Joel Osteen claims the OT dietary laws are still binding in the NT.
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Prepared for God's Calling
Joel, the son of John Osteen, a highly respected minister of the Gospel and the founder of Lakewood Church, attended Oral Roberts University in Tulsa, Oklahoma where he studied radio and television communications. In 1982, Joel returned to Houston and founded Lakewood's television ministry where he produced John Osteen's televised sermons for 17 years until January 1999 when his father passed away suddenly from a heart attack.
While he may be a very charismatic speaker with a large following. So were Jim and Jimmy. Why should we accept his radical departure from traditional Evangelical Christianity?Joel, the son of John Osteen, a highly respected minister of the Gospel and the founder of Lakewood Church, attended Oral Roberts University in Tulsa, Oklahoma where he studied radio and television communications. In 1982, Joel returned to Houston and founded Lakewood's television ministry where he produced John Osteen's televised sermons for 17 years until January 1999 when his father passed away suddenly from a heart attack.
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Well, we know for certain these characters didn't have it
Luke 11:52 "Woe to ye the Lawyers, that ye take away the Key of the Knowledge,
yeselves not enter and of the ones entering ye hinder/forbid'
[Hosea 4:6]
Revelation 14:11 And the Smoke of the tormenting of them is ascending into Ages to-Ages..........
[Luke 16:24,26]
This is another of those strange synchronocities....I'm working on a thread based on that very verse in Luke. Great minds ya' know...even if we don't always agree.
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Trying to bend scripture to fit teachings that did not exist prior to about 100 years ago. Why would Paul be saying anything about Levite priests or "clean food?" He was not writing to a synagogue of Jews, he was writing to the church at Corinth, there were few if any Jews in the church. The Corinthians had no OT background and did NOT have the OT.
International Standard Bible Encyclopedia - Corinth
The church in Corinth consisted principally of non-Jews (1Co_12:2). Paul
Various arts were cultivated and the Corinthians, even in the earliest times, were famous for their cleverness, inventiveness and artistic sense, and they prided themselves on surpassing the other Greeks in the embellishment of their city and in the adornment of their temples.
Finding strong opposition in the synagogue he [Paul] left the Jews and went to the Gentiles (Act_18:6).
The corrupting worship of Aphrodite, with its hordes of hieródouloi, [temple slaves] was dominant, and all over the Greek-Roman world, to behave as a Corinthian was a proverbial synonym for leading a low, shameless and immoral life. Very naturally such a polluted and idolatrous environment accounts for much that has to be recorded of the semi-pagan and imperfect life of many of the early converts.
The church in Corinth consisted principally of non-Jews (1Co_12:2). Paul
Various arts were cultivated and the Corinthians, even in the earliest times, were famous for their cleverness, inventiveness and artistic sense, and they prided themselves on surpassing the other Greeks in the embellishment of their city and in the adornment of their temples.
Finding strong opposition in the synagogue he [Paul] left the Jews and went to the Gentiles (Act_18:6).
The corrupting worship of Aphrodite, with its hordes of hieródouloi, [temple slaves] was dominant, and all over the Greek-Roman world, to behave as a Corinthian was a proverbial synonym for leading a low, shameless and immoral life. Very naturally such a polluted and idolatrous environment accounts for much that has to be recorded of the semi-pagan and imperfect life of many of the early converts.
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Frogster
Galatians is the best!
Yup..I wonder if folks wear interwoven clothing.That is antilevitical.
Paul even knew the food sold in Corinth was offered to idols,but he said eat it..unless the 'weak coscience" person would be streesed,But he knew otheriwse,the mature could eat it.
1 Corinthians 10:27
If one of the unbelievers invites you to dinner and you are disposed to go, eat whatever is set before you without raising any question on the ground of conscience.
28 But if someone says to you, This has been offered in sacrifice, then do not eat it, for the sake of the one who informed you, and for the sake of conscience 29 I do not mean your conscience, but his. For why should my liberty be determined by someone else's conscience?
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Christos Anesti
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You have probably lived longer than the VAST majority of the ancient Israelites who lived only on clean food. Heck people living on McDonald probably live longer given the benefits of modern medicine. I can understand that there may be some health benefit from refraining from eating pork but I doubt it's really as drastic as some of my SDA friends claim. Clean vs unclean doesn't mean healthy vs unhealthy. It was primarily a method of separating/defining the Jewish community and providing an avenue for practicing obedience to God. There is nothing inherently unclean (or clean) about pork it was merely the religous tradition God gave to the Jews that made it unclean for them. Christ told Saint Peter that all foods are clean for us (Christians).
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laconicstudent
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It isn't. Animal muscle tissue is all remarkably similar. Especially considering we eat mainly mammals, which are all very closely related. There simply is not a difference other then slightly differing levels of some ions and lipids. But all tissue will still contain things like sodium and fat. Sodium is, in fact, essential for action potential propagation.
