Judging

"love the sinner, not the sin."

we are human, though. so this can be hard to do at times.  i personally have a hard time judging others.  one of my biggest faults, so i'm really not a good person to be giving any advice on this.

imagine how hard it is for the parents of the child to "love" this guy.

may that little girl rest in peace.

This is the way I think about things like this. The real enemy when your going through life is Satan. He wants to take all glory away from God and wants as many souls as he can get to go to Hell. My best advice, as hard as it is, is to pray for this person so he can convert and try to right the wrong he has done. Though it may be hard for us, the mercy of God is endless and he forgives. I would point you to the story of St. Maria Gorretti. Alessandro Sarenelli tried to rape her at the age of 12 and she refused to submit because it was a sin. He stabbed her 14 times. When the horse drawn ambulance came to take Maria to the Hospital (this was in the early 1900's), she forgave her attacker right before she died a martyr for the faith. Many years later Alessandro had a dream about Maria where she appeared to him and gave him 14 flowers (one for each wound he inflicted on her) and she told him she forgave him. Allessandro repented, went to confession and it is rumored he was at her Canonization. With any luck he is in heaven. We can only pray that as many people as possible get to heaven and that Satan may continue to lose until Jesus comes again...

I think the thing we need to avoid is the overwhelming desire to seek revenge. Revenge precludes mercy and justice, which are two traits of our Almighty Father, traits which we should strive to emulate.

Well, maybe General Schwartzkopf has the best reply; when asked if the American people should forgive the 9/11 terrorists, he replied, "I believe that forgiving them is God's function; our job is simply to arrange the meeting."

That little girl will never know what mercy and justice is.

Originally posted by Mr.Cheese
That little girl will never know what mercy and justice is.

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Why is it, that when little children are involved, we can seemingly justify and rationalize that it's quite ok to throw morality out the window? That it's quite alright to act like uncivilized barbarians? I just don't get it.

Yes, that little girl will know what mercy and justice are because she is with God, who is eternally merciful and justful. At this point though, knowing that that child is in the most capable hands we can ever imagine (ie: God's Hands), we must deal with what we can, and that is the dispensing of justice. Justice must be tempered by mercy, otherwise it is simply revenge and law ceases to become law if it doesn't protect the rights of those it was designed for. Revenge cares nothing for rights and cares only about bloodshed. Revenge is often never satisfied either.

... law, when it ceases to be justice, ceases even to be law. - G.K. Chesterton

You took the words right out of my mouth...

Originally posted by nyj


Why is it, that when little children are involved, we can seemingly justify and rationalize that it's quite ok to throw morality out the window? That it's quite alright to act like uncivilized barbarians? I just don't get it.

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What did Jesus say about people who harm little children? Didn't Jesus say that it would be better for the offender of children if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were drowned in the depth of the sea? Do you believe Jesus was an "uncivilized barbarian"?

"Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy." Did Jesus advocate mercy for those who harm children? Absolutely not. Mercy is reserved for those who are merciful.

Lock him up so that other children are safe from him. If someone has the love, faith, and courage to minister to him, God bless him or her.

Originally posted by s0uljah


What are we supposed to do about this guy?

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Jesus said it would be better for him if he were drowned.

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
What did Jesus say about people who harm little children? Didn't Jesus say that it would be better for the offender of children if a millstone were hung around his neck and he were drowned in the depth of the sea? Do you believe Jesus was an "uncivilized barbarian"?

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The actual Bible verse reads as follows:
Matthew 18:5-6 (RSV)
Whoever receives one such child in my name receives me;_but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened round his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
"Blessed are the merciful: for they shall obtain mercy." Did Jesus advocate mercy for those who harm children? Absolutely not. Mercy is reserved for those who are merciful.

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Matthew 9:13
Go and learn what this means, 'I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.' For I came not to call the righteous, but sinners."

To NYJ:

So put your self-righteousness in a box, bury it somewhere, bury it deep, go and learn what Jesus meant by saying "I desire mercy, and not sacrifice.", and repent of your wicked ways.

