Could we be healed today

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SnuP

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Would it not have been even more glorious if after witnessing though her cancer, she had been able to get to the place that God could heal her?

Imagine how much more of a witness that would have been. :clap:

He could have then taken her home naturally, instead of from some demonic thing like cancer. :(
 
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I never could see how my being sick would be a witness to somebody. Somebody who has not come to know Jesus as their personal Savior would not see any glory in it. Why would they want to become saved if it means being sick and suffering? Now, to be ill for so long that the world has given up hope THEN God heals me showing without a doubt that it was HIS doing not mans ...that I could witness to. but to say "Oh God wants me sick! praise the lord for my sickness!" I can't believe that. I truthfully do not understand why I have not been healed yet, but I just can't believe that it is for the Glory of God.
 
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SpiritPsalmist

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Originally posted by 1hope
I never could see how my being sick would be a witness to somebody. Somebody who has not come to know Jesus as their personal Savior would not see any glory in it. Why would they want to become saved if it means being sick and suffering? Now, to be ill for so long that the world has given up hope THEN God heals me showing without a doubt that it was HIS doing not mans ...that I could witness to. but to say "Oh God wants me sick! praise the lord for my sickness!" I can't believe that. I truthfully do not understand why I have not been healed yet, but I just can't believe that it is for the Glory of God.

1Hope,

You're right.  It's you who brings glory to God not your circumstance.  Continue to praise Him for Who He Is. 

Know that by His stripes you are healed.  Now. You may not see the manefestation of it but none the less you are healed.  So continue to praise Him.  I believe I've already explained all that to you though so I won't belabor it again.

You've asked, in His Word He answered, now praise Him.

I'm praying for you.

 
 
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Andrew

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quote:"I never could see how my being sick would be a witness to somebody. Somebody who has not come to know Jesus as their personal Savior would not see any glory in it. Why would they want to become saved if it means being sick and suffering? Now, to be ill for so long that the world has given up hope THEN God heals me showing without a doubt that it was HIS doing not mans ...that I could witness to. but to say "Oh God wants me sick! praise the lord for my sickness!" I can't believe that. I truthfully do not understand why I have not been healed yet, but I just can't believe that it is for the Glory of God."

EXACTLY! 1hope, praise the Lord you are on the right track at least!
As to wy your healing has not manifested yet, continue to seek the Lord on this. But know this for sure: He wants your healing manifested more than you do! continue to search and dont give up!
 
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SUNSTONE

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Originally posted by Andrew
quote:"I never could see how my being sick would be a witness to somebody. Somebody who has not come to know Jesus as their personal Savior would not see any glory in it. Why would they want to become saved if it means being sick and suffering? Now, to be ill for so long that the world has given up hope THEN God heals me showing without a doubt that it was HIS doing not mans ...that I could witness to. but to say "Oh God wants me sick! praise the lord for my sickness!" I can't believe that. I truthfully do not understand why I have not been healed yet, but I just can't believe that it is for the Glory of God."

EXACTLY! 1hope, praise the Lord you are on the right track at least!
As to wy your healing has not manifested yet, continue to seek the Lord on this. But know this for sure: He wants your healing manifested more than you do! continue to search and dont give up!


Amen
 
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LouisBooth

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"Would it not have been even more glorious if after witnessing though her cancer, she had been able to get to the place that God could heal her? "

Nope, God's purpose in her was fufilled. Nothing was left undone. She witnesses perfectly with her sickness. I don't second guess God snup, he choose not to heal her, and his actions where right.


"I never could see how my being sick would be a witness to somebody. "

Then I'd say you don't know God as intimatly as I do :) I have seen him in this time and past times witness through people who couldn't talk, stand up or could bearly breath, and it was more powerful then anyone who was healed I have ever seen. LIke those boys said in the book of Daniel, we will worship him even if he chooses not to save us. God is sovergn, and he allows people to be sick and its part of his plan. I have seen it and believe it. God has created the good and the bad times, weather you want to acknowledge it or not.
 
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"God is sovergn, and he allows people to be sick and its part of his plan. I have seen it and believe it. God has created the good and the bad times, weather you want to acknowledge it or not." Where in the bible did Jesus ever refuse to heal anybody because it was Gods will for them to be sick? I know we all have the bad times to strengthen our faith, I just don't believe we have to STAY in the bad times without any good times in our lives as well.
 
