The Real Israel

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brakelite

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Nearly all Christendom is looking in the wrong direction waiting for prophecy to be fulfilled. Focusing on the nation of Israel in expectation of the fulfilment of end-time events will lead to 2 things. Disappointment and deception. So many are sitting quietly and waiting for the temple to be rebuilt, while all along it has been. And you are it! The church, not the nation of Israel, is the prime object of prophecy. It is the prime focus of God's love and attention in preparation for Jesus return, and it is the prime focus of Satan's war against the saints in order to destroy or deceive them before Jesus returns.
Following is the evidence of why the church is the subject of end-time prophecy with regards to Israel, and not the nation.

The name "Israel" first appears in the Bible in Genesis 32:28 After a night of wrestling with the heavenly visitor (who I personally believe to be Christ Himself) Jacob prevails in his efforts and his name is changed from Jacob, the deceiver or supplanter, to Israel, meaning he will rule. Jacob has prevailed with God and overcome.

At the time of this event, Jacob was reluctant to face Esau after 20 years of exile and was quite simply terrified of him. His former deception of his father and claim to be Esau was now playing on his conscience and he desired God's blessing and forgiveness before proceeding. So the 'Angel' asks Jacob his name, to which he truthfully replies 'my name is Jacob'. In this he was confessing his guilt, and God then knew he was a changed man, so gave him a new name that celebrated so to speak his victory over sin, self and his night of wrestling in prayer, the 'Angel' saying "for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed."
Israel, as a name therefore represents spiritual victory over sin.

In Exod 4:22,23 Moses is instructed on how he is to speak to Pharaoh in order that Israel's descendants may be freed from slavery. God says to Moses "and thou shalt say unto Pharaoh 'Thus saith the Lord,Israel is My son, my firstborn and I say unto thee let My son go to serve me..."
This is the first time Israel is used in a corporate sense for the entire nation. Before it applied only to an individual, but here we see it being applied to his descendants. First to a victorious man, then to his people.
Did Israel live up to that name? What was God trying to accomplish in establishing Israel in the first place? Was it not that He would have a people to represent Him on the earth? Before God had His champions, but all failed. Sin interposed and no longer was any of God's chosen able to fulfil the true destiny that God intended for them. Adam failed over appetite. So did Noah. Abraham also, but God was determined to establish a people after His own heart and show the gentiles His law, His mercy and grace and power. Interesting that Adam, Noah, and Israel all failed on points of appetite. (Gen 9:20,21; Exodus 16:27-29.)

It wasn't until Jesus came on the scene in person that the title "Israel" in it's truest spiritual sense and power could be rightly bestowed. And Mathew in particular showed this time and time again how Jesus was the fulfilment of the OT prophecies which may have originally applied to the nation, but now, according to Mathew's inspired writings, applied in fact to Jesus. Examples are Hosea 11:1 ; Isaiah 41:8,42:1-3 .
Paul followed the same idea and reasoning by paralleling Coll 1:15 with Ex 4:22, Gal 3:16 with Isaiah 41:8 and elsewhere.

Jesus Himself proclaimed Himself as the true vine, in fulfilment of Ps 80:8 which applied to the nation.
So now the mantle and authority once bestowed upon the nation has been given to Jesus. Jesus is the essence of true Israel. He only has the right to bear the name for He only has prevailed with sin and overcome. Jesus walked over the same ground that Israel walked, but came through victorious. In His temptations in the wilderness, it was appetite that came under particular scrutiny.

What Paul does in Romans and other writers in the NT however is extend that idea and show how the name Israel also now applies to Jesus' descendants, just as it did to Jacob's descendants. Peter also showed this when he compared the church to Exodus 19:6.(1 Peter 2:9).
So as Paul says, immediately after saying that Jesus is the 'seed' of Abraham, Gentile converts in Galatia were now also Abraham's seed because they are Christ's. They are also heirs according to the promise.
This is not 'replacement ' theology. It is merely a revelation of who true Israel always was and who Israel is now. True Israel are those people, of whatever nation kindred tongue and people, who by faith in the mercy grace and power of God overcome sin and receive Christ's righteousness and forgiveness as a gift and are willing to share that gift with the lost. True Israel was always exclusively those who "as princes had power with God and men and prevailed".
 

Biblewriter

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Should we believe the reasonings of men or the word of God? Your reasonings seem to have merit. But if they are correct, then much of the Old Testament is a lie.

Look, for instance, at Ezekiel 36, where we read, "1Also, thou son of man, prophesy unto the mountains of Israel, and say, Ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the LORD: 2Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because the enemy hath said against you, Aha, even the ancient high places are ours in possession: 3Therefore prophesy and say, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Because they have made you desolate, and swallowed you up on every side, that ye might be a possession unto the residue of the heathen, and ye are taken up in the lips of talkers, and are an infamy of the people: 4Therefore, ye mountains of Israel, hear the word of the Lord GOD; Thus saith the Lord GOD to the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, to the desolate wastes, and to the cities that are forsaken, which became a prey and derision to the residue of the heathen that are round about; 5Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; Surely in the fire of my jealousy have I spoken against the residue of the heathen, and against all Idumea, which have appointed my land into their possession with the joy of all their heart, with despiteful minds, to cast it out for a prey. 6Prophesy therefore concerning the land of Israel, and say unto the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, I have spoken in my jealousy and in my fury, because ye have borne the shame of the heathen: 7Therefore thus saith the Lord GOD; I have lifted up mine hand, Surely the heathen that are about you, they shall bear their shame. 8But ye, O mountains of Israel, ye shall shoot forth your branches, and yield your fruit to my people of Israel; for they are at hand to come. 9For, behold, I am for you, and I will turn unto you, and ye shall be tilled and sown: 10And I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, even all of it: and the cities shall be inhabited, and the wastes shall be builded: 11And I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bring fruit: and I will settle you after your old estates, and will do better unto you than at your beginnings: and ye shall know that I am the LORD. 12Yea, I will cause men to walk upon you, even my people Israel; and they shall possess thee, and thou shalt be their inheritance, and thou shalt no more henceforth bereave them of men."

This prophesy is specifically and explicitly addressed to a piece of real estate. "The mountains of Israel" are told, "Thus saith the Lord GOD to the mountains, and to the hills, to the rivers, and to the valleys, to the desolate wastes, and to the cities that are forsaken." They are told that "I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, even all of it: and the cities shall be inhabited, and the wastes shall be builded."

