Christ Jesus is the Son of God,and not God himself

muarader64

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The source of all creation is God, he is the Creator, whom created all things through his Son, even the living Word of God, Christ Jesus. Christ Jesus is the SON of God, and is not God himself, for there is only ONE God(The Lord of Hosts is his name), and no other.



The First Epistle of Paul to the Corinthians Chap. 8 : 6 states:


But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.






The First Epistle of Paul to Timothy Chap. 2 : 5 states:

For there is one God, and one mediator between God and men, the man Christ Jesus;

6 Who gave himself a ransom for all, to be testified in due time.






It is written that Christ Jesus said unto the Pharisees in The Gospel according to John Chap. 8 : 17:


It is also written in your law, that the testimony of two men is true.

18 I am one that bear witness of myself, and the Father that sent me beareth witness of me.





The Epistle of Paul to the Hebrews Chap. 1 : 1 states:


God, who at sundry times and in divers manners spake in time past unto the fathers by the prophets,

2 Hath in these last days spoken unto us by his Son, whom he hath appointed heir of all things, by whom also he made the worlds;

3 Who being the brightness of his glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high:

4 Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they.







In regards to what is written in:



The Book of Isaiah Chap. 42 : 8:


I am the LORD: that is my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images.




All glory belongs to God, for he's the maker of all things, our Saviour(through Christ Jesus), and provider. He's a God of miracles. We're to give him the glory, and him the praise, and not give the praise that is due to him, nor the glory, to graven images, for they cannot save, nor to Man, for they are fallible, and only God is good, and it is God whom MADE man in the first place and is the possessor of all Wisdom and the giver of. God is infallible.


A definition of glory: praise, great honor, adoration, and thanksgiving given to someone, maybe for something they did, correct?




Also:

The Gospel according to John Chap. 7 : 16 states:

Jesus answered them, and said, My doctrine is not mine, but his that sent me.

17 If any man will do his will, he shall know of the doctrine, whether it be of God, or whether I speak of myself.

18 He that speaketh of himself seeketh his own glory: but he that seeketh his glory that sent him, the same is true, and no unrighteousness is in him.



For God sent Christ Jesus down from earth, and Christ Jesus kept the Father's(God's) commands, and spoke of the Father(God), whom did works through him.




The Gospel according to John Chap. 14 : 8 states:

Philip saith unto him, Lord, shew us the Father, and it sufficeth us.

9 Jesus saith unto him, Have I been so long time with you, and yet hast thou not known me, Philip? he that hath seen me hath seen the Father; and how sayest thou then, Shew us the Father?

10 Believest thou not that I am in the Father, and the Father in me? the words that I speak unto you I speak not of myself: but the Father that dwelleth in me, he doeth the works.

11 Believe me that I am in the Father, and the Father in me: or else believe me for the very works' sake.




Reference:


It is written that the LORD said in a time far past before Christ Jesus came to earth in The Book of Isaiah Chap. 42 : 1:

Behold my servant, whom I uphold; mine elect, in whom my soul delighteth; I have put my spirit upon him: he shall bring forth judgment to the Gentiles.




Which is referring to:



The Gospel according to Matthew Chap. 3 : 16 states:


And Jesus, when he was baptized, went up straightway out of the water: and, lo, the heavens were opened unto him, and he saw the Spirit of God descending like a dove, and lighting upon him:

17 And lo a voice from heaven, saying, This is my beloved Son, in whom I am well pleased.




It is written that Christ Jesus said unto some Jews that sought to kill him in a time far past in The Gospel according to John Chap. 5 : 43:


I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.




Furthermore:


The Gospel according to John Chap. 1 : 18 states:


No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him.





Furthermore:




It is written that Christ Jesus said in The Gospel according to John chap. 4 : 24:


God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
 

Lion-Of-Zion

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the first chapter of John disagrees with you severely.

John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. <-- Jesus says follow me, for only he bares knowlage of the father.

John 1:34 And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.

:confused:
 
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Soon Rev 22:11-12

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Within creation - If a human being (man) generates a son, his son is human (by nature, inheriting all the characteristics of man).

Would it be true or not that:

Prior to Creation - If a Divine Being (God) generates a Son, His Son is Divine (by nature, inheriting all the characteristics of God)?

