daniel itself. We are supposed to understand the book of Daniel much much better than anyone who lived in the 4th century. That is because we have allot of history behind us to help us follow through with bible prophecy. All people like Rebera did was cause people to forget about what is going on currently around them and keep looking in the future for what is before their very eyes. Even wikipedia says it straight out.

ivebeenshown · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
Your assumption is incorrect. Please point me to the scripture and also evidence that somehow after the 70 year cut of point the time is suppose to increase 7fold. This does not sound ordinary. How is it that Leviticus is contributing so greatly to a time prophecy in Ezekiel noting the fact that Leviticus was written first and therefore Moses would have had no knowledge of such prophecy.

Don't mind my analysis but in order for us to have this idea we have 2 do 2 strange things to bible time prophecy. We must insert an indefinite huge gap between one and then increase the duration of the other after the prophecy already began. So in essence these time prophecies are longer than the stated time.

Leviticus 26. It is about not worshipping other gods, or carved stone idols, and how if after God does all these great things for Israel, they do not listen to him, he will punish them for their sins seven times over.

To deny this 'time prophecy' is to write off the release of their captivity in Babylon up until 1948, which so happens to match this concept EXACTLY. I do not see any mere coincidence here. Also, there is no 'indefinite huge gap' here. The timeline is very definite. About 606BC to 536BC, seventy years captivity, ending in release and an order from the Persian conqueror to rebuild their temple. 536BC to 1948AD, their remaining 360 years but SEVENFOLD because after God saw to it they were free *yet again* and able to rebuild their temple, they IMMEDIATELY continued go sin against God.

Then we wrap up before Jesus, with the book of Isaiah, about how the people are just direspectful and not listening to God and pleasing him, and the prophecy of John the Baptist and Jesus and the plan for salvation, including that the Jews would deny the messiah.

Also, WHY would Moses have to have knowledge of the Ezekiel prophecy? It's entirely possible he COULD have and we don't know, and also, Moses wrote the LAW of God for the people. That's like saying when Paul talks about how we are not bound by the law, but rather are to fulfill it, that he is talking about some other law and not the law of Moses, since he wrote those segments well after Moses wrote the law.

Please confirm whether or not you feel the time period from 536BC to 1948AD is a mere coincidence and bears no effect of the scriptures...

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 5, 2010

Originally Posted by PROPHECYKID Jen, Futurism is dangerous. You should look up Francisco Ribera who contributed greatly to futurism and understand why and how he came up with many of his futuristic ideas.

What would then say about Preterism?

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

LittleLambofJesus said:
What would then say about Preterism?

The same effect. By looking at everything as being past you cannot scripture being fulfilled in the present.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
The same effect. By looking at everything as being past you cannot scripture being fulfilled in the present.

Interesting

Btw, what is the view of SDAs concerning Matt 24 being fulfilled? Thanks :wave:

http://www.christianforums.com/t7392923/

NJBeliever · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
Which was first, the gospels or Corinthians. There was a literal temple in Jerusalem but it was destroyed. There is nothing wrong with the scriptures given. Our bodies is the temple of God. That is a true statement.

If you are looking for the Antichrist in a literal Jewish temple then you won't find him. The very idea of this was invented to hide the identity of the Antichrist and that is why I keep telling folks to research for themselves people like Francisco Ribera who contributed very greatly to what Futurist believe today. His role was to conceal the Antichrist. In his day many knew exactly who it was.

You didn't answer my question.

LittleLambofJesus · Aug 5, 2010

Originally Posted by PROPHECYKID Which was first, the gospels or Corinthians. There was a literal temple in Jerusalem but it was destroyed. There is nothing wrong with the scriptures given. Our bodies is the temple of God. That is a true statement.

Why do ya think it and Jerusalem were destroyed?

Luke 19:44 and they shall be leveling Thee and the offspring of Thee in Thee. And not they shall be leaving stone upon stone in Thee stead which not thou knew the time of the visitation of Thee.