Again, Ezekiel 47 we read, "13Thus saith the Lord GOD; This shall be the border, whereby ye shall inherit the land according to the twelve tribes of Israel: Joseph shall have two portions. 14And ye shall inherit it, one as well as another: concerning the which I lifted up mine hand to give it unto your fathers: and this land shall fall unto you for inheritance. 15And this shall be the border of the land toward the north side, from the great sea, the way of Hethlon, as men go to Zedad; 16Hamath, Berothah, Sibraim, which is between the border of Damascus and the border of Hamath; Hazarhatticon, which is by the coast of Hauran. 17And the border from the sea shall be Hazarenan, the border of Damascus, and the north northward, and the border of Hamath. And this is the north side. 18And the east side ye shall measure from Hauran, and from Damascus, and from Gilead, and from the land of Israel by Jordan, from the border unto the east sea. And this is the east side. 19And the south side southward, from Tamar even to the waters of strife in Kadesh, the river to the great sea. And this is the south side southward. 20The west side also shall be the great sea from the border, till a man come over against Hamath. This is the west side."

Here even the future borders of the land are specifically defined. And the next chapter tells which portion of this piece of real estate is to go to each of the twelve tribes of Israel. There is no way to reverently "spiritualize" such explicit language to mean the church. It is simply unbelief to claim that these prophecies do not mean what they explicitly say. Indeed, the entire last third of the book of Ezekiel is simply untrue if what you say is true. So also for much of Isaiah, Daniel, and almost all the other Old Testament prophets.
 
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PROPHECYKID

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Nearly all Christendom is looking in the wrong direction waiting for prophecy to be fulfilled. Focusing on the nation of Israel in expectation of the fulfilment of end-time events will lead to 2 things. Disappointment and deception. So many are sitting quietly and waiting for the temple to be rebuilt, while all along it has been. And you are it! The church, not the nation of Israel, is the prime object of prophecy. It is the prime focus of God's love and attention in preparation for Jesus return, and it is the prime focus of Satan's war against the saints in order to destroy or deceive them before Jesus returns.
Following is the evidence of why the church is the subject of end-time prophecy with regards to Israel, and not the nation.

The name "Israel" first appears in the Bible in Genesis 32:28 After a night of wrestling with the heavenly visitor (who I personally believe to be Christ Himself) Jacob prevails in his efforts and his name is changed from Jacob, the deceiver or supplanter, to Israel, meaning he will rule. Jacob has prevailed with God and overcome.

At the time of this event, Jacob was reluctant to face Esau after 20 years of exile and was quite simply terrified of him. His former deception of his father and claim to be Esau was now playing on his conscience and he desired God's blessing and forgiveness before proceeding. So the 'Angel' asks Jacob his name, to which he truthfully replies 'my name is Jacob'. In this he was confessing his guilt, and God then knew he was a changed man, so gave him a new name that celebrated so to speak his victory over sin, self and his night of wrestling in prayer, the 'Angel' saying "for as a prince hast thou power with God and with men, and hast prevailed."
Israel, as a name therefore represents spiritual victory over sin.

In Exod 4:22,23 Moses is instructed on how he is to speak to Pharaoh in order that Israel's descendants may be freed from slavery. God says to Moses "and thou shalt say unto Pharaoh 'Thus saith the Lord,Israel is My son, my firstborn and I say unto thee let My son go to serve me..."
This is the first time Israel is used in a corporate sense for the entire nation. Before it applied only to an individual, but here we see it being applied to his descendants. First to a victorious man, then to his people.
Did Israel live up to that name? What was God trying to accomplish in establishing Israel in the first place? Was it not that He would have a people to represent Him on the earth? Before God had His champions, but all failed. Sin interposed and no longer was any of God's chosen able to fulfil the true destiny that God intended for them. Adam failed over appetite. So did Noah. Abraham also, but God was determined to establish a people after His own heart and show the gentiles His law, His mercy and grace and power. Interesting that Adam, Noah, and Israel all failed on points of appetite. (Gen 9:20,21; Exodus 16:27-29.)

It wasn't until Jesus came on the scene in person that the title "Israel" in it's truest spiritual sense and power could be rightly bestowed. And Mathew in particular showed this time and time again how Jesus was the fulfilment of the OT prophecies which may have originally applied to the nation, but now, according to Mathew's inspired writings, applied in fact to Jesus. Examples are Hosea 11:1 ; Isaiah 41:8,42:1-3 .
Paul followed the same idea and reasoning by paralleling Coll 1:15 with Ex 4:22, Gal 3:16 with Isaiah 41:8 and elsewhere.

Jesus Himself proclaimed Himself as the true vine, in fulfilment of Ps 80:8 which applied to the nation.
So now the mantle and authority once bestowed upon the nation has been given to Jesus. Jesus is the essence of true Israel. He only has the right to bear the name for He only has prevailed with sin and overcome. Jesus walked over the same ground that Israel walked, but came through victorious. In His temptations in the wilderness, it was appetite that came under particular scrutiny.

What Paul does in Romans and other writers in the NT however is extend that idea and show how the name Israel also now applies to Jesus' descendants, just as it did to Jacob's descendants. Peter also showed this when he compared the church to Exodus 19:6.(1 Peter 2:9).
So as Paul says, immediately after saying that Jesus is the 'seed' of Abraham, Gentile converts in Galatia were now also Abraham's seed because they are Christ's. They are also heirs according to the promise.
This is not 'replacement ' theology. It is merely a revelation of who true Israel always was and who Israel is now. True Israel are those people, of whatever nation kindred tongue and people, who by faith in the mercy grace and power of God overcome sin and receive Christ's righteousness and forgiveness as a gift and are willing to share that gift with the lost. True Israel was always exclusively those who "as princes had power with God and men and prevailed".

Good post. :clap::clap:

I am surprised that you didn't use some biblical references to what Paul said about if any man be Christ's, he is Abraham's seed. The nation of Israel is Abraham's seed. Therefore if any man be Christ's he is apart of the nation of Israel. Not the physical nation but the spiritual nation.
 
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HisdaughterJen

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Jesus said in Matt 24 that there is a desolation of Israel (66-70AD) that leads to great tribulation which continues until the end and is cut short for the sake of the elect (or else no one would survive).

Jesus said in Matt 24 that after the tribulation is cut short, THEN there will be false Christs/false prophets/false miracles.

Jesus said in Matt 24 that the sun/moon darken immediately after the tribulation which is seal #6 in Rev 6. Seal #7 follows and is full of false christs/false prophets/false miracles...proving Jesus' words in Matt 24 that the tribulation ends before the beasts even take the stage.

The tribulation is cut short for the sake of the elect. Do you know who the elect are and what happens so that the tribulation has to be cut short so abruptly when the sun/moon darken? The answer is in Joel 2 and Rev 12 and Ezek 38. There is a massive Northern army invasion OF ISRAEL which God has to stop or else no one would survive. THEN, as Matt 24, Rev 12/13 shows us, the beasts reign for 42 months.

