explain this verse to me. please

Break it down...

The experience of the new birth is what Jesue is talking about. to be born again you have to be born before. born of water means being born. in being born you have the inherited sin nature of Adam. To be born of the Spirit is a supernatural thing. You are born a second time but you have nothing to do with this birth. it is of the Holy Spirit.

I know alot of scholors would disagree but I have a hard time seeing baptism in this verse.

Before you are born, you are swimming in amniontic fluid, and when you are born, this water gusses out of you mother. In this way you are born of water. This means your physical birth.

When you are born again, it is a spiritual birth. You are born bathed in the Spirit, not in water this time.

So you must be born physically AND spiritually to enter the kingdom of God.

Christ said this to a Jew who thought he would get into heaven because he was physically born a Jew--a free pass into heaven for being decended from Abraham, so to speak. He thought he'd skate in on his physical birth alone. But Jesus was saying that no, that was not enough. You have to be born again, born spiritually, in order to enter the kingdom or heaven.

Baptism is not in that passage at all.

Jesus is also referred to as the Living Water....

Food for thought?  That just came to me as I was reading it.......hmm....

 

Terri

Originally posted by Ultimate
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
jonh 3:5
Some say baptism but I dont beleive so.
what do you think?

Click to expand...

*******
(the spell check is toooo busy : and 'i' am a lousy speller! Sorry)

But 'Hi' anyway,
mankind is lost eternally! a way of escape is offered. It is up to us to accept the [Everlasting Gospel & Everlasting Covenant]. Eternal life is a [two party] agreement, pledge, contract. God has made ALL Provision in Christ! Phil. 4:13 & 2 Cor. 12:9. And, we fail any other way. Acts 4:12!

Yet, He also said that He would re/create us. Otherwise we would not need Him. And we would be powerless & [miserable!] We would already have Agape LOVE. (and none do!)We need a starting point! We have got to LOVE HIM! This was the problem with Nicodemus, and notice that he was a ruler of the Jews. A professed Sabbath keeper, tithe payer & probably looked on the outside, GREAT!?

And although all of these 'works' do not save a person, none will be saved without them, they are to FOLLOW the Born Again life because of a LOVE relationship with our FIRST LOVE, CHRIST! (re/created) If you check 2 Cor. 3:3 you will see what takes place at conversion. (born again) It is the [first heart transplant]! Now we LOVE THE MASTER! From tables of stone into the 'fleshy tables of the mind & heart, written by the Holy Ghost! Try Act 5:32 also.

OK: Now, what do [we do] to be... 'Born Again'? There are good verses for this [if all] are used together. Matt. 4:4 & 2 Tim. 3:16. BELIEVE ON JESUS CHRIST! What is that, huh?? How can a person LOVE? that has not 'tasted of the good Word of God'? [or] have 'been made partakers of the Holy Ghost'? (Heb. 6's positives) He CANNOT! And without the changed heart man attempts to work his way to heaven. It can be done ONLY by death to self or 'spiritual' suicide. [I give up Lord!] Total submission to the Everlasting Gospel & Everlasting Covenant & then we are RECREATED NEW!. That is OUR AGREEMENT part, and then & only then can we see who is Born Again in Acts 5:32! No Holy Ghost, no eternal life or POWER from Christ to live!

Hope that this helps?
Pastor N.B.

The spirit in this verse is reference to the word of God. Notice John 6:63 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life.

1Peter 1:23 Being born again, not of corruptible seed, but of incorruptible, by the word of God, which liveth and abideth for ever.

Being born of water is in reference to baptism. You are right in saying that it does not say baptism anywhere in these verses but it is implied. When is says born again that would mean you would have to die first. Of course we find out in other passages that it is at the point of baptism that we die with christ and our old man is crucified. Then when we are raised up from the water it is our faith in the opereration of God that we know that we have been raised with christ a new creation being born again. We know that we have to have our sins forgiven and we see from acts 22:16 that it isnt until we are baptised that our sins are forgiven.

Originally posted by Ultimate
Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
jonh 3:5
Some say baptism but I dont beleive so.
what do you think?

Click to expand...

******************

Hi ,
is this question for me?

As 'i' teach & practice it, Conversion comes first! (thief on the cross) And then their is NO WAY that i would refuse baptism. OK? Now i grant you that some did, Read Luke 7:30 for a VERY BAD Christ rejected example. And the thief could not be. Let me just add this ok?

It was a COMMANDMENT of Christ in Matt. 10:5-6 to go to the [lost sheep of the house of Israel 'first']. From 27-34AD. This thief had had the teachings of Christ taught in previous 'seed' sowing. Also he was with Christ in His court proceedings,
you know, the love that HIS OWN had for Him? Slapped, spit on Him & crucifixion!

