Obedience to Satan Brought Light of Christ

RufustheRed said:

"Pre-Existence" is a oxymoron. Nothing can exist before it does. It is logically impossible.

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Then just think of it as short for, "pre-mortal existence," instead, and it shouldn't be an insurmountable problem.

Ran77 said:

I think something very important is being overlooked here. Eve wasn't obeying satan. She was deceived. That doesn't involve obedience or any kind of recognition of soverrn status towards satan. The use of this word seems to be intended to bring a negative light to the discussion of the fall of man and the decision by Eve to eat the fruit. I haven't previously participated in this discussion because I dislike this kind of tactic.

NO obedience.

YES to free choice influenced by the words of others.

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Indeed. I find the, "Obedience to Satan Brought Light of Christ," offensive. How hard would it have been to explore questions about Adam and Eve, the fall of man, or the light of Christ, without resorting to that kind of ugliness?

Zechariah said:

Indeed. I find the, "Obedience to Satan Brought Light of Christ," offensive. How hard would it have been to explore questions about Adam and Eve, the fall of man, or the light of Christ, without resorting to that kind of ugliness?

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Don't like it? Simple. Don't talk about it - Report it.

Zechariah said:

Then just think of it as short for, "pre-mortal existence," instead, and it shouldn't be an insurmountable problem.

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Ah, yes. The old "It all depends on what "is" is." William Jefferson Clinton
We can always take words out to make a context for the statement.

It is still a logical impossibility as stated in the other posts.

Phoebe Ann said:

Katya, you say that the Fall provided you the opportunity to be here. Do you believe that you were happy in Heavenly Father's presence before you came here? Can you explain why leaving him to get a physical body was so important?

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I think we were happy. But we didn't experience pain. So I don't think we could comprehend what we had so to speak. Coming here and gaining a physical body is important to me. I've experienced some harsh realities in my life. But it makes me appreciate the good times more. And what is to come if I endure this life.

This teaching about needing pain in order to experience joy strikes me as quite masochistic. Until I developed fibromyalgia I did not have a clue as to what chronic pain really is and I can assure you that I was much happier before than I am now.

Phoebe Ann said:

We were happy and didn't know that we were happy? Is that what you are saying?

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Not so much that we didn't know. Maybe we were happy up to a certain point. Sorry, I know it probably doesn't make sense, I just don't know how else to explain it.

Can you explain why leaving him to get a physical body was so important?

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I will have to get back to you on that. I would seriously need to think about the why.

bbbbbbb said:

This teaching about needing pain in order to experience joy strikes me as quite masochistic. Until I developed fibromyalgia I did not have a clue as to what chronic pain really is and I can assure you that I was much happier before than I am now.

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Yeah I'm a bit of a [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse], or at least that's what I've been told.

Katya said:

Not so much that we didn't know. Maybe we were happy up to a certain point. Sorry, I know it probably doesn't make sense, I just don't know how else to explain it.

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When we exit this life we will have a vast amount of experience that we will eternally benefit from. Of course, gaining a physical form on Earth is not for the purpose of experiencing pain. But during our time we will experience much that is uncomfortable. Then during the eternty, we will have a frame of referrence for what it really means to be young, live forever, without pain.

Beyond that, we learn something ever so more valuable, we learn to empathize with the suffering of others. If we had never experienced pain or sorrow or depression, how could we hope to understand those who have? Perhaps, it is a measure of mercy that we gain from these experiences more than anything else.

And yet, that still is not the reason for a physical form.


Hope some of that helps.