So, you see, it is indeed all about Israel, and the elect therein for whom God ends this tribulation and begins His wrath.
 
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brakelite

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Deut. 28:1 ¶ And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe and to do all his commandments which I command thee this day, that the LORD thy God will set thee on high above all nations of the earth:

All the blessings of God, all the subsequent prophecies and promises of God of establishment of the nation, were conditional on obedience.


For what purpose was Israel chosen in the first place? Was it not to reveal the character and love of God to as world lost in idolatry and pagan perversions?
Not only so, but also for the fact that God loved man so much that He simply wanted to have someone to fellowship with. So He chose Abraham, and accepted His descendants as His special people because of Abraham's obedience. God's continuing favour was conditional however on Israel's continuing obedience and faithfulnass. God certainly promised that He would never reject them, but He gave many warnings of what would result of their rejecting Him.

By the time of Jesus, the national religion was so corrupted that they were suffering relentlessly under the harsh rule of an occupying power. A fulfilment of one of the warnings. That Jesus came though confirms God's faithfulness. He had not yet rejected them. He was giving them every opportunity to repent, and reestablish truth to their now formalised and meaningless ceremonies. Jesus came to set them straight. He was the last in a long line of prophets who were sent by the owner of the vineyard, all of whom they killed. Would they kill the Son also?

When Jesus entered the temple for the first time He found it a mess.
So Jesus went about to clean up His Father's house.
John 2:13 And the Jews’ passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem,
14 And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables;
16 And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father’s house an house of merchandise.
17 And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.


Then, later on in His ministry, again He visited the temple, only to find it had reverted to what it had been before, So, again Jesus cleansed it.

Mathew 21:12 ¶ And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,
13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.


When the Jews questioned Jesus authority, He told them the following parable.



Mathew 21:33 ¶ Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:
34 And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.
35 And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.
36 Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.
37 But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.
38 But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.
39 And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.
40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?
41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.
42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord’s doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.
45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.
46 But when they sought to lay hands on him, they feared the multitude, because they took him for a prophet.


Notice this very important thing. When cleansing the temple the first time, Jesus called it My Father's house.

At the second cleansing, Jesus quoted the OT and referred to it again as being My house.

Continuing to reject Jesus authority and teaching however, brought upon the religious rulers the woes of Mathew 23. Denunciations of no mean character and judgment.
Jesus laments their obstinacy and rebellion with His heart rendering cry of "O Jerusalem,Jerusalem. thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Then take careful note. He finishes His address with the following words.
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.


Whose house is it now? Is it God's house? No.His Father's house? No. My house? No. He says Your house!!! They rejected the Son, therefore the kingdom was given to a nation that would bear the fruit and fulfill the purposes that God originally intended. The church. A holy nation, a royal priesthood.

Has God rejected His people though? No. They can still be grafted back into the vine, but they must first renounce and repent of their rejection of their Messiah and accept Him. Then, and only then, can any Jew enter the kingdom of God. Same condition as set out for anyone else. "No man cometh unto the Father except by Me."
 
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hiscosmicgoldfish

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glad to see someones thinking straight.


Commentary on Ezekiel by Dr Peter Pett BA BD (Hons London) DD

Thus Peter and James could describe Christians as ‘the twelve tribes which are of the Dispersion’ (James 1.1) or as ‘the elect who are sojourners of the Dispersion’ (1 Peter 1.1) (the Dispersion was the name given to Jews scattered around the world). Neither give any hint that they are distinguishing between Jewish and Gentile Christians, which would be remarkable if it were so, especially as Peter in his letter refers to Gentiles as non-Christians.

So ‘Israel’ has always been a fluid conception and the church was seen to be Israel in truth, not just some vague idea of a ‘spiritual Israel’. Indeed the above facts exclude anyone else as being finally seen as Israel by the church. The Jews were the Jews. The church was the true Israel, foreknown by God (Romans 11.2 compare 8.29). It is true that Paul calls the Jews ‘Israel’ in Romans 9-11, but he also specifically says there that they were not really Israel (Romans 9.6). The elect were Israel. The rest were blinded. Indeed all who are truly Israel will be saved (Romans 11.26). So he did not see the old Israel as really Israel any more. It was not a question of Israel being superseded by the church, the church was seen as the true continuation of Israel.
 
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Biblewriter

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Deut. 28:1 ¶ And it shall come to pass, if thou shalt hearken diligently unto the voice of the LORD thy God, to observe and to do all his commandments which I command thee this day, that the LORD thy God will set thee on high above all nations of the earth:

All the blessings of God, all the subsequent prophecies and promises of God of establishment of the nation, were conditional on obedience.

It would be difficult to make a more erroneous statement about scripture. We are repeatedly told that the promises to Abraham and to David were unconditional.

For what purpose was Israel chosen in the first place? Was it not to reveal the character and love of God to as world lost in idolatry and pagan perversions?
Not only so, but also for the fact that God loved man so much that He simply wanted to have someone to fellowship with. So He chose Abraham, and accepted His descendants as His special people because of Abraham's obedience. God's continuing favour was conditional however on Israel's continuing obedience and faithfulnass. God certainly promised that He would never reject them, but He gave many warnings of what would result of their rejecting Him.

But He also promised that after they were cast out for their rebellion, He would again bring them to repentance.

By the time of Jesus, the national religion was so corrupted that they were suffering relentlessly under the harsh rule of an occupying power. A fulfilment of one of the warnings. That Jesus came though confirms God's faithfulness. He had not yet rejected them. He was giving them every opportunity to repent, and reestablish truth to their now formalised and meaningless ceremonies. Jesus came to set them straight. He was the last in a long line of prophets who were sent by the owner of the vineyard, all of whom they killed. Would they kill the Son also?

When Jesus entered the temple for the first time He found it a mess.
So Jesus went about to clean up His Father's house.
John 2:13 And the Jews’ passover was at hand, and Jesus went up to Jerusalem,
14 And found in the temple those that sold oxen and sheep and doves, and the changers of money sitting:
15 And when he had made a scourge of small cords, he drove them all out of the temple, and the sheep, and the oxen; and poured out the changers’ money, and overthrew the tables;
16 And said unto them that sold doves, Take these things hence; make not my Father’s house an house of merchandise.
17 And his disciples remembered that it was written, The zeal of thine house hath eaten me up.


Then, later on in His ministry, again He visited the temple, only to find it had reverted to what it had been before, So, again Jesus cleansed it.

Mathew 21:12 ¶ And Jesus went into the temple of God, and cast out all them that sold and bought in the temple, and overthrew the tables of the moneychangers, and the seats of them that sold doves,
13 And said unto them, It is written, My house shall be called the house of prayer; but ye have made it a den of thieves.


