One Gospel? Lets See, shall we?

JMWHALEN said:

And this is, and has been, sojourner's response:

"...We cannot tell..."(Mt. 21:27, Mark 11:33)


In Christ,
John M. Whalen

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Can you quote me in context please? I'd like to know what you left out. And please cite the link to the post as well. Thanks.

Yours truly in Christ,
sojourner

s0journ3r said:

Can you quote me in context please? I'd like to know what you left out. And please cite the link to the post as well. Thanks.

Yours truly in Christ,
sojourner

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This is a tactic Mr Whalen has used to try to say I have said things I have not, also, by cutting and dividing and twisting what I say.
I do not reply to his posts, for he does not have Scriptural answers and divides one's posts into pieces to make them 'appear' as they are not.

yeshuasavedme said:

This is a tactic Mr Whalen has used to try to say I have said things I have not, also, by cutting and dividing and twisting what I say.
I do not reply to his posts, for he does not have Scriptural answers and divides one's posts into pieces to make them 'appear' as they are not.

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______
Thanks Enoch. I would be concerned if you complimented me. Whenever a Lordship Salvation proponent, like yourself, criticizes me, I know I am speaking the truth.

In Christ,
John M. Whalen

s0journ3r said:

Can you quote me in context please? I'd like to know what you left out. And please cite the link to the post as well. Thanks.

Yours truly in Christ,
sojourner

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Apollos1
E39 -

In reply to post #46 - you repeated yourself once again. I have already seen that - you offered nothing new.

So try to answer just ONE point I made. Answer the following - I mean actually deal with the substance of it.


If what Jesus taught the disciples was “according to the scriptures” – see Luke 24:44 – (and it was!) WHILE he was yet with them – - -

then it is NECESSARY that IT WAS THE SAME GOSPEL that Paul taught - - -

just as Paul remarked in 1 Cor. 15:1-4 ...
as well as Romans 16:25-26, 1:1-2 !

IT MUST BE !###

Can you answer E39 - or will you just cut&paste some more abstract mumblings ??? Hmmmmm????????

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Preaching "the" gospel of the kingdom/Peter(and Judas).... preached "the gospel of the kingdom":

"And when he had called unto him his twelve disciples, he gave them power against unclean spirits, to cast them out, and to heal all manner of sickness and all manner of disease. Now the names of the twelve apostles are these; The first, Simon, who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother; James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother; Philip, and Bartholomew; Thomas, and Matthew the publican; James the son of Alphaeus, and Lebbaeus, whose surname was Thaddaeus; Simon the Canaanite, andJudas Iscariot, who also betrayed him. These twelve Jesus sent forth, and commanded them, saying, Go not into the way of the Gentiles, and into any city of the Samaritans enter ye not: But go rather to the lost sheep of the house of Israel. And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand. Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give." Matthew 10:1-8


"....And as ye go, preach, saying, The kingdom of heaven is at hand. Heal the sick, cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: freely ye have received, freely give." Matthew 10:7,8

"And Jesus went about all Galilee, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing all manner of sickness and all manner of disease among the people." Matthew 4:23

"And Jesus went about all the cities and villages, teaching in their synagogues, and preaching the gospel of the kingdom, and healing every sickness and every disease among the people." Matthew 9:35



"Then he called his twelve disciples together, and gave them power and authority over all devils, and to cure diseases.

And he sent them to preach the kingdom of God, and to heal the sick.
And he said unto them, Take nothing for your journey, neither staves, nor scrip, neither bread, neither money; neither have two coats apiece.
And whatsoever house ye enter into, there abide, and thence depart.
And whosoever will not receive you, when ye go out of that city, shake off the very dust from your feet for a testimony against them.
And they departed, and went through the towns, preaching the gospel, and healing every where.
Now Herod the tetrarch heard of all that was done by him: and he was perplexed, because that it was said of some, that John was risen from the dead;
And of some, that Elias had appeared; and of others, that one of the old prophets was risen again.
And Herod said, John have I beheaded: but who is this, of whom I hear such things? And he desired to see him.
And the apostles, when they were returned, told him all that they had done. And he took them, and went aside privately into a desert place belonging to the city called Bethsaida.
And the people, when they knew it, followed him: and he received them, and spake unto them of the kingdom of God, and healed them that had need of healing.
And when the day began to wear away, then came the twelve, and said unto him, Send the multitude away, that they may go into the towns and country round about, and lodge, and get victuals: for we are here in a desert place.
But he said unto them, Give ye them to eat. And they said, We have no more but five loaves and two fishes; except we should go and buy meat for all this people.
For they were about five thousand men. And he said to his disciples, Make them sit down by fifties in a company.
And they did so, and made them all sit down.
Then he took the five loaves and the two fishes, and looking up to heaven, he blessed them, and brake, and gave to the disciples to set before the multitude.
And they did eat, and were all filled: and there was taken up of fragments that remained to them twelve baskets.
And it came to pass, as he was alone praying, his disciples were with him: and he asked them, saying, Whom say the people that I am?
They answering said, John the Baptist; but some say, Elias; and others say, that one of the old prophets is risen again.
He said unto them, But whom say ye that I am? Peter answering said, The Christ of God.
And he straitly charged them, and commanded them to tell no man that thing; Saying, The Son of man must suffer many things, and be rejected of the elders and chief priests and scribes, and be slain, and be raised the third day. " Luke 9:1-22

