Hindus Strike Again

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Tanakh

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Without US dollars we hope? Oh no, sorry, someone already threatened to make you vanish from the pages of history. Arrogant!

I keep hearing how Israel takes billions upon billions of U.S. dollars to commit evil toward the "Palestinians". Israel, on average, receives 3-6 billion per year and is a friend of the United States and yet America spends 60+ billion per year in Germany which hates America so go figure that logic. And Israel, unlike other countries, does not require American blood to keep our country, Israel, as we Jews are more than willing to die for it.

"Arrogant" I think not!
 
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Tanakh

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In Nam huh?

Was he a tourist at the time?

He claims to be 49, the war ended in 75, he would have been 16 or 17 at the time. The draft was discontinued in 73 which would put him at about 14 or 15 at that time, so he probably didn't get drafted and the army doesn't take 16 year olds.

So when did he go to nam?

LOL :D
 
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Secundulus

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In Nam huh?

Was he a tourist at the time?

He claims to be 49, the war ended in 75, he would have been 16 or 17 at the time. The draft was discontinued in 73 which would put him at about 14 or 15 at that time, so he probably didn't get drafted and the army doesn't take 16 year olds.

So when did he go to nam?
He made a mistake on the timeline. I served in the US Army from 1977 to 2001.

US Army Retired, Infantry, Airborne, Ranger.

I am not impressed by the militaristic rantings of wanabee american teenagers. Not you, the other guy; the one that is going to cleanse Israel of all the Christians.
 
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Druweid

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Greetings Rasta!

Well here it is:

attachment.php


"Dozens watch in horror as a thread is derailed."

With that out of the way, I feel compelled to address some of the issues you've brought up.
NCR used to be so much better before the Christians here went on their anti-Islam spree. We used to have actual discussions. Not peeing contests about whose dick is the biggest.
If a peeing contest is all you see, then you're not really seeing the big picture. But please, don't take this the wrong way, it's not a criticism toward you. You are very young, and though reasonably bright for your age, young nonetheless. And all I mean by this is that you still have much to learn.

In contemplating on how to respond to these posts, I was reminded of a time when I was still a child. My friends and I would watch the teen-agers playing tackle football in a local field. Of course we cheered for certain teams, had favorite players (especially when older brothers were involved!), and even jeered at players being too rough or arrogant. One time, though, one of my friends, Stan (who was pretty big and well-muscled for his age) approached the teenagers and demanded he be allowed to play. What do you think happened? Well, the teenagers surrounded Stan, and began pushing him around, from person to person, knocking him down, and laughing at him the whole time. They were being bullies, right? Read on: Finally, Stan got up off the ground, fist-size rock in hand, and lunged at one of the players. Immediately, they grabbed him to hold him still while one of the oldest spoke to him. He said to Stan, "This is what it is to play football. You will be knocked down, treated unfairly, and laughed at. As long as you can't deal with that, you're too young to play." Just food for thought, 'kay?

That all having been said, I agree the Anti-Muslim sentiment has become excessive and over-zealous at times, but Bushmaster, Arunma, and Secundulus are not the main perpetrators or worst offenders, so it's not fair to put it entirely on them. And yes, there were better quality discussions and debates in the past than there are now (which, by the way, all three previously mentioned were participants). But rather than cast blame, I choose to do what I can to bring that back. In futility? Perhaps, but I will not give up. All good and worthwhile things begin and end with hope. To me, thinking any other way is spiritual suicide.
It's not me. It's the Pagans and the Muslims who have taken the brunt of ignorant ridicule here. I'm just annoyed of the type of "logic" employed to convey said remarks.
Indeed, and I've been the target of such more than once. Nonetheless, I am known and marked by the logic and reason *I* use, not the logic and reason, or lack thereof, used by others.
Rasta said:
There were some troubled people, who would only attack. There were a lot of sensible people who have left due to the belligerant attacks on their faith. Most of the Pagans are gone, and many of the frequent Muslim posters are gone.
Let's be both real and honest here. This is a Christian Forum. Here, I am the pariah, as is any other Pagan, or Muslim, or Hindu, or even Atheist. Surely, I can demand a certain level of dignity and respect, but let's not lose sight of the concept that, from the Christian member's POV, I am here for only one of two reasons; to be converted, or to be admonished. Some have left for their inability to accept this, though I must admit, many others have left over what many (including myself) felt were sincere injustices.
Rasta said:
I have tried to be sensible with you in the past. I have tried to be sensible with Seculundus in the past. I have tried to be sensible with Arunma in the past. All I remember you guys resorting to was "well you're an atheist, of course you don't understand Christianity." No discussion, no debate. Just brushing other's opinions off like water on a ducks back.
I understand very well what you are saying. As you have likely seen in the past, in matters of religion I am diametrically opposed to each person you mention. And there are times when I've found each of them to be single-minded within certain discussions. But honestly, I have not found any one of them incapable of reasonable, civilized discussion when it was warranted.