Notice the verse of water baptism there? "But the Pharisees and lawyers [REJECTED THE COUNSEL OF GOD] AGAINST THEM SELVES, being [NOT BAPTISED OF HIM]"

Now remember that Matt. 28 is Gospel! And the Word Himself STATED to: "teach them [ALL THINGS] whatsoever I have COMMANDED you]". This works both ways! This is my responsiblity! And if the 'seed' is not ready to accept the 'folds' doctrine as i see it? Then he is ready yet.
Again Acts 5:32 comes first, (total surrender) along with the First Heart Transplant of 2 Cor. 3:3 (you will like Eze. 11:19-20 )

Did i miss anything?
Perhaps i should add for others sake, that once that a person is born again, they will GLADLY OBEY the Master! Not to be saved, but BECAUSE they [LOVE HIM] & OTHERS! OK?

Think of this beloved John person, the one time 'son of thunder' who penned the Christ's inspiration in 1 Jn. 2:4.

"He that sayeth, I know (LOVE) Him, [and keepeth not His Commandments], [is a liar], and (AND) the [TRUTH] is not [in him]". Remember that the 10 Commandments are actually the ONLY part of inspiration that God Himself did not want man using his many words to describe! (try Isa. 8:20 for the seperate parts)

Hope this helps? By the way, Who would want to be a Christian, if they were the [same person] after conversion as before NOT ME! (try 1 Cor. 6:9-11)

Pastor N.B.

When a person is born again, it is his dead/unregenerate human spirit that is recreated or made alive. That is what it means to be born of the spirit. That's why when a person is saved, he still looks physically the same, and his mind is still pretty much the same. But his spirit has been recreated and is born of God.

His spirit has the nature of God. As for his mind, he is suppose to renew it with the Word, as the Bible says. As for his flesh/body, he is suppose to keep it under the control of his spirit or the Spirit

A man is made up of 3 parts -- body (physical body), spirit and soul (mind, will, emotions), just like God's temple in the OT -- Outer Court (physical body), Inner Court (soul), and Holy of Holies where God's Spirit dwells (our spirit part).

That's why in the NT we are called God's temple and the holy of holies is now in that part of our spirit, where the Holy Spirit dwells alongside, in every believer.

The "water" can refer to the water bag of the womb if left in context, but I beleive it is refering more to the washing of the Word of God. The Bible calls the Word water sometimes. IOW, you hear the gospel/Word preached first, then get saved when you believe.

From the context, it seems clear that the explanation given by most folk here is the 'correct' one - 'born of water' refers to 'natural' birth (amniotic fluid and all that), while 'born of the Spirit' refers to the 'born again' experience, of being made spiritually alive by the Spirit of God. It was this spiritual reality which was the whole purpose of Christ's coming - to deal with sin on the cross so that we could all come into a living relationship with God in and through the person of the Holy Spirit dwelling in us.

Of course, there are many images which overlap - Christ's words are ;'Spirit and Life', we are 'washed in His blood', made clean by the 'water of the Word', and filled to overflowing with the 'Living Waters' of the Spirit! But remember Nicodemus prompted this particualr response by asking his question about the feasibility of entering again into the womb - 'No', said Jesus, 'not just that kind of birth, but a spiritual one also is what makes a child of God'!

Anthony

Hi guy, (?)
there are some answers posted here. What do [you] think?
I suspect that man became a living soul when the breath of life was 'installed'

And it seems that when that 'breath' is gone, so are we. I think perhaps for that first [created] 'living soul' to live on after sin, that it was as God said in Gen. 3:22. That the tree of life would have caused evil to [live forever.] Seems that that is what 's'atan said, ye shall not surely die!? And the Word said that he was a liar from the beginning.

What does immortal mean? And only God has it we are told!
Even after the first resurrection it appears that we will have conditional immortality. (if i can use that word) Na. 1:9 says that sin will not arise a second time. So we will have immortal life from this [time forward]. True immortal life would be as God, ETERNAL, BEFORE and AFTER. OK? Personally for one, i do not remember living in the 1800's.

NO? Well then, read Rev. 22:1-2 to see that we will still eat of the Tree of Life 'for the healing of the nations'.

Regardless: Twice in Eze. it states that the 'soul that sinneth, it [shall die].' (chapter 18:4 & verse 20)

So the followup question that you might ask is: When the REQUIREMENT that the Master stated that 'We MUST be Born Again' has taken place, then what, can we once again be LOST??? This is a good question? Yet, i would rather work on it at home & send it here email and save it for future use. (i think that Doc said that he was working on that tool?)