When the Jews questioned Jesus authority, He told them the following parable.



Mathew 21:33 ¶ Hear another parable: There was a certain householder, which planted a vineyard, and hedged it round about, and digged a winepress in it, and built a tower, and let it out to husbandmen, and went into a far country:
34 And when the time of the fruit drew near, he sent his servants to the husbandmen, that they might receive the fruits of it.
35 And the husbandmen took his servants, and beat one, and killed another, and stoned another.
36 Again, he sent other servants more than the first: and they did unto them likewise.
37 But last of all he sent unto them his son, saying, They will reverence my son.
38 But when the husbandmen saw the son, they said among themselves, This is the heir; come, let us kill him, and let us seize on his inheritance.
39 And they caught him, and cast him out of the vineyard, and slew him.
40 When the lord therefore of the vineyard cometh, what will he do unto those husbandmen?
41 They say unto him, He will miserably destroy those wicked men, and will let out his vineyard unto other husbandmen, which shall render him the fruits in their seasons.
42 Jesus saith unto them, Did ye never read in the scriptures, The stone which the builders rejected, the same is become the head of the corner: this is the Lord’s doing, and it is marvellous in our eyes?
43 Therefore say I unto you, The kingdom of God shall be taken from you, and given to a nation bringing forth the fruits thereof.
44 And whosoever shall fall on this stone shall be broken: but on whomsoever it shall fall, it will grind him to powder.
45 And when the chief priests and Pharisees had heard his parables, they perceived that he spake of them.
46 But when they sought to lay hands on him, they feared the multitude, because they took him for a prophet.


Notice this very important thing. When cleansing the temple the first time, Jesus called it My Father's house.

At the second cleansing, Jesus quoted the OT and referred to it again as being My house.

Continuing to reject Jesus authority and teaching however, brought upon the religious rulers the woes of Mathew 23. Denunciations of no mean character and judgment.
Jesus laments their obstinacy and rebellion with His heart rendering cry of "O Jerusalem,Jerusalem. thou that killest the prophets, and stonest them which are sent unto thee, how often would I have gathered thy children together, even as a hen gathereth her chickens under her wings, and ye would not!

Then take careful note. He finishes His address with the following words.
38 Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.

Why did you leave out the next sentence? There was an until in this ststement. Jesus aaid "Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord." This is recorded in both Matthew 23:38-39 and Luke 13:35.

The word "until" clearly shows that this desolation will end when they say "Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord." That time has not come yet, but Zechariah clearly describes it in chapters 12:9-14 and 13:6.

Whose house is it now? Is it God's house? No.His Father's house? No. My house? No. He says Your house!!! They rejected the Son, therefore the kingdom was given to a nation that would bear the fruit and fulfill the purposes that God originally intended. The church. A holy nation, a royal priesthood.
Has God rejected His people though? No. They can still be grafted back into the vine, but they must first renounce and repent of their rejection of their Messiah and accept Him. Then, and only then, can any Jew enter the kingdom of God. Same condition as set out for anyone else. "No man cometh unto the Father except by Me."

And no man, including all Israel, will ever come to the Father in any other way. But the passages I cited from Matthew, Luke, and Zechariah clearly show that Israel will some day say "Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord."
 
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Nearly all Christendom is looking in the wrong direction waiting for prophecy to be fulfilled. Focusing on the nation of Israel in expectation of the fulfilment of end-time events will lead to 2 things. Disappointment and deception. So many are sitting quietly and waiting for the temple to be rebuilt, while all along it has been. And you are it! The church, not the nation of Israel, is the prime object of prophecy. It is the prime focus of God's love and attention in preparation for Jesus return, and it is the prime focus of Satan's war against the saints in order to destroy or deceive them before Jesus returns.
Following is the evidence of why the church is the subject of end-time prophecy with regards to Israel, and not the nation.

So, you are contending that the man of lawlessness will construct an abomination on the pinnacle of Christianity, declaring himself as God? Let me guess, Pope Benedict or the future Pope Madariaga, Javier Solana Madariaga's namesake? That Kool Aid definitely has an SDA aftertaste--I'm feeling a touch woozy at this point:priest::mad::mad::mad:

The name "Israel" first appears in the Bible in Genesis 32:28 After a night of wrestling with the heavenly visitor (who I personally believe to be Christ Himself) Jacob prevails in his efforts and his name is changed from Jacob, the deceiver or supplanter, to Israel, meaning he will rule. Jacob has prevailed with God and overcome.

Israel means, "one who strives with God." Israel, the nation, has been true to its name throughout its history from Israel (the man) to the present, suffering upheaval, division, forced assimilation, captivity, dispersion, etc. It took a Holocaust to bring Jews back to their homeland!

This mass genocide/persecution during WWII was prophesied through the Prophet Jeremiah:


18:14 “Therefore behold, the days are coming,” says the LORD, “that it shall no more be said, ‘The LORD lives who brought up the children of Israel from the land of Egypt,’ 15 but, ‘The LORD lives who brought up the children of Israel from the land of the north and from all the lands where He had driven them.’ For I will bring them back into their land which I gave to their fathers.
16 “Behold, I will send for many fishermen,” says the LORD, “and they shall fish them; and afterward I will send for many hunters, and they shall hunt them from every mountain and every hill, and out of the holes of the rocks. 17 For My eyes
are on all their ways; they are not hidden from My face, nor is their iniquity hidden from My eyes. 18 And first I will repay double for their iniquity and their sin, because they have defiled My land; they have filled My inheritance with the carcasses of their detestable and abominable idols.”


... True Israel are those people, of whatever nation kindred tongue and people, who by faith in the mercy grace and power of God overcome sin and receive Christ's righteousness and forgiveness as a gift and are willing to share that gift with the lost
. True Israel was always exclusively those who "as princes had power with God and men and prevailed".

Your statement contradicts the OT account. The few faithful heroes of the OT were "gray" characters refined in the fires of affliction
. For the most part, Israel, the nation, is a worldly, stiff-necked, rebellious people that took 40 years to walk a 12 day journey! Only 2 of the thousands that left Israel reached the promised land. Moses was not among them. Israel was special because YHWH chose Israel--not the other way around! Israelites suffered much more defeat and misery than triumphs and glory.

Romans 11:11 I say then, have they (Israel) stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!
13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy
those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
16 For if the firstfruit
is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree, 18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well
said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in
His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.

Here we are, one generation since Israel recaptured Jerusalem and they have joined a covenant confirmed with many as prophesied in Daniel 9:24-27 (The European Neighborhood Policy agreement). 144,000 Jews will be sealed after the Tribulation has passed and the Day of the Lord has begun. (Rev. 6,7)

SDA's spend more time than most denominations studying the OT and have contributed much to our understanding of the Gospel and Eschatology. I am most fond of the Gospel & Prophecy teachings of Dr. Desmond Ford (too bad the SDA excommunicated him).

