Antagonistic relationship between Islam and Christianity

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français

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snowbunny, nice perspective, and i used to sort of have views like that.

unfortunetely, as time has progressed,i keep getting a more negative view of islam. which is really sad, because i HATE holding grudges on a specific group of people. i find it hoerrendously disgusting when people hold grudges on a specific group of people. so i try and try and try to change my views, because hate is never good! but sadly, my view doesn't change. :(

i think i've just had some bad experiences with muslims.. really bad. and it's made me stereotype all for the actions of a few. :(
 
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Bookofknowledge

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unfortunetely, as time has progressed,i keep getting a more negative view of islam. which is really sad, because i HATE holding grudges on a specific group of people. i find it hoerrendously disgusting when people hold grudges on a specific group of people. so i try and try and try to change my views, because hate is never good! but sadly, my view doesn't change.

If I show you something from Qur'aan you will not be able to deny it hence don't confirm yourself as not a good listener.

Come to what is common simply repeating like a broken record doesn't make sense at all.
 
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bostonlass

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As I would suggest the following authors for a more balanced understanding of Islam.

Jeffrey Lang
Martin Lings
Muhammad Asad (Leopold Weiss)
Yahiya Emerick
Tariq Ramadan
Karen Armstrong
John Esposito
Hamza Yusuf

To name a few.

Western Muslims and the Future of Islam, by Tariq Ramadan is a book that I'm 1/2 way through reading right now. It's a hard read because it's so jam packed with information but it is soooo worth it and it addresses one of the things that kjf512 just brought up, specifically the fact that American muslims are so arab.

I fell into that myself when I first converted. Truly I thought my days of Kraft mac n cheese were gone for good and now it was gonna be all hummus and falafel!!!:eek: :eek:

It's been a slow process but I'm starting to realize that I can be muslim AND keep my American identity all at the same time. :idea: So.................while I do eat the occaisional hummus and mashi with the hubster, I still delve into that mac n cheese and (all beef) hot dogs when I want. :thumbsup:

If the US would finally let Mr. Ramadan into the country perhaps he could actually bring some much needed change into our muslim community. :swoon:
 
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bostonlass

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Whoops....I forgot to say that both mosques that I frequent have frequent dinners with the community which include both priests, ministers and rabbis. We have a lot of interfaith dialogues and it is really helpful to all that get involved. It has gone a long way in bridging the gap that used to exist. I don't know if this happens in other communities outside of the Boston area but it should.
 
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français

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bostonlass - i think the problem with arabic islam here is that most muslims seem to be arabs (or at least the imams. most muslims are prolly black?)

in germany though, it seems that the islam is more of a turkish islam. and in france, it's more african style. so i think the culture of this or that happens to do with a lot of it. hopefully western islam will get its own liberal, western style and not be so heretically arab!

bookofknowledge - i read it again, and it doesn't mean any sense. it sounds like a run on sentence.
 
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français

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Get ready to deny everything that I am going to post.

what on earth are you talking about? what, are you going to try to find some way to backstab me? or perhpas specifically pick on me (as islam mulia does) or maybe ur going to try to put some huge burden of claims on me and ask me to debunk them?

what is ur problem man?
 
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Bookofknowledge

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what on earth are you talking about? what, are you going to try to find some way to backstab me? or perhpas specifically pick on me (as islam mulia does) or maybe ur going to try to put some huge burden of claims on me and ask me to debunk them?

what is ur problem man?

In order for you to have negative view I am sure you had sufficient knowledge about the teachings of Islam. Simply read the following verses and based on human understanding tell me good or bad.....

Accept or Deny after Reading

2:271
To give charity in public is good, but to gives the poor in private is better and will remove from you some of your sins. Allah is aware of your actions.

Accept or Deny after Reading

2:283
If you are on a journey and cannot find a scribe to write down the transaction, then transect your business by taking possession of a pledge. If one of you entrust another with a pledge, let the trustee deliver the pledged property to its owner, and let him fear Allah, his Rabb. Do not conceal testimony, and whoever conceals it, his heart is surely sinful. Allah is aware of all your actions.

