___________Golly Gee, John, you have such aggression in your writing. I do like the kid thing, though. I am 55 years old and I haven't been called a kid in years. Thank you, that is equal to being asked for an ID when I buy a bottle of wine.
I'm not scared to address your assertion. You guys make assertions without biblical basis, I don't. Also when I find that scripture contradicts what I believe I change my belief. I don't add to or try to change scripture to fit my belief.
Paul points out that basis for justification has always been faith not works.
Rom 9: 30 ¶ What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
Paul says here that Israel did not attain to righteousness because they sought it by the works of the Law and not by faith. Faith has always been the path to justification. God's grace provides faith to those who seek justification.
Here Jesus illustrates God's grace in justification coupled with man's responsibility in this story about two men praying to the Father.
Luke 18: 10 Two men went up into the temple to pray; the one a Pharisee, and the other a publican.
11 The Pharisee stood and prayed thus with himself, God, I thank thee, that I am not as other men are, extortioners, unjust, adulterers, or even as this publican.
12 I fast twice in the week, I give tithes of all that I possess.
13 And the publican, standing afar off, would not lift up so much as his eyes unto heaven, but smote upon his breast, saying, God be merciful to me a sinner.
14 I tell you, this man went down to his house justified rather than the other: for every one that exalteth himself shall be abased; and he that humbleth himself shall be exalted.
This story is consistent with the gospel message that Jesus told His disciples to bring to the world. This publican was repentant the Pharisee wasn't. This publican asked for mercy and went home justified, that is grace, my friend, anyway you want to put it. Oh and this was before the death, burial, and resurrection of Christ, right?
Here again is the gospel message that Jesus told His disciples to share with the world.
Luke 24:45 Then opened he their understanding, that they might understand the scriptures,
46 And said unto them, Thus it is written, and thus it behoved Christ to suffer, and to rise from the dead the third day:
47 And that repentance and remission of sins should be preached in his name among all nations, beginning at Jerusalem.
Yes this was before the resurrection but we see that after the resurrection, Peter and Paul are still sharing the same message. Paul said that it came to him from a heavenly vision which is different than what you are saying Paul received.
Ok now I have addressed your assertion. Now I would like you to address why Paul in his own words would tell Agrippa that the heavenly vision that he received from the Lord matched the same gospel message that Peter preached?
Isn't this after the death,burial, and resurrection?
Acts 26:19 Whereupon, O king Agrippa, I was not disobedient unto the heavenly vision:
20 But shewed first unto them of Damascus, and at Jerusalem, and throughout all the coasts of Judaea, and then to the Gentiles, that they should repent and turn to God, and do works meet for repentance.
GLJCA
part 1:
Golly Gee, John, you have such aggression in your writing. I do like the kid thing, though. I am 55 years old and I haven't been called a kid in years. Thank you, that is equal to being asked for an ID when I buy a bottle of wine.
I'm not scared to address your assertion. You guys make assertions without biblical basis, I don't. Also when I find that scripture contradicts what I believe I change my belief. I don't add to or try to change scripture to fit my belief."-GLJCA
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My comment(Mc):
" You guys make assertions without biblical basis, I don't."-GLJCA
Specifics, please. I quoted the scripture prior to the death, burial, and resurrection. By your method of argumentation, I say you REPPYS make assertions without biblical basis-we do not. What do you think of that-"so there!"="kidstuff."
"Paul points out that basis for justification has always been faith not works.
Rom 9: 30 ¶ What shall we say then? That the Gentiles, which followed not after righteousness, have attained to righteousness, even the righteousness which is of faith.
31 But Israel, which followed after the law of righteousness, hath not attained to the law of righteousness.
32 Wherefore? Because they sought it not by faith, but as it were by the works of the law. For they stumbled at that stumblingstone;
Paul says here that Israel did not attain to righteousness because they sought it by the works of the Law and not by faith. Faith has always been the path to justification. God's grace provides faith to those who seek justification."-GLJCA
Mc: You assume the content of the faith required for justification is the same in all dispensations. And it was not. What was the content of faith required in Mt.-John, at least prior to the dbr?
