From strathyboy,
You are tremendously idealistic, and that isn't necessarily bad, but you need to add in a big fat bucket of reality into your beliefs.
First off, yes, many of the American actions in the past.... But you are ignoring the realities of life on the planet we call earth.
Friend,
I am not idealistic nor am I ignoring the realities of life. I am simply a Christian. I do what Christ and His true followers have done for centuries. Even our atheist friend can see that there is no biblical authorization for our wars. Can one of you cite from any of the apostles words or actions (especially their example) where they endorsed war or a spirit of retaliation?
Here is what Paul, who was attacked and beaten on many occasions, and who was ultimately beheaded had to say:
Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. Rejoice with those who rejoice; weep with those who weep. Be in agreement with one another. Do not be proud; instead, associate with the humble. Do not be wise in your own estimation. Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Try to do what is honorable in everyone's eyes. If possible, on your part, live at peace with everyone. Friends, do not avenge yourselves; instead, leave room for His wrath. For it is written: Vengeance belongs to Me; I will repay, says the Lord. But If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink. For in so doing you will be heaping fiery coals on his head.Do not be conquered by evil, but conquer evil with good. Romans 12:14-21
And Peter, who went through many of the same abusive conditions without fighting back and was finally crucified:
Now finally, all of you should be like-minded and sympathetic, should love believers, and be compassionate and humble, not paying back evil for evil or insult for insult but, on the contrary, giving a blessing since you were called for this, so that you can inherit a blessing. For the one who wants to love life and to see good days must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from speaking deceit, and he must turn away from evil and do good. He must seek peace and pursue it, because the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous and His ears are open to their request. But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil. And who will harm you if you are passionate for what is good? But even if you should suffer for righteousness, you are blessed. Do not fear what they fear or be disturbed. 1 Peter 3:8-14
James:
My dearly loved brothers, understand this: everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak, and slow to anger, for man's anger does not accomplish God's righteousness. James 1:19-20
My brothers, hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ without showing favoritism. haven't you discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? Listen, my dear brothers: Didn't God choose the poor in this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom that He has promised to those who love Him? Yet you dishonored that poor man. Don't the rich oppress you and drag you into the courts? Don't they blaspheme the noble name that you bear?
If you really carry out the royal law prescribed in Scripture, You shall love your neighbor color](neighboring countries) as yourself, you are doing well.[/b] But if you show favoritism, you commit sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. For whoever keeps the entire law, yet fails in one point, is guilty of breaking it all. For He who said, Do not commit adultery, also said, Do not murder. So if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you are a lawbreaker. Speak and act as those who will be judged by the law of freedom. For judgment is without mercy to the one who hasn't shown mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith, but does not have works? Can his faith save him? If a brother or sister is without clothes and lacks daily food, and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, keep warm, and eat well," but you don't give them what the body needs, what good is it? In the same way faith, if it doesn't have works, is dead by itself. But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without works, and I will show you faith from my works. You believe that God is one; you do well. The demons also believe--and they shudder. Foolish man! Are you willing to learn that faith without works is useless? James 2:
What is the source of the wars and the fights among you? Don't they come from the cravings that are at war within you? You desire and do not have. You murder and covet and cannot obtain. You fight and war. You do not have because you do not ask. James 4:1-2
And from John, the one who was the closest to Jesus, who was boiled alive and beaten numerous times as well . We hear nothing from him about retaliating and defending yourself from those who do not believe:
Dear friends, I am not writing you a new command, but an old command that you have had from the beginning. The old command is the message you have heard.Yet I am writing you a new command, which is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away and the true light is already shining. The one who says he is in the light but hates his brother is in the darkness until now. The one who loves his brother remains in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But the one who hates his brother is in the darkness, walks in the darkness, and doesn't know where he's going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 2:7-11
Those who profess to love their fellow humans and yet are willing to drop bombs on them (or pay for them to be dropped) show they do not love anyone but their own self.
For decades, many individuals have protested the slaughter that the U.S. and their allies have committed thought the earth. Some have exercised great faith and shown true compassion by violating laws prohibiting them to assist those who are labeled the enemy. These true believers face imprisonment and large fines from your government (U.S.) for attempting to follow the golden rule. This link is to one such example.
http://www.nonviolence.org/vitw/pages/214.htm
You look with wonder at those who stood by and watched Hitler kill his neighbors, and yet you protest if anyone attempts to raise their voices to the modern day genocides that take place in the name of your God. Truly this is a mystery.
If God had asked you to give up any of the things that you mentioned, then you should. However all that has been asked of those of a murderous spirit is to quit killing your neighbors. That would not be too hard for you to do.
You are tremendously idealistic, and that isn't necessarily bad, but you need to add in a big fat bucket of reality into your beliefs.
First off, yes, many of the American actions in the past.... But you are ignoring the realities of life on the planet we call earth.