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LouisBooth

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"Where in the bible did Jesus ever refuse to heal anybody because it was Gods will for them to be sick? "

He didn't heal everyone he encountered..read mark.

As for healing people, he wasn't going the heal the guy with the mat, just did so because people didn't believe he could forgive sins. As for people bing sick and it being God's will, Job is a great example, as was my friend which I talked about. He says he will be with you in the valley of the shadow of death, not that you won't go there.
 
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SnuP

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Bad examples Louis.

She specifically asked for a scripture where God refused to heal someone because it wasn't His will.

The passages in Mark could easaly be shown to be talking about those will a lack of faith. The other two people that you mentioned, God healed.

I really don't see any evidence here, just hearsay.
 
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LouisBooth

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"She specifically asked for a scripture where God refused to heal someone because it wasn't His will."

I just showed you some perfect examples of them snup.


"The passages in Mark could easaly be shown to be talking about those will a lack of faith. "

Not really, its no where in the context at all. You have to add things to the text to get it to say that.

As far as the other two, it was God's will for them to be sick, that's exactly what they were asking for. As for other proof, I'd say look at Ecc 7:14, great verse on how God works, he is over all and every even :)

if you want to get down to brass tacks, according to what you believe about christ, it was the fathers will for him to be sick and he was not healed, but remade with a imperishable body :)
 
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SnuP

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Parralel passages to the one in mark show that the people had a lack of faith.

By the way. The lack of faith mentioned in the Bible is not faith for healing, but faith that God loves them and that God is big enough for them to trust in. Most of them didn't think that Jesus was big enough to handle their sickness ("he didn't have that authority because he wasn't God").
 
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Chloe

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Originally posted by 1hope
"God is sovergn, and he allows people to be sick and its part of his plan. I have seen it and believe it. God has created the good and the bad times, weather you want to acknowledge it or not." Where in the bible did Jesus ever refuse to heal anybody because it was Gods will for them to be sick? I know we all have the bad times to strengthen our faith, I just don't believe we have to STAY in the bad times without any good times in our lives as well.

 

Where in the Bible are we guaranteed healing?

Everyone will die, physically, so to say that it is God's will to be free of every sickness or disability is wrong, because eventually we will die from something.  We are only guaranteed spiritual healing, which is reconciliation with God through Jesus' death on the cross. 

Why did Paul have a thorn in the flesh and God would tell Paul that His grace was sufficient for him?  Why did Paul tell Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach and frequent infirmities?


Oh, and where did you get the idea that cancer is demonic?  Even though our spirits are saved and are renewed, our bodies are still fallen and therefore prone to disease and death is inevitable.
 
 
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SpiritPsalmist

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Originally posted by Chloe
 

Where in the Bible are we guaranteed healing?

Everyone will die, physically, so to say that it is God's will to be free of every sickness or disability is wrong, because eventually we will die from something.  We are only guaranteed spiritual healing, which is reconciliation with God through Jesus' death on the cross. 

Why did Paul have a thorn in the flesh and God would tell Paul that His grace was sufficient for him?  Why did Paul tell Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach and frequent infirmities?

Oh, and where did you get the idea that cancer is demonic?  Even though our spirits are saved and are renewed, our bodies are still fallen and therefore prone to disease and death is inevitable.
 

That guarentee would be found in Is 53:5 and 1 Peter 2:24

No one has to die due to sickness or disease.  Old age is not a sickness or disease.  The word "healed" is all conclusive.  Besides spiritural, it includes mental and physical. 

It's like the package deal you get at the bank.  You don't have to use all the services in the package but they were paid for.  In the package of Jesus dying on the cross and raising on the third day our body and mind were included.  Body, soul, and spirit.  Jesus came to make us whole.  Not just 1/3 whole, but whole.  Math may not be my strong point but I know that 1/3 does not make a whole.   :D

The issues with Paul and Timothy and where sickness comes from are dealt with in other threads so we don't need to go into them again.  You may check out the "faith" thread for how we've answered those questions.  There are other good threads as well.  Lot's of good reading and thinking.
:)
 
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Chloe

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Originally posted by Quaffer
That guarentee would be found in Is 53:5 and 1 Peter 2:24

No one has to die due to sickness or disease.  Old age is not a sickness or disease.  The word "healed" is all conclusive.  Besides spiritural, it includes mental and physical. 

