Son of God

Originally posted by s0uljah
Yes, and you belittle Him by claiming He isn't God.

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No souj, your really missing the whole point and this tells me your probably not even paying any attention to scripture at all!  Let me bring some more passages to your attention to prove how your belief in this 3 person god is scripturally false:

2 John 1:7, "For many deceivers are entered into the world, who confess not that Jesus Christ is come in the flesh. This is a deceiver and an antichrist."

This is another passage that proves "we are warned not to belittle Christ" and is very significant, and worthy of much study. If we make Christ an all-powerful, all-knowing, untemptable co-equal part of the Supreme God, we deny that he has come "in the flesh" and we are manifested as anti-Christ's.  But the main point is that there were many deceivers even in John's day who denied that Christ had really and truly "come in the flesh", denied that he was truly a man, denied that he truly "increased in wisdom", truly had been born a helpless babe.

Trinitarians are also making the same mistake the Jews in Jesus' day. Here is the reason why the Jews thought that Jesus was making himself equal with God:

John 5:18, "Therefore the Jews sought the more to kill him, because he not only had broken the sabbath, but said also that God was his Father, making himself equal with God."

You see, Jesus did not claim that he was equal with the Father, he did not say that he himself was "God." Jesus said that God was his Father! And when somebody is someone's son, they inherit all that is of their father's. Father and son are basically one flesh, but two distinct men.

Be sure your beliefs are derived from and founded upon God's Word, not man's speculations. Anyone who learned their "theology" direct from the scripture would never believe in the Trinity, because there is no such thing taught anywhere therein. 


 

"So if I am reading this right, the son has the authority of the father. The son performs acts with the authority of the father. The son is "legally" considered the agent of the father.

But that does not make the son the father. Either in Jewish rights of first born, or with Jesus and God."

EXACTLY!! It doesnt make the son the father but it does make him God. Thus 3 in 1 and 1 in 3. You're catching on!

Originally posted by LouisBooth
"So if I am reading this right, the son has the authority of the father. The son performs acts with the authority of the father. The son is "legally" considered the agent of the father.

But that does not make the son the father. Either in Jewish rights of first born, or with Jesus and God."

EXACTLY!! It doesnt make the son the father but it does make him God. Thus 3 in 1 and 1 in 3. You're catching on!

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Doesn't make the son the father, but it does make him God? I'm afraid you still don't get it. The son is seperate from the father. The father is seperate from the son. The two can't be the same.

Oh, I think that now I get it. God is the family name.

"The son is seperate from the father. The father is seperate from the son. The two can't be the same."

Exactly! Its akin to my water analogy. Water isn't ice, nor is steam water, but they all are H20..ie the same essenice. The father isn't Christ, but they are both God.

I have a favour to ask you Amatire.

raise both your hands to the sky and ask God if Christ is also God or son of God or is he just a man like the ones who passed before him but people made him God, he will not leave you unanswered, trust me, satan can't answer your plea to God. it's forbidden on him.

bear with me and "hear" the facts .... no the "scriptures" do NOT say Iesous (transliterated in English as Jesus) is not Gad
(transliterated in English as God)

What the "Scrolls" (falsely Greek biblio) do tell us is Yahshua Mashaiyah (wrongly Messiah) was the first brought forth male child of YAHWEH.

The Rescuer (savior) sent by YAHWEH that did die for us that no one even cares to know what his name really was instead insists on clinging to a Greco/Latinized man made name "Iesous" and the reason this is sad to hear is because "christians" do not acknowledge the very "bible" they are reading in Revelation, YAHWEH tells us 'Satan, who deceives the whole world" "The great harlot, WITH BLASPHEMOUS TITLES"
"a few men left" THAT'S IT!!

What is YAHWEH referring to with these powerful statements??
Everyone thinks they are the ones doing everything "correctly" and yet they ignore the end results!

You see, Jesus did not claim that he was equal with the Father, he did not say that he himself was "God." Jesus said that God was his Father! And when somebody is someone's son, they inherit all that is of their father's. Father and son are basically one flesh, but two distinct men.

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Jesus said, "If you have seen me you have seen the Father". So I reckon he did claim to be God.

Jesus was God With Us. Though the same, I imagine God was still in heaven while he walked with us on this earth. God's Omnipotence expempts him from physical laws. Christ willingly laid down this exemption to become as one of us.

Now - As for all God's Children - count me in.

I am made a son of God, by Christ's imputed righteousness, through his sacrifice, once for many. Once a servant, now a son, and fellow heir with Christ, in the kingdom.  Who is now made equal to whom?

