BelindaP
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- Sep 21, 2006
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Since you picked on me, I'm going to answer this from my perspective. I think this is where the disconnect is happening, but the political conservatives in this forum don't seem to be capable of looking outside their little box to see that it IS possible to be theologically conservative and politically liberal. And, no that doesn't mean we are moderate. Moderate is when you have a mix of liberal and conservative theological views. I don't. I am a theological conservative through and through.
2. Maybe we're voting democrat because we really believe the party will do what it claims it will do wrt social justice. I'm a life-long Republican. But, I gave them up as liars during the last presidential term. Instead of doing something to stop abortion or improve morality, all they've done is get millions of people killed (higher death toll than abortion, btw).
That is correct. And we resent people who don't walk in our shoes and try to tell us we aren't 'conservative enough'. You want a safe haven like that, then you should write politics into the SOF and move over to the Politics forum.In my opinion the issue many people run into is one of priority, not politics.
Looking specifically at the political issue. There are some who come here because they believe they are theologically conservative because they believe in the authority and inerrancy of scripture or because their church is commonly viewed as a conservative church etc, but they voted democrat in the last election, maybe they vote democrat regularly.
As soon as they get into a political conversation they are accused of not being conservative because of the way they voted. Their assumption is that the forum then is really about politics and not theology or faith.
Why does the fact I consider social issues to be on a par with abortion make me a liberal. If I recall, Jesus didn't speak of abortion, but he did call the people who showed no charity towards the least of these goats. Seems to me he thought it rather important.Thats understandable.
But really the issue isn't merely political. It certainly involves politics, but its really about moral and social values, and even more specifically its about the priority people assign to those values.
I will use a statement Belinda made, not to single her out but because I think it illustrates the point I'm getting at well.
Many pages back there was talk about socialism, and Belinda said something to the effect that the political conservatives have no problem forcing their religious view about abortion on people via government and law, so why should we have a problem forcing the christian view of charity and social justice on people via government and law.
I guarentee you that 90% or more of the conservatives I know would assume from that statement that she is a liberal. The reason for this is both the language used and priority of issues.
It is a religious issue. Muslims believe that life begins at 40 days gestation. Abortion before that is acceptable. So do many Jews. Then, you have pagans, who may or may not be pro-life. Most don't see a problem with early-term abortion. Getting to the liberal Christians--same thing. So, peoples' desire to outlaw abortion comes from their religious views.Now, Belinda is pro-life, she has said so and I think she said she agreed with the forum having a pro-life stance.
In her statement she used the phrase "your religious view about abortion" (paraphrased). This statement is guarenteed to set off the vast majority of conservatives because we do not believe that pro-life is a "mere religious view". To us this would be equivalent to calling murder a mere religious view and saying that laws prohibiting murder were people forcing their religious views on everyone else.
Right here you're calling the 50% of people in this country who aren't opposed to early term abortion indecent, or even Christian. Gotcha.Granted, my views about abortion are motivated by my religion, as are my views on murder. However, they are things that I believe every person in a decent society should agree with regardless of religion because life is such a basic human right.
In order for people not to believe in the right of life they have to be so far gone down the path of selfishness and destruction that I couldn't consider them a decent person, let alone a good Christian.
Yes you have, in this forum. But, they are usually run out of here on a rail.Further, I have yet to meet a conservative Christian who's number one top priority in terms of social issues was not abortion.
So, where are the street rallies to get adultery made illegal? After all, it's a much more common sin than homosexuality? Do conservative Christians really care about morality, or are they just going after the 'icky' sins.For virtually every conservative Christian I know, the social issue of second importance is sexual morality and of course the issue of the day there is homosexuality. Though promescuity is also an ever increasing problem.
1. What if we are? Does that make us less theologically conservative?When a person who claims to be pro-life votes democrat, it is usually based on the fact that they are anti-war (specifically in iraq) and because they believe social charity and helping the poor to be a Christian duty. Thus they are essentially puting those values at a higher priority than abortion and homosexuality.
2. Maybe we're voting democrat because we really believe the party will do what it claims it will do wrt social justice. I'm a life-long Republican. But, I gave them up as liars during the last presidential term. Instead of doing something to stop abortion or improve morality, all they've done is get millions of people killed (higher death toll than abortion, btw).
Yeah. Except the churches aren't holding up their end of the bargain. We have children literally starving to death in America. I don't see any street protests about that either.Conservatives are not against helping the poor, but most of us see this as an duty of the Church at the local level, and of the individual.
Incomprehensible or not, it is true. So, try breaking out of the little box that you've put God and have a look at the bigger picture. We will go to hell faster for not taking care of the 'least of these' than we will for any other sin.Further, it is literally incomprehensible to most conservatives to think that getting a government economic program passed would be more important than abortion, or trying to preserve our public values of sexual morality.
Funny you should say that. Most conservative churches didn't really care one way or the other about abortion until the mid-70s. They considered it to be a Catholic problem and didn't take stances one way or the other. It wasn't until Falwell started beating the drums that the evangelical churches took it up. 30 years isn't very long to set up a long-standing tradition imo.What sets conservatives apart on that issue is not that we are against it.. most people are. It is the priority we place upon it. It is the fact that for most us we consider it to be the greatest evil in our society by far.
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