Friend,
I am not idealistic nor am I ignoring the realities of life. I am simply a Christian. I do what Christ and His true followers have done for centuries. Even our atheist friend can see that there is no biblical authorization for our wars. Can one of you cite from any of the apostles words or actions (especially their example) where they endorsed war or a spirit of retaliation?
Here is what Paul, who was attacked and beaten on many occasions, and who was ultimately beheaded had to say:
Bless those who persecute you; bless and do not curse. Rejoice with those who rejoice; weep with those who weep. Be in agreement with one another. Do not be proud; instead, associate with the humble. Do not be wise in your own estimation. Do not repay anyone evil for evil. Try to do what is honorable in everyone's eyes. If possible, on your part, live at peace with everyone. Friends, do not avenge yourselves; instead, leave room for His wrath. For it is written: Vengeance belongs to Me; I will repay, says the Lord. But If your enemy is hungry, feed him. If he is thirsty, give him something to drink. For in so doing you will be heaping fiery coals on his head.Do not be conquered by evil, but conquer evil with good. Romans 12:14-21
And Peter, who went through many of the same abusive conditions without fighting back and was finally crucified:
Now finally, all of you should be like-minded and sympathetic, should love believers, and be compassionate and humble, not paying back evil for evil or insult for insult but, on the contrary, giving a blessing since you were called for this, so that you can inherit a blessing. For the one who wants to love life and to see good days must keep his tongue from evil and his lips from speaking deceit, and he must turn away from evil and do good. He must seek peace and pursue it, because the eyes of the Lord are on the righteous and His ears are open to their request. But the face of the Lord is against those who do evil. And who will harm you if you are passionate for what is good? But even if you should suffer for righteousness, you are blessed. Do not fear what they fear or be disturbed. 1 Peter 3:8-14
James:
My dearly loved brothers, understand this: everyone must be quick to hear, slow to speak, and slow to anger, for man's anger does not accomplish God's righteousness. James 1:19-20
My brothers, hold your faith in our glorious Lord Jesus Christ without showing favoritism. haven't you discriminated among yourselves and become judges with evil thoughts? Listen, my dear brothers: Didn't God choose the poor in this world to be rich in faith and heirs of the kingdom that He has promised to those who love Him? Yet you dishonored that poor man. Don't the rich oppress you and drag you into the courts? Don't they blaspheme the noble name that you bear?
If you really carry out the royal law prescribed in Scripture, You shall love your neighbor color](neighboring countries) as yourself, you are doing well.[/b] But if you show favoritism, you commit sin and are convicted by the law as transgressors. For whoever keeps the entire law, yet fails in one point, is guilty of breaking it all. For He who said, Do not commit adultery, also said, Do not murder. So if you do not commit adultery, but you do murder, you are a lawbreaker. Speak and act as those who will be judged by the law of freedom. For judgment is without mercy to the one who hasn't shown mercy. Mercy triumphs over judgment.
What good is it, my brothers, if someone says he has faith, but does not have works? Can his faith save him? If a brother or sister is without clothes and lacks daily food, and one of you says to them, "Go in peace, keep warm, and eat well," but you don't give them what the body needs, what good is it? In the same way faith, if it doesn't have works, is dead by itself. But someone will say, "You have faith, and I have works." Show me your faith without works, and I will show you faith from my works. You believe that God is one; you do well. The demons also believe--and they shudder. Foolish man! Are you willing to learn that faith without works is useless? James 2:
What is the source of the wars and the fights among you? Don't they come from the cravings that are at war within you? You desire and do not have. You murder and covet and cannot obtain. You fight and war. You do not have because you do not ask. James 4:1-2
And from John, the one who was the closest to Jesus, who was boiled alive and beaten numerous times as well . We hear nothing from him about retaliating and defending yourself from those who do not believe:
Dear friends, I am not writing you a new command, but an old command that you have had from the beginning. The old command is the message you have heard.Yet I am writing you a new command, which is true in Him and in you, because the darkness is passing away and the true light is already shining. The one who says he is in the light but hates his brother is in the darkness until now. The one who loves his brother remains in the light, and there is no cause for stumbling in him. But the one who hates his brother is in the darkness, walks in the darkness, and doesn't know where he's going, because the darkness has blinded his eyes. 1 John 2:7-11
Those who profess to love their fellow humans and yet are willing to drop bombs on them (or pay for them to be dropped) show they do not love anyone but their own self.
For decades, many individuals have protested the slaughter that the U.S. and their allies have committed thought the earth. Some have exercised great faith and shown true compassion by violating laws prohibiting them to assist those who are labeled the enemy. These true believers face imprisonment and large fines from your government (U.S.) for attempting to follow the golden rule. This link is to one such example.
http://www.nonviolence.org/vitw/pages/214.htm
You look with wonder at those who stood by and watched Hitler kill his neighbors, and yet you protest if anyone attempts to raise their voices to the modern day genocides that take place in the name of your God. Truly this is a mystery.
If God had asked you to give up any of the things that you mentioned, then you should. However all that has been asked of those of a murderous spirit is to quit killing your neighbors. That would not be too hard for you to do.
Upvote
0