As I said before, I believe you are a bright person, and I do enjoy seeing and considering your opinions on any and all these issues. But there are going to be times when we will be pushed around, knocked to the ground, and caused to feel degraded. Let's just get over it, and move along. I believe it's fourth down and 18 to go. I suggest you punt. ;)

With all due respect,
- Druweid
 
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MahaSudarshanChakra

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For all you smart guys who said this was being made up when it was reported in the Christian media, here is is in the New York Times.

Hindu Threat to Christians: Convert or Flee
By SOMINI SENGUPTA
Published: October 12, 2008
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/10/13/world/asia/13india.html?_r=2&th&emc=th&oref=slogin&oref=slogin

BOREPANGA, India — The family of Solomon Digal was summoned by neighbors to what serves as a public square in front of the village tea shop.

They were ordered to get on their knees and bow before the portrait of a Hindu preacher. They were told to turn over their Bibles, hymnals and the two brightly colored calendar images of Christ that hung on their wall. Then, Mr. Digal, 45, a Christian since childhood, was forced to watch his Hindu neighbors set the items on fire.

“ ‘Embrace Hinduism, and your house will not be demolished,’ ” Mr. Digal recalled being told on that Wednesday afternoon in September. “ ‘Otherwise, you will be killed, or you will be thrown out of the village.’ ” . . .

The forced conversions come amid widening attacks on Christians here and in at least five other states across the country, as India prepares for national elections next spring.

That is sad...

These kind of incidents will stop the moment the average christian learns to respect the beliefs of others and live in harmony. Anyway, I hope that Hindus will not stoop to the level of the people they attack or else there is no difference between the two sides.

Attacks against the christians are real, but first find out what is the root cause so that you can eliminate it. Presenting one side of the story ( without presenting what provokes these incidents) is not fair enough. That would be a like a judge listening to one party and giving his judgement. Do you see any Hindu scripture asking Hindus to attack others?
 
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Rasta

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Greetings Rasta!

Well here it is:

attachment.php


"Dozens watch in horror as a thread is derailed."

With that out of the way, I feel compelled to address some of the issues you've brought up.

If a peeing contest is all you see, then you're not really seeing the big picture. But please, don't take this the wrong way, it's not a criticism toward you. You are very young, and though reasonably bright for your age, young nonetheless. And all I mean by this is that you still have much to learn.

In contemplating on how to respond to these posts, I was reminded of a time when I was still a child. My friends and I would watch the teen-agers playing tackle football in a local field. Of course we cheered for certain teams, had favorite players (especially when older brothers were involved!), and even jeered at players being too rough or arrogant. One time, though, one of my friends, Stan (who was pretty big and well-muscled for his age) approached the teenagers and demanded he be allowed to play. What do you think happened? Well, the teenagers surrounded Stan, and began pushing him around, from person to person, knocking him down, and laughing at him the whole time. They were being bullies, right? Read on: Finally, Stan got up off the ground, fist-size rock in hand, and lunged at one of the players. Immediately, they grabbed him to hold him still while one of the oldest spoke to him. He said to Stan, "This is what it is to play football. You will be knocked down, treated unfairly, and laughed at. As long as you can't deal with that, you're too young to play." Just food for thought, 'kay?

