Why is homosexuality wrong?

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JustAsIam77

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He has advanced this erroneous argument before. (In addition to other erroneous arguments.) Even if Paul were familiar with Plato (specifically, the text in question), it is completely irrelevant to the veracity of Paul's argument against homosexual acts, which is not narrow in scope.

I didn't know that. I've asked several times for proof in some documented form that the assertions are true, until the time it's forthcoming I have to assume it's false doctrine and that is a very serious offense.
 
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LightHorseman

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I didn't know that. I've asked several times for proof in some documented form that the assertions are true, until the time it's forthcoming I have to assume it's false doctrine and that is a very serious offense.
There's no such thing as "proof" in a literary critique... however, he has most certainly provided evidence supporting the thesis.
 
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Sarcalogos Deus

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My thoughts on the issue of homosexuality are reflected perfectly in the Catechism of the Catholic Church, Paragraph 2357.

Chastity and homosexuality

2357 Homosexuality refers to relations between men or between women who experience an exclusive or predominant sexual attraction toward persons of the same sex. It has taken a great variety of forms through the centuries and in different cultures. Its psychological genesis remains largely unexplained. Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarityUnder no circumstances can they be approved.

To me this is all there is to it.
 
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Sarcalogos Deus

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Thinking for yourself is intrinsically disordered.

It's a judgment by the Church that is to be held by all faithful Catholics, including you. As a Catholic i would assume you would understand this. But instead i get ad hominem attacks directed at me.
 
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LightHorseman

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It's a judgment by the Church that is to be held by all faithful Catholics, including you. As a Catholic i would assume you would understand this. But instead i get ad hominem attacks directed at me.
Maybe you should look up "ad hominem".
 
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Brennin

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Basing itself on Sacred Scripture, which presents homosexual acts as acts of grave depravity,141 tradition has always declared that "homosexual acts are intrinsically disordered."142 They are contrary to the natural law. They close the sexual act to the gift of life. They do not proceed from a genuine affective and sexual complementarity. Under no circumstances can they be approved.

I agree.
 
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marklbernard

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Here we go because you insist on dragging us there. No one is trying to make Christians endorse homosexual marriages, she makes it quite clear that shes only talking about in the secular.

Further, as has been repeatedly pointed out to you, there are a bunch of anatomical structure that seem to have evolved for homosexual functionality. "Anatomy itself" doesn't oppose anything, and your argument from design is as flawed as every other time you've trotted it out.

I am unclear as to which structres you are referring to?
 
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marklbernard

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Yes, and he did it to make a point. The fact that the sin of Passion in Plato was cast in "homosexual" terms is not the focus for Plato, nor is it for Paul. The focus is, and should be, on the mindless hedonism of Passion.

Regardless of the point Plato was making, you must now read the context in Which Paul was writing in and ask what was his focus.

The focus in Romans 1 is not homosexuality, i.e. homosexuality is not the centerpiece of Paul's discussion. The centerpiece is the outworking of a life that refuses to worship God and acknowledge Him for who He is.
 
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LightHorseman

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I am unclear as to which structres you are referring to?
The external [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] on females, and sexually responsive nerve endings in the anus.

eta; as opposed to all the external clitorises (clitorii?) on males. [/application to department of redundancy department]
 
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marklbernard

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The external [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] on females, and sexually responsive nerve endings in the anus.

eta; as opposed to all the external clitorises (clitorii?) on males. [/application to department of redundancy department]

I am afraid that sexually responsive nerve endings on the anus does not prove and evolution for sexual functioning, the anus itself is not made for a penis due to the size of the anus which must be progressively stretched to accommodate it, in addition it lacks any self lubricating mechanism. Both of which can be found within the functioning of the female genitalia. If there is some sort of evolution occouring it has not sufficiently occoured for proper sexual functioning. In addition their are a number of nerve endings occurring on a number of body parts which can also be seen to assist in general sexual stimulation, including the mouth, tongue etc. We are sensory creatures.
 
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LightHorseman

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I am afraid that sexually responsive nerve endings on the anus does not prove and evolution for sexual functioning, the anus itself is not made for a penis due to the size of the anus which must be progressively stretched to accommodate it, in addition it lacks any self lubricating mechanism. Both of which can be found within the functioning of the female genitalia. If there is some sort of evolution occouring it has not sufficiently occoured for proper sexual functioning. In addition their are a number of nerve endings occurring on a number of body parts which can also be seen to assist in general sexual stimulation, including the mouth, tongue etc. We are sensory creatures.
the "mouth, tongue etc" you mention... as you say, said nerve endings are to assist in sexual stimulation... so... what do you propose similar nerve endings in the anus are for?

And the external [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], it makes way more sense for it to be an internal organ, homosexual functionality is one of very few plausible explanations for its externality.
 