Or is this a blasphemy?

This is another passage that proves "we are warned not to belittle Christ" and is very significant, and worthy of much study. If we make Christ an all-powerful, all-knowing, untemptable co-equal part of the Supreme God, we deny that he has come "in the flesh" and we are manifested as anti-Christ's. But the main point is that there were many deceivers even in John's day who denied that Christ had really and truly "come in the flesh", denied that he was truly a man, denied that he truly "increased in wisdom", truly had been born a helpless babe.

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Nobody claims that Jesus wasn't fully man... (although He was also fully God, just emptied for purposes of His mission)

Did you miss the scripture that says "The Father and I Are One"

Originally posted by Zico
I have a favour to ask you Amatire.

raise both your hands to the sky and ask God if Christ is also God or son of God or is he just a man like the ones who passed before him but people made him God, he will not leave you unanswered, trust me, satan can't answer your plea to God. it's forbidden on him.

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Cool, God already told me the Gospels are true.  I promise.  I swear to Him I believe that.

"You see, Jesus did not claim that he was equal with the Father"

Umm..yeah he did..he said everything the Father has I have and everything I have the father has. He even claims some glory for himself..Check out John 17

"All I have is yours, and al you have is mine. And glory has come to me through them..." He is talking to the father (you and I) and them is christians.

The question was asked - "Does the statement that Jesus is the Son of God mean that he is God." The answer to the question - as asked - is "no."

Jesus is God is not addressed by the statement: "Jesus is the Son of God." Those passages which DO show Jesus to be God are not the passages that say "Jesus is the Son of God."

"In the beginning was the word and the word was with God and the word was God" shows that God has at least two facets (for want of a better word). The statement does NOT show that Jesus was the word - to learn that, one must read further into John.

"Be of like mind with the Christ, who being in very substance, God: did not count equality with God to be grasped, but emptied himself, taking on the form of a man." Now THAT declares: Jesus was God.

I think it does..in terms of the jews they thought so too..

Does the comment that "son (or sons) of the devil" make it that those referred to are Satan? But the Jews did equate the son of God with God. That much is clear - of course they DID have the prophecies to show that the messiah would be God himself, so that may have had something to do with it. Why else would they assume that Jesus was not an angel, "sons of God" being the Hebrew term for angels?

The disciples said "show us the Father"
Jesus responded "Have I been with you so long and you do not know me?"

Hmmm - does circumlocution count as a direct statement? Perhaps not. But the Bible states that Jesus did not regard his innate nature as God a thing to cling to, but emptied himself, becoming a man. The statement is clear enough - God became a man. Even if Jesus had never claimed equality with God (of his own declaration) that would not be surprising, given the circumstances.

Hi Amatire. You posed the question and then answered it yourself when you said it was about our individual faith. Allow me to quote John 10:
24: Then came the Jews round about him, and said unto him, How long dost thou make us to doubt? If thou be the Christ, tell us plainly.
25: Jesus answered them, I told you, and ye believed not: the works that I do in my Father's name, they bear witness of me.
26: But ye believe not, because ye are not of my sheep, as I said unto you.
27: My sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow me:
28: And I give unto them eternal life; and they shall never perish, neither shall any man pluck them out of my hand.
29: My Father, which gave them me, is greater than all; and no man is able to pluck them out of my Father's hand.
30: I and my Father are one.
31: Then the Jews took up stones again to stone him.
32: Jesus answered them, Many good works have I shewed you from my Father; for which of those works do ye stone me?
33: The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself God.
34: Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?
35: If he called them gods, unto whom the word of God came, and the scripture cannot be broken;
36: Say ye of him, whom the Father hath sanctified, and sent into the world, Thou blasphemest; because I said, I am the Son of God?
37: If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not.
38: But if I do, though ye believe not me, believe the works: that ye may know, and believe, that the Father is in me, and I in him.

These verses fit nicely with the one Thunderchild quoted above. Jesus was/is man, but also had the awareness that God was in him and he in God. What Jesus tried to show us is that we are also one with God, if we'd only have faith. That is what he meant when he said, "The Kingdom of God is within you." It is what he meant when he said, "If you only had faith the size of a mustard seed you could say to that mountain, 'move over there' and it would be so."

When Jesus said we must be born again into the spirit he was saying that we must realize that we ARE spirits in human form, that God IS within us, that the world is not what life is all about, but that our spiritual kinship is.

Have a wonderful journey.