So, they are "preaching the gospel." Later, they are charged not to reveal that He is "The Christ of God", and then they are told about the prophecy, the fact, of the impending death, burial, and resurrection, nor its meaning, for:


"For he taught his disciples, and said unto them, The Son of man is delivered into the hands of men, and they shall kill him; and after that he is killed, he shall rise the third day. But they understood not that saying, and were afraid to ask him." Mark 9:31,32

"Then he took unto him the twelve, and said unto them, Behold, we go up to Jerusalem, and all things that are written by the prophets concerning the Son of man shall be accomplished. For he shall be delivered unto the Gentiles, and shall be mocked, and spitefully entreated, and spitted on: And they shall scourge him, and put him to death: and the third day he shall rise again. And they understood none of these things: and this saying was hid from them, neither knew they the things which were spoken." Luke 18:31-34

"For as yet they knew not the scripture, that he must rise again from the dead." John 20:9


Same "the" gospel? Right. Good one.

According to the scriptures, they were not preaching 1 Cor. 15:1-4 at least prior to the dbr.


Provide scripture, from Mt.-John, prior to the dbr, where the Lord Jesus Christ, the 12, or anybody, preached "I/He is going to die for your sins....be buried.....be raised again for your/our justification....believe on this and you will be saved...." Chapter and verse.

You cannot, and will not. Thus, "the gospel of the kingdom", which the 12 did preach in Mt.-John, at least prior to the dbr, is not equivalent to "the" gospel of 1 Cor. 15:1-4, since 1 Cor. 15:1-4 was not preached during this same time period, at least prior to the dbr. And thus, your "supporting walls"(premises) of your "argument" crumbles.


And this is, and has been, sojourner's response:

"...We cannot tell..."(Mt. 21:27, Mark 11:33)


In Christ,
John M. Whalen

JMWHALEN said:

And this is, and has been, sojourner's response:

"...We cannot tell..."(Mt. 21:27, Mark 11:33)


In Christ,
John M. Whalen

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I'm asking you nicely to stop lying about me. That is not my response.

Yours truly in Christ,
sojourner

Provide scripture, from Mt.-John, prior to the dbr, where the Lord Jesus Christ, the 12, or anybody, preached "I/He is going to die for your sins....be buried.....be raised again for your/our justification....believe on this and you will be saved...." Chapter and verse.

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Lets go back even further, taking the lords hand as we do; to see who was preaching it-

The revealing of the mystery-of old- is bought to light;



These are My words which I spoke to you while I was still with you, that all things which are written about Me in the Law of Moses and the Prophets and the Psalms must be fulfilled."

45 Then He opened their minds[18][Lit mind ] to understand the Scriptures,
46 and He said to them,

"Thus it is written, that the Christ[19][I.e. Messiah] would suffer and rise again from the dead the third day,
47 and that repentance for forgiveness of sins would be proclaimed in[21][Or on the basis of ] His name to all the nations, beginning from Jerusalem.

48 "You are witnesses of these things.

49 "And behold, I am sending forth the promise of My Father upon you; but you are to stay in the city until you are clothed with power from on high."

E39 -

I see you offered the same old hidden response...

"I don't have an answer to scripture and logic, therefore I will post an ambiguous response that answers nothing and hides my errant theology."

Yes E39 - that's about the size of "it" - no surpirses here - LOL !!!

Apollos1 said:

E39 -

I see you offered the same old hidden response...

"I don't have an answer to scripture and logic, therefore I will post an ambiguous response that answers nothing and hides my errant theology."

Yes E39 - that's about the size of "it" - no surpirses here - LOL !!!

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They are correct on one thing though, there were 2 gospels/2 covenants.
http://www.scripture4all.org/

(Young) Nahum 3:2 The sound of a Whip, And the sound of the rattling of a wheel, And of a prancing horse, and of a bounding chariot, Of a horseman mounting.

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Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of Her [Peter's gospel], My People [Paul's gospel], lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her Stripes/Whippings.

Luke 21:27 `And then they shall see the Son of Man, coming in a cloud, with power and much glory; 28 and these things beginning to happen bend yourselves back, and lift up Your heads, because Your Redemption/ apolutrwsiV <629> doth draw nigh.'

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John W. -

Although your replies are more lengthy and splatter more scriptures, you are not addressing any of my points directly.

Having slowed things to a snail's pace............. I can't make it any simpler for you. So I guess I will reduce the quanity to a minimum... How about just ONE question-one point to answer...

