Women of TAW: Where do you draw the line?

My problem is that my main hobby is sewing. I get restless if I'm not working on a new outfit. All of my friends know I sew and are always asking what I'm working and praise my finished projects. It can be a source of pride. It felt good to sew things for the church bazaar, but as soon as they were done, I started thinking about new outfits to make.

Monica said:

OOOhh me too! Except its not catalogs but thrift stores and consignment shops. I say to myself that because the stuff is so reasonable I can have more of it but I go beyond what I really need. Over the last year I have been whittling down but with one trip to a thrift store in a rich neighborhood, I can almost double what I have given away.

M.

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Oh man! I have problems with Thrifting and consignment shops too. What i have tried to do is not buy anymore hangers. That way when I run out - its time to purge. It helps a bit to keep things down.

That reminds me, I need a moving van to clean out my sons' closets.

We have so many clothes too but fortunately my church sends a ton of clothes to Ukraine so I just bag up stuff I don't like/don't use about 3 times a year. Still have a way to go but I've probably taken up about 20 of the 13 gallon bags so far between me and hubs. I do like shopping for new stuff but I try to make sure to get rid of a fair share each year.
As for other things... I just think me feeling good about myself reflects much on how I feel about other things and how much I focus on them. When I don't feel good about myself I tend to obsess about it and forget about the rest that should be important in my life.
The fact that many of us now work too makes it even more difficult to keep it totally 'un-vain' and so. We're expected to look presentable and professional. Even I, who stay at home most of the time and don't really care if I put on make up in the morning (which I rarely do)... still when hubs squadron has an event, the way I look reflects on him.
I did ask Father about this when I was a Cathecumen and he said to go with what was needed in my 'professional' life and I felt was 'necessary'. Then he looked at me and asked: Why are you asking anyways?? (as I don't wear much make up, but I do enjoy some beauty treatments every now and then).
I colored my hair back close to my original color after being fairly blonde for a while. While I love going to the hair dresser and being pampered I just don't see the point of spending money for upkeep all the time. Now I can again get away with just a little bit of highlights instead of a double process color.

Ok, now I feel really vain...

Great topic that often enters my thoughts. I think the key is moderation. I tried to go grey since I had not really made a habit of coloring my hair. But instead of a nice salt and pepper look I had these strange blotches of grey here and there. So I began to color again but I decided to do it myself now. With little effort I color the roots every so often and have a very natural look.(no highghts, etc.)
Later I will try again to quit coloring and see if it is grey throughout and looks decent.
I think the more we concentrate on our spiritual life and deepen our life of prayer the less we concentrate on the physical. NOt to say that we totally neglect it so we begin to look like hags or anything. But rather we keep it as simple as possible so we can devote more of our time to important things like prayer, works of charity, etc.
Just a few thoughts,
Peace in Christ,
Marie

And just to add that it really depends too upon our state in life. I am a housewife so I don't feel the pressure that a career woman may feel to have botox or micordermabrasion or whatever so that she looks fresh and vibrant to meet her work challenges.

Although, it really saddens me to see this immense pressure on women to try to do everything to look and stay young. We are no longer allowed to look our age. What is wrong with having wrinkles? Who determined that it is such a bad thing???? How much time do we want to spend on ourselves and how advantageous is that to our spiritual life? How can you have a spiritual life if you are spending so much time at the hairdresser, the manicurist, the masseuse, the dermatologist...etc.? There are endless possibilities in which we can pamper ouselves.

Any other thoughts????