Characterisitcs of God: omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent (by His Spirit), immortal
 
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Nadiine

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Within creation - If a human being (man) generates a son, his son is human (by nature, inheriting all the characteristics of man).

Would it be true or not that:

Prior to Creation - If a Divine Being (God) generates a Son, His Son is Divine (by nature, inheriting all the characteristics of God)?

Characterisitcs of God: omnipotent, omniscient, omnipresent (by His Spirit), immortal
K, define "generates". If God "procreates" another, then the son is also another god/God....

God said He will not share His glory with another and that He is the only true God and there are no others beside Him.
And that we cannot worship any other gods.
So it creates an obvious problem if Jesus is literal offspring from God.
 
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Nadiine

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John 1:18 No man hath seen God at any time, the only begotten Son, which is in the bosom of the Father, he hath declared him. <-- Jesus says follow me, for only he bares knowlage of the father.

John 1:34 And I saw, and bare record that this is the Son of God.

:confused:
You're missing the KEY factor here, God is SPIRIT. NO man has seen God in His full glory in Spirit form - HE IS LIGHT.
1 John 1:5
[ Fellowship with Him and One Another ] This is the message which we have heard from Him and declare to you, that God is light and in Him is no darkness at all.

John 4:24
God is Spirit, and those who worship Him must worship in spirit and truth.”

This is WHY Christ took on a flesh (shell) body to perform His mission of dying on the cross to shed blood. What spirit would bleed blood?
None.
Christ taking on flesh, becomes a human body to fulfill the entire OT law (mandatory to complete to be perfect/sinless) and then die as the sacrifice shedding blood to atone just as law demands a perfect sacrifice.

Read Hebrews 2 about why He came & what took place.

14 Therefore, since the children share in flesh and blood, He Himself likewise also partook of the same, that through death He might render powerless him who had the power of death, that is, the devil,

15 and might free those who through fear of death were subject to slavery all their lives.
16 For assuredly He does not give help to angels, but He gives help to the descendant of Abraham.
17 Therefore, He had to be made like His brethren in all things, so that He might become a merciful and faithful high priest in things pertaining to God, to make propitiation for the sins of the people. 18 For since He Himself was tempted in that which He has suffered, He is able to come to the aid of those who are tempted.

Read John 1, He BECAME FLESH. One doesn't become what they innately are. They become something they are NOT.
God who is spirit BECAME flesh for the mission of salvation. Fulfilling the perfect Law, then dying to atone for mankind's sin.
 
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scriptures

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Read John 1, He BECAME FLESH. One doesn't become what they innately are. They become something they are NOT.
God who is spirit BECAME flesh for the mission of salvation. Fulfilling the perfect Law, then dying to atone for mankind's sin.

Hi nadiine!!!! remember????

Did John said "He became flesh" or "God who is spirit became flesh"?????

Can you quote these words of yours from the Bible?????

It seems to me that your changing what the Bible said......
 
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Nadiine

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Hi nadiine!!!! remember????

Did John said "He became flesh" or "God who is spirit became flesh"?????

Can you quote these words of yours from the Bible?????

It seems to me that your changing what the Bible said......
Now you want THIS hoop jumped thru? lolol
Oh boy, now it has to say THAT. What's next?
"until there's one full page of verses that say He's God in 5 different
ways at least 50 times in 3 different languages - I reject this
doctrine".

You do not "BECOME" what you already are by nature. What human
do we or any writers in the bible attribute to "becoming flesh" when
they are created that way in the womb naturally?

You "become" something you are NOT naturally.
Just as scripture explains how we TAKE ON spirit when we put off
these physical bodies.
We are not born spirit - we are born in flesh. The flesh is put off
& we BECOME spirit for eternal life or eternal damnation.

That is what the Bible teaches about our natures. So it's quite
obvious that we don't need your clause in scripture to know
Jesus was Spirit prior to being placed into the womb by the
Holy Spirit. (Christ had no earthly father - hard to be pure human
w/out sperm)
 
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Nadiine

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Nadiine, I am looking for your word "He became flesh" or "God who is spirit became flesh"?????

Where did you quote that????

Nadiine 3:16??????
I'm not sure what's so tough about the word "become".

Did you "become" human/flesh from something you were before
you were concieved?

Somehow I fail to see how this demand is even necessary to
disprove He's God in the first place? :scratch:
All I see is someone digging for any scrap of a detail they
can find in hopes of supporting their own theory when the
overwhelming evidence is against them.