Unfortunately, to their detriment, the SDA's self-imposed isolation has led to interpretive myopia and many heretical beliefs--the worst of which is that somehow they have supplanted God's chosen people--the Jews.

Their second-worst heresy is the de facto removal of Romans 14 from their canon, which has produced a prejudicial view of Christians who choose to worship and praise the Lord on a day other than the Sabbath. So much has this myopic view permeated SDA culture that they have demonized the rest of Christianity, calling Sunday worship "the mark of the beast." Even a casual reading of Romans 14 reveals the heresy of such a doctrine.

You seem to have written this OP with godly intentions. However, in your zeal to serve your heavenly Father, you have run past the cross of Calvary and like the Apostle Paul, have unwittingly set out to condemn those who belong to Christ (including the Jews), who will join Him in the Day of the Lord.

May I suggest that while you are at CF, please resist the temptation to "slam dance" in this Eschatological "mosh pit" and seek out Biblical exegesis and Scriptural interpretations in other CF subforums that will complement your SDA scholarship. Christianity is a corporate (community) experience, after all:groupray::wave:
 
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Hismessenger

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The fact of it is that the Israel of God has not returned to the land for He said that He would bring them back. And when he brings them back, NO ONE would make them afraid.

I ask is this the atmosphere in The land of Israel now. I think the answer is pretty apparent. The people who are there now are not all Israel but children of the flesh. They are there for the sacrifice of God so that the true Israel might be made manifest in the latter days. Let me clarify my last statement so that there can be no misunderstanding of what I am saying. The people there now are physical Israel, descendant from Issac Jacob and Abraham. But the word says that all Israel is not Israel for they are the children of the flesh. It is to the children of promise, the true Israel that the land will be given forever. The children of promise are those who believe in the risen savior and live by the grace afforded them by his death burial and resurrection.
If you don't believe it do a study in the scripture where God says that He will bring the people back into their own land and what the surrounding nations think of them when they are come.

hismessenger
 
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DArceri

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The people there now are physical Israel, descendant from Issac Jacob and Abraham. But the word says that all Israel is not Israel for they are the children of the flesh. It is to the children of promise, the true Israel that the land will be given forever. The children of promise are those who believe in the risen savior and live by the grace afforded them by his death burial and resurrection.
hismessenger
RIGHT, physical Israel is not the children of God, especially if they rebuild their physical temple!!! What God-pleasing sacrifice could they possibly offer to God at that alter???? It should be obvious to all christians that any temple that is rebuilt by the Jews for sacrificial purposes would be an abomination to the Lord and would be considered a synogogue of Satan. Jews that worship there are doomed for destruction.
 
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hiscosmicgoldfish

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The fact of it is that the Israel of God has not returned to the land for He said that He would bring them back. And when he brings them back, NO ONE would make them afraid.

I ask is this the atmosphere in The land of Israel now. I think the answer is pretty apparent. The people who are there now are not all Israel but children of the flesh. They are there for the sacrifice of God so that the true Israel might be made manifest in the latter days. Let me clarify my last statement so that there can be no misunderstanding of what I am saying. The people there now are physical Israel, descendant from Issac Jacob and Abraham. But the word says that all Israel is not Israel for they are the children of the flesh. It is to the children of promise, the true Israel that the land will be given forever. The children of promise are those who believe in the risen savior and live by the grace afforded them by his death burial and resurrection.
If you don't believe it do a study in the scripture where God says that He will bring the people back into their own land and what the surrounding nations think of them when they are come.

hismessenger

No they arn't.
 
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brakelite

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It would be difficult to make a more erroneous statement about scripture. We are repeatedly told that the promises to Abraham and to David were unconditional.
So there must be plenty of examples you can quote.........?


But He also promised that after they were cast out for their rebellion, He would again bring them to repentance.
No, He promised them that IF they repented, He would THEN forgive them. They didn't, not as a nation anyway, and He didn't, nor will, forgive them as a nation.Their house was left to them DESOLATE. He WILL forgive them IF they come to Jesus as individuals.


Why did you leave out the next sentence? There was an until in this ststement. Jesus aaid "Behold, your house is left unto you desolate.For I say unto you, Ye shall not see me henceforth, till ye shall say, Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord." This is recorded in both Matthew 23:38-39 and Luke 13:35.
Ah yes. Here is another scripture describing the same event.
Re 1:7 Behold, he cometh with clouds; and every eye shall see him, and they also which pierced him: and all kindreds of the earth shall wail because of him. Even so, Amen.


Here is another;
15 And the kings of the earth, and the great men, and the rich men, and the chief captains, and the mighty men, and every bondman, and every free man, hid themselves in the dens and in the rocks of the mountains;
16 And said to the mountains and rocks, Fall on us, and hide us from the face of him that sitteth on the throne, and from the wrath of the Lamb:
17 For the great day of his wrath is come; and who shall be able to stand?


The word "until" clearly shows that this desolation will end when they say "Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord." That time has not come yet, but Zechariah clearly describes it in chapters 12:9-14 and 13:6.
Yep, the children of Israel will certainly be saying that at His coming. I have a hope that I will be one of them. Do you?

And no man, including all Israel, will ever come to the Father in any other way. But the passages I cited from Matthew, Luke, and Zechariah clearly show that Israel will some day say "Blessed is he that cometh in the name of the Lord."
Yes, but what Israel? The nation? Never.
 
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brakelite

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Your statement contradicts the OT account. The few faithful heroes of the OT were "gray" characters refined in the fires of affliction
. For the most part, Israel, the nation, is a worldly, stiff-necked, rebellious people that took 40 years to walk a 12 day journey! Only 2 of the thousands that left Israel reached the promised land. Moses was not among them. Israel was special because YHWH chose Israel--not the other way around! Israelites suffered much more defeat and misery than triumphs and glory.

Romans 11:11 I say then, have they (Israel) stumbled that they should fall? Certainly not! But through their fall, to provoke them to jealousy, salvation has come to the Gentiles. 12 Now if their fall is riches for the world, and their failure riches for the Gentiles, how much more their fullness!
13 For I speak to you Gentiles; inasmuch as I am an apostle to the Gentiles, I magnify my ministry, 14 if by any means I may provoke to jealousy
those who are my flesh and save some of them. 15 For if their being cast away is the reconciling of the world, what will their acceptance be but life from the dead?
16 For if the firstfruit
is holy, the lump is also holy; and if the root is holy, so are the branches. 17 And if some of the branches were broken off, and you, being a wild olive tree, were grafted in among them, and with them became a partaker of the root and fatness of the olive tree, 18 do not boast against the branches. But if you do boast, remember that you do not support the root, but the root supports you.
19 You will say then, “Branches were broken off that I might be grafted in.” 20 Well
said. Because of unbelief they were broken off, and you stand by faith. Do not be haughty, but fear. 21 For if God did not spare the natural branches, He may not spare you either. 22 Therefore consider the goodness and severity of God: on those who fell, severity; but toward you, goodness, if you continue in
His goodness. Otherwise you also will be cut off.