That all having been said, I agree the Anti-Muslim sentiment has become excessive and over-zealous at times, but Bushmaster, Arunma, and Secundulus are not the main perpetrators or worst offenders, so it's not fair to put it entirely on them. And yes, there were better quality discussions and debates in the past than there are now (which, by the way, all three previously mentioned were participants). But rather than cast blame, I choose to do what I can to bring that back. In futility? Perhaps, but I will not give up. All good and worthwhile things begin and end with hope. To me, thinking any other way is spiritual suicide.
Indeed, and I've been the target of such more than once. Nonetheless, I am known and marked by the logic and reason *I* use, not the logic and reason, or lack thereof, used by others.
Let's be both real and honest here. This is a Christian Forum. Here, I am the pariah, as is any other Pagan, or Muslim, or Hindu, or even Atheist. Surely, I can demand a certain level of dignity and respect, but let's not lose sight of the concept that, from the Christian member's POV, I am here for only one of two reasons; to be converted, or to be admonished. Some have left for their inability to accept this, though I must admit, many others have left over what many (including myself) felt were sincere injustices.
I understand very well what you are saying. As you have likely seen in the past, in matters of religion I am diametrically opposed to each person you mention. And there are times when I've found each of them to be single-minded within certain discussions. But honestly, I have not found any one of them incapable of reasonable, civilized discussion when it was warranted.

As I said before, I believe you are a bright person, and I do enjoy seeing and considering your opinions on any and all these issues. But there are going to be times when we will be pushed around, knocked to the ground, and caused to feel degraded. Let's just get over it, and move along. I believe it's fourth down and 18 to go. I suggest you punt. ;)

With all due respect,
- Druweid


Thanks man. You are right of course. My bad.
 
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Druweid

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Greetings!

By the way, I don't know why, but I forgot to reply to this earlier:
For all you smart guys who said this was being made up when it was reported in the Christian media, here is is in the New York Times.
I surely hope you weren't talking about me, since I had made it perfectly clear in a previous post:
HOWEVER, this is not to say that the Christian persecution is not happening, only that information should be gathered and opinions formed through more reliable sources than what is presented here (asiannews.it).
Regards,
-- Druweid
 
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Ramona

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Jeez Louise, I sign in for five minutes and this is what I see. Dang. Now I remember why I never bother to post here anymore. I used to love NCR.

Bushmaster, Arunma, Secundulus...you guys are great, and in a weird way I love y'all, but...less venom and more kindness will get you much further than you are right now. I know for a fact that people read your posts and said, "Christians are insane. I'm glad I'm not one of them." You three aren't insane - far from it, actually. You are rational, good-hearted, and sound of mind. If you're trying to make a point, please act like the men we know you are deep down.

I hope everyone is well!

Love,
Hallie
 
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Rasta

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Rasta, you're agnostic, I assume?

I'm agnostic atheist. My definition for thoes words are the same as the dictionary's.

This isn't the first time I've seen you respond to information on Christian persecution like this. Considering how you like to bring up the Inquisition and other horrendous atrocities by so-called Christians so often, it'd be nice to see you treat the persecution of Christians with the same disapproval. That'd be consistent, at least.

Your right, which is why I said it was sad. Persecution is always sad. I'm not saying the Christians there are bad, because I don't know them. It's clear that the Hindus who did this have a different idea of what Christianity is than you do.

Perhaps you've had some very unpleasant encounters with Christians in your life, which has gone some way to giving you a particular hatred for Christianity and Christians over all other religious beliefs.

I live in the Midwest, so yeah, there is a lot of fundimentalism there. I don't like people who authoritative claims on my behalf. So yep, I'm at odds with many Christians who have that mindset. Hate is not a word I would use. Though feel free to use it if it justifys your perception of me.

If so, that's a shame: while a Christian who listens to the Holy Spirit won't compromise on truth, he or she will also not compromise on being unconditionally loving.

Unconditionally loving? That is not a trait I see much here. People say that they are justified in being arrogant and hostile.

He or she will be gentle in approach, respectful, and full of joy. A Christian who listens to and obeys the Spirit is a wonderful person to be around.

So are the people who are not gentle and respectful not listening to the HS?

Also, I'm not entirely sure why you're so offended by Christians who have responded on this thread. Stating beliefs and defending one's faith in an uncompromising manner is to be expected; why follow a God if you don't believe Him to be true? Of course Christians will hold to certain beliefs that you dislike or find "close-minded" - they'll hold on to them because they believe them to be true. I thought you were possibly wound up by unjust and rude postings, which would be fair enough, but instead what seems to be irritating you to the point of acting like the way you are is simply what you consider to be "bad logic". I'd take a simple, child-like individual who knows how to truly love over a bitter, cynical, sarcastic highly intellectual individual any day (I'm not implying that that is who you are; I'm simply wondering at why you are so offended by what you consider to be faulty arguments on the side of Christians....)