Accept or Deny after Reading

2:264
O believers! Do not make your charity worthless by reminders of your generosity or by injury to the recipients feelings, like those who spend their wealth to be seen by people and believe neither in Allah nor in the Last Day. Their parable is like a hard barren rock covered with thin layer of soil; a heavy rain falls, leaving it just a bare stone. Such people will not gain any reward that they thought they had earned. Allah does not guide the unbelievers.


Accept or Deny after Reading

2:215
They ask you what they should spend in charity. Say: "Whatever you spend with a good heart, give it to parents, relatives, orphans, the helpless, and travellers in need. Whatever good you do, Allah is aware of it.

Tell me what why you getting more negative view of islam after Reading

2:136
Say: "We believe in Allah and that which is revealed to us; and what was revealed to Ibrahim (Abraham), Isma'il (Ishmael), Ishaq (Isaac), Ya'qoob (Jacob) and their descendants, and that which was given to Musa (Moses), Isa (Jesus) and other Prophets from their Rabb. We do not discriminate any of them, and to Allah we have surrendered ourselves (in Islam)."

Tell me why you getting more negative view of islam after Reading

12:43
One day the king of Egypt said: "I saw seven fat cows in my dream which were eaten up by seven lean cows,
likewise I saw seven green ears of corn and seven others that were dried up. O chiefs! Tell me the meaning of my dream if you can interpret the dreams."

Tell me why you getting more negative view of islam after Reading

14:35
Remember when Ibrahim (Abraham) said: "My Rabb! Make this city a city of peace and save me and my sons from the worship of idols.

16:125
Call people to the Way of your Rabb with wisdom and best advice, and reason with them, if you have to, in the most courteous manner: for your Rabb knows best who strays from His Way and He knows best who is rightly guided.

2:272
O Prophet, you are not responsible for their guidance, it is Allah Who guides whom He pleases. Whatever wealth you spend in charity, it is to your own advantage; provided you give to seek the pleasure of Allah. Whatever wealth you spend for the sake of Allah, will be paid back to you in full, and you will not be wronged.

I can go move indepth if needed...
 
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français

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In order for you to have negative view I am sure you had sufficient knowledge about the teachings of Islam. Simply read the following verses and based on human understanding tell me good or bad.....

Accept or Deny after Reading



Accept or Deny after Reading



Accept or Deny after Reading




Accept or Deny after Reading





Tell me what why you getting more negative view of islam after Reading




Tell me what why you getting more negative view of islam after Reading



Tell me what why you getting more negative view of islam after Reading

WOW. you made me wait here for 2 hours, when i was going to get a coffee, all to post that?

yes, the quran most definetely some has good verses.. some VERY nice verses. and i am thankful for that.

now, let's see if you can deny this..

Koran 8:65
"O Prophet exhort the believers to fight. If there be of you 20 steadfast,they will overcome 200 and if there be of you a 100, they shall overcome a 1000, because the disbelievers are a folk without intelligence"

accept of deny?

Koran 8:67-68
"It is not for any Prophet to have captives until he hath made slaughter in the land. You desire the lure of this world and Allah desires for you the hereafter and Allah is Mighty, Wise.. Now enjoy what you have won as lawful and good and keep your duty to Allah. Lo! Allah is forgiving, merciful."

accept of deny?

(Koran 8:55-57)
"Lo, the worst of beasts in Allah's sight are the ungrateful who will not believe."

"Those of them with whom you made a treaty and then at every opportunity they break their treaty and they keep not duty to Allah, If you come on them in the war, deal with them so as to strike fear in those who are behind them, so that they may remember."

acept or deny?

Koran 3:153
"When you climbed the hill and paid no heed, while the Messenger (Mohammed) in your rear was calling you to fight. Therefore he rewarded you grief for his grief that he might teach you, not to sorrow either for that which you missed or for that which befell you. Allah is informed of what you do."

accept or deny?

One of the men Abu Sa'id Khudri of Mohammed's army reported : "We were lusting after women and chastity had become too hard for us, but we wanted to get the ransom money for our prisoners. So we wanted to use the "Azl" (Coitus Interruptus- where the man withdraws before [bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse][bless and do not curse])...We asked the Prophet about it and he said: "You are not under any obligation to stop yourselves from doing it like that.." Later on the women and children were given for ransom to their envoys. They all went away to their country and not One wanted to stay although they had the choice.."


accept or deny?