Here we are, one generation since Israel recaptured Jerusalem and they have joined a covenant confirmed with many as prophesied in Daniel 9:24-27 (The European Neighborhood Policy agreement). 144,000 Jews will be sealed after the Tribulation has passed and the Day of the Lord has begun. (Rev. 6,7)

SDA's spend more time than most denominations studying the OT and have contributed much to our understanding of the Gospel and Eschatology. I am most fond of the Gospel & Prophecy teachings of Dr. Desmond Ford (too bad the SDA excommunicated him).
You claim gratitude for SDA contribution to your understanding of theology then say your favourite SDA is one who was disfellowshipped teaching contrary theology. Huh???


Unfortunately, to their detriment, the SDA's self-imposed isolation has led to interpretive myopia and many heretical beliefs--the worst of which is that somehow they have supplanted God's chosen people--the Jews.
Not only do you need to reread my post again, I think you need to read the Bible again. Peter was writing to Christians when he said they were a chosen nation. He was not writing to the nation. And nowhere did I claim that the SDA church has replaced Israel .


Their second-worst heresy is the de facto removal of Romans 14 from their canon, which has produced a prejudicial view of Christians who choose to worship and praise the Lord on a day other than the Sabbath. So much has this myopic view permeated SDA culture that they have demonized the rest of Christianity, calling Sunday worship "the mark of the beast." Even a casual reading of Romans 14 reveals the heresy of such a doctrine.
Mmmmm. So therefore Romans 14 somehow contradicts Jesus command that if we love Him, we should keep His commandments. And if the 'day' that Romans 14 is talking about is in fact the Sabbath as you would have us believe, then it also contradicts Jesus' statement that till heaven and earth pass, so the law will remain. When did Paul contradict the teachings of Jesus?


You seem to have written this OP with godly intentions. However, in your zeal to serve your heavenly Father, you have run past the cross of Calvary and like the Apostle Paul, have unwittingly set out to condemn those who belong to Christ (including the Jews), who will join Him in the Day of the Lord.
I am extremely flattered that you have compared me to Paul, but it is quite undeserved, believe me.


May I suggest that while you are at CF, please resist the temptation to "slam dance" in this Eschatological "mosh pit" and seek out Biblical exegesis and Scriptural interpretations in other CF subforums that will complement your SDA scholarship.
No . you may not.

Christianity is a corporate (community) experience, after all:groupray::wave:
Which is why I am staying where my SDA scholarship as you so generously describe, is needed most.After all. it was you that said we have so much to contribute, yeah?
 
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Biblewriter

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The fact of it is that the Israel of God has not returned to the land for He said that He would bring them back. And when he brings them back, NO ONE would make them afraid.

I ask is this the atmosphere in The land of Israel now. I think the answer is pretty apparent.

You are unquestionably correct about this.

The people who are there now are not all Israel but children of the flesh. They are there for the sacrifice of God so that the true Israel might be made manifest in the latter days. Let me clarify my last statement so that there can be no misunderstanding of what I am saying. The people there now are physical Israel, descendant from Issac Jacob and Abraham. But the word says that all Israel is not Israel for they are the children of the flesh.

This is as wrong as the first part is right. The Bible most absolutely does not say that "all Israel is not Israel." It says "they are not all Israel which are of Israel." (Romans 9:6)

Your statement says that the true Israel is something different from all Israel. But the statement you imagined you were citing says that not every member of the nation of Israel is a true Israelite. These two thoughts are fundamentally different.

It is to the children of promise, the true Israel that the land will be given forever. The children of promise are those who believe in the risen savior and live by the grace afforded them by his death burial and resurrection.
The child of promise in this passage was Isaac.

If you don't believe it do a study in the scripture where God says that He will bring the people back into their own land and what the surrounding nations think of them when they are come.

hismessenger

He will most assuredly bring them back into the land. But He will not only bring them into the land. he will bring all of them into the land. (see the following from Ezekiel 36)

"8But ye, O mountains of Israel, ye shall shoot forth your branches, and yield your fruit to my people of Israel; for they are at hand to come. 9For, behold, I am for you, and I will turn unto you, and ye shall be tilled and sown: 10And I will multiply men upon you, all the house of Israel, even all of it: and the cities shall be inhabited, and the wastes shall be builded: 11And I will multiply upon you man and beast; and they shall increase and bring fruit: and I will settle you after your old estates, and will do better unto you than at your beginnings: and ye shall know that I am the LORD. 12Yea, I will cause men to walk upon you, even my people Israel; and they shall possess thee, and thou shalt be their inheritance, and thou shalt no more henceforth bereave them of men."

There is no way that all "who believe in the risen savior and live by the grace afforded them by his death burial and resurrection" could ever fit into the land of Israel.
 
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Biblewriter

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Originally Posted by Biblewriter
It would be difficult to make a more erroneous statement about scripture. We are repeatedly told that the promises to Abraham and to David were unconditional.
So there must be plenty of examples you can quote.........?

Yes, there indeed are. As I have already presented many of them, I will simply give thess links to the threads.
The unfulfilled promise to Abraham.
The Bible tells us of many promises made by God to Abraham. The best known of these is:
“Then the Angel of the Lord called to Abraham a second time out of heaven, and said: ‘By Myself I have sworn, says the Lord, because you have done this thing, and have not withheld your son, your only son—blessing I will bless you, and multiplying I will multiply your descendants as the stars of the heaven and as the sand which is on the seashore; and your descendants shall possess the gate of their enemies. In your seed all the nations of the earth shall be blessed, because you have obeyed My voice.’” Genesis 22:15-18

This promise is so well known because it is cited in the New Testament. We read in Hebrews 6:13-20, “For when God made a promise to Abraham, because He could swear by no one greater, He swore by Himself, 14saying, ‘Surely blessing I will bless you, and multiplying I will multiply you.’ And so, after he had patiently endured, he obtained the promise. For men indeed swear by the greater, and an oath for confirmation is for them an end of all dispute. Thus God, determining to show more abundantly to the heirs of promise the immutability of His counsel, confirmed it by an oath, that by two immutable things, in which it is impossible for God to lie, we might have strong consolation, who have fled for refuge to lay hold of the hope set before us.”

