Originally posted by SemperReformanda
JohnR7-
Again, we run into the context issue. When studying the Word, we need to look at not only the immediate context of what is being said, but also to whom it's being said, and in what way it is being said. By that I mean, is it poetry, wisdom literature, history, prophecy, a didactic epistle, etc.
We run into this in a big way with your interpretation of Duet. 11:14.
First of all, to whom is God speaking? National Israel. This is a NATIONAL promise which was given to the people of Israel, the Jews. Unless you believe that by obedience to the Law you will be given a portion of the land between Lebanon and the River Euphrates.
I am reminded of a book written by Frances Shaffer that talked about: "How then should we live". He asked a question but I do not think he ever found the answer for his question.
Now we are asking: How or in what way does the Old Testament apply to us today? First we must look at some key scripture and go on from there.
2 Tim. 3:16 All Scripture is given by inspiration of God, and is profitable for doctrine, for reproof, for correction, for instruction in righteousness,
Hebrews 10:1a For the law, having a shadow of the good things to come, and not the very image of the things,
1 Cor. 10:11 Now all these things happened to them as examples, and they were written for our admonition, upon whom the ends of the ages have come.
I'll tell you that this is exactly what I was talking about in that we are going to have to go beyond the early church. We are going to need a greater annointing then what they had.
People have been debating over what Paul wrote for a very long time now. They just don't get it. But Paul was one of the few people who really made an effort to show us how the Old Testamant applys to the church. He was one of the few Christians who had really studied the Old Testment at the time.
Now you say: "we need to look at not only the immediate context of what is being said, but also to whom it's being said" Who it is being said to is US. I do not have the time to look up all the scriptures that talk about how things were written for our sake. But here is one of them:
Romans 4:23-24 Now it was not written for his sake alone that it was imputed to him, but also for us.
I asked the pastor at the church I attend here. How can you talk to 1500 people or 150,000 people all at once and make them feel like you are personally talking to each and every one of them. He said it is very simple, I talk to everyone. Meaning he does not exclude anyone. It is the same thing with the Bible. God though the inspiration of the Holy Spirit talked though men, and God talked to everyone. He was talking to you, He was talking to me, He was talking to everyone.
So your premise that it was intended for Isreal, or that He was talking to Isreal is just not accurate. He may have been talking to Isreal, but He was talking to us also.
The question then becomes not how does it apply to us, as if it were Robert's rules of order. The question now is, what is God speaking to us though the inspiration of the Holy Spirit and though Holy men.
Now are you still with me? Let us look at something else you said: "Unless you believe that by obedience to the Law you will be given a portion of the land between Lebanon and the River Euphrates."
This portion of land is the "promised land". What we enter into are the promises of God. As Peter says: "exceedingly great and precious promises,"
Now, I think what you are wanting is some sort of Rosetta stone that will say: "Rain = Holy Spirit".
Anyways, if you want to believe the whole 2000 year period is the latter rain, that is fine, who am I to try and change your thinking on that one. Thanks, JohnR7