1 peter 5 : she who is in Babylon ?

Rome

Jerusalem.

-A

Rome. Peter was under house arrest, I believe and so as not to arouse the passions of his captors, he referred to the city where he was located as Bablyon. In addition, there was a church established in Rome as well.

Rome; with the caveat that we're talking about Imperial Rome, the city-state of Rome, the Rome of the pagan Roman emperors who persecuted the early Christians, and NOT the Roman Catholic Church.

Compare what Jesus says in Matthew 23:37

"O Jerusalem, Jerusalem, killing the prophets and stoning those who are sent to you!

To what John says in Rev 18:21-24

"So shall Babylon the great city be thrown down with violence, and shall be found no more... 24 And in her was found the blood of prophets and of saints, and of ALL who have been slain on earth." 

Also, lets consider what Jerimiah says in 4:30

O desolate one [Jerusalem], what will you do? Although you dress in scarlet, Although you decorate [yourself with] ornaments of gold, Although you enlarge your eyes with paint, In vain you make yourself beautiful

And Ezekiel 16:37

therefore I am going to gather all your [Israel's] lovers, with whom you found pleasure, those you loved as well as those you hated. I will gather them against you from all around and will strip you in front of them, and they will see all your nakedness.

To Revelation 17:4-16

17:4 And the woman was clothed in purple and scarlet, and adorned with gold and precious stones and pearls, having in her hand a gold cup full of abominations and of the unclean things of her immorality...
17:16 And the ten horns which you saw, and the beast, these will hate the harlot and will make her desolate and naked, and will eat her flesh and will burn her up with fire. 


I can only conclude that there is a very strong comparison between the Mystery: Babylon and 1st Century Jerusalem.

-A

The historical context of Peter's letter suggests Rome is a better candidate for "Babylon" in this case. Remember, he had long since fled from Jerusalem after his miraculous escape from prison. This is not to suggest that "Babylon" used elsewhere (eg. Revelation) cannot also be a reference to Jerusalem. In traditional Christian parlance, "Babylon" has become a metaphor for any culture, nation or civilization which wreaks of spiritual and moral bankruptcy. For both Jerusalem and Rome in the first century, the term is apt.

I always found biblical references which would place Peter's residence in Jerusalem not Rome. Of course -he had travelled to Rome.

-After the great persecution the church was scattered, but the apostles (i.e. Peter) stayed in Jerusalem (Acts 8:1).

-When Philip preached in Samaria, the apostles at Jerusalem sent Peter and John to them. Thus Peter must have been living there (Acts 8:14).

- When Herod Agrippa imprisoned Peter, he was in Jerusalem (Acts 12:1-4).

- Three years after his conversion, Paul goes to Jerusalem to see Peter and even abides with him there. Therefore, Peter must have lived there (Galatians 1:18).

- Fourteen years after his conversion, Paul again returns to Jerusalem with Barnabas and Titus. Peter is there again and even named as a "pillar" in the church at Jerusalem (Galatians 2:1, 9).

- Paul tells us that Peter was intimidated by "Jews from James (i.e. Jerusalem)". Surely this would be because Peter's residence was there and he had to live with these people (Galatians 2:11,12).

- In the scripture in question (1 Peter 5:13), who is Mark?  If it is a reference to John Mark then we presumably know that his original residence was in Jerusalem in the house of his mother. So if Marcus is John Mark, then the "church" would also be at Jerusalem (Acts 12:12).  

Patmosman_sga:
Please post the historical context of Peter's letter which led you to your conclusion.

-A

Originally posted by Patmosman_sga
The historical context of Peter's letter suggests Rome is a better candidate for "Babylon" in this case. Remember, he had long since fled from Jerusalem after his miraculous escape from prison. This is not to suggest that "Babylon" used elsewhere (eg. Revelation) cannot also be a reference to Jerusalem. In traditional Christian parlance, "Babylon" has become a metaphor for any culture, nation or civilization which wreaks of spiritual and moral bankruptcy. For both Jerusalem and Rome in the first century, the term is apt.

