The First Day

Hank · Nov 9, 2002

Originally posted by JohnR7
I suppose time could be an illusion. But the earth seems to be going around the sun at a consistant rate. Years do not seemed to have changed from the beginning. Also on a micro scale,  protons & neutrons seem to spin at a fairly consistant rate.

 This is not what I meant. Time is a real factor in our daily life. But time by itself is still only a measurement. What you describe is motion and not time. Earth orbits around the sun - this is a motion. As it happens it takes earth 365 days to complete one orbit. The orbit is in relation to the distance of the sun. If you are interested I can explain this relation in detail.

At a higher level, if time is something like matter or even space-time our universe would be deterministic. Since we have random actions taking place this too shows time does not exist. There even some respected physicists disagree sharply with my statement. Or you are not alone giving time more what it logically can be.

Since this Thursday I got a heavy flue, thus if you are interested I can give a comprehensive explanation of what I said when I can think for more then just five minutes.

JohnR7 · Nov 9, 2002

Originally posted by Hank
  Time is a real factor in our daily life. But time by itself is still only a measurement. What you describe is motion and not time. Earth orbits around the sun - this is a motion. 

If time is a measurement but you are not measureing the length of a day or the length of a year, then what are you measuring?

Hank · Nov 10, 2002

Originally posted by JohnR7
If time is a measurement but you are not measureing the length of a day or the length of a year, then what are you measuring?

Can you define lenght of day?

JohnR7 · Nov 10, 2002

Originally posted by Hank
Can you define lenght of day?

A 24 hour day, the amount of time it takes for the planet to make one rotation.

Hank · Nov 10, 2002

Originally posted by JohnR7
A 24 hour day, the amount of time it takes for the planet to make one rotation.

The rotation of the planet, the motion, exists since it is a real event. Now the '24 hours' is simply a measurement of that event. Time is real only as a concept, of our measurement.
Well so I think.

JohnR7 · Nov 11, 2002

Originally posted by Hank
Time is real only as a concept, of our measurement.
Well so I think.

Time may not matter much to a food gather. But to a food producer you have to know the seasons. It is important to know when to plant the seeds. So you have to keep track of time to some degree.

It maybe a rather abstract concept. But everything in creation relates to our ability to be able to preceive it. The universe is what it is to us, because of our ability to either preceive it that way with our natural eyes (senses), or with a instrament we have make.

Christian claim they have more than just the natural sense that we are born with. Christians claim that they have 6 spiritual senses, that non believers do not have. They claim to be able to preceive things that non believers are not able to preceive.

Jeremiah 5:21
    'Hear this now, O foolish people,
    Without understanding,
    Who have eyes and see not,
    And who have ears and hear not:

Ezekiel 12:2  "Son of man, you dwell in the midst of a rebellious house, which has eyes to see but does not see, and ears to hear but does not hear; for they are a rebellious house.

 

Morat · Nov 11, 2002

Of course, it would have to be more then the speed of light, because there was nothing but darkness

   Hehehe. That has got to be the funniest way to break Einstein I've ever seen.

   That ranks right up there with the old Aggie joke: "How are you going to handle the heat of visting the Sun? We're going to go at night!"

 

Hank · Nov 11, 2002

Originally posted by JohnR7
Time may not matter much to a food gather. But to a food producer you have to know the seasons. It is important to know when to plant the seeds. So you have to keep track of time to some degree.

It maybe a rather abstract concept. But everything in creation relates to our ability to be able to preceive it. The universe is what it is to us, because of our ability to either preceive it that way with our natural eyes (senses), or with a instrament we have make.

Christian claim they have more than just the natural sense that we are born with. Christians claim that they have 6 spiritual senses, that non believers do not have. They claim to be able to preceive things that non believers are not able to preceive.

Jeremiah 5:21
    'Hear this now, O foolish people,
    Without understanding,
    Who have eyes and see not,
    And who have ears and hear not:

Ezekiel 12:2  "Son of man, you dwell in the midst of a rebellious house, which has eyes to see but does not see, and ears to hear but does not hear; for they are a rebellious house.

 

Not sure if it is my fever or whatever, but you just lost me.

I do not believe in anything like those Christians say.

To the Bible
Ezekiel 12:1-11 (NIV)
The word of the LORD came to me: "Son of man, you are living among a rebellious people. They have eyes to see but do not see and ears to hear but do not hear, for they are a rebellious people.
"Therefore, son of man, pack your belongings for exile and in the daytime, as they watch, set out and go from where you are to another place. Perhaps they will understand, though they are a rebellious house. During the daytime, while they watch, bring out your belongings packed for exile. Then in the evening, while they are watching, go out like those who go into exile. While they watch, dig through the wall and take your belongings out through it. Put them on your shoulder as they are watching and carry them out at dusk. Cover your face so that you cannot see the land, for I have made you a sign to the house of Israel."
So I did as I was commanded. During the day I brought out my things packed for exile. Then in the evening I dug through the wall with my hands. I took my belongings out at dusk, carrying them on my shoulders while they watched.
In the morning the word of the LORD came to me: "Son of man, did not that rebellious house of Israel ask you, 'What are you doing?'
"Say to them, 'This is what the Sovereign LORD says: This oracle concerns the prince in Jerusalem and the whole house of Israel who are there.' 11 Say to them, 'I am a sign to you.'
"As I have done, so it will be done to them. They will go into exile as captives.

I hope you see why your passage of the scripture can only apply to actual the Israelites in the Bible.

JohnR7 · Nov 11, 2002

Originally posted by Hank
I hope you see why your passage of the scripture can only apply to actual the Israelites in the Bible.

So you think it is only the Hebrews that have eyes that can not see what God is doing, and ear that can not hear Him talking to them & a tongue that can not give Him thanks, praise, honor and glory?

I know of at least a few non Hebrews that are deaf, dumb, blind and mute when it comes to God and the things of God.

Hank · Nov 11, 2002

Originally posted by JohnR7
So you think it is only the Hebrews that have eyes that can not see what God is doing, and ear that can not hear Him talking to them & a tongue that can not give Him thanks, praise, honor and glory?

I know of at least a few non Hebrews that are deaf, dumb, blind and mute when it comes to God and the things of God.

Quoting the Bible out of contexts does not support your thesis.

Also what one considers the true other consider false, how do you know there is a God? Just because you and I believe does not require that to be true!

sulphur · Nov 12, 2002

In astonomy two time scales or clocks or whatever are used .Why do we have two systems if 24 hours is the set time .Could an expert please release us from our ignorance

JohnR7 · Nov 12, 2002

Originally posted by Hank
how do you know there is a God?

Because I know God. The same way I know I am married and I know I have a 4 year old son. I am not so sure about my 24 year old son, I only see him every week or two, so he is not as real to me as the family that I see every day. Now that he has his phone working, I suppose I could call him more often.

God is lot more real to me than you are. You are just pixels on a screen. He is so very much more than that. God fills me and refreshes me all the time, He gives me the strength I need. He give me all the healing I need. And on & on & on.

If you have no need for God and what He has to offer, then that is you, not me. I would not want to live without the benifits I receive as a Christian. In fact, He gives us life itself. Apart from God, there is no life. Jesus is the new and the living way.

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