jckstraw72
Doin' that whole Orthodox thing
- Dec 9, 2005
- 10,160
- 1,143
- 39
- Faith
- Eastern Orthodox
- Marital Status
- Engaged
- Politics
- US-Republican
your objections to the interpretation i provided made no sense that i could discern.
Upvote
0
Who is God
- Thread starter tpony298
- Start date
- Status
your objections to the interpretation i provided made no sense that i could discern.
Christ, the Fellow of Jehovah, came as the God-sent Shepherd to the children of Israel but was attacked unto death by them (v. 7a; Matt. 9:36; John 10:11; Matt. 26:31; Acts 2:23). Zechariah 13:7a says, "Awake, O sword, against My Shepherd, / And against the man who is My Fellow, / Declares Jehovah of hosts. / Strike the Shepherd, / That the sheep may be scattered." Christ was both a relative to the children of Israel and a Fellow of Jehovah. As He was hanging on the cross, His relatives wounded Him, and God called in the sword to strike Him. He was in a situation where His relatives were against Him and where God, to whom He is a Fellow, was also against Him.
The word in verse 7a about striking the Shepherd is quoted by the Lord Jesus in Matthew 26:31. To strike the Shepherd means to attack the Shepherd. Immediately after He established the table, He told His disciples that He would be attacked and that they, the sheep, would be scattered.
The word in verse 7a about striking the Shepherd is quoted by the Lord Jesus in Matthew 26:31. To strike the Shepherd means to attack the Shepherd. Immediately after He established the table, He told His disciples that He would be attacked and that they, the sheep, would be scattered.
Upvote
0
H
headhoncho
Guest
I have asked you questions, about meaning of terms from
Zechariah 13:7, The Lord have chosen you to give "your" answer
regarding "lost sheep", which everyone with an IQ higher than 80,
knows it represents Disciples of Jesus, but when i have asked you
what do you mean "they lost hope" this is "your" answer ;
" they looked to Him as the Messiah, and according to their understanding the Messiah certainly wasnt mean to die. when they watched Him die they were like well crap I guess He's NOT the Messiah."
Which Biblical verses are supporting this massacre of rational thought ?
When you judge someone's statements as an error, can you provide
the truth that corrects that "error" ?
Like I do, I mean, isn't that the way civilized people communicate ?
You are 23, I study Scripture that long, and I am a Scorpio,
which is the last group of people, you would want to prove wrong,
if they know they're right.
You see sweetie, knowledge is energy that creates experience, your
entire way of thinking is based upon assumption.
Jew Peter from Jewpiter
Upvote
0
H
headhoncho
Guest
Hi p, my man, to strike is to kill, because Jesus was killed,
only The Lord kills, no one else, Satan is tool, and Christ is Judgment, Jesus brings the tool, because Christ is committed everything Matthew 10:34 " Do not suppose that I have come to bring peace to the earth. I did not come to bring peace, but a sword."
John 9:39 " Jesus said, "For judgment I have come into this world, so that the blind will see and those who see will become blind."
This is extremely important verse, that Pauline Christianity do not
have ability of understanding.
"Fellow of Jehovah" "Man close to Jehovah" "an Associate of Jehovah", are the terms (from various English translations), those who are indulging in an " eternal trinity "One and
only God/The Lord, should think about.
What do you mean "children of Israel ", was Jesus killed, so
Israel can hear Gospel, of entire World ?
Children of Israel were children of Devil, before Jesus was killed,
John 8:42-47, "Children of Israel were done with God, before
Jesus was killed by them Matthew 21:33-44, John 19:11
" Jesus answered, "You would have no power over me if it were not given to you from above. Therefore the one who handed me over to you is guilty of a greater sin."
love
Jew Peter from Jewpiter
Upvote
0
jckstraw72
Doin' that whole Orthodox thing
- Dec 9, 2005
- 10,160
- 1,143
- 39
- Faith
- Eastern Orthodox
- Marital Status
- Engaged
- Politics
- US-Republican
headhoncho -- i simply told you what Christ Himself said about the verse and you didnt want to accept it.
Upvote
0
Mark 12:29-30
Jesus answered: The first is, Hear, O Israel, Jehovah our God is one Jehovah, 30 and you must love Jehovah your God with your whole heart and with your whole soul and with your whole mind and with your whole strength.
Luke 4:8
In reply Jesus said to him: It is written, It is Jehovah your God you must worship, and it is to him alone you must render sacred service.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
Matthew 28:16-17
However, the eleven disciples went into Gal´i·lee to the mountain where Jesus had arranged for them, 17 and when they saw him they did obeisance, but some doubted.
However, the eleven disciples went into Gal´i·lee to the mountain where Jesus had arranged for them, 17 and when they saw him they did obeisance, but some doubted.
"Mark 5:6 Worshipped It is true that proskyneo (from kyneo, "kiss") means "to make obeisance, do reverence to, worship" ([G.] A[bbott]-S[mith], p.386). Arndt and Gingrich note that the verb was "used to designate the custom of prostrating oneself before a person or kissing his feet, the hem of his garment, the ground, etc.; the Persian did this in the presence of their defied king, and the Greeks before a divinity or something holy" (p.716) But it was also used for a slave prostrating himself before his master (Matt 18:26*). The pertinent question remains: would the demon-possessed man be worshiping Jesus, even though he called Him "Son of the Most High God" (NASB, NIV, RSV)? Probably "Fell on his knees in front of him" (NIV) is a safer translation."-Word Meanings in the New Testament by Ralph Earle p.37
*N.K.J.V. "fell down before him", K.J.V. "worshiped him"; why change?