We begin with this promise because we have specific scriptural authority for pointing out that this was an unconditional promise. But this was not the only unconditional promise made to Abraham. We read again:

"And the Lord said to Abram, after Lot had separated from him: ‘Lift your eyes now and look from the place where you are—northward, southward, eastward, and westward; for all the land which you see I give to you and your descendants forever. And I will make your descendants as the dust of the earth; so that if a man could number the dust of the earth, then your descendants also could be numbered. Arise, walk in the land through its length and its width, for I give it to you.’” Genesis 13:14-17

“When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, ‘I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.’ Then Abram fell on his face, and God talked with him, saying: ‘As for Me, behold, My covenant is with you, and you shall be a father of many nations. No longer shall your name be called Abram, but your name shall be Abraham; for I have made you a father of many nations. I will make you exceedingly fruitful; and I will make nations of you, and kings shall come from you. And I will establish My covenant between Me and you and your descendants after you in their generations, for an everlasting covenant, to be God to you and your descendants after you. Also I give to you and your descendants after you the land in which you are a stranger, all the land of Canaan, as an everlasting possession; and I will be their God.” Genesis 17:1-8

In these places the land is promised to the descendants of Abraham “forever” and “for an everlasting possession.” This is not just an interpretation of the promises. Again, we have specific scriptural authority to say it means exactly this. We read in Psalm 105: 7-12:

“He is the Lord our God;
His judgments are in all the earth.
He remembers His covenant forever,
The word which He commanded, for a thousand generations,
The covenant which He made with Abraham,
And His oath to Isaac,
And confirmed it to Jacob for a statute,
To Israel as an everlasting covenant,
Saying, ‘To you I will give the land of Canaan
As the allotment of your inheritance,’
When they were few in number,
Indeed very few, and strangers in it.”

The Hebrew word rendered “forever” in Genesis 13:15 and “everlasting” in Genesis 17:7-8 is “olam.” This word properly means “concealed,” but generally means “time out of mind.” What, specifically, does that mean? In Psalm 105:8 the Holy Spirit interprets this Hebrew word to mean “unto a thousand generations,” or possibly “unto a thousand ages.” If we were to use the shorter possibility, and shorten an average generation to only twenty years, this would still mean twenty thousand years. Since Abraham lived approximately four thousand years ago, this would mean the promise will remain in force for at least another 16,000 years! Thus we see that in these places, the Holy Spirit’s intended meaning of the Hebrew word “olam” is the same as the meaning of our words “forever” and “everlasting.” Thus we see that The land of Canaan was promised to Abraham’s descendants for, at the very least, another 16,000 years.


But how large a tract of land was promised to Abraham?

“On the same day the Lord made a covenant with Abram, saying:
‘To your descendants I have given this land, from the river of Egypt to the great river, the River Euphrates—the Kenites, the Kenezzites, the Kadmonites, the Hittites, the Perizzites, the Rephaim, the Amorites, the Canaanites, the Girgashites, and the Jebusites.’” Genesis 15:18-21

While in ancient times, Abraham’s descendants occupied the land north of the river of Egypt (this is a small stream at the southern end of ancient Judah, not the Nile), they never reached even nearly to the Euphrates. So there remains a very large tract of land promised to Abraham’s descendants which they have never yet occupied.

So we see that there is a promise to Abraham that his descendants would inherit a very large tract of land, which they have never held, and that the shortest possible interpretation of the term of the promise is for another 16,000 years. Thus I conclude that it is beyond debate that there remains an unfulfilled promise to Abraham.


The unfulfilled promise to David
Psalm 89:20 I have found David my servant; with my holy oil have I anointed him:

21 With whom my hand shall be established: mine arm also shall strengthen him.

22 The enemy shall not exact upon him; nor the son of wickedness afflict him.

23 And I will beat down his foes before his face, and plague them that hate him.

24 But my faithfulness and my mercy shall be with him: and in my name shall his horn be exalted.

25 I will set his hand also in the sea, and his right hand in the rivers.

26 He shall cry unto me, Thou art my father, my God, and the rock of my salvation.

27 Also I will make him my firstborn, higher than the kings of the earth.

28 My mercy will I keep for him for evermore, and my covenant shall stand fast with him.

29 His seed also will I make to endure for ever, and his throne as the days of heaven.

30 If his children forsake my law, and walk not in my judgments;

31 If they break my statutes, and keep not my commandments;

32 Then will I visit their transgression with the rod, and their iniquity with stripes.

33 Nevertheless my lovingkindness will I not utterly take from him, nor suffer my faithfulness to fail.

34 My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.

35 Once have I sworn by my holiness that I will not lie unto David.

36 His seed shall endure for ever, and his throne as the sun before me.

37 It shall be established for ever as the moon, and as a faithful witness in heaven.

Selah

These words are so strongly stated as to leave no "wiggle room" to naysayers. Here the Lord specifically and expressly states that His covenant with David is so strong that even sin cannot cancel it.

More scriptures could be given. But this passage is conclusive.

(All scripture quotations are from the NKJV)
 
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Biblewriter

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Originally Posted by Biblewriter
But He also promised that after they were cast out for their rebellion, He would again bring them to repentance.


No, He promised them that IF they repented, He would THEN forgive them. They didn't, not as a nation anyway, and He didn't, nor will, forgive them as a nation.Their house was left to them DESOLATE. He WILL forgive them IF they come to Jesus as individuals.

The unfulfilled promise of Israel's repentence.
Here are twelve places where we are specifically told that Israel will eventually repent, and how God will make this happen.

“Now therefore, thus says the Lord, the God of Israel, concerning this city of which you say, ‘It shall be delivered into the hand of the king of Babylon by the sword, by the famine, and by the pestilence: Behold, I will gather them out of all countries where I have driven them in My anger, in My fury, and in great wrath; I will bring them back to this place, and I will cause them to dwell safely. They shall be My people, and I will be their God; then I will give them one heart and one way, that they may fear Me forever, for the good of them and their children after them. And I will make an everlasting covenant with them, that I will not turn away from doing them good; but I will put My fear in their hearts so that they will not depart from Me. Yes, I will rejoice over them to do them good, and I will assuredly plant them in this land, with all My heart and with all My soul.’” (Jeremiah 32:36-41)

“Behold, the days are coming, says the Lord, when I will make a new covenant with the house of Israel and with the house of Judah—not according to the covenant that I made with their fathers in the day that I took them by the hand to lead them out of the land of Egypt, My covenant which they broke, £though I was a husband to them, says the Lord. But this is the covenant that I will make with the house of Israel after those days, says the Lord: I will put My law in their minds, and write it on their hearts; and I will be their God, and they shall be My people. No more shall every man teach his neighbor, and every man his brother, saying, ‘Know the Lord,’ for they all shall know Me, from the least of them to the greatest of them, says the Lord. For I will forgive their iniquity, and their sin I will remember no more.” (Jeremiah 31:31-34)