Reve 14:8 And another Messenger, second-one follows saying "She falls, She falls, Babylon the Great, the out of the wine of the fury of the fornication of her she has given to drink all the nations".
[Jeremiah 51:8/Luke 19:44]

http://www.christianforums.com/t7164949-3/#post46105783
DO NOT WEEP!!!!! The Great City

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

NJBeliever said:
You didn't answer my question.

I'm sorry that I did not address your final question. Of course the Antichrist will not be standing inside anyone. The temple here means the church. Because in the church you will find the people of God. If you narrow it down to a specific temple that needs to be rebuilt you will be missing the meaning of the text. This is because the Antichrist will not be aiming to deceive those in the world although he will. He is not coming to deceive those who already believe in Jesus. Those who are already saved. If you are already lost then why deceive you. The Antichrist will target the church, he will target Christians. Because you cannot deceive the whole world meaning a vast majority if you do not deceive Christians.

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

LittleLambofJesus said:
Why do ya think it and Jerusalem were destroyed?

Luke 19:44 and they shall be leveling Thee and the offspring of Thee in Thee. And not they shall be leaving stone upon stone in Thee stead which not thou knew the time of the visitation of Thee.

Reve 14:8 And another Messenger, second-one follows saying "She falls, She falls, Babylon the Great, the out of the wine of the fury of the fornication of her she has given to drink all the nations".
[Jeremiah 51:8/Luke 19:44]

http://www.christianforums.com/t7164949-3/#post46105783
DO NOT WEEP!!!!! The Great City

Because the Jews did not accept Christ and there appointed time was up. Notice Jesus had already said that the temple was desolate, meaning that God had already removed his presence.

Mat 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
Mat 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Then in Matthew 24 he tells them that the temple will be destroyed.

Mat 24:1 And Jesus went out, and departed from the temple: and his disciples came to him for to shew him the buildings of the temple.
Mat 24:2 And Jesus said unto them, See ye not all these things? verily I say unto you, There shall not be left here one stone upon another, that shall not be thrown down.

Now in the 70 week prophecy of Daniel 9 it says in verse 27...

Dan 9:27 And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured upon the desolate.

Note here he is making it desolate because of the overspreading of abominations. Now notice Matthew 23 and check out the what led to Jesus pronouncing that their house will be left desolate.

Mat 23:33 Ye serpents, ye generation of vipers, how can ye escape the damnation of hell?
Mat 23:34 Wherefore, behold, I send unto you prophets, and wise men, and scribes: and some of them ye shall kill and crucify; and some of them shall ye scourge in your synagogues, and persecute them from city to city:
Mat 23:35 That upon you may come all the righteous blood shed upon the earth, from the blood of righteous Abel unto the blood of Zacharias son of Barachias, whom ye slew between the temple and the altar.
Mat 23:36 Verily I say unto you, All these things shall come upon this generation.
Mat 23:37 O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!
Mat 23:38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

It seems here like Jesus is saying that he is tired of there constant rebellion and many sins therefore there house if left desolate. And just as in Matthew 24 he starts speaking about the destruction just so the 70 week prophecy ends by stating that the determined (destruction) will be poured out on the desolater. The desolater here is Jerusalem because they are the ones who caused the desolation.

NJBeliever · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
I'm sorry that I did not address your final question. Of course the Antichrist will not be standing inside anyone. The temple here means the church. Because in the church you will find the people of God. If you narrow it down to a specific temple that needs to be rebuilt you will be missing the meaning of the text. This is because the Antichrist will not be aiming to deceive those in the world although he will. He is not coming to deceive those who already believe in Jesus. Those who are already saved. If you are already lost then why deceive you. The Antichrist will target the church, he will target Christians. Because you cannot deceive the whole world meaning a vast majority if you do not deceive Christians.

Where is the BIblical verses that say the Church is the temple of God?

Why would Jesus say run when the abomination is already standing where it out not to be as if their lives are in danger? Is the antichrist deceiving Christians or killing them?

