Word Faith/Positive Confession

My mom has had allergies to cats as long as I can remember. And we also had cats as long as I can remember. She had to take meds in order to controll the allergies, but about 2 years ago she developed asthma. The doctor told her to remove the cats as much as possible from the areas that she spends the most time in. She also had to start using two different inhailers twice a day.

My moms relationship with God has changed alot since then, not as a result of the asthma, but because of the church that we go to. About a year ago she through the meds and inhailers away and has been totally set free. She also has since moved up from three cats to ten just recently.

Why would a soverein and loving God heal my mom of a simple thing like allergies, and not heal some one who is dieing of cancer who has supposably all this faith?

The truth is that is because my mom began to see God's reality through her relationship with Him rather then the reality of her allergies. And consiquently her faith graduated from mere human belief to the faith of God.

The true reason that God allows sickness in the world is so that we can find out just how much we need Him. To draw us closer to him. All the faith in the world is pointless if their is no move in the relationship toward God.

If you find some one with cancer or some other disease that they are looking for healing from. And this person seems to show great faith. Why don't you ask them where their relationship with God is, and if they have grown closer, more dependent on Him and His love as a result of their situation. I'm willing to almost bet that if they have seen no healing from their situation that its because they have not overcome the one hurtle in their relationship that has allowed sickness to comein in the first place. In other words, they have not grown any closer to Christ.

"Why would a soverein and loving God heal my mom of a simple thing like allergies, and not heal some one who is dieing of cancer who has supposably all this faith?"

why would God allow a great person to die and not a criminal? its his will snup, it happens though we dont always understand it.

quote:"That, IMHO, is as cruel as teaching gets. Not only does a sick person have the burden of being ill, they also have to feel an added burden of guilt for their alleged lack of faith."

why make such a big deal out of it? i lack faith in certain areas of my Christian walk but i dont have to hold a pity party for it. i just find out where I'm missing it and move on. What do u expect us to do? stroke and pat your illness?

And if you think that's cruel, what abt those who tell the sick their heavenly Father made them that way and wants them to remain that way and suffer. That's a thousand times worse and pure blasphemy!

quote:"It is NOT faith that heals. It is God that heals, and He does it in many ways.

yes the healing comes from God but the 'currency' is faith. Did not Jesus tell the woman "your FAITH has made you well"?

quote:" And yes, sometimes He doesn't heal at all. It's HIS will not ours.""

that's nonsense that runs contradictory to the scriptures. Healing is part of Christ redemptive work. Once you understnd this simple truth, you cant say that sometimes he does, sometimes he doesnt. It's like saying "sometimes God wants to save sinners, sometimes he doesnt!"

Originally posted by Susan
I'm willing to almost bet that if they have seen no healing from their situation that its because they have not overcome the one hurtle in their relationship that has allowed sickness to comein in the first place. In other words, they have not grown any closer to Christ.


SnuP, you have finally said it, albeit amidst many words. You have stated the main point of Word-Faith healing.

"You're sick because your faith isn't strong enough" or "You wouldn't be sick if you have a good relationship with God."

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I think that you have completely missed it.  The hurtle that they have to overcome is usually sin, an idol that stance between them and God (maybe just pride).  I did not say that that you have to have a good relationship or lots of faith.

Simply put:  Your sick because your not obedient.  Or your sick because you won't listen to what God says.

If you want to believe that I was talking about a lack of faith or a lack of relationship, then your not listening also.  Relationship only plays a part in it because God wants you to establish a relationship with Him through your overcoming.

"Your sick because your not obedient. Or your sick because you won't listen to what God says."

What about children? Is that just nature like hobart said earlier? Why do people who don't believe in God live long healthy lives? Is it luck?

--tibac

Yes LouisBooth- Great books,
I just wanted to say that Job was a great man of faith, I did not see him getting out of his trials and tests.
Perhaps God is allowing these things in your life to cause you to grow.

God Bless Ya All!

Originally posted by SnuP

Simply put:  Your sick because your not obedient.  Or your sick because you won't listen to what God says. 

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Is this truly what you believe?

Originally posted by SnuP
Good post. Faith comes by revelation. by hearing Christ.

Some people have no idea how powerful this idea is. Thats why some try to manufacture a healing out of their soul.

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The Bible says that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

"Some people have no idea how powerful this idea is."

Is the idea what is so powerful, or is it's God's grace and love? Is it works (strong faith) or grace?

--tibac

Originally posted by SnuP
WOF people don't necisarily believe that God wants us to have a cushy life.  Rather He wants us to have a fulfilled life.  You cannot be sick and be fulfilled.  You cannot be hungry and be fulfilled.  You cannot be lonly and be fulfilled.

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How untrue!

Fulfillment is not in what we have (wealth) or what we don't have (freedom from all sickness or disease), our fulfillment comes from Christ, from being a child of God and walking with Him and growing in the knowledge and grace of Jesus Christ!

Paul said in Philippians 4, Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content. I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.

Paul was content. We are to be content, no matter what we have or what we lack. 

I can think of no better witness, than someone who is not rich and perfectly healthy, but are poor or sickly or disabled, yet live their lives for Christ, not with bitterness, but with joy! 

I personally believe that God gives us more then what we need so that we have an oppertunity to sow in to the kingdom.  To be a blessing.  You can not be a blessing is you are filled with wanting.  We must remember the parable of the talent.  If we expect for God to act on our behalf then we must be willing to invest into the kingdom.  He will also reward us for our selflessness. 

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We don't need to have lots of money to sow in to the kingdom.  Nor do we need to have money or be wealthy to be a blessing.  We invest in the kingdom with our hearts and our opportunities and gifts as God sees fit to give us. 