It's like the package deal you get at the bank.  You don't have to use all the services in the package but they were paid for.  In the package of Jesus dying on the cross and raising on the third day our body and mind were included.  Body, soul, and spirit.  Jesus came to make us whole.  Not just 1/3 whole, but whole.  Math may not be my strong point but I know that 1/3 does not make a whole.   :D

The issues with Paul and Timothy and where sickness comes from are dealt with in other threads so we don't need to go into them again.  You may check out the "faith" thread for how we've answered those questions.  There are other good threads as well.  Lot's of good reading and thinking.
:)

Those verses you gave are not in reference to physical healing.  These verses have nothing to do with the physical at all.  God is far more concerned with our souls, which are eternal, than with our earthly tents that will perish. Our bodies are not redeemed along with our souls, otherwise we would they would not die.  Again, we are not promised health, wealth, or even long lives.  We are here to do the work of God, no matter if our health is good or poor, if we are rich or poor, or our lives will be long or short.  

Could you perhaps post a link?
 
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Andrew

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quote: "Those verses you gave are not in reference to physical healing.Ê These verses have nothing to do with the physical at all."

The literal truth about Isaiah 53:4

Besides our sins, Jesus bore our sicknesses and pains on the cross. He was also whipped 39 times on His back (till His flesh was torn and His bones exposed) to buy us healing.

Isaiah 53:4,5
4 Surely he hath borne our griefs [sicknesses], and carried our sorrows [pains]: yet we did esteem him stricken, smitten of God, and afflicted.
5 But he was wounded for our transgressions, he was bruised for our iniquities: the chastisement of our peace was upon him; and with his stripes we are healed.


The words "griefs" and "sorrows" actually mean "sicknesses" and "pains" (physical and mental) in the original Hebrew text (see Strong's numbers 02483 and 04341). The translation is thus unfortunate.

Recently, we had 2 messianic Jews in our church. My Pastor asked them to read from their Hebrew Bible these verses. They said it reads "sicknesses and pains" not griefs and sorrows.

But if that doesnt satissfy you, let's see how the Bible interprets itself:

More proof: The verses are quoted again in Matthew 8:17 and 1 Peter 2:24.

Some have insisted that Isaiah 53:4 has to do with spiritual healing only. But let the Bible interpret the Bible. How does the Holy Spirit translate Isaiah 53:4 in Matthew 8:15? He says, "Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses", implying physical healing.

Matthew 8:15-17
15 And he touched her hand, and the fever left her: and she arose, and ministered unto them.
16 When the even was come, they brought unto him many that were possessed with devils: and he cast out the spirits with his word, and healed all that were sick:
17 That it might be fulfilled which was spoken by Esaias the prophet, saying, Himself took our infirmities, and bare our sicknesses.


Moreover, the immediate context of Matthew 8:17 (verses 15 and 16) proves that the verse is referring to physical healing. This is not to say that spiritual healing is excluded as demons were cast out too.

Also, you might wanna check out what the word "saved" in the NT means. The Greek word for "saved" in the New Testament, which is "sozo", it means more than just saved from sin and hell. According to Strong's Greek lexicon, it also means:

* To save, keep safe and sound, to rescue from danger or destruction.
* To save one from injury or peril.
* To save a suffering one from perishing, that is, one suffering from disease, to make well, heal, restore to health.
* To preserve one who is in danger of destruction.
* To save or rescue.


Just by studying the Greek word for "saved", we can know that salvation is more than just forgiveness of sin and "fire insurance". It includes physical healing, protection and, basically, being delivered from whatever troubles we encounter.

Redeemed from every sickness and plague

In Deuteronomy 28, there are 11 verses of blessings (verses 3 to 13) and 53 verses of curses (verses 16 to 68). Since there are more curses than blessings here, it behoves the Christian to study what these curses are, lest he calls something a blessing when it is a curse!

One of the curses is:

Deuteronomy 28:61
61 Also every sickness, and every plague, which is not written in the book of this law, them will the LORD bring upon thee, until thou be destroyed.


Notice it says "every sickness, and every plague". This means that any and every sickness or disease is a curse, never a blessing as some Christians believe. So, if you say that your sickness is a blessing from God, you are contradicting Deuteronomy 28:61, which implies that any sickness is a curse.

But praise God that because of Christ's work on the cross, we have been redeemed from the curses of the law, including Deuteronomy 28:61.