“And it shall come to pass in all the land,”
Says the Lord,
“That two-thirds in it shall be cut off and die,
But one-third shall be left in it:
I will bring the one-third through the fire,
Will refine them as silver is refined,
And test them as gold is tested.
They will call on My name,
And I will answer them.
I will say, ‘This is My people’;
And each one will say, ‘The Lord is my God.’” (Zechariah 13:8-9)

Therefore thus says the Lord, who redeemed Abraham, concerning the house of Jacob:
“Jacob shall not now be ashamed,
Nor shall his face now grow pale;
But when he sees his children,
The work of My hands, in his midst,
They will hallow My name,
And hallow the Holy One of Jacob,
And fear the God of Israel.
These also who erred in spirit will come to understanding,
And those who complained will learn doctrine.” (Isaiah 29:22-24)

“And I will pour on the house of David and on the inhabitants of Jerusalem the Spirit of grace and supplication; then they will look on Me whom they pierced. Yes, they will mourn for Him as one mourns for his only son, and grieve for Him as one grieves for a firstborn. In that day there shall be a great mourning in Jerusalem, like the mourning at Hadad Rimmon in the plain of Megiddo. And the land shall mourn, every family by itself: the family of the house of David by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the house of Nathan by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of the house of Levi by itself, and their wives by themselves; the family of Shimei by itself, and their wives by themselves; all the families that remain, every family by itself, and their wives by themselves. (Zechariah 12:10-14)

“Therefore say to the house of Israel, ‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “I do not do this for your sake, O house of Israel, but for My holy name’s sake, which you have profaned among the nations wherever you went. And I will sanctify My great name, which has been profaned among the nations, which you have profaned in their midst; and the nations shall know that I am the Lord,” says the Lord GOD, “when I am hallowed in you before their eyes. For I will take you from among the nations, gather you out of all countries, and bring you into your own land. Then I will sprinkle clean water on you, and you shall be clean; I will cleanse you from all your filthiness and from all your idols. I will give you a new heart and put a new spirit within you; I will take the heart of stone out of your flesh and give you a heart of flesh. I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will keep My judgments and do them. Then you shall dwell in the land that I gave to your fathers; you shall be My people, and I will be your God. I will deliver you from all your uncleannesses. I will call for the grain and multiply it, and bring no famine upon you. And I will multiply the fruit of your trees and the increase of your fields, so that you need never again bear the reproach of famine among the nations. Then you will remember your evil ways and your deeds that were not good; and you will loathe yourselves in your own sight, for your iniquities and your abominations. Not for your sake do I do this,” says the Lord GOD, “let it be known to you. Be ashamed and confounded for your own ways, O house of Israel!”

As I live, saith the Lord GOD, surely with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out, will I rule over you: And I will bring you out from the people, and will gather you out of the countries wherein ye are scattered, with a mighty hand, and with a stretched out arm, and with fury poured out. And I will bring you into the wilderness of the people, and there will I plead with you face to face. Like as I pleaded with your fathers in the wilderness of the land of Egypt, so will I plead with you, saith the Lord GOD. And I will cause you to pass under the rod, and I will bring you into the bond of the covenant: And I will purge out from among you the rebels, and them that transgress against me: I will bring them forth out of the country where they sojourn, and they shall not enter into the land of Israel: and ye shall know that I am the LORD. (Ezekiel 20:33-38)

And it shall come to pass that he who is left in Zion and remains in Jerusalem will be called holy—everyone who is recorded among the living in Jerusalem. When the Lord has washed away the filth of the daughters of Zion, and purged the blood of Jerusalem from her midst, by the spirit of judgment and by the spirit of burning. (Isaiah 4:3-4)

In that day you shall not be shamed for any of your deeds
In which you transgress against Me;
For then I will take away from your midst
Those who rejoice in your pride,
And you shall no longer be haughty
In My holy mountain.
I will leave in your midst
A meek and humble people,
And they shall trust in the name of the Lord.
The remnant of Israel shall do no unrighteousness
And speak no lies,
Nor shall a deceitful tongue be found in their mouth;
For they shall feed their flocks and lie down,
And no one shall make them afraid.” (Zephaniah 3:11-13)

“At that time Jerusalem shall be called The Throne of the Lord, and all the nations shall be gathered to it, to the name of the Lord, to Jerusalem. No more shall they follow the dictates of their evil hearts.
“In those days the house of Judah shall walk with the house of Israel, and they shall come together out of the land of the north to the land that I have given as an inheritance to your fathers. (Jeremiah 3:17-18)

‘Thus says the Lord GOD: “On the day that I cleanse you from all your iniquities, I will also enable you to dwell in the cities, and the ruins shall be rebuilt. The desolate land shall be tilled instead of lying desolate in the sight of all who pass by. So they will say, ‘This land that was desolate has become like the garden of Eden; and the wasted, desolate, and ruined cities are now fortified and inhabited.’ Then the nations which are left all around you shall know that I, the Lord, have rebuilt the ruined places and planted what was desolate. I, the Lord, have spoken it, and I will do it.” (Ezekiel 36:22-36)

(All scripture quotations are from the NKJV.)
 
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brakelite

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“When Abram was ninety-nine years old, the Lord appeared to Abram and said to him, ‘I am Almighty God; walk before Me and be blameless. And I will make My covenant between Me and you, and will multiply you exceedingly.’

This I quote from your own post in an attempt to convince me that God's promises are unconditional. Forgive me for being possibly a little naive and accepting the Bible as written, but it seems to me that the bolded portion is a condition.

Gen. 26:1 ¶ And there was a famine in the land, beside the first famine that was in the days of Abraham. And Isaac went unto Abimelech king of the Philistines unto Gerar.
2 And the LORD appeared unto him, and said, Go not down into Egypt; dwell in the land which I shall tell thee of:
3 Sojourn in this land, and I will be with thee, and will bless thee; for unto thee, and unto thy seed, I will give all these countries, and I will perform the oath which I sware unto Abraham thy father;
4 And I will make thy seed to multiply as the stars of heaven, and will give unto thy seed all these countries; and in thy seed shall all the nations of the earth be blessed;
5 Because that Abraham obeyed my voice, and kept my charge, my commandments, my statutes, and my laws.

This is a promise to Isaac, a confirmation of the same promise to his father. Please note the last verse. There is a reason God is keeping His promise, because Abraham met the condition laid down for all eternity and still applies to the promises of eternal life to Christians today, that is obedience to all God's commandments.
 
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