Why should we even worry about deception when the Bible makes it clear that the grand delusion will only happen to the lost? No Christian will ever be deceived by the antichrist.

zeke37 · Aug 5, 2010

NJBeliever said:
To quote Jesus Christ our Lord:

Mark 13: 14But when ye shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, standing where it ought not, (let him that readeth understand,) then let them that be in Judaea flee to the mountains:

So (according to you) Jesus is saying to His disciples "when you see the abomination of desolation standing inside of YOU then run to the mountains."

So the antichrist will be indwelling inside Christians??? That doesn't remotely make sense.

of course it makes sense Brother...

the seduction of the potential bride of Christ...
harlots or virgins...
which will you be?

Satan seduces/beguiles/deceives/gets folks to worship him
as Christ returned...

did you not read the temple quotes? is the temple of God TODAY made up of morter and brick?

IMO the scriptures do not tell of a physical new temple,
until the Millennial one in Ez40-48

BrotherBob · Aug 5, 2010

I guess the anti-Christ can stand in the dome of the rock and declare
himself god.

zeke37 · Aug 5, 2010

Biblewriter said:
No prophecy states that there will be a temple built before the return of the Messiah. But several prophecies explicitly refer to a destruction of the temple and a bringing an end to sacrifices that will be made by an individual who has not yet appeared on the scene.

HI

ok

He could not destroy something that was not there, and he could not bring an end to a practice that was not taking place.

ok ...but "destroy" is not really mentioned, just assumed...
he will "defile" the temple

and there are sacrifices to God today...not in animal killings tho.
Christ put an end to all blood ordinances, including blood sacrifice
God will not "sanctify" the blood of animals in the Millennium, or the trib

God desires our love and prayers...not the blood of animals.
to think that God would re-instate such, is short sighted
and does not take into consideration many other scriptures,
including the vast majority of the NT

so the end time temple is "us" Christians
and the sacrifices that the end time bad guy stops,
will be our prayers to God,...seduction...beguilement

for he sit in the temple of God,
showing that he is God,
and everything called God

when Christians worship the false lamb instead of Christ,
then that is what the abomination of desolation is,
and that happens in us/the temple

in all but the very elect witnesses...they are faithful virgins

the rest are apostate and worshiping another..seduced

there is no pretrib rapture

So we know that a temple will be rebuilt,

no we do not...there is already a temple today...and you are part of it

and that non-christian Jews will offer sacrifices in it.

again, no....just symbolism...
or all Christ did would have been in vain
(if we or anyone goes back to animal sacrifice)

But this will be dine in unbelief in the gospel of Christ. This will be a thoroughly Jewish temple and thoroughly Jewish worship.

nope....

But to deny that there will be a future temple, recognized by God, and that there will be animal sacrifices offered in it, is to deny explicitly stated scripture.

Ezekiel 40-43 describe in great detail a temple unlike anything that has ever been built. Then Ezekiel 43:7 says, "And He said to me, 'Son of man, this is the place of My throne and the place of the soles of My feet, where I will dwell in the midst of the children of Israel forever. No more shall the house of Israel defile My holy name, they nor their kings, by their harlotry or with the carcasses of their kings on their high places.'"

no it is not denial...but rather proper division

there will be no animal sacrifices in Ezekiel's Millennial temple
"we" are the "pillars in the temple" if we are faithful and overcome

"we" are the firstfruits, through which Christ shall teach/reign/rule many
"us" as firstfruits.....have nothing to do with animal sacrifices...
and "the faithful virgins/us who overcome" teach the others,
acc. to Rev5, Rev20 and Ez44

again, Christ put an end to that animal sacrifice (as accepted by God).
it will NOT be reinstated

This is followed by a detailed account of the altar in this temple,which goes from Ezekiel 43:13-17. Then begins a detailed instruction of the offerings to be offered to cleanse this altar in Ezekiel 43:18-27. Then Ezekiel 44:10-28 gives detailed instructions for the priesthood in this future temple. Finally, Ezekiel 45:13-46:13 gives a detailed instruction for the offerings to be offered on the altar in this new temple. These offerings are distinctly different from the offerings described in the law of Moses.