If what Jesus taught the disciples was “according to the scriptures” – see Luke 24:44 – (and it was!) WHILE he was yet with them – - -

then it is NECESSARY that IT WAS THE SAME GOSPEL that Paul taught - - -

just as Paul remarked in 1 Cor. 15:1-4 ...
as well as Romans 16:25-26, 1:1-2 !

IT MUST BE !###

So John boy, answer up. Jesus said that ALL things mentioned of Him - in the Law, Psalms, and Prophets... you know, the OLD TESTAMENT SCRIPTURES - must be fulfilled... AND that Jesus TOLD the disciples these things while He was still WITH THEM - prior DBR !!!

Paul said Jeus died "according to the scriptures" - the gospel you said Paul was preaching !!!

Did Paul have a separate OLD TESTAMENT as well as a separate GOSPEL ???

LOL !!! Hmmmmmmm?

So John boy, answer up. Jesus said that ALL things mentioned of Him - in the Law, Psalms, and Prophets... you know, the OLD TESTAMENT SCRIPTURES - must be fulfilled... AND that Jesus TOLD the disciples these things while He was still WITH THEM - prior DBR !!!

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http://www.eliyah.com/lexicon.html

The words it is Written occur in 93 verses, including 66 exact phrase matches shown first:

Luke 21:22 "For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are WRITTEN may be fulfilled. 23 "But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people.

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eph3Nine said:

All things that will be fulfilled were interupted when Israel was SET ASIDE. God will resume His plan and purpose with them at a future time (ages to COME) AFTER he is done building the BODY OF CHRIST which is part of the MYSTERY truths revealed to Paul.

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Yes. The Jews are anxiously awaiting that. Israel was "set aside/divorced from God" before Jesus ever came btw.
http://www.scripture4all.org/

(Young) Nahum 3:2 The sound of a Whip, And the sound of the rattling of a wheel, And of a prancing horse, and of a bounding chariot, Of a horseman mounting.

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Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of Her [Peter's gospel], My People [Paul's gospel], lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her Stripes/Whippings.

Luke 21:22 "For these are the days of vengeance, that all things which are WRITTEN may be fulfilled. 23 "But woe to those who are pregnant and to those who are nursing babies in those days! For there will be great distress in the land and wrath upon this people...............27 `And then they shall see the Son of Man, coming in a cloud, with power and much glory; 28 and these things beginning to happen bend yourselves back, and lift up Your heads, because Your Redemption/ apolutrwsiV <629> doth draw nigh.'

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eph3Nine said:

All things that will be fulfilled were interupted when Israel was SET ASIDE. God will resume His plan and purpose with them at a future time (ages to COME) AFTER he is done building the BODY OF CHRIST which is part of the MYSTERY truths revealed to Paul.

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Yes. The Jews are anxiously awaiting that. Israel was "set aside/divorced from God" before Jesus ever came btw.

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Revelation 18:4 And I heard another voice from heaven saying, "Come out of Her [Peter's gospel], My People [Paul's gospel], lest you share in her sins, and lest you receive of her Stripes/Whippings.

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eph3Nine said:

The "jews" are still looking for their promised Messiah who came and went two thousand years ago!!!!!

Are you aware that God is in a totally different program today?????

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Yep, and they will continue to look and wail at the wailing wall for more eons to come I am afraid, much like some of them did in Ezra 3, as the Veil of Moses still "veils" their eyes to this day. [Perhaps because of the MAD's telling them He will come back to them, don't know] Peace.

alleluia occurs 4 times in 4 verses: [All in revelation chapter 19]

Ezra 3:11 And they sang responsively, praising and giving thanks to the LORD: "For [He is] good, For His mercy [endures] forever toward Israel." Then all the people shouted with a great shout, when they praised the LORD, because the foundation of the house of the LORD was laid. 12 But many of the priests and Levites and heads of the fathers' [houses,] old men who had seen the first temple, wept with a loud voice when the foundation of this temple was laid before their eyes. Yet many shouted aloud for joy, 13 so that the people could not discern the noise of the shout of joy from the noise of the weeping of the people, for the people shouted with a loud shout, and the sound was heard afar off.

Revelation 19:3 Again they said, "Alleluia! Her smoke rises up forever and ever!"

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We have strayed from the topics we were discussing - items I am still hoping to get answers for (lol- yeah right) before I start refuting "set aside" Israel and who "Babylon" is in Rev. 18, etc.

If I can't get answers to the stuff already posted, I don't believe I'll get any to new items.

What cha' think?

LilLamb - I don't have time to chase your links down. If you have something of your own to say - fine. If not, I don't care to have a battle of hyperlinks.
Thankx.

E39 -

I have acknowledged every scripture you and John W. have taken out of context or misapplied.

Why not deal with the logical arguments and applications I presented to you? I gave you just ONE in red above - where is your direct response to that?

Cutesy comments don't accomplish much...