Posted by edpobre: The Lord of Glory is Jesus. Don't you know that God MADE Jesus LORD? Read Acts 2:36.
Here ed
you are contradicting every part of: I am the LORD; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another or my praise to idols. (Isaiah 42:8)
What does the LORD say ed? He says that He will NOT do what you are saying He did. Explain that one. Of course
that is unless they are one in the same (which they are)
Posted by edpobre: If you THINK God the Father BECAME Jesus because of YOUR interpretation of these verses, then answer me HONESTLY fow, who is the Father to whom Jesus was praying in John 17:1
Here ed
lets let everyone read this and see what they see
how about it?
The Bible says: (John 14:5-10) Thomas said to him, "Lord, we don't know where you are going, so how can we know the way?" Jesus answered, "I am the way the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him." Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us." Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work."
You ask: Who is the Father to whom Jesus was praying in John 17:1? Your dimensional understanding does not limit the Father ed. He is the LORD of LORDS
He is the Alpha and the Omega
the Beginning and the End
the First and the Last
He is the Living God who says that there are no others but Him. He is the Savior
He is the Redeemer. All of these things Christ claims as well.
However
you say that God made Him these things
and that He gave all of this to Christ. Ah ha, but ed
that contradicts the very character of God
He says that He will NOT give these things to another
He says that there are no others but Him. Therefore Christ is God the Father who TOOK the nature of a man, out of His own Love
He says that He made HIMSELF a man
no one else did this to Him. God did not make
some sub-god a man
He made HIMSELF a man. This is the Father to whom the one who came from the Father prayed to during the time that He made Himself nothing.
Posted by edpobre: While it is true that Jesus (the MAN into which the WORD that was God BECAME) is the WORD of God
You say that the Word is God
and that it came into a man. However, God says that The He (the He that you refer to as a mere man) was with God in the Beginning. So, basically
the Word was God refers to this He who was with God in the Beginning.
(In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it... The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.)
Posted by edpobre: show me a scripture which says that <I>Jesus WAS the WORD</I> that was God <I>BEFORE he WAS born.</I>
The Bible says: (Revelation 19:13) He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.
Posted by edpobre: Apostle Paul SAID: there is ONLY ONE God, the FATHER (1 Cor. 8:6)
Here
I will post the verse for you ed: yet for us there is but one God, the Father, from whom all things came and from whom we live; and there is but one Lord, Jesus Christ, through whom all things came and through whom we live.
First of all
read the verse
tell me
do you think that this verse is saying that they are two different beings? It is not
Furthermore
this does explain exactly what we have been discussing here. God the Father had to fulfill His covenant. He had to become the ultimate sacrifice for man
you want to see this in the Bible? >>> Here you go: The Bible says, (Hebrews 9:16-17), In the case of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while THE ONE WHO MADE IT is living. Through what was man made (as the verse indicates)? I say that it was through Love that God created us. (Remember through Him all things were made that have been made: John 1) Also, 1 John 4:9This is how God showed His love among us: He sent His one and only Son into the world that we might live through Him. 1 John 4:19We love because He first loved us. I also know that God is love (1 John 4:8 and 4:16) This Love whom He is
desired to become our sacrifice: (Remember
the greatest love is willing to lay down his own life for his friend)
Importance on HIS OWN. You may say
God will not make Himself nothing therefore being able to sacrifice Himself. Why ed? Is God unwilling to do this? Is He too self-seeking to allow Himself to become humble and submit Himself to death? How would this be if Love is not self-seeking, and God is Love? (1 Corinthians 13:5)
Therefore: From an earlier post---When God made Himself a man... it was love.... Jesus Christ... and He subjected himself to endure mans punishment, and subservience. (Which is why you see Him in subservience to the Father) This was His sacrifice, that He became our sins... God the Father can not be in the presence of sin, much less become it. Therefore, out of His uncomprehendable love... He made Himself nothing. He came to us and His name is Jesus Christ-Emmanuel-God with us: Yes... God can do that, even becoming something on earth, while at the same time being God the Father in Heaven. Yes... God can do any number of "evens" that one could fathom asking.
Posted by edpobre: Sure, God and Jesus are BOTH Alpha and Omega. They BOTH said "I am the Alpha and the Omega." But that does NOT make them ONE God. Alpha and Omega does NOT mean the same to God as it means to Jesus.
Really
according to whom ed? Are you now speaking for Christ
saying what He is and is not? I simply believe what He says. I believe what He says to me through His Spirit. And I believe what He says in His word. I do not try to twist things around as you do. And if you say you havent, then answer all of the questions pertaining to Isaiah 42:8
Posted by edpobre: Show me the verse that says "God MADE Himself a MAN.
Well ed
Christ, in the word of God, says that He made HIMSELF nothing. The word does not say some separate being made Him nothing
it says He made Himself nothing. You seem to indicate that God gave some other being everything indicated in the above posts (coming with info straight out of the word)
The problem is that God HIMSELF says that He will NOT do exactly what you say He did. Here-- The Bible says: (Phil 2:5-10) Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. And being found in APPEARANCE as a man, he HUMBLED HIMSELF and BECAME obedient to death--even death on a cross! Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, (Reminder: God will not give His glory to another... He is the LORD and Him alone), that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.
Posted by edpobre: Earlier, you said that God the Father BECAME Jesus Christ. Now you are saying that Christ BECAME subject to God the Father.
Well ed
the Bible says that the Word (who was God) became flesh. It is the flesh (who was God) that became subservient to the very God (the only God) from whom He came.
Posted by edpobre: Christ will SUBJECT himself to HIM (meaning God) who placed ALL things under his feet (1 Cor. 15:28). Finally, God will again become "Lord of Lords."
You say again meaning that there was time when He was not
a time where it was Christ. However, this again contradicts the nature of God. He says that HE WILL NOT give His glory to another. Yet Christ is the Lord of Glory. This can only mean that Christ is the same as the one who spoke this: I am the LORD; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another
The fact is ed, that you are indeed wrong. You have allowed darkness to pervert what God says. Believe Him ed!
Christ, who being in very nature God, who made Himself nothing, became subject to God the Father... and at the end when all things were finished, was taken again into glory and given the title KING OF KINGS AND LORD OR LORDS... ALL CAPS ED. This is the title reserved for the LORD HIMSELF... WHO WILL NOT GIVE HIS GLORY TO ANOTHER... IT IS THE TITLE OF MY LORD CHRIST WHO IS RISEN FROM THE GRAVE HAVING DEFEATED DEATH... AND THE KEYS OF DEATH AND HADES RESIDE IN HIS HANDS! And after it is all over... Christ will subject Himself to the Father thus the Father becomes all in all. Christ is God... who made>HIMSELF<a man... and who was then again glorified by Him from whom He came
I believe
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