"Then they that were in the ship came and worshipped him, saying, Of a truth thou art the Son of God." Mt. 14:33
"And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God." Mt. 16:16
(comment: and with the 16:18 "upon this rock" statement by the Lord Jesus Christ, our Saviour was setting the "foundation", i.e., the "rock", upon which the kingdom church, the "little flock" church(Luke 12:32 )would be built upon-their faith would rest upon the foundation that He was " the Christ, the Son of the living God.")
"And he saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am? And Peter answereth and saith unto him, Thou art the Christ." Mark 8:29
"He said unto them, But whom say ye that I am? Peter answering said, The Christ of God." Luke 9:20
"But as many as received him, to them gave he power to become the sons of God, even to them that believe on his name." Jn. 1:12
"Now when he was in Jerusalem at the passover, in the feast day, many believed in his name, when they saw the miracles which he did." Jn. 2:23
"He that believeth on him is not condemned: but he that believeth not is condemned already, because he hath not believed in the name of the only begotten Son of God." Jn. 3:18
"And said unto the woman, Now we believe, not because of thy saying: for we have heard him ourselves, and know that this is indeed the Christ, the Saviour of the world." Jn 4:42
"And we believe and are sure that thou art that Christ, the Son of the living God." Jn. 6:69
"She saith unto him, Yea, Lord: I believe that thou art the Christ, the Son of God, which should come into the world." Jn. 11:27
"But these are written, that ye might believe that Jesus is the Christ, the Son of God; and that believing ye might have life through his name." Jn. 20:31
No change in the message in "early" Acts:
"Therefore let all the house of Israel know assuredly, that God hath made the same Jesus, whom ye have crucified, both Lord and Christ." Acts 2:36
"And his name through faith in his name hath made this man strong, whom ye see and know: yea, the faith which is by him hath given him this perfect soundness in the presence of you all." Acts 3:16
"Be it known unto you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom God raised from the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you whole." Acts 4:10
"Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved." Acts 4:12
"And daily in the temple, and in every house, they ceased not to teach and preach Jesus Christ." Acts 4:42
"And Philip said, If thou believest with all thine heart, thou mayest. And he answered and said, I believe that Jesus Christ is the Son of God." Acts 8:37
No change in the message by Paul, early in his ministry, before he was progressively/gradually(i.e., progressive revelation:Acts 9:9,16; 22:10,16,17("trance"); 26:16; 1 Cor. 11:23; 2 Cor. 12:1 ; Gal. 2:2; Eph. 3:3; Col. 1:25; "But now"-Romans 16:26, Eph. 2:13, Col. 1:26 / notice Paul spent 3 years in Arabia per Galatians 1:17,18! 3 years! I find this amazing! Could that be Mt. Sinai? ) given the revelation of the mystery, from the risen, ascended, and glorified Lord Jesus Christ, from heaven(not earth),and the prophetic program was progressively/gradually(but temporarily) set aside:
"And straightway he preached Christ in the synagogues, that he is the Son of God." Acts 9:20
"But Saul increased the more in strength, and confounded the Jews which dwelt at Damascus, proving that this is very Christ." Acts 9:22
Notice the change in Acts 13:
Paul presents the "outline" of 1 Cor. 15:1-4, the only gospel that will save in the current dispensation we are under :
Verse 13:28:"And though they found no cause of death in him, yet desired they Pilate that he should be slain." = the death of the Lord Jesus Christ
Verse 13:29: "And when they had fulfilled all that was written of him, they took him down from the tree, and laid him in a sepulchre."=the burial of the Lord Jesus Christ
Verse 13:30: "But God raised him from the dead:..." =the resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ
And notice the gradual change in the message, as Paul boldly states:
"Be it known unto you therefore, men and brethren, that through this man is preached unto you the forgiveness of sins: And by him all that believe are justified from all things, from which ye could not be justified by the law of Moses." Acts 13:38,39
No one preached 1 Cor. 15:1-4, at least prior to the dbr, as a basis for justification-no scripture states this.
(continued)
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