It's illogical, hypocritical, bigotry that gets me steemed. Implying the actions of a small group are representing a whole group (which is what this thread is about) is ludicrase.

I'm positive that you don't believe Fred Phelps represents Christianity. Yet we hear this over and over and over again. Seclundus often makes this implication.

I've never experienced all the unpleasant Christians many non-Christians seem to have experienced here, ever.

Perhaps you are biased. So when someone says Allah is satan, you just think "Yeah that's probably true."

Yet, if someone said Jesus was satan, you would think "What an awfull attack on Christianity."

I know there are folk like Fred Phelps out there, but my experiences of fellow Christians have always been positive; they display all the positive fruits of the Spirit (and if they don't, it's because they've come from a very bad place and are being taken on a journey of refinement from that low place.) It's a shame you can't see, or haven't come across, the wonderful Christian individuals I seem to encounter more often than not.

My whole family are wonderfull Christians. I don't think all Christians are bad. I don't think most Christians are bad. The bad apples are bad. That is all.
 
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Luzeiro

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Rasta is like a parrot who keeps spouting these stupid things he read somewhere. It doesn't do any good to put forth the facts to him because like that parrot he doesn't think critically, he just repeats what he hears. I think he wasted whatever money he paid for his education because it certainly didn't teach him to think.

That's why I don't bother responding to him anymore. It is like talking to a three year old.
Ditto! A belligerent and antagonistic one at that. :thumbsup:
 
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Luzeiro

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Rasta is like a parrot who keeps spouting these stupid things he read somewhere. It doesn't do any good to put forth the facts to him because like that parrot he doesn't think critically, he just repeats what he hears. I think he wasted whatever money he paid for his education because it certainly didn't teach him to think.

That's why I don't bother responding to him anymore. It is like talking to a three year old.
Ditto! A belligerent and antagonistic one at that. :thumbsup:
 
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Catherineanne

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Many of the leaders of the Anglican church deny that the Bible is the inspired word of God,

Name one.

and claim that non-Christians can be saved.

As indeed Matthew 25 states. Not all who call Christ 'Lord' will enter heaven, and not all who enter heaven will call Christ 'Lord'. It is for God to decide, not for us.


The point is that most of the British Anglican church has not been Christian in quite some time,

I would find this offensive were it not for the fact that to be commended as a Christian in some circles is no compliment. So instead I will say, thank you very much; from you that is a true commendation.

Meanwhile, I agree with the comments from Hindus here, that these actions against Christians are to be condemned, and say nothing about the Hindu faith, and everything about intolerance in a particular location, with particular roots.
 
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Catherineanne

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The Hindus strike again? A ragtag bunch of illiterate, impecunious, fatuous clowns with no knowledge or understanding of the fundamental principles of their religion engage in a meaningless quest for retribution and now all Hindus are to blame. Yes, religion is the divisive factor in this situation, but if you knew anything about the political and historical context of that region, you would know that this is more about the surfacing of the contentious economic and social relationship between the Kandhas and the Panas that has been simmering for decades.

Thanks for the overview, Indianx, it makes a lot of sense. :wave:
 
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Secundulus

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I'm positive that you don't believe Fred Phelps represents Christianity. Yet we hear this over and over and over again. Seclundus often makes this implication.
No I don't. That's the conclusion that you always jump due to your lack of critical thought. I argue against philosophies. That you are unable to see a difference between criticizing a philosophy and condemning those who believe it is the fault of your poor reasoning skills, not my presentation.

Even in this thread I never said anything about ALL HINDUS being anything. But as usual, all the normal pinheads jump right in and accuse me of it.

Moreover, I said that this forum has become worthless because it has become impossible to make a critical statement here without being suffocated by the worthless effluence of those whose minds are paralyzed by political correctness.
 
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Catherineanne

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A large number of Anglican bishops and churches deny the inerrency of the Scriptures and believe that non-Christians can be saved. These are heretical beliefs which ultimately deny Christ and cut people off from the communion of the church.