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{tongue-in-cheek mode] I'm so GLAD we have NYJ here to correct any person's self-righteousness. [/tongue-in-cheek mode]


[whatever closing is acceptable]
~VOW

Originally posted by Auntie_Belle_Um
Jesus said it would be better for him if he were drowned.

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Yes, that would be civilized. Let's start drowning criminals.

**Edited cause I cannot delete**

To NYJ:

How DARE you classify me! Until you have lived my life, walked in my shoes, experienced what I have, you have no right to sit in judgment of me. JESUS is my judge, NYJ. NOT YOU. Get OFF your throne, the job has been taken.

YOU need to get your rear end to Church and do some studying yourself. Try "humility," or "meekness." Read the Gospel about "judge not lest you be judged."

Pot calling the kettle black and all that.

Shame on you.


~VOW

Originally posted by nyj


The actual Bible verse reads as follows:
Matthew 18:5-6
Whoever receives one such child in my name receives me;_but whoever causes one of these little ones who believe in me to sin, it would be better for him to have a great millstone fastened round his neck and to be drowned in the depth of the sea.

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I don't know what Bible you are reading from, nyj, but verse #5 says: "And whoso shall receive one such little child in my name receiveth me."

I won't resort to your slanderous ways, nyj.

"But whoso shall offend one of these little ones which believe in me, it were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and that he were drowned in the depth of the sea."
Matthew 18:6 KJV

"And whosoever shall offend one of these little ones that believe in me, it is better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he were cast into the sea."
Mark 9:42 KJV

"It were better for him that a millstone were hanged about his neck, and he cast into the sea, than that he should offend one of these little ones."
Luke 17:2 KJV

And I am leaving this board, because I am tired of the unchecked evil here. I didn't come to a Christian board to be called an uncivilized babarian.

Originally posted by VOW
Until you have lived my life, walked in my shoes, experienced what I have, you have no right to sit in judgment of me.

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I don't need to live your life, walk in your shoes, experience what you have to know what you advocated on that past thread was wrong. So wrong that if anyone one of us participated in what you advocated, we'd cease to be Catholic. How do I know this? Because the Catholic Church teaches it, the Catholic Church preaches it, the Catholic Church has professed it for almost 2000 years.

To Auntie:

I have dearly enjoyed all my communications with you, and I'd appreciate it if you would stay.

Besides, before he deleted the post, NYJ called me something much more foul than an uncivilized barbarian.

See, I KNOW I differ from the Church teachings on abortion, for the mixed feelings I have in the hypothetical case that NYJ put to the poll. And I've said that I don't know what my decision would be under those circumstances, because I can see so many sides to the situation.

NYJ has promoted himself to judge, jury, and executioner. At least I know I am in conflict. That is between me and the Lord. I surrender my soul to Him, and trust in His eternal compassion. He has His own agenda as to what I learn, and when.

NYJ is mistaken in thinking he already has all the answers. May God have mercy on him, when he encounters a completely unthinkable situation. And I will offer to weep with him. God knows, I've cried many bitter, burning tears over some of the unthinkable situations in my own life. And those situations have taught me I still have a LOT to learn.

Please stay, Auntie.



Peace be with you,
~VOW

To NYJ:

If a priest were to be as judgmental, sanctimonious, haughty, and downright NASTY to me in my pain as you have been, I'd walk away. I'd find another priest who exhibits the compassion and caring and concern that Jesus showed.

I wouldn't walk away because of the priest's MESSAGE. I'd walk away to find someone who would cry with me, who would understand my views, and who would offer to pray with me and guide me, and who would help me find the right doctor, the right hospital, the right SUPPORT that I would so desperately need, to understand and to accept the Church teachings.

Jesus managed to give his lessons with LOVE. I've seen no love expressed in your rudeness, your hatefulness, and your haughtiness shown to people who have the audacity to disagree with you.

Grow up, little boy.


~VOW