Koran 4:24 "And all married women are forbidden unto you EXCEPT those captives whom your right hand possesses. It is a decree of Allah for you. Lawful unto you are all beyond those mentioned, so that you seek them with your wealth in honest wedlock, not debauchery..."


accept or deny?


Koran 5:51
O you who believe! Take not the Jews and Christians for friends. They are friends one to another. He among you who taketh them for friends is one of them. Lo allah guideth not wrongdoing folk.
Koran 5:64
The Jews say: "Allah's hand is fettered." It is THEIR hands that are fettered and they are ACCURSED for saying so. Nay, but both his (Allah's) hands are spread in bounty. He bestoweth as he will. That which hath been revealed unto thee from thy Lord is certain to increase the contumacy and belief of many of them, And We have cast among them (The Jews) Enmity and Hatred till the day of Resurrection. As often as they light a fire for war, Allah extinguishes it!





accept or deny?

Koran 5:33

" And many gains will they (Pious Muslims) acquire besides, and Allah is Exalted in Power, full of Wisdom. Allah has promised you many gains that ye shall Acquire and he has given you these beforehand; and he has restrained the hands of Men from you; so that it may be a sign for the Believers and that he may guide you to a Straight Path. And other gains there are, which are not within your power now, but which Allah has compassed for you and Allah has Power over all things."



accept or deny?



Koran 66:1-2

"O Prophet! Why holdest Thou to be forbidden That which Allah has made Lawful to Thee? Thou seekest to Please Thy consorts. But Allah is Oft-Forgiving, Most Merciful. Allah has already ORDAINED for you (Mohammed), the DISSOLUTION OF YOUR OATHS, in some cases and Allah is your Protector; and he is full of Knowledge and Wisdom."



accept or deny?




i know that the quran doesn't say to kill all non muslims. it has many restrictions n when, and why to do a such. so yeah, i know that. fine.


but the fact is, is the quran isn't free of vioelcnce by any means? and yes, there are some good verses in the quran. but there are also some bad verses.


maybe it's not islam that's the problem.. but rather muslims, who portray islam. but either way.. islam is in a horrible stage right now. :(


i'm thankful that the quran has good verses here and there. and never did ideny that it did. but that doesn't mean that the quran doesn't have violent verses as well.


 
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czach8

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If I show you something from Qur'aan you will not be able to deny it hence don't confirm yourself as not a good listener.

And if I show you a chapter in the Hadith, and question it accordingly, you yourself fail to conform to proper listening skills.

Come to what is common simply repeating like a broken record doesn't make sense at all.

Yeah brother, my point exactly.
 
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Bookofknowledge

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WOW. you made me wait here for 2 hours, when i was going to get a coffee, all to post that?

yes, the quran most definetely some has good verses.. some VERY nice verses. and i am thankful for that.

now, let's see if you can deny this..

i'm thankful that the quran has good verses here and there. and never did ideny that it did. but that doesn't mean that the quran doesn't have violent verses as well.

You guys don't follow the teachings of Jesus either, instead of agreing with people who are trying to explain and show good you have to point out what you can't even understand...

take one step at a time if you really want to learn... did you graduated High School before passing kindergarden?

2:40
O children of Israel! Remember My favors to you; fulfil your covenant (firm Commitment) with Me and I will fulfil My covenant with you, that you should fear none but Me.

2:41
Believe in My revelations, which are confirming your scriptures; do not be the first one to deny My revelations, and do not sell them for a petty price, fear Me and Me alone.

2:42
Do not mix the Truth with falsehood, or knowingly conceal the truth.

2:43
Establish Salah (prayers); give Zakah (charity); and bow down with those who bow down in worship.
 
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czach8

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In order for you to have negative view I am sure you had sufficient knowledge about the teachings of Islam. Simply read the following verses and based on human understanding tell me good or bad.....

And do you deny or accept the following verses:

1. In book 1 chp 9 says, “It is forbidden to supplicate blessings for the polytheists”.

Don't Muslims have a warm heart for polytheists?

