How many "Gods" can you count?

How many "Gods" can you count?

  • ONE

  • TWO

  • THREE


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edpobre

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Originally posted by OldShepherd
Originally posted by lared
I am sorry, but I have never come across the expression......."God the son" .......in the Bible. Perhaps you can tell me where exactly it is located. Thank-you.

Oh I am sorry, I have been a believer since six months before the six day war and that reply is just so clever and so original, I have never heard it before (more than several dozen times, that is.)

OldShepherd,

Why can't Trinitarians SHOW where "God the Son" may be found in the Bible? Now, instead of being sarcastic, why can't you be OLD enough to SHOW Lared where it is, if you can, or ADMIT the lack of it, if you CAN'T?

Ed
 
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franklin

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    Originally posted by OldShepherd
I do not follow traditions and speculations of men. You do. If I am correct you belong to a false cult that can be traced to 1913.  
 
OS... I think your wearing out your usual cult tripe!  I wonder what John would say about the followers of the 3 in one triune, trinitarian cult that is so overwhelming within the body of Christ in our day?  "For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist. Look to yourselves, that we lose not those things which we have wrought, but that we receive a full reward".  2 Jn 7-9
As you can see OS, I'm not following the speculations of men!  I'm following the words of the men who were inspired by the power of God's spirit!  Notice that John said, "many deceivers" ?  I can imagine how he would have wrote that if he came back today and visited our church houses?   

How can I be describing 3 gods when I quote from the O.T.? God the Redeemer, God the Savior, God the Father, God the lord of Hosts, and God the Deliverer. Appears that someone isn't reading the posts just posting blind attacks.
 
Your right OS!  I count 6 in your quote!  Can't you guys make up your mind how many God's your serving?  I choose to serve only One! 

The fact that you are a self-confessed liar does not prove that I or anyone else is. I know what I believe you haven't proved anything I have posted false.

You know Os, sometimes your statements are rediculas and your also twisting what I said out of context!  That is not a sign of a good debater!  I never claimed to be a self prclaimed liar!  I said I was deceived when I believed in the trinity!  I believe that most people who support the trinity are well meaning people but they can be deceived without knowing it themselves. I don't have to prove what you say is false either, the scriptures does that very well! 

How about Muslims they must be OK too they believe that the Trinity is false.[/b] [/B]

That's a poor argument OS!  It amazes me how you trinitarian defernders have to point to other religions and cults to try and prove and justify your false doctrine!   :(
 
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Gunny

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Chicago's Moody Church pastor, the late A.W. Tozer wrote these words:


"The teaching of the New Testament is that now, at this very moment, there is a Man in heaven appearing in the presence of God for us. He is as certainly a man as was Adam or Moses or Paul; he is a man glorified, but his glorification did not de-humanize him. Today he is a real man, of the race of mankind, bearing our lineaments and dimensions, a visible and audible man, whom any other man would recognize instantly as one of us. But more than this, he is the heir of all things, Lord of all lords, head of the church, firstborn of the new creation. He is the way to God, the life of the believer, the hope of Israel, and the high priest of every true worshiper. He holds the keys of death and hell, and stands as advocate and surety for everyone who believes on him in truth. Salvation comes not by accepting the finished work, or deciding for Christ; it comes by believing on the Lord Jesus Christ, the whole, living, victorious Lord who, as God and man, fought our fight and won it, accepted our debt as his own and paid it, took our sins and died under them, and rose again to set us free. This is the true Christ; nothing less will do."
 
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franklin

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Sarge....

These are the words of the Son of God......

John 5:17-24, "But Jesus answered them, My Father worketh hitherto, and I work. Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God. Then answered Jesus and said unto them, Verily, verily, I say unto you, The Son can do nothing of himself, but what he seeth the Father do: for what things soever he doeth, these also doeth the Son likewise. For the Father loveth the Son, and sheweth him all things that himself doeth: and he will shew him greater works than these, that ye may marvel. For as the Father raiseth up the dead, and quickeneth them; even so the Son quickeneth whom he will. For the Father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son: That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father. He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him. Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that heareth my word, and believeth on him that sent me, hath everlasting life, and shall not come into condemnation; but is passed from death unto life."

I like the authorship of Tozer myself, but his writtings are not inspiration.... Sorry, the words of Jesus carry more weight! 