For those of us who struggle with vanity, moderation is not an option, because honestly, I have no idea what that is. If vanity is an issue, and girls, you know who you are , the cure is to forget the make-up, haircolor, new clothes, ect, ect, ect. Just like those who struggle with materialism or greed, the cure is to give to the poor.
There was a saint whose advice on curing the passions was to do the opposite . . . can't remember who it was. I have always had serious image issues my entire life, and when I became Orthodox, it was only natural to begin to conquer this passion. What I did was I went to Church without a single drop of make-up on. I know, for most of you, this probably isn't a big deal, but believe me, to me, it was huge. Guess what happened? Nothing. People didn't go screaming out of the church at my ghastly appearance, but treated me just like anyone else, imagine that. I, of course, felt very uncomfortable, but the more I did it, the easier it was. I used to enjoy having people look at me, but now, it makes me uncomfortable [which, to me, is the right response, knowwhatImean]. It should be my character that draws people to Christ, and I honestly believe that I work harder on that inner part, when the outer is plain and average. When the outer is drawing inappropriate attention, then the inner suffers. Anyway, I've rambled on and on. This issue is very close to my heart.

God Bless

Asinner, when I read your post I laughed because I felt you were "talking" to me! I have also struggled with self-image and body image...to the point of obsessive.

Were there any prayers in particular you used in regards to your struggle with this?

Blessings!

I really struggle with this. Everytime a new product or some girly comes out, I find that all my focus is into it. Suddently, somthing i didn't know that existed 5 minutes ago is now a "need".

Society scatters our senses and tells us that we need certain things when we really don't. I learned that it is important to focus our senses into one picture to see the clear picture, and then to work on it by prayer and focus.. just like those olden camera's, everything is a blur, and we have to adjust the focus to get the clear picture. With scattered senses we have a scattered picture and our thoughts and influences run wild and we get caught into them.

I read this a quote somewhere that really helped me with this struggle, and it was directed towards the Orthodox females living in this society. The quote said, "Do we women spend the same time praying in our Icon corner as we spend time looking into the mirror?"

lsg03 said:

Asinner, when I read your post I laughed because I felt you were "talking" to me! I have also struggled with self-image and body image...to the point of obsessive.

Were there any prayers in particular you used in regards to your struggle with this?

Blessings!

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Blessings to you as well. Here is my favorite prayer, especially when I struggle to know His Will.

Prayer of St. Philaret
Metropolitan of Moscow

My Lord, I know not what I ought to ask of Thee.

Thou and Thou alone knowest my needs.

Thou lovest me more than I am able to love Thee.

O Father, grant unto me, They servant, all which I cannot ask.

For a cross I dare not ask, nor for consolation;

I dare only to stand in Thy presence.

My heart is open to Thee.

Thou seest my needs of which I myself am unaware.

Behold and lift me up!

In Thy presence I stand,

awed and silenced by Thy will and Thy judgments,

into which my mind cannot penetrate.

To Thee I offer myself as a sacrifice.

No other desire is mine but to fulfill Thy will.

Teach me how to pray.

Do Thyself pray within me.



Amen.

I heard a speaker once at a protestant church. He was asked the question: "How much makeup should a woman wear who loves the Lord?"

Without pausing he simply said:
"It depends on her face."


hey, it was funny at the time....

I have the opposite problem. I tend to put too little focus on my appearance and I wear my clothes and shoes until they fall apart. I still have shoes that I wore in high school.

I think it should be noted that you can draw attention to yourself by your lack of regard for your appearance as well. I work at a university, and some of the female professors seem to make it a point to look like they don't own a mirror (or a hairbrush or razor, but I digress). Even if you're not particularly fashion-conscious, you notice them. So how is that any better than a woman who draws attention to herself by wearing hot pink eyeshadow?

frostymama said:

I still have shoes that I wore in high school.

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What's that smell??

Monica,

thanks so much for starting this thread. It looks like it is something most of us struggle with. When I lost a whole bunch of weight 3 years ago, I went a little crazy on buying clothes and makeup and whatever else made me feel good about my appearance. It's like - now that I was sorta thin again - I wanted to look like I did when I was thin at age 25! The problem is, I'm now 53.

I definitely struggle with not wanting to grow old or look my age. I want to be young, darn it!

Anyway, thanks to everyone for the good thoughts on this.

Mary

frostymama said:

I have the opposite problem. I tend to put too little focus on my appearance and I wear my clothes and shoes until they fall apart. I still have shoes that I wore in high school.