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marklbernard

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the "mouth, tongue etc" you mention... as you say, said nerve endings are to assist in sexual stimulation... so... what do you propose similar nerve endings in the anus are for?

And the external [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], it makes way more sense for it to be an internal organ, homosexual functionality is one of very few plausible explanations for its externality.

I am sorry but I fail to see how the externallity of the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] is proof of homosexual design. Nerve endings serve more than one typical purpose other than sexual functioning, and you have not addressed how the lack of flexibility and self lubricating features, seem to detract fro this idea of homosexual evolution.

The fact is God is clear on the subject of homosexuality, it is a sin, it is against the design of the human body. However the fact that homosexuality being a sin, as I told a homosexual friend of a mutual friend is no different to adultery, cheating, stealing, hatred, murder etc etc. Sin is sin, as in James it says if you break one part of the Law you are guilty of breaking all of it. The point is we all need a saviour as we are all lost and guilty of disobedience to God
 
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LightHorseman

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I am sorry but I fail to see how the externallity of the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] is proof of homosexual design.
Not design, evolution.

Think, for 2 seconds, what the purpose of the [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse] is. Then think about one thing that men typically have, and women typically don't, and what sense it makes for something of that function to be outside of the body, rather than inside, considering who has what and does what with it. Sorry, language filters, you know?

Nerve endings serve more than one typical purpose other than sexual functioning,
Actually, no. Nerve endings typically have one highly specific function. Heat sensors detect heat, light pressure sensors detect light pressure, itch sensors detect itch... But by all means, if you can think of a non sexual function for sexually responsive nerve endings in the anus, I'm all ears.

and you have not addressed how the lack of flexibility and self lubricating features, seem to detract fro this idea of homosexual evolution.
Not at all. The body is full of "design flaws". The eye, for example, could be much better designed to see better and for longevity. But you aren't going to tell me the eye isn't for seeing just because there are a few design sensors. All we can determine is what an organs function is from what we can observe it doing. If we were to take the idea and run with it that structures with design flaws inherent aren't intended for any activity that agravates those design flaws, well, pretty soon you'll be telling me that knees aren't intended for walking on!

The fact is God is clear on the subject of homosexuality,
How do you know what God thinks on the matter? You're not another fair weather Biblical literalist, are you?
it is against the design of the human body.
Nonsense. arguments from design inherently fail here. Now, I don't know you from a bar of soap, but how close am I... You were first sure that homosexuality was a sin, and then went looking for support from an argument from design, rather than looking at the body, determining that homosexually didn't seem to be an appropriate function, and then deciding it was a sin. Am I right?

However the fact that homosexuality being a sin, as I told a homosexual friend of a mutual friend is no different to adultery, cheating, stealing, hatred, murder etc etc. Sin is sin, as in James it says if you break one part of the Law you are guilty of breaking all of it. The point is we all need a saviour as we are all lost and guilty of disobedience to God
This part I agree with.

Don't forget being judgemental and haughty too.
 
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marklbernard

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My last word on the matter.

My appeal to the fact of whether or not Homosexuality is wrong is not according to nature but according to the word of God. I simply state that it is against the function also of the human body, your arguments about this have not swayed me. I wonder what a Human Biologist would say about your hypothosis???

If you wish to label me a fundamentalist, then by all means, because such a tag is not disparaging for me, it is a blessing, I believe in the plenary inspiration of the Word of God. I believe that the Father Himself, inspired the Prophets, the writers and the apostles to set forth His words to Mankind, without fear without favour, the Word of God is the Word of God, and therefore "all scripture is by inspiration of God", just as the Apostle Paul stated that it was. I know this not only because of the reliablity of the scriptures, but also in the way that God has proven Himself to me, in many ways.

Yes, if that means that I am a fundamentalist in your mind, then so be it, but praise God you can be a fundamentalist and still love God and love others. :)
 
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BigBadWlf

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My last word on the matter.

My appeal to the fact of whether or not Homosexuality is wrong is not according to nature but according to the word of God. I simply state that it is against the function also of the human body, your arguments about this have not swayed me. I wonder what a Human Biologist would say about your hypothosis???
Then your appeal fails because gays and lesbians have been enjoying intimacy for thousands of years. If it was against design…it wouldn’t be possible
 
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Sarcalogos Deus

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Then your appeal fails because gays and lesbians have been enjoying intimacy for thousands of years. If it was against design…it wouldn’t be possible

Thats not necessarily true.
 
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LightHorseman

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My last word on the matter.

My appeal to the fact of whether or not Homosexuality is wrong is not according to nature but according to the word of God. I simply state that it is against the function also of the human body, your arguments about this have not swayed me. I wonder what a Human Biologist would say about your hypothosis???
I'm a nurse and have an associate diploma in biomedical technology. I'm not just making this stuff up.
 
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