Your true friend in the Master's quickly finished work,
Pastor N.B.

"Jesus answered and said unto him, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a MAN be born AGAIN, he cannot see the kingdom of God." - John 3:3
"Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a MAN be BORN OF WATER and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God." - John 3:5

"BORN OF WATER" is water baptism in JESUS NAME just as stated in Matthew 28:19 and Acts 2:38. It does not mean natural child birth as some foolish people suggest. Note that he says " Except a MAN", He is talking about a man, not a baby. Then He says "born AGAIN" (a second time).

"...while the ark was a preparing, wherein few, that is, eight souls were saved by water. The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us. . ." I Peter 3:20,21

"He that believeth and is baptized shall be saved; but he that believeth not shall be ******." - Mark 16:16

Ultimate said:

Jesus answered, Verily, verily, I say unto thee, Except a man be born of water and of the Spirit, he cannot enter into the kingdom of God.
jonh 3:5
Some say baptism but I dont beleive so.
what do you think?

Click to expand...

I know there are many different views as to what baptism is even within Protestantism, however, I believe it does teach baptismal regeneration.

Perhaps it is helpful to understand how the early Church understood this passage . .

St. Irenaeus is a second century Church Father who describes the nature and necessity of Baptism by water in his famous First Apology (written about 155 AD). In this document he has the following to say about Baptism by water: Those who are persuaded and believe that the things we teach and say are true, and promise that they can live accordingly, are instructed to pray and beseech God with fasting for the remission of their past sins, while we pray and fast along with them. Then they are brought by us where there is water, and are reborn by the same manner of rebirth by which we ourselves were reborn; for they are then washed in the water in the name of God the Father and Master of all, and of our Saviour Jesus Christ, and of the Holy Spirit. For Christ said, "Unless you are born again you will not enter into the Kingdom of heaven." Now it is clear to all that those who have once come into being cannot enter the wombs of those who bore them. But as I quoted before, it was said through the prophet Isaiah how those who have sinned and repent shall escape from their sins. He said this: "Wash yourselves, be clean, take away wickednesses from your souls, learn to do good, give judgement for the orphan and defend the cause of the widow, and come and let us reason together, says the Lord. And though your sins be as scarlet, I will make them as white as wool, and though they be as crimson, I will make them as white as snow. If you will not listen to me, the sword will devour you; for the mouth of the Lord has spoken these things" (#61; Richardson, 282).

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Augustine also commented specifically on this passage:

"It is this one Spirit who makes possible for an infant to be regenerated through the agency of another's will when that infant is brought to Baptism; and it is through this one Spirit that the infant so presented is reborn. For it is not written: 'Unless a man be born again by the will of his parents' or 'by the faith of those presenting him or ministering to him', but 'Unless a man be born again of water and the Holy Spirit' [John 3: 5]. The water, therefore, manifesting exteriorly the sacrament of grace, and the Spirit effecting interiorly the benefit of grace, both regenerate in one Christ that man who was generated in one Adam."

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There are many other quotes from the Early Church Father's regarding Baptismal regeneration, but the ones above speak about this passage in particular. . . . Peace in Him!

Hi Forum,

I don't agree with the meaning of 'born again' as it is being used in this thread.
In 1 Peter the term 'born again' refers to a rejuvination of the human existance because of the new-to-man indwelling of the Holy Spirit. That started in Acts 2.

IN John 3:

5Jesus answered, "I tell you the truth, no one can enter the kingdom of God unless he is born of water and the Spirit.

The Kingdom of God is the same as the Kingdom of Heaven and you can't enter the Kingdom of Heaven in this 'adjusted physical' state that is described as the 'born again' of this thread.

The key is that you can't enter Heaven unless you physically die.The verse means you are born once a natural being (from water) and after death become a spiritual being. (of the spirit)

3In reply Jesus declared, "I tell you the truth, no one can see the kingdom of God unless he is born again.

So I read this as saying you can not enter the Kingdom of God unless you pass away from the natural life and are 'born again' a spiritual being.

This fits in with the conversation with Nicodemus further on where Jesus says:
12I have spoken to you of earthly things and you do not believe; how then will you believe if I speak of heavenly things?

The key is that to see the Kingdom of Heaven/God you have to DIE first.

Justme

This verse paralells the comments in the previous 2 verses. Jesus is saying that you must be born of the flesh and of the spirit, or born again. The water is an allusion to when a mother goes in labor and her water breaks.

Other interpeations think is is one term like Holy Spirit and fire.

To think it means baptism is based on cojecture, there is nothing in John's Gospel to suggest this.