To deny that all this will happen, and that God will recognize it, is to deny explicitly stated scripture.

it is symbolism...of a sacrificial act, but not of animals...see Amos 8

Now many say that this cannot happen, because the sacrifice of Jesus did away with all other sacrifice. But this is using human reasoning to do away with explicitly stated scripture.

no, this has MANY scriptures explaining just that, both New Test. and Old.
YOU must now reconsile all scripture...
now, since we know that both are "explicite", which one would be literal, and which one would be symbolic?
I leave that to you to figrue out!
remember, no contradictions in the Word when properly divided

and you do believe in Christ's sacrifice right? I know you do

as the sacrificial Lamb of God, that takes away the sins of the WORLD?

This will not be a return to the law of Moses, for the sacrifices detailed here are distinctly different from those specified in the law.

Our breaking of bread, often called the communion service looks back to the offering Jesus made on the cross. In like manner, the Old Testament sacrifices looked forward to this same offering. The millennial sacrifices will also look back to the sacrifice Jesus made on the cross.

our communion is the sacrifice to God....that is what is stopped so to speak...
prayers and communion....as the world will soon be offering THESE to Satan in disguise,
instead of to the true Lamb and Father

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

Where is the BIblical verses that say the Church is the temple of God?

There is no scripture which says point blank that the Church is the temple of God. But if as we know every member of the Church is the temple of God then the church collectively can be looked at as the temple of God. The Antichrist will deceive the whole world meaning his influence will be worldwide. Putting him in a actual temple in Jerusalem is not really going to do it. God has already left the temple desolate and even if a new one is rebuilt it cannot be termed 'The temple of God' because God will not be dwelling there.

Why would Jesus say run when the abomination is already standing where it out not to be as if their lives are in danger? Is the antichrist deceiving Christians or killing them?

When you put the event in the future you will have this problem.

Luk 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
Luk 21:21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
Luk 21:22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

But if you look at the text simply and compare Luke's account with Matthews the answer is simple. Matthew says..

Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

The abomination comes from these armies being in the holy place where they ought not to be. If you know how Jerusalem was, there was a certain area around the city which was holy. These armies would therefore be compassed in this holy place around the city where they should not be. These are the armies which bring the destruction upon the city. If you are looking for an Antichrist to fulfill this prophecy you are looking the wrong place. Luke 21:22 tells us that this will happen to fulfill scripture. Which prophecy does these armies fulfill other than the 70 week prophecy?

Why should we even worry about deception when the Bible makes it clear that the grand delusion will only happen to the lost? No Christian will ever be deceived by the antichrist.

If you don't guard yourself you will be deceived. Think about it really. Why would Satan seek the deceive those who are already lost? What does he gain by that. The devil's attack is on the church and not those outside the church. He seeks to have us who are in Christ to leave and join his side, this the Antichrist is not going to be someone who Christians already don't like. The devil has never ever worked that way. Lets look at the text which speaks about the Antichrist again.

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

All I am going to ask is how can you fall away if you were never once there. This falling away is a falling away of Christians who got deceived. People who are lost cannot fall away for they have already fallen. Only saved people can fall away.

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

NJBeliever · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
There is no scripture which says point blank that the Church is the temple of God. But if as we know every member of the Church is the temple of God then the church collectively can be looked at as the temple of God. The Antichrist will deceive the whole world meaning his influence will be worldwide. Putting him in a actual temple in Jerusalem is not really going to do it. God has already left the temple desolate and even if a new one is rebuilt it cannot be termed 'The temple of God' because God will not be dwelling there.

When you put the event in the future you will have this problem.

Luk 21:20 And when ye shall see Jerusalem compassed with armies, then know that the desolation thereof is nigh.
Luk 21:21 Then let them which are in Judaea flee to the mountains; and let them which are in the midst of it depart out; and let not them that are in the countries enter thereinto.
Luk 21:22 For these be the days of vengeance, that all things which are written may be fulfilled.