 
 
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OldShepherd

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Previously posted by Franklin
Weather you know it or not OS, that's exactly what you are doing! You are worshipping 3 and not just one! And your right about what I used to believe about the trinity but back then I was lying to myself and I'm here to admit that, how bout you?
”back then I was lying to myself and I'm here to admit that. . .My response: “The fact that you are a self-confessed liar does not prove that I or anyone else is. I know what I believe, you haven't proved anything I have posted false.”
You know Os, sometimes your statements are rediculas and your also twisting what I said out of context! That is not a sign of a good debater! I never claimed to be a self prclaimed liar! I said I was deceived when I believed in the trinity!
Please note the highlighted words in your previous post. Further affirmed by the words “admit it.” I do not see the word "deceived" in there anywhere. Please know what you are talking about when responding. You can't even keep track of what you post from one day to the next and you are going to teach us?
I don't have to prove what you say is false either, the scriptures does that very well!
Nothing but empty words. As I said I have quoted many, many passages of scripture, exegesis from the original languages, and documentary support from the early church and you have ignored about 99% of what I have posted.
That's a poor argument OS! It amazes me how you trinitarian defernders have to point to other religions and cults to try and prove and justify your false doctrine!
Oh you mean the way you keep pointing to the blasphemeous teaching of the Iglesias ni Christo, presented by Pobre, to support your arguments?
 
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OldShepherd

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Originally posted by edpobre
Why can't Trinitarians SHOW where "God the Son" may be found in the Bible? Now, instead of being sarcastic, why can't you be OLD enough to SHOW Lared where it is, if you can, or ADMIT the lack of it, if you CAN'T?
I'll show you where "God the Son" is in the Bible as soon as you show me the word Bible in the scriptures. "or ADMIT the lack of it, if you CAN'T?"
 
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OldShepherd

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Originally posted by franklin
Your right OS!  I count 6 in your quote!  Can't you guys make up your mind how many God's your serving?  I choose to serve only One! 
Previously posted by OS: "How many times does the word God appear in this sentence? God the Redeemer, God the Savior, God the Father, God the lord of Hosts, and God the Deliverer.

Here we see the cult mindset. If I, as a believer, quote from the O.T., as I have done, the statements listed in my previous post I am accused of worshipping six Gods. Although every one of these are titles/names that God referred to Himself by. So when the Bible itself does not agree with the false teachings of Franklin's cult, then the Bible is wrong.


Isaiah 41:14 Fear not, thou worm Jacob, and ye men of Israel; I help thee, saith the LORD, and thy Redeemer, the Holy One of Israel.

Isaiah 43:3 For I am the LORD thy God, The Holy One of Israel, thy Saviour; I have given Egypt as thy ransom, Ethiopia and Seba for thee.

Psalms 89:26 (89-27) He shall call unto Me: Thou art my Father, my God, and the rock of my salvation.

Psalms 18:2 (18-3) The LORD is my rock, and my fortress, and my deliverer; my God, my rock, in Him I take refuge; my shield, and my horn of salvation, my high tower.
 
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edpobre

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Originally posted by OldShepherd
I'll show you where "God the Son" is in the Bible as soon as you show me the word Bible in the scriptures. "or ADMIT the lack of it, if you CAN'T?"

OldShepherd,

Who says the word BIBLE is not in the Scriptures? The Scriptures that I am reading right now  has The HOLY BIBLE written on its inside cover. I bet you CAN'T show me where "God the Son" is ANYWHERE in or on the Holy Bible.

Ed
 
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OldShepherd

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Originally posted by edpobre
Who says the word BIBLE is not in the Scriptures? The Scriptures that I am reading right now  has The HOLY BIBLE written on its inside cover. I bet you CAN'T show me where "God the Son" is ANYWHERE in or on the Holy Bible.
"Who says the word BIBLE is not in the Scriptures?" On the cover is not "in the scriptures." There is a lot of information on the cover and fly leaf which are not part of the scriptures. When you can answer my question I will answer yours.
 
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edpobre

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Originally posted by OldShepherd
"Who says the word BIBLE is not in the Scriptures?" On the cover is not "in the scriptures." There is a lot of information on the cover and fly leaf which are not part of the scriptures. When you can answer my question I will answer yours.

OldShepherd,

Whether you answer or not, readers know you CAN'T, because they are more intelligent than you give them credit for.  