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Yup..I wonder if folks wear interwoven clothing.That is antilevitical.
In looking through that chapter I didn't see anything strange.....
Leviticus 19:1-2 And the LORD spake unto Moses, saying, "Speak unto all the congregation of the children of Israel, and say unto them, 'Ye shall be holy: for I the LORD your God am holy.
We are His children and we are to be holy (set apart). We are to keep His Sabbaths (our Sabbath being our Rest and our Rest is...Christ), we are to love our mother and father, not "turn ye unto idols," we are to feed the poor, not steal, deal falsely, lie to one another, not swear falsely, profane His name, defraud our neighbors or rob him, not curse the deaf and blind, bare false tales, hate our brother, not avenge or bear grudges.
That is how we live and that sets us apart from others. So what is meant when He also instructs us....
19:19 Ye shall keep My statues. Thou shalt not let thy cattle gender with a diverse kind: thou shalt now sow thy field with mingled seed: neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee.
Genesis 1:11 And God said, "Let the earth bring forth grass, the herb yielding seed, and the fruit tree yielding fruit after his kind, whose seed is in itself, upon the earth:" and it was so. (21) And God created great whales, and every living creature that moveth, which the waters brought forth abundantly, after their kind, and every wingled fowl after his kind: and God saw that it was good. (24-25) And God said, "Let the earth bring forth the living creature after his kind, cattle, and creeping thing, and beast of the earth after his kind:" and it was so. And God made the beast of the earth after his kind, and cattle after their kind, and every thing that creepeth upon the earth after his kind: and God saw that it was good.
Things are not to be "mingled" but are to remain "after his kind." How does that apply to...."neither shall a garment mingled of linen and woollen come upon thee?" And, as it was in the same paragraph the meaning is associated with remaining "after his kind." I add....
Deuteronomy 22:10-11 Thou shalt not plow with an ox and an ass together. Thou shalt not wear a garment of divers sorts, as of woollen and linen together.
What do you believe that statute is instructing us about? Is it wearing literal clothes?
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It isn't that one purposely spiritualizes....it is that one is given to see the spirit of the Word.
1 Corinthians 2:12-14 Now we have received, not the spirit of the world, but the spirit which is of God; that we might know the things that are freely given to us of God. which things also we speak, not in the words which man's wisdom teacheth, but which the Holy Gost teacheth; comparing spiritual things with spiritual. But the natural man receiveth not the things of the Spirit of God: for they are foolishness unto him: neither can he know them, because they are spiritually discerned.
John 14:26 But the Comforter, Which is the Holy Ghost, Whom the Father will send in My name, He shall teach you all things, and bring all things to your remembrance, whatsoever I have said unto you.
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Frogster
Galatians is the best!
Did Paul not care about the set apart Galatian Chrisitians? Because when Peter tried to impose food restrictions at Antioch,Paul said he was not in line with the Gospel,and confronted him.Adoption has set us apart,not law.Gal 4.Actually the law is what set Jews and gentiles apart,hence that is why it went to the cross,to end division.Eph 2:15.
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Spirit Compass
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For a Levite and those following the levitical code, field and farm fashion was to be plain and simple with no accessories or creative detail. Basic and utilitarian--no Wranglers and Ropers. Those were to be saved for the rodeo. No shrimp platters at the rodeo cafeteria permitted--lambchops and beefsteak only!
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Of course Paul cared about them...they are those he was sent to. The disciples and Jesus were sent to the "house of Israel," but Paul was sent to the Gentiles.
Much of the writing we've been quoting is Paul saying we shouldn't allow restrictions they may not follow to keep us from accepting them. I guess the question is....Does that mean we should give up what our Father tells us?
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For a Levite and those following the levitical code, field and farm fashion was to be plain and simple with no accessories or creative detail. Basic and utilitarian--no Wranglers and Ropers. Those were to be saved for the rodeo. No shrimp platters at the rodeo cafeteria permitted--lambchops and beefsteak only!
Hi Spirit Compass,
What you have written makes sense. The problem is the "mingling of linen and woollen" is included with not mixing seed. It carries the same meaning...or, so I believe.
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Hi 1whirlwind,
If you are a Jew or unsaved the law applies to you. If you are a Christian you have the new covenant even if your ethnic ancestry is Jewish.
What are you now saying we are not oblogated to wear clothes. Now that should attract people like bees to a hive.
bugkiller
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No. The gospel is the same but....
Matthew 10:5-6 These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, "Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
15:24 But He answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
Then...along came Paul.As the food laws are not "go to hell issues," or so I believe....Paul said not to make a big deal out of them if that kept souls from the Father.15:24 But He answered and said, I am not sent but unto the lost sheep of the house of Israel.
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