One big boulder...

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david_x

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Common question to disprove the existence of Him:

Can He make a rock so big that He can't lift it?

A well conceived question by the limited human intellect. The reality being that we understand Him as a paradox. Therefore He can and He cannot, both one hundred percent...

Best possible way to answer the question, or something else?
 

Bellicus

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I've been thinking about it earlier, and the way I see it God can create a rock that is so heavy that He can't lift it, but He can also lift it. That seem to be the illogical nature of God to me.

He can make a burger so delicious that He can't resist it, but He can resist it.

Paradoxes and impossibilities is not something that can stop Him, cause everything is possible for Him.
 
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one11

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Common question to disprove the existence of Him:

Can He make a rock so big that He can't lift it?

A well conceived question by the limited human intellect. The reality being that we understand Him as a paradox. Therefore He can and He cannot, both one hundred percent...

Best possible way to answer the question, or something else?

To me that is the stupidest question I've ever heard.

God has far wiser things to do than play games.
 
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LightSeaker

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Common question to disprove the existence of Him:

Can He make a rock so big that He can't lift it?

A well conceived question by the limited human intellect. The reality being that we understand Him as a paradox. Therefore He can and He cannot, both one hundred percent...

Best possible way to answer the question, or something else?
I don't know how to separate God from that which He Created. Given that perspective, I'd have to ask the question a bit differently: Can God lift Himself?

.
 
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Tissue

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Pray tell, what is so logical about our situation.

How does something come about from nothing, reactions neither increase or decrease the amount of matter it remains constant. But it came from somewhere. Logically logic does not always apply.

There is nothing outside of logic. To affirm the illogical is to affirm meaninglessness. To affirm God is illogical is to remove meaning from God. God is thoroughly logical.
 
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Tissue

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1. The study of the principles of reasoning, especially of the structure of propositions as distinguished from their content and of method and validity in deductive reasoning.

That one is more precise, I think.

Regardless, that is the strict nature in which I mean it, which is much more formal and strong than the sense in which you mean it.
 
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SpiritualAntiseptic

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Common question to disprove the existence of Him:

Can He make a rock so big that He can't lift it?

A well conceived question by the limited human intellect. The reality being that we understand Him as a paradox. Therefore He can and He cannot, both one hundred percent...

Best possible way to answer the question, or something else?

What you are asking is if an infinite force can create something with infinite counterforce. The only way a rock would have infinite counter force is if had infinite weight.

The answer to your question is quite simple. God is able to move every object He creates. According to Aristotle, God (Logos) is the primary mover, therefore He can cause the moving of every object within creation.
 
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david_x

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What you are asking is if an infinite force can create something with infinite counterforce. The only way a rock would have infinite counter force is if had infinite weight.

The answer to your question is quite simple. God is able to move every object He creates. According to Aristotle, God (Logos) is the primary mover, therefore He can cause the moving of every object within creation.

That is correct, but only part of the power of God. He is also an all powerful creator, therefore he can make an object so big that he can't move it. (Even though he can) paradox...
 
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AvgJoe

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Common question to disprove the existence of Him:

Can He make a rock so big that He can't lift it?

A well conceived question by the limited human intellect. The reality being that we understand Him as a paradox. Therefore He can and He cannot, both one hundred percent...

Best possible way to answer the question, or something else?

This question is representative of the type of paradoxes atheists use in attempts to prove that God cannot exist. It works like this. God is supposed to be omnipotent. If He is omnipotent, then He can create a rock so big that He can't pick it up. If He cannot make a rock like this, then He is not omnipotent. If He can make a rock so big He can't pick it up, then He isn't omnipotent either. Either way demonstrates that God cannot do something. Therefore God is not omnipotent. Therefore God does not exist.

Is this logical? A little. However, the problem is that this bit of logic omits some crucial information, therefore, it's conclusion is inaccurate.

What the above "paradox" lacks is vital information concerning God's nature. His omnipotence is not something independent of His nature. It is part of His nature. God has a nature and His attributes operate within that nature, as does anything and everything else.

For example, I have human nature. I can run. But, I cannot outrun a lion. My nature simply does not permit it. My ability to run is connected to my nature and I cannot violate it. So too with God. His omnipotence is connected to His nature since being omnipotent is part of what He is. Omnipotence, then, must be consistent with what He is and not with what He is not since His omnipotence is not an entity to itself. Therefore, God can only do those things that are consistent with His nature. He cannot lie because it is against His nature to do so. Not being able to lie does not mean He is not God or that He is not all powerful. Also, He cannot cease to be God. Since He is in all places at all times, if He stopped existing then He wouldn't be in all places at all time. Therefore, He cannot cease to exist without violating His own nature.

The point is that God cannot do something that is a violation of His own existence and nature. Therefore, He cannot make a rock so big he can't pick up, or make something bigger than Himself, etc. But, not being able to do this does not mean He is not God nor that He is not omnipotent. Omnipotence is not the ability to do anything conceivable, but the ability to do anything consistent with His nature and consistent with His desire within the realm of His unlimited and universal power which we do not possess. This does not mean He can violate His own nature. If He did something inconsistent with His nature, then He would be self contradictory. If God were self contradictory, He would not be true. Likewise, if He did something that violated his nature, like make a rock so big He can't pick it up, He would also not be true since that would be a self contradiction. Since truth is not self contradictory, as neither is God, if He were not true, then He would not be God. But God is true and not self contradictory, therefore, God cannot do something that violates His own nature.

Another way to look at it is realize that in order for God to make something so big He couldn't pick it up, He would have to make a rock bigger than Himself. Since He is infinite in size, He would have to make something that would be bigger than Himself. Since it is His nature to be the biggest thing in existence because He created all things, He cannot violate His own nature by making a rock that is larger than He.

Also, since a rock, by definition, is not infinitely big, then it isn't logically possible to make a rock, something that is finite in size, be infinite in size (no longer a rock) since only God is infinite in size. At dictionary.com, a rock is defined as a "Relatively hard, naturally formed mineral or petrified matter; stone. a) A relatively small piece or fragment of such material. b) A relatively large body of such material, as a cliff or peak. c) A naturally formed aggregate of mineral matter constituting a significant part of the earth's crust." A rock, by definition is not infinitely large. So, to say that the rock must be so big that God cannot pick it up is to say that the rock is no longer a rock.

What the critics are asking is that God become self contradictory as a proof He doesn't exist. Their assertion is illogical from the start. So what they are doing is trying to get God to be illogical. They want to use illogic to prove God doesn't exist instead of logic. It doesn't work and the "paradox" is self-refuting and invalid.

http://www.carm.org/questions/rock.htm
 
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anonymous1515

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This question is representative of the type of paradoxes atheists use in attempts to prove that God cannot exist.
Can I point out that this paradox isn't used to prove that God does not exist. Instead, it simply shows that omnipotence is a logical impossibility. Thus, it does not disprove the existence of a God - rather, it demonstrates that if a God does exist, it cannot be truly omnipotent. It is still possible that a non-omnipotent God exists.
 
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