Apostle John wrote: "but these are written that you may BELIEVE that Jesus is the Christ, the SON of God, and that BELIEVING you may have life in his name" (John 20:31).

Now be HONEST OldShepherd and tell me. Is there a verse in the WHOLE Bible (including the Apocrypha) that says: "but these are written that you may BELIEVE that Jesus is GOD the son, and that BELIEVING you may have life in his name?"

Show me, if you can.

Ed
 
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Gunny

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Originally posted by edpobre
Like Jesus, Bro. Felix Manalo TAUGHT that he was SENT by God and BACKED UP his belief by prophecies recorded in the Bible like what Jesus did. Bro. Felix Manalo TAUGHT doctrines from God like what Jesus did.
Ed

Originally posted by edpobre
because it is in the Philippines where this TRUE "Church of Christ" RE-EMERGED.
As anyone can SEE, these doctrinal statements are NOT mandated by the INC Administration but are MANDATED by God THROUGH the INC Administration.
Ed


http://members.tripod.com/insiders_inc/

http://www.gospelcom.net/apologeticsindex/i00.html

http://www.letusreason.org/igleidir.htm

http://members.tripod.com/~janchung/table_of_contents.html

http://members.tripod.com/~janchung/false_messenger.html

http://members.tripod.com/xcrusaders/angeleast.html

http://www.adeptsys.com/chrysalis/Pages/info/iglesia.html

http://www.nossumus.net/iglesyanikristo/lesson11.html

http://www.examineiglesianicristo.com/honesty4.html

http://thebereans.net/qa-realname.shtml
 
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edpobre

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"My dear friends,

do not believe all who claim to have the spirit, but test them to find out if the spirit they have comes from God. For many false prophets have gone out everywhere.

This is how you will be able to know whether it is God's Spirit: anyone who acknowledges that Jesus Christ CAME as a HUMAN BEING has the Spirit who comes from God. But anyone who DENIES this about Jesus does NOT have the Spirit of God. The spirit that he has is the ENEMY of Christ; you heard that it would come, and now it is here in the world already" (1 John 4:1-3 Today's English Version).

Trinitarians DENY that Jesus Christ CAME as a  HUMAN being. They TEACH that Jesus Christ CAME as God who BECAME a MAN.

Do Trinitarians have the Spirit of God? The Bible says NO! Those who PERSECUTE the Iglesia Ni Cristo are TRINITARIANS. Should you believe them? The Bible says NO!

Ed



 
 
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Gunny

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Originally posted by edpobre
"My dear friends,

do not believe all who claim to have the spirit, but test them to find out if the spirit they have comes from God. For many false prophets have gone out everywhere.
Ed

Originally posted by edpobre
Like Jesus, Bro. Felix Manalo TAUGHT that he was SENT by God and BACKED UP his belief by prophecies recorded in the Bible like what Jesus did. Bro. Felix Manalo TAUGHT doctrines from God like what Jesus did.
Ed

Originally posted by edpobre
because it is in the Philippines where this TRUE "Church of Christ" RE-EMERGED.
As anyone can SEE, these doctrinal statements are NOT mandated by the INC Administration but are MANDATED by God THROUGH the INC Administration.
Ed

Originally posted by edpobre
Like Jesus, Bro. Felix Manalo TAUGHT that he was SENT by God and BACKED UP his belief by prophecies recorded in the Bible like what Jesus did. Bro. Felix Manalo TAUGHT doctrines from God like what Jesus did.
Ed

Originally posted by edpobre
because it is in the Philippines where this TRUE "Church of Christ" RE-EMERGED.
As anyone can SEE, these doctrinal statements are NOT mandated by the INC Administration but are MANDATED by God THROUGH the INC Administration.
Ed


Originally posted by edpobre
The IGLESIA NI CRISTO is the TRUE church of Christ in these last days.
Thus, ONLY members of the IGLESIA NI CRISTO WILL be saved!




That's TRUE! The work of Christ on the cross is NOT sufficient in of itself for salvation
One must ENTER the FOLD or FLOCK in order to be SAVED. That fold or flock is the IGLESIA NI CRISTO, the TRUE church of Christ in these last days.