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This is me. I think I finally got rid of the last of my highschool leftover clothes last year when we moved to Alaska. I just had to pare down my closet and figured it best to send the oldest stuff to the trash heap. (I still have a few things from college though and I know some of those things are over 15 years old). I also don't wear cosmetics except for just a few times a year. And I probably only get my hair trimmed about once a year professionally.

ufonium2 said:

I think it should be noted that you can draw attention to yourself by your lack of regard for your appearance as well. I work at a university, and some of the female professors seem to make it a point to look like they don't own a mirror (or a hairbrush or razor, but I digress). Even if you're not particularly fashion-conscious, you notice them. So how is that any better than a woman who draws attention to herself by wearing hot pink eyeshadow?

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I agree and this is one thing I've actually been thinking about recently. It's not only that but also the fact that we are to treat our bodies as a temple (is this a protestant only thing?). Anyway, I've been thinking recently that the decorations for my temple are a bit shoddy. This doesn't mean I'm going out to Nieman Marcus tomorrow but, really, I do need to make more of an effort.

...

I am a very thrifty person and rather plain but I was like this from my pentecostal days too. I wear make up, but not much. I wear a little bit of jewlery but not flashy stuff, etc.

However, I used to spend a lot of money on my hair. I have colored it and permed it, etc etc. I had short hair that needed frequent trimmings to keep its style. I had stopped coloring it years ago, but had kept the short style.

I decided about two years ago to grow my hair out. That decision had to do with wanting a change, but it also had to do with my feeling odd about having short hair and wearing a scarf to pray. (Not that I care about if others have short hair and cover, but for me, I just felt I was lacking in femininity with my very very short hair.)

I ended up getting a rather short trim after my chrismation because when Fr. did the tonsuring he messed up a collic of mine. (spelling for collic?... you know, after the cut... I had hairs that stood up ins tead of layed down.) But from that point I have grown my hair out. It is now longer than my shoulders which really is a lot of growth from starting right at the lowest hair line of my bottom of my head.

Then after growing it out, I reached a point where I felt it looked straggly and I broke down and got a perm.

I have to say, I felt guilty about that perm. But my Godmother and friends at chruch all complimented me and a good friend told me she felt it was the right thing to do as she felt I needed the boost to my self esteem.

I realize it was vanity however. Nevertheless, a year after that perm, I got another one. I know the money I spent could go to the poor and I feel a bit torn, but my hair looks more professional with a perm as normally it is straight and flat in a way that I don't think looks good. If I had thicker hair it would be fine, but it is fine hair with little body.

I personally wouldn't get a face lift or botex in my lips. I kind of feel that is too far most of the time.

I wear clothes out. I recently lost 25 pounds and I have not replaced my clothes. I need to I have been able to make the clothes work (or in other words, make them not fall off.) I will buy more clothes when this no longer works. (I had a wieght loss once before of about 50 pounds and had a slip under my skirt fall off while runnig to get a buss. That taught me not to take thrift too far. A new slip was not that big an expense.)

I want to look professional for work and dress approprately for church. But I buy my clothes from places like JC Penny, K-Mart, Meijers, and some catalogues that have very reasonable, clothes that are not designer stuff. But that is the way I have been my entire life, not just since I converted. I am just thrifty by nature.

Monica said:

For example, is getting Lasik or laser hair removal just as acceptable as getting contacts or buying razors and shaving cream? Is it less than pious to spend money in that way? How much attention are we to pay to our apperance?

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Lasik surgery can save you thousands of dollars in a life time that would otherwise need to be spent on glasses or contact lenses. While contacts can have vanity aspects they are simply a lot more functional than glasses.

I quit using makeup at the age of 36... after going to Europe and seeing how the women there wore little or no makeup. I used to go to beauty college, and also sold Jafra and Mary Kay products, so I had makeup stashed everywhere in my bathroom. I gave most of it away. Now I may wear a subdued color of lipstick on a special occasion. I do not color my hair anymore because I love the silver, and got tired of tinting the roots anyway. Ugh, what a chore after a while! Now I wear a clean face and hair, and dab on a little eyebrow pencil from time to time. Lipstick if absolutely necessary... that's it.