The Bible does not anywhere claim to be inerrant, and therefore such a belief is not Biblical, nor demanded in our faith. Therefore, you are quite right many of our bishops don't believe it, and neither do I. :cool: This is not the same thing as saying the Bible is not inspired by God. It says it is, and therefore it is. It does not say it is inerrant, and therefore it is not.

And as I have already said, non Christians, including Hindus, may be saved by the grace of God as detailed by Our Lord in Matthew 25. Neither of these beliefs are heretical, because they are held by all the apostolic churches. Neither do any of these beliefs equate to a denial of Christ.

Sorry for the derailment, but it is very difficult to allow this this kind of nonsense to go unchallenged. It used to be unacceptable on this forum to post vitriolic comments against other denominations, but it seems anything is allowed these days.
 
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anatolian

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Wrongo! You need proof that the people who killed people were Christians.
Oh.That's just a useless argument "they are not christian or they are not muslim in fact..." If those people were called christians for the centuries and if they identified themselves christians then I should so do too.This doesn't mean "this is what Christianity teachs or what they did is justified by Christianity and all christians" but they were christians.
 
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Rasta

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Ditto! A belligerent and antagonistic one at that. :thumbsup:


So I take it that belligerent and antagonistic are qualities that you don't engage in?

Like starting threads titled "Muslims say the darndest things" or "Allah the moon god" or "What tekeyya means to Muslims".

It's so nice to see someone who can walk the walk and all that. :thumbsup:
 
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Rasta

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No I don't. That's the conclusion that you always jump due to your lack of critical thought. I argue against philosophies. That you are unable to see a difference between criticizing a philosophy and condemning those who believe it is the fault of your poor reasoning skills, not my presentation.

Ok. I'll take your word for it. What exactly was your implication when you wrote this:“I like your Christ, I do not like your Christians. Your Christians are so unlike your Christ.” Mahatma Gandhi quote

Given current events, I have to laugh at such a statement from a Hindu.


I must be missing the qualifications you imply I am missing due to my "poor reasoning skills". Do be thorough with your explanation so I don't make the same mistake again.

Even in this thread I never said anything about ALL HINDUS being anything. But as usual, all the normal pinheads jump right in and accuse me of it.

Semantics.

Moreover, I said that this forum has become worthless because it has become impossible to make a critical statement here without being suffocated by the worthless effluence of those whose minds are paralyzed by political correctness.

What would you like to say that you have not said 3,000 times already?
 
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The Hindus strike again? A ragtag bunch of illiterate, impecunious, fatuous clowns with no knowledge or understanding of the fundamental principles of their religion engage in a meaningless quest for retribution and now all Hindus are to blame. Yes, religion is the divisive factor in this situation, but if you knew anything about the political and historical context of that region, you would know that this is more about the surfacing of the contentious economic and social relationship between the Kandhas and the Panas that has been simmering for decades. Swami Laxmanananda Saraswati had started working with the Kandhas (the still majority Hindu tribal group) in the 1960s, when the Christian missionary organizations began to arrive in the region. His murder, in the hands of Christians, served as the catalyst for the outbreak of violence. The Kandhas have to be faulted and held responsible for their inexcusable decision to look towards retribution in the aftermath of the murder of their religious leader, rather than to protest peacefully, in the spirit of ahimsa. It's unfortunate that in the land of Gandhi, the Hindu most representative of the peaceful nature of the religion, that these Hindus have instead resorted to violence. The first course of action now, from the Hindu perspective, should be for Hindu service organizations to step in immediately and counsel the perpetrators of violence among the Kandhas to repudiate their decision to succumb to violence. Differences among tribal groups have historically been difficult to reconcile, in India and in other parts of the world, but, immediate and meaningful efforts, on the part of the government and the communal groups involved, have to be made to at least draft a peace-brokering agreement. I think that it is the duty of every Hindu in that state and elsewhere to condemn the violence and work towards resolving the terrible situation. It is unfortunate that on this Columbus Day, the spirit of religious violence and the forceful conversions of indigenous groups marked by his arrival in the Americas more than half a millennium ago, still remain a thorn in the sides of moderate and peaceful adherents of all religions around the world.

Alright, calm down. Stop calling them names! They were probably raised to hate Christians.
 
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