The IGLESIA NI CRISTO is the TRUE church of Christ in these last days. It has been GIVEN to them to KNOW The mysteries of the kingdom of heaven THROUGH a MESSENGER commissioned by God THROUGH Bible PROPHECIES.
Ed 
 





Alpha and Omega


The Trinity: The Father, The Son, The Holy Spirit


Is the Creedal Doctrine of Trinity Biblical


A brief declaration and vindication of the Trinity


The following links provide information regarding Iglesia ni Cristo, it's founder, their doctrine, who they state Jesus is?, what Salvation is according to their man-made doctrinal beliefs, the control they adminster to it's members, their deceptive practices, and the claims of the founder, Felix Manalo and his belief that he is spoken of in scripture as a messenger of God/The 5th angel.

There is a considerable amount of data that has been gathered on Iglesia ni Cristo, much of it from their own publications and former members.

I believe it is well worth the time reading over the information regarding Iglesia ni Cristo, indeed.


Examine Iglesia ni Cristi

http://members.tripod.com/insiders_inc/

http://www.gospelcom.net/apologeticsindex/i00.html

http://www.letusreason.org/igleidir.htm

http://members.tripod.com/~janchung/table_of_contents.html

http://members.tripod.com/~janchung/false_messenger.html

http://members.tripod.com/xcrusaders/angeleast.html

http://www.adeptsys.com/chrysalis/Pages/info/iglesia.html

http://www.nossumus.net/iglesyanikristo/lesson11.html

http://www.examineiglesianicristo.com/honesty4.html

http://thebereans.net/qa-realname.shtml
 
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OldShepherd

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Originally posted by lared
I am sorry, but I have never come across the expression......."God the son" .......in the Bible. Perhaps you can tell me where exactly it is located. Thank-you.
I'm sorry Lared this is at least the second time you have posted this inane juvenile question and you ignored my reponse before. So here it is again. Perhaps you would care to show us exactly where the word Bible appears in the scriptures?

outwV gar hgaphsen o qeoV ton kosmon wste ton uion autou ton monogenh edwken ina paV o pisteuwn eiV auton mh apolhtai all ech zwhn aiwnion
 
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I am sorry, but I have never come across the expression......."God the son" .......in the Bible. Perhaps you can tell me where exactly it is located. Thank-you.

If the Son is also "God" then one could naturally refer to the son as "God the Son".

Zech14:4..cf..Act1:11-12..etc..

God bless--FM
 
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edpobre

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Originally posted by Future Man
I am sorry, but I have never come across the expression......."God the son" .......in the Bible. Perhaps you can tell me where exactly it is located. Thank-you.

If the Son is also "God" then one could naturally refer to the son as "God the Son".

Zech14:4..cf..Act1:11-12..etc..

God bless--FM

Perhaps you can show us where exactly does the Bible say that the Son is "ALSO God." Zechariah 14:4 cf Acts 1:11-12 does NOT tell us EXACTLY that the Son is ALSO God.

Ed
 
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fieldsofwind

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------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Posted by edpobre: "I wonder if Einstein would agree to this "out of space" equation!"

I wonder if you have read 1 cor. chapter 1. God says that he delights in the fact that man finds Himself as foolishness.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted by edpobre: "You really are FORCING a square peg into a round hole Ben. How can Jesus, a SEPARATE personality, be ABSOLUTE God when he does NOT know EVERYTHING the Father knows?"


Got something for you here ed... look this up.

Revelation chapter 19:12

take care

FOW
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I am the LORD; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another or my praise to idols. (Isaiah 42:8)


Ed... who is the Lord of Glory?

scroll down








1 Corinthians 2:8-- None of the rulers of this age understood it, for if they had, they would not have crucified the Lord of glory.
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I find it strange that edpobre has yet to address this post... been here for over a month I think... in various threads... each about this topic.

Posted by ed: I know what is in the Bible fow. But that is not my question. I said you are NOT being RATIONAL because you said that this "thing" who is at the the side of the Father is "one and the SAME thing as the Father." BTW, what is this you cal "thing" fow?

you are the one that refered to 'thing'

Posted by ed: "Then show me the verse which says that the Father BECAME the SON."