2. In book 1 chp 22 says, “Concerning the fact that no one will enter paradise except the believers”.

So all Muslims will easily and openly condemn non-believers to hell?

3. book 1 chp 31 says, “When the slave runs away from his master, his prayer is not accepted and the slave automatically becomes an infidel”.

Why do slaves have it this bad. Isn't the way of life suppose to be the same for all Muslims?

4. In book 1 chp 93 says, “Friendship with believers and dissociation with non-believers”.

This is the way of life for Muslims? How snobbish, don't you think?

5. In book 15 chp 41 says, “excellence of kissing the black stone while circumambulating”.

The Islamic way of life is to kiss an idol?

6. In book 16 chp 17 says, “it is not permissible to marry a woman who is divorced by three pronouncements until she is married to another man and he has sexual intercourse with her, and then he abandons her and completes her iddah”.

The Islamic way of life condones divorce, and breaks the vow between a man and wife before God?

7. In book 28(pertaining to the oath for fighting, requital, and blood) chp 6 says, “it is permissible to take the life of a Muslim pertaining to 3 cases: married adulteress, a lie for a like, and 1 who leaves Islam after accepting it.”

The way of Islam is to kill non-believers?

8. In book 31(pertaining to holy struggle) chp 21 says, “I will expel the Jews and Christians from the Arabian peninsula and will not leave any but Muslims”.

The way of life in Islam is to expel all Jews and Christians out of Arabia?

9. In book 33(pertaining to hermitage) says, “it is forbidden to take the Quran to land of the infidels when it is feared that it might fall into their hands”.

The way of Islamic life cannot be shared with the infidels?

10. In book 41(pertaining to poetry) chp 1 says, “it is prohibited to play chess”.

Playing chess is harmful to the Islamic way of life?

11. Book 32 Chp 23, “He upon whom Allah’s apostle invoked a curse on one who did not deserve it, but was intended to be a source of reward and mercy for him.”

The way of life in Islam is to invoke evil curses on others?

12. .Book 32 Chp 30, “it is forbidden to strike at the face”.

The way of life in Islam is to condone violence anywhere but the face?

13. Book 32 Chp 33, “the prohibition of pointing a weapon to a Muslim”.

The way of Islamic life is to point a weapon only to non-believers?

14. .Book 33 chp 6, “There is none born but is created to his true nature (Islam). It is his parents who make him a Jew or a Christian or a Magian quite as beasts produce their young with their limbs perfect. Do you see anything deficient in them? Then he quoted the Qur'an., The nature made by Allah in which He has created men there is no altering of Allah's creation; that is the right religion".

If Islam is way of life from the beginning of Adam, then why do Muslims condemn Hindus, Christians, etc as non-believers if they are already born in Islam?

14. Book 36 chp 1 says, “the majority in paradise would consist of the poor pious persons and the majority of the denizens of hell consist of women, and the trial by means of women”.

The way of Islam is throw more women in hell?

15. Book 42 chp 11, “disapproval of yawning and sneezing”.

The way of Islam is to not yawn or sneeze?

If you are hesitant in either accepting or denying these verses, then I understand if you choose to flee from my questions. However, my advice to you is think before you talk. Peace bro.
 
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Bookofknowledge

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no, i passed kindergarten, and went to high school later in my life.

now will you accept czachs challenge?

czachs has limited understanding ability to grasp because when explained to him he will quit and start another thread and when explained to him on other threads he quit posting for some time and return by posting same questions...

Forget about him he comes and go but what about you? and your knowledge.

I have given One Post and you couldn't deny anything on what I have posted rather you have posted on something completely based on your own understanding.
 
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czach8

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You guys don't follow the teachings of Jesus either, instead of agreing with people who are trying to explain and show good you have to point out what you can't even understand...

I think Christians can accept that there are some flaws in the bible, but do not fool yourself to believe that Islamic scripture is absolutely flawless.

take one step at a time if you really want to learn... did you graduated High School before passing kindergarden?

And did Prophet Muhammad or Jesus Christ have high advanced degrees from Ivy League schools? I don't think so. Again like I said before, think before you talk.

Thank you.
 
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