"proskunew, . . .1. . . . to prostrate oneself before in token of respect, to do obeisance, salute. 2. of the gods, to worship: to deprecate, disarm by worship." -A Lexicon Abridged from Gk.-Eng. Lexicon by H.G. Liddell, M.A., & R. Scott, M.A. p.635
"17.21 proskunew; (an idiom, literally 'to incline the face to the ground'): to prostrate oneself before someone as an act of reverence, fear, or supplication - 'to prostrate oneself before'.' proskunew: kai proskunhsousin enwpion twn podwn sou 'and they will prostrate themselves before your feet' Re 3,9; tiqenteV ta gonata prosekunoun autw 'kneeling down, they prostrate themselves before him' Mk 15.19. proskunew is semantically very complex in that it indicates not only body position but also an attitude and activity of reverence of honor. In many contexts it is not necessary to specify both semantic elements, but one or the other may be selected depending upon what seems to be the focus of attention. For example, in Mk 15.19 one may either translate 'they knelt before him and worshiped him in a mocking way' or 'they knelt before him and prostrate themselves before him.' klinw to prospon eiV thn ghn emfobwn de genomenwn autwn kai klinouswn ta proswpa eiV thn ghn 'they were fearful and prostrated themselves on the ground' or '. . . bowed down to the ground' Lk 24.5."-Greek-English Lexicon of the N.T. based on Semantic Domains Vol. 1 by the United Bible Societies p.216
Also see 'Vincent's Word Studies of the New Testament' page 889
According to the above definitions and explanation of the use of the Greek idiom "proskyneo" it may be translated as "worship" when it is used in matters relating to sacred things and to Almighty God, a lesser, and or false god, gods or as "obeisance" when used man to man, man to Christ, (can be secular) or lesser divine being to another divine being but as "worship" in matter of other creatures toward the Almighty God etc.. These deferring uses of "proskyneo" will always be governed by the scriptural context wherein it is used, which in turn will be affected by the translators own theological doctrines.
Another intresting comment from ‘Truth In Translation’ Accuracy and Bias in English Translations of the New Testament by Jason David DeDuhn p.48
"In our exploration of the Greek word proskuneo in the New Testament, therefore, the NAB and NW* receive the highest marks for accuracy, while the others* show a tendency to lapse into interpretive judgments guided by their theological biases."
*NWT
**KJV, NASB, NRSV, NIV, AB, TEV, LB.
Upvote
0
GraceSeeker
Senior Member
So, basically you are saying that you dispute the word chosen by the translators and would prefer a different word than worship.
I would agree that all translators let their biases in to the work of translation, even when they do their best to exclude them. I believe this has happened with the NWT as well. What is the NAB? I'm not familiar with it or at least those initials. Who is Jason David DeDuhn? Who is the publisher of "Truth in Translation"?
I would agree that all translators let their biases in to the work of translation, even when they do their best to exclude them. I believe this has happened with the NWT as well. What is the NAB? I'm not familiar with it or at least those initials. Who is Jason David DeDuhn? Who is the publisher of "Truth in Translation"?
Upvote
0
Blackhawk
Monkey Boy
- Feb 5, 2002
- 4,930
- 73
- 52
- Faith
- Eastern Orthodox
- Marital Status
- Married
- Politics
- US-Republican
Who is God? It matters what you mean by God. Usually when the Bible uses the word "God" it means the Father. This is very clear in john. The Spirit is the Spirit. Jesus is the Son of God. And God is the Father.
But john and the rest of scripture also makes very clear that Jesus and the HS are directly identified with the Father. Thus Jesus and the HS are Divine or in modern use of the word they are both God.
One example of how Jesus is shown to be a part of the ONe God in the Bible. WEll first it is clear that there is one God from the Shema in Deut. 6. And it is also very clear that only God is to worshipped. But Jesus accepts worship and the Bible condones worship of Jesus. This is jsut a small example but it makes clear that although the Bible mostly restricts the word theos for the Father it does not mean that the Spirit or the Son are not part of the Triune God.
But john and the rest of scripture also makes very clear that Jesus and the HS are directly identified with the Father. Thus Jesus and the HS are Divine or in modern use of the word they are both God.
One example of how Jesus is shown to be a part of the ONe God in the Bible. WEll first it is clear that there is one God from the Shema in Deut. 6. And it is also very clear that only God is to worshipped. But Jesus accepts worship and the Bible condones worship of Jesus. This is jsut a small example but it makes clear that although the Bible mostly restricts the word theos for the Father it does not mean that the Spirit or the Son are not part of the Triune God.
Upvote
0
GraceSeeker
Senior Member
God is also not a person nor a place. If we accept your statement; then, since God is not a person, place or thing, we must conclude that God is not a noun. Perhaps God is a VERB.
Upvote
0
This site stays free and accessible to all because of donations from people like you.
Consider making a one-time or monthly donation. We appreciate your support!
- Dan Doughty and Team Christian Forums
artybloke
Well-Known Member
Sounds good to me
But I suspect that there's a problem with that: language starts breaking down the closer we get to a definition of God. However, it does have the advantage of making the idea of God a much active idea than the static idea of God as a "person." God is a process of becoming?
To make God a thing is to make God part of the universe of things, a created thing not its creator.
Therefore, any God that is described as a thing is essentially an idol.
But I suspect that there's a problem with that: language starts breaking down the closer we get to a definition of God. However, it does have the advantage of making the idea of God a much active idea than the static idea of God as a "person." God is a process of becoming?
To make God a thing is to make God part of the universe of things, a created thing not its creator.
Therefore, any God that is described as a thing is essentially an idol.
Upvote
0
- Status
Similar threads