But if you look at the text simply and compare Luke's account with Matthews the answer is simple. Matthew says..

Mat 24:15 When ye therefore shall see the abomination of desolation, spoken of by Daniel the prophet, stand in the holy place, (whoso readeth, let him understand

The abomination comes from these armies being in the holy place where they ought not to be. If you know how Jerusalem was, there was a certain area around the city which was holy. These armies would therefore be compassed in this holy place around the city where they should not be. These are the armies which bring the destruction upon the city. If you are looking for an Antichrist to fulfill this prophecy you are looking the wrong place. Luke 21:22 tells us that this will happen to fulfill scripture. Which prophecy does these armies fulfill other than the 70 week prophecy?

If you don't guard yourself you will be deceived. Think about it really. Why would Satan seek the deceive those who are already lost? What does he gain by that. The devil's attack is on the church and not those outside the church. He seeks to have us who are in Christ to leave and join his side, this the Antichrist is not going to be someone who Christians already don't like. The devil has never ever worked that way. Lets look at the text which speaks about the Antichrist again.

2Th 2:3 Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition;
2Th 2:4 Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, shewing himself that he is God.

All I am going to ask is how can you fall away if you were never once there. This falling away is a falling away of Christians who got deceived. People who are lost cannot fall away for they have already fallen. Only saved people can fall away.

Heb 6:4 For it is impossible for those who were once enlightened, and have tasted of the heavenly gift, and were made partakers of the Holy Ghost,
Heb 6:5 And have tasted the good word of God, and the powers of the world to come,
Heb 6:6 If they shall fall away, to renew them again unto repentance; seeing they crucify to themselves the Son of God afresh, and put him to an open shame.

I'm confused. First you said the abomination was spiritual deception in the church, now it's an all-out attack. Which is it?

And I don't believe any real Christian could ever fall away. The deception is for those who are not saved. Not Christians. We could never be deceived. I think that verse in Hebrew 6 makes it clear that that is the case.

I also don't understand your timeline. Has the abomination happened already or is it going to happen?

PROPHECYKID · Aug 5, 2010

NJBeliever said:
I'm confused. First you said the abomination was spiritual deception in the church, now it's an all-out attack. Which is it?

And I don't believe any real Christian could ever fall away. The deception is for those who are not saved. Not Christians. We could never be deceived. I think that verse in Hebrew 6 makes it clear that that is the case.

I also don't understand your timeline. Has the abomination happened already or is it going to happen?

I never said anything about the abomination being spiritual deception in the church. Nothing close to that. But what do you understand by the scriptures from Luke and Matthew. Its not enough for me to just say something. You must see it too. So look at the scriptures themselves that I posted. How do you understand it in relation to what the abomination was.

NJBeliever · Aug 5, 2010

PROPHECYKID said:
I never said anything about the abomination being spiritual deception in the church. Nothing close to that. But what do you understand by the scriptures from Luke and Matthew. Its not enough for me to just say something. You must see it too. So look at the scriptures themselves that I posted. How do you understand it in relation to what the abomination was.

You should be able to explain your beliefs. I believe the abomination is a future event that happens at day 1260 of the 7 prophetic years of Daniel's 70th week. At that time the antichrist will be in an actual temple, proclaiming himself to be God, in the same pattern of Antiochus Ephiphanes (the historical reference Jesus is making in Matthew 24 when he talks about women who are giving suck and praying that you don't have to flee on Sabbath day).

BrotherBob · Aug 5, 2010

NJBeliever said:
You should be able to explain your beliefs. I believe the abomination is a future event that happens at day 1260 of the 7 prophetic years of Daniel's 70th week. At that time the antichrist will be in an actual temple, proclaiming himself to be God, in the same pattern of Antiochus Ephiphanes (the historical reference Jesus is making in Matthew 24 when he talks about women who are giving suck and praying that you don't have to flee on Sabbath day).

I AGREE Good post :amen:

The Temple HAS to be rebuilt

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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Hebrews 2:14.... Pesky Devil, git!

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IMO...

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