The Bible says: (John 14:5-10) Thomas said to him, "Lord, we don't know where you are going, so how can we know the way?" Jesus answered, "I am the way the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me. If you really knew me, you would know my Father as well. From now on, you do know him and have seen him." Philip said, "Lord, show us the Father and that will be enough for us." Jesus answered: "Don't you know me, Philip, even after I have been among you such a long time? Anyone who has seen me has seen the Father. How can you say, 'Show us the Father'? Don't you believe that I am in the Father, and that the Father is in me? The words I say to you are not just my own. Rather, it is the Father, living in me, who is doing his work."

The Bible says: (John 1:1-5, 14) In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. He was with God in the beginning. Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. In him was life, and that life was the light of men. The light shines in the darkness, but the darkness has not understood it... The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the One and Only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.

The Bible says: (Revelation 19:13) He is dressed in a robe dipped in blood, and his name is the Word of God.

The Bible says: (Phil 2:5-10) Your attitude should be the same as that of Christ Jesus: Who, being in very nature God, did not consider equality with God something to be grasped, but made himself nothing, taking the very nature of a servant, being made in human likeness. And being found in APPEARANCE as a man, he HUMBLED HIMSELF and BECAME obedient to death--even death on a cross! Therefore God exalted him to the highest place and gave him the name that is above every name, (Reminder: God will not give His glory to another... He is the LORD and Him alone), that at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, in heaven and on earth and under the earth, and every tongue confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father.

The Bible says this was necessary: (Hebrews 9:14) How much more, then, will the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself unblemished to God, cleanse our consciences from acts that lead to death, so that we may serve the living God!

The Bible says: (Hebrews 9:16-17) In the cse of a will, it is necessary to prove the death of the one who made it, because a will is in force only when somebody has died; it never takes effect while THE ONE WHO MADE IT is living.

Did God not make the covenant???

The Bible says: (Rev 19:16) On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS. (Remeber God says that I am the LORD; that is my name! I will not give my glory to another or my praise to idols. (Isaiah 42:8)


well ed.... Christ says that HE is the Alapha and the Omega... the Beginning and the End... the First and the Last..... as does the Father. I ask you ed... are they not claiming the saim thing??? if two things come in first in a race... are they not of equal speed??? simple

ed's reply: If that's how you think, do you admit then that you believe there are two "Gods" whom you pass off as "things?"

No ed... that's not how I think.. They both say it ed... God says that there are no others... therefore they are one... they are both the Alpha and the Omega... the Beginning and the End... ther FIRST AND THE LAST!!!

Why did God create the earth ed??? It was because He desired a love relationship with a creation... Love ed... "Through Him all things were made that have been made" (John 1)... God is Love (1st John 4:8)... and through His love, He came to us. (also John 1) There are not two separate 'things' as you say ed... there is one Living God who is omniscient, omnipresent, and omnipotent. He is undescribable... and says that He IS.

When God made Himself a man... it was His love.... Jesus Christ... and He subjected himself to endure mans punishment, and subservience. This was His sacrifice, that He became our sins... God the Father can not be in the presence of sin, much less become it. Therefore, out of His uncomprehendible love... He made Himself nothing. He came to us and His name is Jesus Christ-Emmanuel-God with us: Yes... God can do that, even becoming something on earth, while at the same time being God the Father in Heaven. Yes... God can do any number of "evens" that one could fathom asking.

Christ, who being in very nature God, who made Himself nothing, became subject to God the Father... and at the end when all things were finished, was taken again into glory and given the title KING OF KINGS AND LORD OR LORDS... ALL CAPS ED. This is the title reserved for the LORD HIMSELF... WHO WILL NOT GIVE HIS GLORY TO ANOTHER... IT IS THE TITLE OF MY LORD CHRIST WHO IS RISEN FROM THE GRAVE HAVING DEFEATED DEATH... AND THE KEYS OF DEATH AND HADES RESIDE IN HIS HANDS! And after it is all over... Christ will subject Himself to the Father thus the Father becomes all in all. Christ is God... who made>HIMSELF<a man... and who was then again glorified by Him from whom He came

I believe
 
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OldShepherd

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Originally posted by lared
I am sorry, but I have never come across the expression......."God the son" .......in the Bible. Perhaps you can tell me where exactly it is located. Thank-you.
Lared, this will be the third time I have responded to this identical post. If you are going to ask questions of the members on this forum, is it too much that you show the common courtesy of acknowledging and responding to their replies?

You used the word Bible in your post, please show me where that word appears in the Bible and then I will answer your question.
 
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