John 4:24
"God is spirit, and those who worship Him
must worship in spirit and truth."

(we do worship Christ, don't we?)
 
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&Abel

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Nadiine, I am looking for your word "He became flesh" or "God who is spirit became flesh"?????

Where did you quote that????

Nadiine 3:16??????

http://www.pseudepigrapha.com/LostBooks/2clement.htm

1. We shall rise, and be judged in our bodies; therefore we must live well in them, 6. that we ought, for own interest, to live well; though few seem to mind what really is for their advantage, 10. and not deceive ourselves: seeing God will certainly judge us, and render to all of us according to our works. 1. And let not any one among you say, that this very flesh is not judged, neither raised up. Consider, in what were you saved; in what did you look up, if not while you were in this flesh.
2. We must, therefore, keep our flesh as the temple of God. For in like manner as ye were called in the flesh, ye shall also come to judgment in the flesh. Our one Lord Jesus Christ, who has saved us, being first a spirit, was made flesh, and so called us; even so we also shall in this flesh receive the reward.
 
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scriptures

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I'm not sure what's so tough about the word "become".

Did you "become" human/flesh from something you were before
you were concieved?

Somehow I fail to see how this demand is even necessary to
disprove He's God in the first place? :scratch:
All I see is someone digging for any scrap of a detail they
can find in hopes of supporting their own theory when the
overwhelming evidence is against them.

John 4:24
"God is spirit, and those who worship Him
must worship in spirit and truth."

(we do worship Christ, don't we?)

It's about your misquotation my friend.....


"He became flesh" or "God who is spirit became flesh" does not appear in the Bible....
 
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2ducklow

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Nadiine, I am looking for your word "He became flesh" or "God who is spirit became flesh"?????

Where did you quote that????

Nadiine 3:16??????
you gotta be more direct.we all know that trinitarians INTERPRET john 1.14 to mean that 'he became flesh' or 'God who is spirit became flesh". She is saying in effect that that is what John 1.14 says, we say that is her interpretation of john 1.14. you gave her too much room to wiggle around in.
as a point of fact, if you don't quote a scripture directly, than anything one says about a scripture is an interpretation, whether they admit it or not, ( and getting trinitarians to admit that "god who is spirit became flesh" is an interpretation of john 1.14, is near about impossible. she is going to insist that that is what it says i would suspect.)

John 1:14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father, full of grace and truth.

that's where she gets it from. course anything WE say about john 1.14 is a false interpretation of john 1.14., and any thing trinitarians say about john 1.14 is what it actually says,. according to them anyway. I've seen it happen in here many times where a trinitarian will say
"god became flesh thats what john 1.14 says"
then you quote it where it says the word became flesh and t hey respond with
"See that's exactly what john 1.14 says, god became flesh."

so really there's nothing t o debate about, because trinitarians and us cannot agree on what john 1.14 actually says.

this is what nadine is doing with you. She is in effect saying that John 1.14 and John 4.24 say 'god who is spirit became flesh''. So we cannot debate with her over the meaning of john 1.14, because she has stated that what she says it says it the same thing as what it actually says. you can't argue with her over what it means, I would bet that she will not admit that 'god who is spirit became flesh" is her interpretation of hers because to do so would be to put her interpretation on equal footing with yours and thus open them up to proof from other scripture, logic, etc. AS long as they say that "god who is spirit became flesh" is what scripture actually says, then they don't have to connsider any other interpretations, it's a way of sealing t hemselves against considering any other possiblity for an interpretation. They can thus say to themselves that we are denying scripture, which they do.
 
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&Abel

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http://www.pseudepigrapha.com/LostBooks/2clement.htm

1. We shall rise, and be judged in our bodies; therefore we must live well in them, 6. that we ought, for own interest, to live well; though few seem to mind what really is for their advantage, 10. and not deceive ourselves: seeing God will certainly judge us, and render to all of us according to our works. 1. And let not any one among you say, that this very flesh is not judged, neither raised up. Consider, in what were you saved; in what did you look up, if not while you were in this flesh.
2. We must, therefore, keep our flesh as the temple of God. For in like manner as ye were called in the flesh, ye shall also come to judgment in the flesh. Our one Lord Jesus Christ, who has saved us, being first a spirit, was made flesh, and so called us; even so we also shall in this flesh receive the reward.
 
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