Galatians 3:13
13 Christ hath redeemed us from the curse of the law, being made a curse for us: for it is written, Cursed is every one that hangeth on a tree:


In other words, healing is part of Christ's redemptive work. Healing is part of the atonement (Isaiah 53:4, Matthew 8:17 and 1 Peter 2:24)!

So, we can't say that God chooses to heal some and not others because the fact is that healing is offered to all through the cross. If we say that God is willing to heal only some people, it is like saying that God is willing to save only some people. Neither can we say that God chastens His children with diseases (see Does God chasten with sicknesses and deaths?). If that were true, God would be going against the work of His Son!
 
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SUNSTONE

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Originally posted by LouisBooth
"Would it not have been even more glorious if after witnessing though her cancer, she had been able to get to the place that God could heal her? "

Nope, God's purpose in her was fufilled. Nothing was left undone. She witnesses perfectly with her sickness. I don't second guess God snup, he choose not to heal her, and his actions where right.


"I never could see how my being sick would be a witness to somebody. "

Then I'd say you don't know God as intimatly as I do :) I have seen him in this time and past times witness through people who couldn't talk, stand up or could bearly breath, and it was more powerful then anyone who was healed I have ever seen. LIke those boys said in the book of Daniel, we will worship him even if he chooses not to save us. God is sovergn, and he allows people to be sick and its part of his plan. I have seen it and believe it. God has created the good and the bad times, weather you want to acknowledge it or not.

You don't know God as well as you think you do. God is sovergn, but he doesn't want his children sick no more than he wants any person to goto hell. If God used a sick person to witness, and it was effective, that is his sovergnty. Its like a coach on a football team, and has an injured player that he uses. The player still produces, but he could do better. God/coach doesn't want the injury but in there soverngty will use it.

Now God creates the good times and the bad times, to test us.He uses those times to see what you will do. Will you fall to temptation or stand on his word? This makes are faith stronger, or actually it gets rid of disbelief.

I believe you know God, but me like you have alot of things to learn, and this healing thing is one you should learn before anybody else gets sick and you just sit back believing its God's will for them to be that way.
 
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SavedByGrace3

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Originally posted by SnuP
Parralel passages to the one in mark show that the people had a lack of faith.

By the way. The lack of faith mentioned in the Bible is not faith for healing, but faith that God loves them and that God is big enough for them to trust in. Most of them didn't think that Jesus was big enough to handle their sickness ("he didn't have that authority because he wasn't God").

Excellent point SnuPer!
 
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SUNSTONE

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Originally posted by Chloe
 

Where in the Bible are we guaranteed healing?

Everyone will die, physically, so to say that it is God's will to be free of every sickness or disability is wrong, because eventually we will die from something.  We are only guaranteed spiritual healing, which is reconciliation with God through Jesus' death on the cross. 

Why did Paul have a thorn in the flesh and God would tell Paul that His grace was sufficient for him?  Why did Paul tell Timothy to take a little wine for his stomach and frequent infirmities?

[Is anyone among you sick? Let him call for the elders of the church, and let them pray over him, anointing him with oil in the name of the Lord;and the prayer offered in faith will restore the one who is sick, and the Lord will raise him up, and if he has committed sins, they will be forgiven him. Therefore, confess your sins to one another, and pray for one another, so that you may be healed.] James 5:14-16

When Philip asked Jesus, "show us the Father and it is enough for us", Jesus said this.
[Have I been with you, and yet you have not come to know Me, Philip?.....
Believe Me that I am in the Father, and the Father in Me; Otherwise believe on account of the works themselves. Truly, truly, I say to you, he who believes in Me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do; because I go to the Father. And whatever you ask in My name, that will I do, that the Father may be glorified in the Son. If you ask Me anything in My name, I will do it.] John 14:9+11-14

What are the works, that He is talking about?


Now God told Paul that his grace was sufficient for him, because in his weakness, God was strong. It doesn't go into detail, but perhaps if he did have that problem fixed, he would have temptation that he couldn't bare.
I have seen and done many healings. My knee is not 100 percent, because God told me if it was, I would go back to playing basketball every chance I got. At the same time ignoring people, and God. My knee was hurt to the point that I needed a knee brace, not anymore. I can even play basketball, but not for more than an hour a day.

It took me weeks to get my MIND right about the healing in my knee. If God didn't tell me that it was as good as it was going to get, I would still be praying for it. So don't think that God is up there saying, ok you can be healed, but you can't. If that is the case, HE will tell you.
 
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