Click to expand...

There isn't one shred of biblical or historical evidence to indicate that Peter was ever in Rome.  In fact Peter never went to witness to gentiles, and Acts says the opposite, that when the persecution broke, he stayed in Jerusalem.  Some of the church fathers indicate that Peter was an elder in the church of Jerusalem, not Rome.

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Thank you for your cooperation.

John

Jerusalem .

The IVP Backround Bible Commentary :

"...Old Testament to the new empire of Rome. 'Babylon' has thus become a fairly common cryptogram for Rome..."


ROME

Thank u and God bless

a4c

Originally posted by Brian45
1 Peter 5


<I>Farewell and Peace</I>
<SUP>12</SUP> By Silvanus, our faithful brother as I consider him, I have written to you briefly, exhorting and testifying that this is the true grace of God in which you stand.
<SUP>13</SUP>She who is in Babylon, elect together with you, greets you; and so does Mark my son.<SUP> 14</SUP>Greet one another with a kiss of love.
Peace to you all who are in Christ Jesus. Amen.

&nbsp;

It is thought by many eschatolygists that peter used the term Babylon in reference to a city which he / they&nbsp; were residing in at that time&nbsp; .

It is also well known that the christians at that time were suffering persecution both by Rome and the jews ,&nbsp; and so they used signs and symbols and mathematical equations when comunicating with one another , so as to avoid the authorities&nbsp; .&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; (&nbsp; The sign of the fish ,&nbsp; we all know well&nbsp;. )

It is believed that if we could know which city it was that peter code named as Babylon , we may be able to understand which city it is that is mentioned in the book of revelation .

My question to everyone is&nbsp; :&nbsp; What city do you believe peter was refering to&nbsp; ?

Click to expand...

&nbsp;

And this is what armothe said -

I always found biblical references which would place Peter's <I>residence</I>&nbsp;in Jerusalem not Rome. Of course -he had travelled to Rome.

-After the great persecution the church was scattered, but the apostles (i.e. Peter) stayed in Jerusalem (Acts 8:1).

-When Philip preached in Samaria, the apostles at Jerusalem sent Peter and John to them. Thus Peter must have been living there (Acts 8:14).

- When Herod Agrippa imprisoned Peter, he was in Jerusalem (Acts 12:1-4).

- Three years after his conversion, Paul goes to Jerusalem to see Peter and even abides with him there. Therefore, Peter must have lived there (Galatians 1:18).

- Fourteen years after his conversion, Paul again returns to Jerusalem with Barnabas and Titus. Peter is there again and even named as a "pillar" in the church at Jerusalem (Galatians 2:1, 9).

- Paul tells us that Peter was intimidated by "Jews from James (i.e. Jerusalem)". Surely this would be because Peter's residence was there and he had to live with these people (Galatians 2:11,12).

- In the scripture in question (1 Peter 5:13), who is Mark?&nbsp; If it is a reference to John Mark then we presumably know that his original residence was in Jerusalem in the house of his mother. So if Marcus is John Mark, then the "church" would also be at Jerusalem (Acts 12:12).&nbsp;&nbsp;

&nbsp;

Interesting .

I'm inclined to agree with the above - and&nbsp;many futurist's&nbsp;likewise agree. Just as in Rev 11:8 we find Jerusalem described as "Sodom" = immorality, and "Egypt" = persecution, so also is Jerusalem described as "Babylon" = wanton idolatry. This accords with Peter's description of Jerusalem as "Babylon" in 1Pt 5:13.

davo

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Brian45, thanks for an honest question - I contributed&nbsp;an honest answer and have been summarily warned [how&nbsp;very sad is that]&nbsp;- I don't know what you think that but so much for chrisitian charity. Anyway, from one Aussie to another, blessings mate!

davo