Malachi 3:
14“You have said, ‘It is futile to serve God. What did we gain by carrying out his requirements and going about like mourners before the LORD Almighty? 15But now we call the arrogant blessed. Certainly the evildoers prosper, and even those who challenge God escape.’”
16Then those who feared the LORD talked with each other, and the LORD listened and heard. A scroll of remembrance was written in his presence concerning those who feared the LORD and honored his name.
17“They will be mine,” says the LORD Almighty, “in the day when I make up my treasured possession.£ I will spare them, just as in compassion a man spares his son who serves him. 18And you will again see the distinction between the righteous and the wicked, between those who serve God and those who do not.
Malachi 4:
1“Surely the day is coming; it will burn like a furnace. All the arrogant and every evildoer will be stubble, and that day that is coming will set them on fire,” says the LORD Almighty. “Not a root or a branch will be left to them. 2But for you who revere my name, the Sun of righteousness will rise with healing in His wings. And you will go out and leap like calves released from the stall. 3Then you will trample down the wicked; they will be ashes under the soles of your feet on the day when I do these things,” says the LORD Almighty.

Originally posted by EJO
Yes LouisBooth- Great books,
I just wanted to say that Job was a great man of faith, I did not see him getting out of his trials and tests.
Perhaps God is allowing these things in your life to cause you to grow.

God Bless Ya All!

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Job's sin was pride.  God wanted him to 'grow' out of that.

Originally posted by wildernesse
"Some people have no idea how powerful this idea is."

Is the idea what is so powerful, or is it's God's grace and love? Is it works (strong faith) or grace?

--tibac

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What is powerful is that God is willing to talk one on one with His elect and show them the answers to get them in to Christ, a place of fulfillment.  He accually wants to come into your room and have a real conversation with you.  Now that is powerful.

Originally posted by Chloe
How untrue!

Fulfillment is not in what we have (wealth) or what we don't have (freedom from all sickness or disease), our fulfillment comes from Christ, from being a child of God and walking with Him and growing in the knowledge and grace of Jesus Christ!

Paul said in Philippians 4, Not that I speak in respect of want: for I have learned, in whatsoever state I am, therewith to be content. I know both how to be abased, and I know how to abound: every where and in all things I am instructed both to be full and to be hungry, both to abound and to suffer need.

Paul was content. We are to be content, no matter what we have or what we lack. 

I can think of no better witness, than someone who is not rich and perfectly healthy, but are poor or sickly or disabled, yet live their lives for Christ, not with bitterness, but with joy! 




We don't need to have lots of money to sow in to the kingdom.  Nor do we need to have money or be wealthy to be a blessing.  We invest in the kingdom with our hearts and our opportunities and gifts as God sees fit to give us. 

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How do you reconsile your beliefs with this.

 

Matthew 6:

28“And why do you worry about clothes? See how the lilies of the field grow. They do not labor or spin. 29Yet I tell you that not even Solomon in all his splendor was dressed like one of these. 30If that is how God clothes the grass of the field, which is here today and tomorrow is thrown into the fire, will he not much more clothe you, O you of little faith? 31So do not worry, saying, ‘What shall we eat?’ or ‘What shall we drink?’ or ‘What shall we wear?’ 32For the pagans run after all these things, and your heavenly Father knows that you need them. 33But seek first his kingdom and his righteousness, and all these things will be given to you as well. 34Therefore do not worry about tomorrow, for tomorrow will worry about itself. Each day has enough trouble of its own.

Matthew 5:

6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled. 

Originally posted by Susan
Originally posted by SnuP

"Your sick because your not obedient. Or your sick because you won't listen to what God says."

I think this statement is untrue. I know someone who suffers from a chronic physical illness. As far as I know, this person is NOT living in any sin that I can think of (although I don't think he's sinless like you allegedly were for 3 months, but then I highly doubt your *sinlessness* for such a period of time too) and if God spoke a word to him that he would be healed, I am 99 percent sure that he would choose healing.

So please, please think before you speak. Think how such statements sound to someone who is suffering.

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Many people have the same problem as your friend.  But most are afraid to do what God asks, because they are afraid to face something in their lives that allows sickness to come in.  The two biggest doors for sickness are fear and bitterness.  You have probably heard it said that everyone is afraid of something.  You have also heard is said that everyone lies, most people lie out of fear.  I'm am saying that your friend probably has some unrepentent bitterness (Jesus said that if you could not forgive your brother then God can not forgive you), or some unrepentent fear (fear is the oposite of faith).  In the instace that I discribe, they probably have all of the faith in the world that God will heal them, but doubt that God will deal with the thing that they are afraid of.  Unless the fear is removed, the door will not be closed and the healing will not be manifested, despite their faith that God will heal them.  This is why it is so important that we seek God face on our healing instead of just claiming it.

Originally posted by Chloe
 

The Bible says that faith comes by hearing and hearing by the word of God.

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Faith comes by hearing Christ and hearing Christ by the revelation of the word of God.

What does hearing mean to you?

"Simply put: Your sick because your not obedient. Or your sick because you won't listen to what God says. "

that is a lie that denies what the bible says.

Job was sick and obendient as were lots of people in the bible. I see it everyday. If you sit there and tell me my friends that die of cancer are either 1. not obenient to God or 2. not listening to him I'd say you need to take a long walk off a short pier because you are DEAD wrong. Snup, you are wrong about this and if you pray God will show you you're wrong.

Being sick is the product of living in a fallen world, that's exactly what the bible declares and that's EXACTLY what christ himself said in John chapter 9. Not being obedient to God is a sin, not listening to God is sin, Sickness is NOT caused by sin snup. YOU ARE WRONG